i am interested to see how the prices fall for the imac line. apple really doesn't have a quality high end consumer desktop and an imac G5 would be interesting fit in that picture.
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iMac G4 no longer?
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MhzDoesMatter said:
eh??? The eMac is a masterstroke of design. The "e" stands for "education". The eMac is meant for tortuous environments with lots of sticky fingers. Whenever I talk to dealers they say "don't buy LCD for kids" - and having 4 kids (under 10), I know why!!
It is robust, all-in-one and CRT. Perfect for kids. And it doesn't look too bad.The eMac is a great example of excellent design for it's target market.
Maybe so but imac cant linger and go sour forever with 1.25 G4, i myself think this was supposed to happen sooner but since the 970fx pushed back powermac they couldnt release imac G5 until powermac was bumped up so here we are. Bump up the powermacs and say hello to Imac G5,cordless keyboard,mouse,mic and multicolor case wrapped around a 2.0 G5 and 9700 video card.( it could happen)QCassidy352 said:
I Think
I have a really strong feeling that the imac3 will look like a G4 cube with alot of glass and white in appearance (no sh*t). Plus it'll come in colours that match the ipod minis. The screen will be seperate from the machine.
I have a really strong feeling that the imac3 will look like a G4 cube with alot of glass and white in appearance (no sh*t). Plus it'll come in colours that match the ipod minis. The screen will be seperate from the machine.
The iMac needs to be upgraded, but personally I dont care what speed the G5 is, it just needs one of any speed, not because of the CPU but because of all the things that go along with it. The faster bus, and memory would be great for the iMac and beyond that a better graphics unit. If the GPU has 128MB of vid memory or more then I will be right on board for it.
LaMerVipere said:
Well, that's your opinion and you're certainly entitled to it. I should point out that I think the iMac has its place; I am not arguing that Apple should REPLACE it. Rather, I'd like to see a new low-end option at the bottom of the line.
Me, I'm trying to figure out a few things: (1) in what universe is $1,799 a "consumer" price? (2) How come, by your logic, the flat panel iMac has NEVER sold as well as the CRT iMac? (hint: price) (3) How can you convince Windows users to switch from their cheap-assed Dells, especially when they all already have perfectly serviceable monitors that they could re-use?
Seems to me, you lop off the monitor, and $400-$500 of cost, and then you have a "real" consumer machine. Right now, I think the iMac is more of a prosumer machine, and that's the real reason why it doesn't sell. Prosumers need expandability; the iMac is in a catch-22 price point.
Basically, it's a non-upgradeable machine at an upgradeable price point.
Apple has proven (with the original iMac) that if you place something at a consumer price point, it will sell like crazy, and maybe they could even gain marketshare, instead of continually falling behind.
Plus, there are a lot of 'prosumers' like me who would buy the headless iMac, just to have a decent serviceable box on our desks for backup, file sharing, music streaming, etc. I can think of 10 people right now off the top of my head who would spend $800 on a simple little low end G5 box tomorrow, if it was available. I can't think of any other realistic product Apple could announce that 10 of my friends would buy immediately.'
And to anyone who mentions the Cube: The Cube was NOT a consumer machine...It cost almost $2k...
suzerain said:
Thats been a big issue with a few posters and hopes are that the new iMac will at least allow the cpu to be replaced and the same monitor kept...
LaMerVipere said:I am very skeptical of the idea that Apple would ever release a headless iMac. At least, it wouldn't fall under the iMac banner, it would be re-branded as some new piece of hardware. The entire concept of the iMac is the all-in-one philosophy, and for consumers, this fits the vast majority of them quite well.
Apple made a headless iMac once, it was called the Cube, and we all see how well that turned out. But the current constraints when dealing with available hardware, the current computer hardware market, and pricing don't seem to spell well for a headless iMac/revamped cube concept. It would either be too expensive or not powerful enough.
Just my 2¢
First off, a headless iMac is an oxymoron as an iMac is an all-in-one.
Second, Apple never mad a "headless" iMac. An iMac is targeted at consumers (albeit the high end). The Cube was not a consumer model. It was a beautiful, over priced "pro" machine.
Third, I think Apple would sell millions of a small form factor tower. Single processor, 1 PCI slot, upgradeable video. Won't happen though. They are afraid of canibalizing PM sales and also don't want to lose the margin in monitor sales as many would opt for third party, less expensive LCDs.
