If you replace your iMac every decade then a separate Mac + display is useless to you

[Longplays]

I think if you like a good screen, the 24” iMac is still quite a good buy. You just don’t get screens that good which are standalone for that price. And my computing needs are pretty minimal, I write and do a little photography these days.

A 2019 iMac 21.5" 4K Core i3 base model is $1,299. 2021 iMac 24" 4.5K M1 base model is also $1,299.

Isn't it amazing that Apple was able to keep to price points even during a worldwide pandemic? I credit it to lowering materials used, lowering shipping weight & shipping dimension, simplifying manufacturing, optimizing supply chain and Apple's cash hoard.

TBH if the 27" 5K display had a M1 or even M2 I'd buy it. I'd expect it to cost $1799-1999.

If you are coming from any iMac a decade prior to that it would outperform it in terms of performance per watt and raw performance other than say a Core i9 or Xeon.

 

[Longplays]

who needs a good screen?
who does photo and video editing, but if you do that 23.8" is today a small size to work with.
for $400 you can buy a 27" monitor with 100% sRG coverage and 98% P3.
With 500 dollars I bought a 32" 4k 100%sRGB and 95%P3 and integrated arm stand...excellent monitors also for photos and video editing, but above all great monitors that allow you to work well.

The new iMAc is a consumer computer, the performance is great, but it's designed for consumer use, there are too many things that limit it.
Those who really need a good monitor won't buy a 24" in 2023 or 2024, because it's too small.

My most taxing use case for a iMac 27" replacement are

- 50MP RAW image editing from a 2015 camera
- browsing (not Chrome)
- 4K streaming
- Office apps
- 1080p video editing (rarely)

I'd want to halve my power consumption to less than 110W.

Apple display standards spoil me. Dell's and other brands are... meh.

Can anyone say I'd need to replace that iMac every 1-6 years? It'll be good until 2033 when the final macOS Security Update is released.

It would be nice to have a 3nm M3 with that iMac for lower power consumption but that means waiting another 12 months or longer?

 

[Ethosik]

That is the best part of this. Now customers have a choice and flexibility. It’s fine if you don’t upgrade your monitor for 10 years. But I do. And I’m a 2 or 3 monitor setup person and really need my monitors to match. Can’t do that. At All with an iMac.

 

[Mark.g4]

a lot also depends on the software and often planned obsolescence is actually software, which forces you to update for security reasons, but new software is designed for new computers and not for old ones, so there is no certainty that a very valid machine today, it is also valid in 3 years, above all because if it is all soldered you cannot do hardware upgrades.

On my imac 27 2010 i can install hardware like modern gpu so that it is metal compatible too and i can run the same applications as you with the exception of 4k.
But it's a different machine and I can practically upgrade everything and I can also use it as a target display.

It's a consumer machine, but one that lends itself and has lent itself over the years to very heavy tasks and today it's not in the dump, because there's the possibility of upgrading and using it safely for many tasks.
1TB SSD Raid0
16GB RAM
i7 CPU upgrade
Metal GPU upgrade.
The screen is not qualitatively as good as today's, but after calibration, even amateur photo and video editing becomes acceptable.

So I agree when Apple says monitor + computer better, because today a 27" or 32" 4k or 5k wide gamut will be very valid even in 10 years.
The same cannot be said of a computer with all the parts welded and not possible to upgrade, because obsolescence is also software, and we have no certainty of what will be developed in the next few years .

and I sincerely hope that these things change radically, we are producing too much garbage and we are throwing away objects that could still be very good.

I will never buy a soldered AIO desktop machine with a glued screen where I can't even easily clean the cooling system which becomes full of dust after a year, and where I can't easily install a vesa mount and most I can accept it on tablets or laptops for reasons of space and design needs and weight and where above all there are no fans for cooling...

 

[Longplays]

a lot also depends on the software and often planned obsolescence is actually software, which forces you to update for security reasons, but new software is designed for new computers and not for old ones, so there is no certainty that a very valid machine today, it is also valid in 3 years, above all because if it is all soldered you cannot do hardware upgrades.

