iMac Pro Appears to Include A10 Fusion Chip for Always-On 'Hey Siri'

[fairuz]

I thought of this immediately as well. It seems they're leaning more towards proprietary than standard components. Not exactly what pros asked for.

They should just release decent* pro machines so the pros don't resort to building Hackintoshes. Using a hackjob machine for serious work, now that's desperate. It's hard enough making one of those things play a video in VLC with sound.

* updated more frequently than once every 4 years, options for more cost-effective consumer-grade CPUs or GPUs, user-upgradeable, actually has ports

 

[curtvaughan]

LOL. Do you keep your eyes closed all day when you go outside or when the lights are on? Because, if not, your eyeballs are being irradiated with IR for hours on end. (Half of all the sun's energy that hits earth hits as infrared).
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I don't stare at the sun, and often wear sun glasses in any case. When I'm in front of a desktop computer, I'm generally staring at it for extended periods of time from 12 to 18 inches away. As you say, LOL. Time will tell on the possible effects of repeated IR exposure over time. I'll wait a while for the lab results.

 

[Ma2k5]

In theory it sounds good, but I think virtual assistants are not quite there yet - not only due to success rate, but rather that people just don't want to talk to their machines.

I think I'd rather just look at the calender than ask Siri whats on the calender today. I'd rather just get the calculator app out and do the calculation rather than asking Siri. I can quite easily just bring up weather information, rather than asking Siri to give me it.

 

[ersan191]

In theory it sounds good, but I think virtual assistants are not quite there yet - not only due to success rate, but rather that people just don't want to talk to their machines.

I think I'd rather just look at the calender than ask Siri whats on the calender today. I'd rather just get the calculator app out and do the calculation rather than asking Siri. I can quite easily just bring up weather information, rather than asking Siri to give me it.

Don't knock it until you try it - Alexa has become an essential centerpiece in my everyday life.

 

[fairuz]

In theory it sounds good, but I think virtual assistants are not quite there yet - not only due to success rate, but rather that people just don't want to talk to their machines.

I think I'd rather just look at the calender than ask Siri whats on the calender today. I'd rather just get the calculator app out and do the calculation rather than asking Siri. I can quite easily just bring up weather information, rather than asking Siri to give me it.

It helps a lot for calendar stuff because the industry tried and failed so many times to make a good calendar UI that I'm convinced it's impossible. You always have to go through tons of menus, and both iOS and Android compound the problem with slow animations. It's so much easier with natural language. I never manually enter reminders anymore. Same with some other things like maps.

 

[asiga]

Nobody is going to create such a dual-brained machine simply for people who prefer one implementation detail over another.

Oh, no, I'm not asking Apple to design a dual heterogenous system board. It's been an Apple idea to include an A10, not mine. What I said, my reaction to Apple's idea, is "cool, give me an A10 if I can use it for running (for example) an ARM Linux virtual machine running natively on the A10, or for running natively ARM code in mach-o binaries". Otherwise, if the A10 is for Siri, or for secondary tasks, then "no, thanks, I don't want that A10 in a Pro machine". Give me more GBs of system RAM for the price of that A10.

Of course, using the A10 in a productive way would require either an heterogenous system board (expensive to design) or two system boards sharing some resources like the graphics and the disk storage (cheaper but maybe non-obvious too). But I wasn't talking about difficulties, only about what use I could give to the A10.

- Display obviously must be replaced by Apple, but external displays are supported.
- GPU cannot be upgraded, but external GPUs are supported (via Metal 2 - see https://9to5mac.com/2017/06/05/appl...it-with-support-external-graphics-vr-headset/)

Yes, my point: AiO are home machines, or even office machines, but not suitable when you are after exploiting the machine to the max for as many years as possible. That requires the previous design of the Mac Pro. The promised "modular Mac Pro" which was promised but kept in much more secret than this iMac Pro. Obviously Apple prefers to sell iMacs than Mac Pros, because people change them more often, so no wonder they keep the modular Mac Pro in secret... maybe they even prefer to cancel it.
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You appear to have a highly romanticized and extremely narrow real-world view of what a professional who uses a computer in their work, is.

It's not about users upgrading GPUs or how to service a computer that has failed, apparently believing that's the sole domain of the computer user.

Professional computer users span a huge range of disciplines. The majority of which are not tinkerers that hang out on computer forums.