Fourth, I am so buying a G5 iMac. Want the fastest chip in a 17" LCD. Will buy 20" if they force me. Knowing Apple, the bastards will put the fastest chip only in the 20".
QCassidy352 said:
Do Apple developers only write software for the PM line? Developers already had the big G5 PM announcement last year. Probably another one this year. Why not the iMac? Oh yeah, developers, now you can really start developing software that exploits the G5 since we're announcing it in our high volume line. (well, high volume until the stagnant technology in the current iMac caught up with them).
No iMacs In the Dallas Area at CompUsa
Just a quick check of the CompUsa website, I checked the availibility of the iMac at all (5) of the Dallas area CompUsa's. Not one of them have a single iMac installed. Also I checked the Chicago area, and most CompUsa's there report out of stock or limited quantities. Also the 20" cinema display is hard to find.
I will bet you $100 that the iMac will be refreshed before July 1st (my birthday), Now I have a hard decision to make, I was going to buy one of the revision-b PowerMacs, but if Apple upgraded the iMac to G5--it will make my buying decision very interesting.
Just a quick check of the CompUsa website, I checked the availibility of the iMac at all (5) of the Dallas area CompUsa's. Not one of them have a single iMac installed. Also I checked the Chicago area, and most CompUsa's there report out of stock or limited quantities. Also the 20" cinema display is hard to find.
I will bet you $100 that the iMac will be refreshed before July 1st (my birthday), Now I have a hard decision to make, I was going to buy one of the revision-b PowerMacs, but if Apple upgraded the iMac to G5--it will make my buying decision very interesting.
refurbished store.....
my first post!!!
hi all.
Just wanted to let you all know that weirdly the apple uk refurbished store (and apparantly the french apple store - read on another site forum somewhere...) was not JUST open on the usual wed. only but was also open the thursday as well and into the hours of friday morning! it was not a mistake as they even advertised it being: "Open Wednesday and Thusday!". I thought this was weird and they had a lot more stock on there as usual. I figured this was something to do with them clearing out as much stock as possibe for WWDC.
I also bothered a local apple store guy about the release of the PBG5 and he told me it has to be liquid cooled.......RAMBLE, RAMBLE, RAMBLE FOR 5 MINS ABOUT NONSENSE......and apple werent going to go back intime and use liquid! He then says (which he thought was funny for some reason!!) that "think of the price for applecare for a powerbook g5!!".
He "thinks" (apart from giving me a quote for £200 more for an pbG4 15" than apple sell it - ****...) that it will be a new chip altogether and maybe a complete redesign and make something entirely new for a pbook G5.
Well that completes my first post guys. Was two days late as couldnt post for some reason. My ibooks on the brink and john lewis want to repair it but i want a replacment!! Im sure im in my legal right to do so....
Peace,
Creative.
my first post!!!
hi all.
Just wanted to let you all know that weirdly the apple uk refurbished store (and apparantly the french apple store - read on another site forum somewhere...) was not JUST open on the usual wed. only but was also open the thursday as well and into the hours of friday morning! it was not a mistake as they even advertised it being: "Open Wednesday and Thusday!". I thought this was weird and they had a lot more stock on there as usual. I figured this was something to do with them clearing out as much stock as possibe for WWDC.
I also bothered a local apple store guy about the release of the PBG5 and he told me it has to be liquid cooled.......RAMBLE, RAMBLE, RAMBLE FOR 5 MINS ABOUT NONSENSE......and apple werent going to go back intime and use liquid! He then says (which he thought was funny for some reason!!) that "think of the price for applecare for a powerbook g5!!".
He "thinks" (apart from giving me a quote for £200 more for an pbG4 15" than apple sell it - ****...) that it will be a new chip altogether and maybe a complete redesign and make something entirely new for a pbook G5.
Well that completes my first post guys. Was two days late as couldnt post for some reason. My ibooks on the brink and john lewis want to repair it but i want a replacment!! Im sure im in my legal right to do so....
Peace,
Creative.
suzerain said:
True, but the flip side of that is, Gorgeous Mac + Crappy Dell Monitor = Poor Image + Sore Eyes = Crappy experience. The monitor is *the* most important piece of the computer; in consumer land where monitors are treated as commodities, maybe it's not all that bad a thing to force Joe Sixpack to retire the 10-year-old strobe box CRT and give his eyes a rest ...
Granted, the opposite argument is that some people actually buy quality monitors to start with, and can't use them with their iMacs ... but that's why god invented PowerMacs ...