On my imac 27 2010 i can install hardware like modern gpu so that it is metal compatible too and i can run the same applications as you with the exception of 4k.
But it's a different machine and I can practically upgrade everything and I can also use it as a target display.

It's a consumer machine, but one that lends itself and has lent itself over the years to very heavy tasks and today it's not in the dump, because there's the possibility of upgrading and using it safely for many tasks.
1TB SSD Raid0
16GB RAM
i7 CPU upgrade
Metal GPU upgrade.
The screen is not qualitatively as good as today's, but after calibration, even amateur photo and video editing becomes acceptable.

So I agree when Apple says monitor + computer better, because today a 27" or 32" 4k or 5k wide gamut will be very valid even in 10 years.
The same cannot be said of a computer with all the parts welded and not possible to upgrade, because obsolescence is also software.

That assumes you'll be upgrading the apps as well that aggressively.

Right now have any SaaS apps on now abandoned macOS versions stop working?

If your cameras and other devices are not updated to anything newer then the old apps would still work with old devices.

It reminds me of some printing presses still using PPC with Quark until now. Their system 'as is' already complies with client requirements that has not changed in a quarter of a century. End users knows the system inside and out so labor isn't distracted.

Clients are continuously asking for cheaper rates so where do you get he money to upgrade much less go multi-monitor?

In 2006, I found it weird that people would keep their pre-OS X Macs but then I realized the use case is unchanged.

 

[henrikhelmers]

When Apple announced the 2021 Studio Display 27" & 2021 Mac Studio they neglected to include the replacement of the 2020 iMac 27". That iMac is now 34 months old.

Apple & many others said that you are better off with a separate 27" display + Mac Studio/mini as the monitor wouldn't be "wasted" if you upgrade.

If you look at the Studio Display there is so much computer in there it is almost an iMac.

I think it would make sense to sell both an integrated computer, a display with microphones, cameras and speakers and a standalone display (for multi-monitor setups).

 

[Longplays]

If you look at the Studio Display there is so much computer in there it is almost an iMac.

I think it would make sense to sell both an integrated computer, a display with microphones, cameras and speakers and a standalone display (for multi-monitor setups).

TBH I wish Apple offered macOS on iPhone chips because that iPhone chip inside that Studio Display is faster than most 2012 Macs.

 

[Ethosik]

👆 At a cost of 2X-plus for a box-plus-display combo versus iMac cost, one might hope it would be!! 🤦‍♂️

That combo doesn’t come close to $10,000 starting point. Maxed out SoC Mac Studio and Display is what replaced the iMac Pro. But I can get a Mac Studio and a $300 display for $2,300. So 27” iMac was only $1,150.

 

[Mark.g4]

That assumes you'll be upgrading the apps as well that aggressively.

Right now have any SaaS apps on now abandoned macOS versions stop working?

If your cameras and other devices are not updated to anything newer then the old apps would still work with old devices.

It reminds me of some printing presses still using PPC with Quark until now. Their system 'as is' already complies with client requirements that has not changed in a quarter of a century. End users knows the system inside and out so labor isn't distracted.

Clients are continuously asking for cheaper rates so where do you get he money to upgrade much less go multi-monitor?

In 2006, I found it weird that people would keep their pre-OS X Macs but then I realized the use case is unchanged.

It depends on what you use, today many software are licensed with monthly subscriptions and when you update the OS then you are also forced to update the apps which actually do it automatically, many programs stop working if you don't update.
So it's a case-by-case discussion.
It's all devoted to unbridled consumerism and planned obsolescence, fortunately the legislators are also fighting the phenomenon of software obsolescence, there is a need to regulate the phenomenon.

 

[Longplays]

It depends on what you use, today many software are licensed with monthly subscriptions and when you update the OS then you are also forced to update the apps which actually do it automatically, many programs stop working if you don't update.
So it's a case-by-case discussion.
It's all devoted to unbridled consumerism and planned obsolescence, fortunately the legislators are also fighting the phenomenon of software obsolescence, there is a need to regulate the phenomenon.