Obviously, you've never seen both iMacs and (non-cylinder) Mac Pros running in the same professional environment, so you completely lack the experience on what's the consequence when an iMac fails compared to when a (non-cylinder) Mac Pro fails (the iMac needs to go to the Apple store, and perhaps it will never come back, depending on the repair price and on if Apple wants to repair it --they refuse after 5 years of purchase; OTOH, the Mac Pro is serviced within minutes in place). Also, you completely lack the experience on what happens when you need to test or use the latest NVIDIA or AMD board in your environment: You plug it in the (non-cylinder) Mac Pros, not on the iMacs (you can't).

Of course, it all depends on what you mean by "professional". I imply in-house development work because that's the professional environment I work at.
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I don't know what company you work for but everyone i have never services machines on their own, they are sent back to the manufacturer regardless of if the parts are removable or not.

Research-related company. Service always in place when it implies a simple component swap. Machines only sent to manufacturer when failure cannot be fixed in place with easily available component swap.

 

[MacGizmo]

Obviously this chip inclusion is for FaceID as well as Siri. There was no way they could include the Gimmick Bar on an external keyboard for touch ID, and they knew FaceID was the future anyway. What I want to know is how are they going to power the sensor of the camera at all times so that it wakes up from sleep when you sit down in front of the computer. Always-on camera? Motion detection sensor?

 

[citysnaps]

Dude I never misquoted go back and verify with your own posts. I don’t need to modify quotes and lie in anyway shape or form to suit any rebuttal or need you may fashionably imagine. I only boldes words for focus of why I originally quoted you.

Take the time to breathe for a few moments clear your mind of frustration then read what I typed.

I used the word outrage not rage. Never used it to change what’s YOU typed. I stated most of the outrage here (meaning the threads on iPhone OG announcement). Jesus I just can’t - you’re going off without justification or reason.

You’re putting words in my mouth and running from your own words directly quoted without any change other than bolding word-for-word what you’ve typed and now changing not only the words I’ve typed (rage vs outrage)
Yet also the meaning.

You’re not worth going over this any longer - this conversation is over.

Yup, that was a typo on my part. Rage instead of outrage. Same meaning, though. And now you seem stuck on that typo rather than addressing my point.

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

So it's a toy? An expensive toy...

 

[citysnaps]

Obviously, you've never seen both iMacs and (non-cylinder) Mac Pros running in the same professional environment, so you completely lack the experience on what's the consequence when an iMac fails compared to when a (non-cylinder) Mac Pro fails (the iMac needs to go to the Apple store, and perhaps it will never come back, depending on the repair price and on if Apple wants to repair it --they refuse after 5 years of purchase; OTOH, the Mac Pro is serviced within minutes in place). Also, you completely lack the experience on what happens when you need to test or use the latest NVIDIA or AMD board in your environment: You plug it in the (non-cylinder) Mac Pros, not on the iMacs (you can't).

Of course, it all depends on what you mean by "professional". I imply in-house development work because that's the professional environment I work at.

I completely lack the experience? Really. You sound very angry. Why? And how in the world do you pretend to know what I do or how I use computers? Or what my experience is. Yet you take the liberty to characterize, making loads of assumptions while knowing absolutely zip about me.

I have two MacPros and have been using them for around 12 years as a design and systems engineer in a variety of engineering environments (design, MatLab, analysis, simulation, chip design, etc.). Software development, too, occasionally. And some architectural design. And in the field of photography editing and post-processing image files, and book design. I have worked in environments where I've maintained my computers, and where my company has either in-house service, or service contracts for repairs and maintenance for a large company I worked for who doesn't want their engineering staff wasting time tinkering with computers. I also have a 5K iMac and a MacBook Pro.

But I'm not so self-centered to think that my computer-use universe is the only one that's deemed professional nor the only one catered to by Apple.

As I said before, a professional is one who uses their tools (including computers) in the course of their work to make money, for themselves or for their company. Feel free to think that only applies to what you do. That's very myopic and self-centered, lacking awareness and imagination. I could easily list several dozen professional work fields not including "in-house development," the particular one you happen to be working in. Let me know if you'd like me to tell you what a dozen or two of them are.

 

[Abazigal]

Don't knock it until you try it - Alexa has become an essential centerpiece in my everyday life.

Would you use Alexa in public though. It’s one thing to use the echo in the privacy of your own home, it’s another to be barking commands in public at your phone.