Consumers don't need to upgrade
<sarcasm>
I agree. Why do consumers think they should have the right to upgrade their video card or hard drive. They are just lowly consumers. They aren't real professionals like the PowerMac users.
</sarcasm>
Get off your high horse dude. You better hope Apple makes a consumer line that is actually liked by the consumers or else Apple's market share will continue to drop. Consumers drive the market not professionals. And if Apple actually made a consumer friendly computer they might actually gain a little market share. Having an all in one machine with limited upgradeability and charging twice as much for it doesn't sit well with the lowly consumers.
Finiksa said:
<sarcasm>
I agree. Why do consumers think they should have the right to upgrade their video card or hard drive. They are just lowly consumers. They aren't real professionals like the PowerMac users.
</sarcasm>
Get off your high horse dude. You better hope Apple makes a consumer line that is actually liked by the consumers or else Apple's market share will continue to drop. Consumers drive the market not professionals. And if Apple actually made a consumer friendly computer they might actually gain a little market share. Having an all in one machine with limited upgradeability and charging twice as much for it doesn't sit well with the lowly consumers.
I totally agree with you
I agree totally with everything you are saying. Consumers don't want an all in one computer. They want a headless machine that they can use with their existing monitor. They want to know that if their monitor fails, they can replace it with another one.
swissmann said:
I agree totally with everything you are saying. Consumers don't want an all in one computer. They want a headless machine that they can use with their existing monitor. They want to know that if their monitor fails, they can replace it with another one.
jettredmont said:True, but the flip side of that is, Gorgeous Mac + Crappy Dell Monitor = Poor Image + Sore Eyes = Crappy experience. The monitor is *the* most important piece of the computer; in consumer land where monitors are treated as commodities, maybe it's not all that bad a thing to force Joe Sixpack to retire the 10-year-old strobe box CRT and give his eyes a rest ...
Granted, the opposite argument is that some people actually buy quality monitors to start with, and can't use them with their iMacs ... but that's why god invented PowerMacs ...
*laughing and laughing* So true! jocknerd said:
While I agree with your point that the current iMac hasn't won many hearts, I have to completely disagree with the notion that consumers drive the market and market share. The reason Apple has 5% or 3% market share is because corporations ("professionals") buy Dells and ThinkPads by the truck load.
Just look back to the CRT iMac, which was a huge consumer hit. How much did Apple's market share increase during those years?
jocknerd said:
Yeah, some do, some don't.
Imagine an iMac, made from two geometric shapes, each cast in solid brushed aluminum - an 8x8x1" thick square plane base upon which sits a 6" sphere. Glowing Apple in the front of the sphere, of course.
The top of the sphere has a 1" round trap door into which slides a mast for the adjustable LCD monitor. If you want a headless iMac, use the VGA or DVI port on the back of the base. If you want a simple all-in-one, buy the integrated screen option - the panel simply snaps into the top of the sphere, the integrated video/airport connector locks everything in place. The back of the sphere has a simple release button (with Kensington security latch, of course) for easy portabiliy.
Inside the base is the motherboard, with connectors on the back. The sphere serves as both a monitor base and a heatsink. With so much metal involved no fans are necessary to cool the 1.8GHz G5.
Somebody should recommend a decent freeware modeling/rendering package to me so I don't prattle on so much.
Fun stuff coming
Okay, so many things and so little time. I have created a new user account so I can at least have a shred of anonymity. I really don't care, but a good friend of mine can lose his job if anything I say is traced back to him. Even though I am putting some definite things in here there are some that are still listed by apple as pending and I will mark them as such. There are also a few things I will have to withhold since I guess there is a way to track who has looked at what on the apple internal site and if the userlist is small for certain subjects it's easy to know who to fire. That aside:
The "big heatsink" you are seeing in the appleinsider pictures is not really a heatsink at all. It is actually just a cover for the rather ugly piping of the liquid cooling system. It seems to be a fairly standard active cooling setup, but none of the info shows where the radiator is located.
iMacs aren't going to be G5, but they are changing a bit with them. There will still be a 15", 17" and 20" model linup, but the 15 is going widescreen and using the same screen as the PB. Speedbumps are on the way too with *pending* either 1.25 , 1.3, 1.5 OR 1.25, 1.5, 1.5 for the 15", 17" and 20" respectively. There are two different set of specs listed. Once again, only the top two models will have a superdrive. Video cards 32MB Geforce FX5200, 64MB ATI Radeon 9600, 64MB ATI Radeon 9600. Once again respective to the models. It doesn't say if the ATI's are pro or XT models though. One of the spec sheets seems to think bluetooth will be standard with the top model. Design wise they really didn't change from looking at the pictures although the border around the monitor might be a little smaller.
