iMac Pro Compared to 5K iMac and MacBook Pro

[SgtPepper12]

Very good question. And kinda worrying. Not what you want to hear when you're considering spending £5000+

Has been answered in this thread already: The consumer grade CPUs built into the iMac line feature an integrated GPU which also contains hardware acceleration for h264 encoding and decoding. As this is hardware specifically designed to perform this task, you'll have a hard time beating this with general purpose hardware. The Xeon processor built into the iMac Pro solely relies on the floating point units and whatnot. I guess if you were to optimize the software to exploit the built-in GPU, that would definitely change.

 

[yurc]

What if Apple does something stupid like selling the drives, memory, CPU and GPU upgrades in proprietary modules that are only sold by Apple? Perhaps the memory is soldered in a module and you have to buy the module you need directly from Apple.

I'm afraid it would be like this.

Imagine single block called "module" which is very easy to install, just click and snap. Each module connected with special connector and contains different type of components. Graphics Module, Memory Module, Processor Module. All should be obtained from Apple.

If those happen, it would comes with Apple usual creative tagline such as "Defining a new way workstation" or such. Hope future doesn't sound pessimistic like me, but I'm doubt Apple want make traditional tower computer again (looking at cheese grater)

I'm just want say thanks to iMac Pro because it bring support for Vega GPUs and newer Intel CPUs. Great machine though, but I'm skip.

Instead, how about separate OSX for those workstation, Apple? Honestly I'm start sick with annual cycle of desktop operating system because sometimes new OS break some software and my workflow. It end up usually with not updating immediately or skip entirely new version one year off, except they bring useful features like support for new hardware.

Separate dedicated super stable workstation version of OSX for those machine (iMac Pro, Mac Pro) which get less update, just security patch. Let generic annual MacOS installed in light machine such as plain Macbook / air

 

[SecuritySteve]

I'm afraid it would be like this.

Imagine single block called "module" which is very easy to install, just click and snap. Each module connected with special connector and contains different type of components. Graphics Module, Memory Module, Processor Module. All should be obtained from Apple.

If those happen, it would comes with Apple usual creative tagline such as "Defining a new way workstation" or such. Hope future doesn't sound pessimistic like me, but I'm doubt Apple want make traditional tower computer again (looking at cheese grater)

I'm just want say thanks to iMac Pro because it bring support for Vega GPUs and newer Intel CPUs. Great machine though, but I'm skip.

Instead, how about separate OSX for those workstation, Apple? Honestly I'm start sick with annual cycle of desktop operating system because sometimes new OS break some software and my workflow. It end up usually with not updating immediately or skip entirely new version one year off, except they bring useful features like support for new hardware.

Separate dedicated super stable workstation version of OSX for those machine (iMac Pro, Mac Pro) which get less update, just security patch. Let generic annual MacOS installed in light machine such as plain Macbook / air

Technically that is exactly what the previous two OS versions are for.

Say you needed to buy an iMac Pro this year, and your software is stable with High Sierra but you have no idea if it will be under the new OS. You can retain your OS for two generations and still receive security patches. But after that, you will need to update.

 

[scottlitch]

I ended up buying a maxed out 5K iMac over the iMac Pro. The only exception was I went for 1TB SSD instead of 2TB, otherwise all the the RAM and GPU memory is maxed, i7 processor, etc. My price came in slightly less expensive than the iMac Pro. I realize I don't get the Full HD FaceTime camera, or the extra USB C ports, but I have 64 GB of RAM. I'm hoping that I made the right choice.

 

[ecommerceedward]

I would consider buying one if I had had a net worth > 10 million dollars.

 

[SecuritySteve]

I ended up buying a maxed out 5K iMac over the iMac Pro. The only exception was I went for 1TB SSD instead of 2TB, otherwise all the the RAM and GPU memory is maxed, i7 processor, etc. My price came in slightly less expensive than the iMac Pro. I realize I don't get the Full HD FaceTime camera, or the extra USB C ports, but I have 64 GB of RAM. I'm hoping that I made the right choice.

Completely depends on what you're using it for. For 90% of use cases, you're probably fine.

 

[yurc]

How does that project compare on an old Mac Pro 5,1 (i.e. 2012) either stock or beefed up. THAT would be a good test.

Honestly iMac Pro would destroy my old 5.1 with ease, even I can equip it with some newer components to match it (SSD GPU), probably it still bottleneck in some department.

Say you needed to buy an iMac Pro this year, and your software is stable with High Sierra but you have no idea if it will be under the new OS.

Yeah, I'm still keep intact with El Capitan and some Sierra, but planning to drop El Capitan this year. This year I have some one month free time breaks from projects and use that time to upgrading everything to High Sierra. Testing High Sierra on spare computer, it's looks good (with some tweaks) for long term in my self-evaluation.

 

[SecuritySteve]

Yeah, I'm still keep intact with El Capitan and some Sierra, but planning to drop El Capitan this year. This year I have some one month free time breaks from projects and use that time to upgrading everything to High Sierra. Testing High Sierra on spare computer, it's looks good (with some tweaks) for long term in my self-evaluation.

Good plan. El Capitan should receive security patches until this summer at the earliest, fall-winter at the latest.