 

[MrUNIMOG]

I don't stare at the sun, and often wear sun glasses in any case. When I'm in front of a desktop computer, I'm generally staring at it for extended periods of time from 12 to 18 inches away. As you say, LOL. Time will tell on the possible effects of repeated IR exposure over time. I'll wait a while for the lab results.

You seem to confuse IR and UV...

UV (ultraviolet) = potentially harmful short-wavelength radiation.
IR (infrared) = harmless long-wavelength thermal radiation.

In between: The whole spectrum of visible light.

Your sunglasses probably don't block IR at all. That's why Face ID will work with most sunglasses.

 

[matrix07]

yeah.
it's better on X though with the side button.
(imo)

----

but more to the point i was trying to make-- Siri itself is better.. smarter and faster with more fluid conversation and less glitch.

she still can't do the continuation thing but for more simple communications, i'm impressed lately compared to a couple of years ago.

*by 'continuation', i mean:

"What's the capital of Alaska?" to which Siri will answer Juneau..
then ask--
"How cold is it there?" to which Siri won't recognize you're talking about the answer she gave from the previous question.

I believe the term is “contextual awareness” and I agree it’s frustrating she doesn’t have one right now.

But I also agree with you Siri is markedly improved lately & indispensable when I’m going oversea or shopping.

See 35% discount sign. Pressing Siri button:
389.99-35%=?

Went to Hong Kong recently
“How many is 385 HKD?”

I would love to see the guy who said he ditched the last thing Siri is useful to Alexa to use Alexa for these.

 

[cmaier]

I don't stare at the sun, and often wear sun glasses in any case. When I'm in front of a desktop computer, I'm generally staring at it for extended periods of time from 12 to 18 inches away. As you say, LOL. Time will tell on the possible effects of repeated IR exposure over time. I'll wait a while for the lab results.

Time will tell? Like the millions of years during which we have evolved to deal with the constant flood of ir we are exposed to, at much greater energy levels than produced by the iPhone, even when you don’t “stare at the sun?” That kind of time?

We definitely are living in a post-facts “what do scientists know”world.

 

[dippnerd]

I believe the term is “contextual awareness” and I agree it’s frustrating she doesn’t have one right now.

But I also agree with you Siri is markedly improved lately & indispensable when I’m going oversea or shopping.

See 35% discount sign. Pressing Siri button:
389.99-35%=?

Went to Hong Kong recently
“How many is 385 HKD?”

I would love to see the guy who said he ditched the last thing Siri is useful to Alexa to use Alexa for these.

This is the part people seem to miss. Each assistant has strengths and weaknesses, and ultimately there's still plenty Siri can do that the others can't, but just because you don't use those features doesn't mean Siri sucks.

Is it surprising that Google's Assistant is good at search and Amazon is good at selling stuff? Not at all. It would be nice if Siri were better at these things, but for the day-to-day tasks I use Siri for, it works without a hitch. I don't know how other folks are using it, maybe I've just trained myself around Siri's shortcomings, but I've had way better luck with my needs using Siri than Alexa (especially with Siri on the wrist). Use what works best for your needs.

 

[asiga]

I completely lack the experience? Really. You sound very angry. Why? And how in the world do you pretend to know what I do or how I use computers? Or what my experience is. Yet you take the liberty to characterize, making loads of assumptions while knowing absolutely zip about me.

It's you the one who said the iMac Pro makes sense, and I showed some of the reasons (though not all of them) why it isn't the case. However, the market will tell if the iMac Pro belongs to success or to (cylinder-like) failure. I believe it belongs to the later, but the market will tell.

I have two MacPros and have been using them for around 12 years as a design and systems engineer in a variety of engineering environments (design, MatLab, analysis, simulation, chip design, etc.)

And do you believe the iMac Pro would serve you for 12 years with the same ease of service+upgrades as your Mac Pros?

Of course you can use the iMac Pro for professional work. And the iMac. And the MacBook Air (I'm using a late 2010 MacBook Air in my professional environment). But that's not the point. The point is that if I'm investing over $5000 in a machine, I expect it to be a decade-long investment, and to be able to keep it updated with newer GPU designs. And the iMac form-factor doesn't belong to long lasting investments, nor to ease of upgrade nor serviceability.

 

[Applebot1]

What would be nice is if all my Applications ran on my iOS devices and all my Apps ran on my MacOS devices. Ooo... We could just have a unified OS that adapts to the hardware. How radical would that be! Too bad Apple is vehemently against such simplification. I really want all the power of what ever machine I'm using without the different OSs getting in the way. Apple has created Babylon with all their different OSs.