The LCD monitor line is being updated. The only thing is, I can only find a picture of the new 20". The 17" and 23" inch sizes are also absent on the current spec sheet. Curiously enough, on the spec sheet the 20" is to the far left and there are two blank columns to the right of it. Does this mean the 20" is now the smallest of 3 monitors or was somebody just being lazy? We don't know. Oh, the new 20" is a brushed aluminium with the familiar tripod type of design.
The best for last: What are the dang G5 speeds going to be? The answer is.... I don't know. They weren't listed, the area in the specs sheets for the processor were completely empty. Didn't even bother leaving the G5 and just leaving out the speed. Let the G6 rumors commence! What I do know is the base model now has 512MB of ram and they are probably deciding if they want to go to 1GB for the other models since it was blank. I doubt they will though, RAM is where you make money upgrading. Although a macmall deal for doubling your ram for the $40 install charge might be fun with 1GB (just kidding, the ram macmall uses is utter crap. Don't EVER do that to your precious mac.) Video cards aren't listed. Hard drives are 120GB, 250GB, 250GB. All list the 8x superdrive. The internal upgradability isn't listed, but I'm hoping for PCI Express video cards since they didn't list the rather unimportant detail of what cards they come with.
There you have it. I tried very hard to differentiate between specs that appeared set in stone and ones that seemed incomplete. Okay, time to put this account in mothballs and continue with my regularly scheduled posting.
Okay, so many things and so little time. I have created a new user account so I can at least have a shred of anonymity. I really don't care, but a good friend of mine can lose his job if anything I say is traced back to him. Even though I am putting some definite things in here there are some that are still listed by apple as pending and I will mark them as such. There are also a few things I will have to withhold since I guess there is a way to track who has looked at what on the apple internal site and if the userlist is small for certain subjects it's easy to know who to fire. That aside:
The "big heatsink" you are seeing in the appleinsider pictures is not really a heatsink at all. It is actually just a cover for the rather ugly piping of the liquid cooling system. It seems to be a fairly standard active cooling setup, but none of the info shows where the radiator is located.
iMacs aren't going to be G5, but they are changing a bit with them. There will still be a 15", 17" and 20" model linup, but the 15 is going widescreen and using the same screen as the PB. Speedbumps are on the way too with *pending* either 1.25 , 1.3, 1.5 OR 1.25, 1.5, 1.5 for the 15", 17" and 20" respectively. There are two different set of specs listed. Once again, only the top two models will have a superdrive. Video cards 32MB Geforce FX5200, 64MB ATI Radeon 9600, 64MB ATI Radeon 9600. Once again respective to the models. It doesn't say if the ATI's are pro or XT models though. One of the spec sheets seems to think bluetooth will be standard with the top model. Design wise they really didn't change from looking at the pictures although the border around the monitor might be a little smaller.
The LCD monitor line is being updated. The only thing is, I can only find a picture of the new 20". The 17" and 23" inch sizes are also absent on the current spec sheet. Curiously enough, on the spec sheet the 20" is to the far left and there are two blank columns to the right of it. Does this mean the 20" is now the smallest of 3 monitors or was somebody just being lazy? We don't know. Oh, the new 20" is a brushed aluminium with the familiar tripod type of design.
The best for last: What are the dang G5 speeds going to be? The answer is.... I don't know. They weren't listed, the area in the specs sheets for the processor were completely empty. Didn't even bother leaving the G5 and just leaving out the speed. Let the G6 rumors commence! What I do know is the base model now has 512MB of ram and they are probably deciding if they want to go to 1GB for the other models since it was blank. I doubt they will though, RAM is where you make money upgrading. Although a macmall deal for doubling your ram for the $40 install charge might be fun with 1GB (just kidding, the ram macmall uses is utter crap. Don't EVER do that to your precious mac.) Video cards aren't listed. Hard drives are 120GB, 250GB, 250GB. All list the 8x superdrive. The internal upgradability isn't listed, but I'm hoping for PCI Express video cards since they didn't list the rather unimportant detail of what cards they come with.
There you have it. I tried very hard to differentiate between specs that appeared set in stone and ones that seemed incomplete. Okay, time to put this account in mothballs and continue with my regularly scheduled posting.