Base on my use case has Adobe stopped SaaS LR or PS to work on older macOS. Apple cease SaaS FC working on older macOS?

When that occurs the answer is simple.

Just buy a new Mac! 😆 At say 6+ years it is beyond the Intel norm already.

 

[Mark.g4]

Base on my use case has Adobe stopped SaaS LR or PS to work on older macOS. Apple cease SaaS FC working on older macOS?

When that occurs the answer is simple.

Just buy a new Mac! 😆 At say 6+ years it is beyond the Intel norm already.

If the computer is all soldered, I prefer to change only the hardware part every 2-3 years instead of 6 and keep the monitor, I can resell used Mac and that is what I will do in the future.
I always have the fresh machine, performing, covered by warranty and I can download the taxes.
And above all I spend little, since I don't have to buy hardware that I don't need such as monitors, speakers, mouse, keyboard, webcam.

for me Apple is right, based on their current offer, better mac + display than an AIO...
but it is certainly not a valid reasoning for everyone. everyone has their own preferences.

I hope that the situation changes for the better due to the environmental impact and pollution.

They are pushing those who really use it for work to change their Mac too often.
Those who have high workflows with 4k video stress memories that write hundreds of TB in a few months bringing the memory to death.
This is a problem if you have an AIO with soldered memory because it also leads to selling the monitor which is not affected by the memory problem.
but it's also a problem if i buy an AIO with only 256gb memory for home use and start downloading your iphone videos to it.
Today, everyone generates large amounts of data with their phones and if you back up on your computer or edit your video files at home, this is a big problem for memory, especially if it is small.
My 2 cent.

 

[JerryDon]

Still lovin' my Late 2012 iMac, thanks to OpenCore I'm running the latest Ventura - All is good. Never buy another iMac as long as the whimpy 23.5" is all Apple has to offer. . .

 

[ignatius345]

The biggest pain I had with my 2012 27" iMac was when I had to take it to the Apple Store for a repair. If I recall it had something to do with the power supply. The screen wise fine. Anyway, the store was in the middle of a mall, and I had to haul that thing from the parking lot and halfway through the mall to get to the store. I then had to replay that scenario in reverse when I had to pick it up after repairs a couple days later. Besides its size, the weight distribution of that machine makes it awkward to carry.

I loved my iMac, but will never buy an AIO ever again. It's just too big and bulky for my taste. Since then, I converted to a Mac Mini, and now a Mac Studio, both attached to a pair of 27" monitors, the same monitors which I will probably continue to use for years to come.

FWIW the current M1 iMac weighs less than 10 pounds -- about half of the old 5K version. It's also a lot thinner. I would expect even a 27" version of this new iMac design would come in lighter and less bulky than the old Intel ones.

I myself like the reduced cord clutter of the AIO design. I had an Mini-based setup some years back but always felt like there was too much junk on my desk.

 

[Longplays]

FWIW the current M1 iMac weighs less than 10 pounds -- about half of the old 5K version. It's also a lot thinner. I would expect even a 27" version of this new iMac design would come in lighter and less bulky than the old Intel ones.

I myself like the reduced cord clutter of the AIO design. I had an Mini-based setup some years back but always felt like there was too much junk on my desk.

When I saw the iMac 24" I just wish there was a 27" equivalent to it even if it was "gimped" with a M1 or M2 chip.

Those chips would still outperform any i9 or Xeon at less than 110W of the whole iMac.

It would be nice if that iMac would have the same port selection as a Mac mini M2 or M2 Pro.

M2

M2 Pro

 

[anselpela]

No, it's not. But an all-in-one definitely can be.

 

[orionquest]

OMG I don't have 4k monitors, my colour space is old, my colours look dull!!
I should upgrade today based on the premise assumption being dangled.

BTW I do photography work using a Dell U3011, one of the best monitor ever and once you go 30" you don't go back, also over a decade old, I'm f'd! 😫

Thanks for the entertainment, this was a joke right?

 

[Gudi]

If the 2012 "display" was separate from the "Mac" would you still continue using it for another decade?