Yea even if it’s an automatic scaled down version.
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This is the part people seem to miss. Each assistant has strengths and weaknesses, and ultimately there's still plenty Siri can do that the others can't, but just because you don't use those features doesn't mean Siri sucks.

Is it surprising that Google's Assistant is good at search and Amazon is good at selling stuff? Not at all. It would be nice if Siri were better at these things, but for the day-to-day tasks I use Siri for, it works without a hitch. I don't know how other folks are using it, maybe I've just trained myself around Siri's shortcomings, but I've had way better luck with my needs using Siri than Alexa (especially with Siri on the wrist). Use what works best for your needs.

It’s quite funny as all these different AI’s claim they are smart but in reality none of them are. They currently all just a voice interface and nothing else. I personally prefer Alexa over Siri (never tried Google or Samsung equivalent) but neither are perfect just Alexa is more accurate for myself plus the family agree.

 

[Appleaker]

Don't the TouchBar MBPs have an A-series chip running the TouchBar?

As cmaier said, it’s not an a-series chip. But it’s not just the name, they are obviously completely different and for different purposes. However, they are both ARM chips.

 

[dippnerd]

It’s quite funny as all these different AI’s claim they are smart but in reality none of them are. They currently all just a voice interface and nothing else. I personally prefer Alexa over Siri (never tried Google or Samsung equivalent) but neither are perfect just Alexa is more accurate for myself plus the family agree.

Exactly, and that's the part people need to keep in mind, it's just a voice interface. It all depends on what you want to accomplish as to which will be better for you, but don't expect any of them to truly be amazing.

Regarding Alexa being more accurate, do you mean in terms of hearing your request correctly or coming back with an accurate result? If it's the former, I'd imagine we'll see an improvement in something like the HomePod where it has equal footing in terms of the mic array and such. For the latter, if you haven't tried Siri since iOS 11 it may be worth a shot, it's gotten a lot better with answers.

 

[MrUNIMOG]

As cmaier said, it’s not an a-series chip. But it’s not just the name, they are obviously completely different and for different purposes. However, they are both ARM chips.

The MacBook Pro's T1 chip (iBridge1,1) is said to have similarities to the Apple Watch's S1, which is why the "BridgeOS" running on it is derived from watchOS.
The BridgeOS running on the iMac Pro's A10 chip will probably differ.

 

[ChrisCW11]

Hey Siri....never mind, I can type a request on a computer faster then waiting for you to return a bunch of irrelevant results.

More likely the A10 will primarily be used to manage the macOS emoji library and support animoji because that is apparently what Apple thinks most Pro users care about these days.

 

[SlowX]

Is it too obvious to say I don't want Siri to be always on? She keeps trying to launch on my laptop (fat fingers), and I keep shutting it off.

 

[dfstock]

Sold. Take my money.

 

[Applebot1]

Exactly, and that's the part people need to keep in mind, it's just a voice interface. It all depends on what you want to accomplish as to which will be better for you, but don't expect any of them to truly be amazing.

Regarding Alexa being more accurate, do you mean in terms of hearing your request correctly or coming back with an accurate result? If it's the former, I'd imagine we'll see an improvement in something like the HomePod where it has equal footing in terms of the mic array and such. For the latter, if you haven't tried Siri since iOS 11 it may be worth a shot, it's gotten a lot better with answers.

More accurate in voice recognition for myself. But I suspect the HomePod will be on equal footing like you pointed out about the mic areat. However Alexa is fast becoming integrated in many products at extremely cheap pricing, so for many will be a major factor inc myself if I’m honest.

 

[dippnerd]

More accurate in voice recognition for myself. But I suspect the HomePod will be on equal footing like you pointed out about the mic areat. However Alexa is fast becoming integrated in many products at extremely cheap pricing, so for many will be a major factor inc myself if I’m honest.

I have a feeling Siri will improve significantly by being able to hear people better. Google and Amazon have much more voice data to work with, but it's not impossible for Apple to catch up. It's just ashame it may be a little too late, with all of the integration of Alexa like you pointed out. I'm still not a fan of an always-on Amazon/Google device vs a privacy-oriented Apple version, but for the money it's going to be a hard sell. I just hope they make an Echo Dot competitor soon, for the right price I'd imagine they'd do well there.