Absolutely, the panel tech of a 2009 iMac is still good for another decade. Just this week I returned an LG 32" 4K monitor, because the colors of a VA panel with a matte finish weren't good enough. And albeit I hate the bassy speakers of the iMac, the 2023 LG monitor speakers sounded a lot worse. I'd still prefer the iMac, but not because a separate display couldn't also last a very very-long time, multiple decades indeed.

 

[jordii]

I bought one of the last 27" iMacs. Felt very smug about owning a nice 5K monitor, along with a free Mac, for $1,439. Processor is Intel, but, hey, it's fast!

But then I tasted of Apple Silicon, on a MBP. And this iMac doesn't have that loving, buttery feeling (or speed). But I'm trapped here, price-wise, due to monitor pricing. So I'm feeling the iMac squeeze from the other direction.

Would I buy a new 27" iMac if they sold them? You betcha. Even just M1. I just want to slip out of Intel's grasp. But it's likely going to be years before I can get what I want (whether iMac or as separates) without paying >$2000.

 

[Siliconguy]

After a decade's use other things break as well.

...

That's a decade's use. Time to replace everything.

The 2014 mini will have support for a decade, maybe, depending on when you bought it, but that is exceptional.

It was sold through most of 2018, so if you bought it then it's only five years old, and it only has another year of Monterey support left, that is only six years.

If you bought a 2012 Mac Pro in 2013 (because the wastebasket Pro wasn't going to cut it) support for that ended at Mohave, which came out in 2018. Add two more years of security support and now it's seven years total.

Windows 10 runs fine on a Core 2 Duo from 2009 and is still supported. Apple's long term support is nothing to commend. Their hardware does do very well. The 2002 Quicksilver still runs, though it can't deal with the web anymore.

 

[Longplays]

2020 iMac 27" Intel & 2021 iMac 24" M1 are the oldest Macs without M2 refresh.

So will we see them with M3 chips 8+ months from now?

 

[mcnallym]

2020 iMac 27" Intel & 2021 iMac 24" M1 are the oldest Macs without M2 refresh.

So will we see them with M3 chips 8+ months from now?

In one word for 27" iMac NO!
24" iMac likely when the M3 launches

Back at Apple HQ when people realise won't be a new 27" iMac (and the response from the Mac Pro users)

 

[Zest28]

What in the hell, Apple Watch is amazing with this feature.

 

[Longplays]

In one word for 27" iMac NO!
24" iMac likely when the M3 launches

View attachment 2212507
Back at Apple HQ when people realise won't be a new 27" iMac (and the response from the Mac Pro users)

Maybe I should just buy an external display to match with my 2019 MBP 16" or downgrade both for TDM.

 

[mcnallym]

OMG I don't have 4k monitors, my colour space is old, my colours look dull!!
I should upgrade today based on the premise assumption being dangled.

BTW I do photography work using a Dell U3011, one of the best monitor ever and once you go 30" you don't go back, also over a decade old, I'm f'd! 😫

Thanks for the entertainment, this was a joke right?

Still rocking the 3008 myself. Get the odd yellow line so tempted to get the U3023QE which is the current 30" 2560x1600 from Dell. I think after this time got my moneys worth out of it as bought fairly soon after launch.

With a 4K 32" then without using scaling then would be running looks like 1080p to map 4 pixels to 1 for retina.
I don't like monitors where scaling the 4K upto 5K to provide a looks like 1440p. May as well my a 1440p screen at point and 32" too big I find as that res is a 27" for me.

I find the 30" 2560x1600 a good compromise.

 

[ignatius345]

When I saw the iMac 24" I just wish there was a 27" equivalent to it even if it was "gimped" with a M1 or M2 chip.

Those chips would still outperform any i9 or Xeon at less than 110W of the whole iMac.

It would be nice if that iMac would have the same port selection as a Mac mini M2 or M2 Pro.

M2

M2 Pro

Agreed. And honestly "even" the M1 is no slouch. I blast through design work all day long on mine, nary a hiccup or beachball in sight.