 

[yoak]

I'm pulled between the 5K and the Pro. Its a lot of money for an editing station, but the reviews and comparison I have seen with RED 8K footage, the iMac Pro blows the maxed out 5K out of the water. For editing, transcode and exporting. I was set on a 5K, but as I have a 8K camera, my editing experience would be a lot more pleasant. Problem is that I hand off 80-90% of what I shoot to editors, so its a bit hard to justify the Pro price

 

[gabeo]

Why is this between the iMac Pro and a 2015 iMac??? The 2017 iMac has a much better graphics card and 7th gen (meh) Intel CPUs.

 

[macsforever]

I ended up buying a maxed out 5K iMac over the iMac Pro. The only exception was I went for 1TB SSD instead of 2TB, otherwise all the the RAM and GPU memory is maxed, i7 processor, etc. My price came in slightly less expensive than the iMac Pro. I realize I don't get the Full HD FaceTime camera, or the extra USB C ports, but I have 64 GB of RAM. I'm hoping that I made the right choice.

I would have gotten the iMP.
It depends on what you do... I need more cores.

 

[Ploki]

Are we really still calling these things "pro" machines?

you wouldn't imagine, but "pro" is defined by people who do professional work on it, not the ability to swap out a component that has negligible failure rate at this point of technological progress.

oh well.

 

[ActionableMango]

Because Intel Xeons (nor the Core i9's they are based on) do not support H.264 hardware encoding and Intel Core i5 and i7's do.

So perhaps hugely embarrassing for Intel, though in their defense the hardware encoding is actually in the iGPU and neither Xeons nor the Core i9's they are based on have iGPUs.

You can't really say that Xeons don't have Quick Sync. Some do and some don't.

In my opinion, the technical reason for the slower performance doesn't make the slower performance any less embarrassing. Even the dirt cheap N3450 Celeron (a CPU found on sub-$200 computers) has Quicksync and supports both H.264 and H.265/HEVC.

 

[ReneR]

I'm absolutely not inserted in new Macs anymore. Slow hardware update cycles, rarely something user serviceable, ... and I was shocked that the models with dedicated GPU require a secret magic EFI BIOS handshake to keep the iGPU enabled for best battery life - e.g. not enabled for Windows, and in this video I unlock it for Linux:

PS: also https://twitter.com/search?q=peakbugs

 

[macsforever]

I'm absolutely not inserted in new Macs anymore. Slow hardware update cycles, rarely something user serviceable, ... and I was shocked that the models with dedicated GPU require a secret magic EFI BIOS handshake to keep the iGPU enabled for best battery life - e.g. not enabled for Windows, and in this video I unlock it for Linux:

I’ve never run Windows on a Mac anyway kind like shooting yourself in the foot!
I do music with my Mac and it works beautifully....

 

[rafark]

It should be obvious a desktop should outperform a laptop. After all, a desktop has better thermal management, desktop class CPUs and GPUs (more cores) and more memory to work from.

Weren't iMac components more like laptop's?

 

[macsforever]

you wouldn't imagine, but "pro" is defined by people who do professional work on it, not the ability to swap out a component that has negligible failure rate at this point of technological progress.

oh well.

Yeah it seems the only reason why you’d want to be getting into a machine is to replace something that failed.

But you CAN service them... just have to know what you’re doing and there’s tons of tutorials to learn... if all these guys are saying how unserviceable iMac is there obviously into tweaking their systems and component swapping.
Just go watch a YouTube video it’s not rocket science and some of those liquid cooled systems in those gaming PCs look like a headache to me! All it takes is one leak and your “state or the art gaming PC” is toast!

 

[a.gomez]

Let me know when I can draw On them.

 

[ReneR]

I’ve never run Windows on a Mac anyway kind like shooting yourself in the foot!
I do music with my Mac and it works beautifully....

I don't use Windows for anything serious either. I use my Linux distribution: https://t2sde.org instead ;-)
PS: also runs on PowerPC: https://t2sde.org/hardware/workstation/Apple/G5/ and Sgi Octane: https://t2sde.org/hardware/workstation/Sgi/Octane/ among other things like SPARC and ARM ;-)

 

[jav6454]

Weren't iMac's components more like laptop's?

Yes and no. Entry level Macs had same laptop level components. Furthermore, due to thermal constraints, some components are laptop level. Hwoever, this Pro iMac does have desktop grade components in it. Look up part numbers and you'll be able to confirm.

 

[CWallace]

You can't really say that Xeons don't have Quick Sync. Some do and some don't.

Yes, some of the entry-level E3 series do support QuickSync since they have iGPUs. However the W-2100 Series used in the iMac Pro as well as the entire Scale-Processor line (Bronze | Silver | Gold | Platinum) do not have iGPUs and therefore do not have QuickSync. So the vast majority of Xeons - especially Xeons aimed at high-performance workstation applications (like the iMac Pro, the next Mac Pro and PC OEMs) do not support QS.

In my opinion, the technical reason for the slower performance doesn't make the slower performance any less embarrassing. Even the dirt cheap N3450 Celeron (a CPU found on sub-$200 computers) has Quicksync and supports both H.264 and H.265/HEVC.

And so Intel should be embarrassed, I guess, though I expect they knew any high-performance workstation would also have a high-performance GPU in it that could support hardware acceleration.

Weren't iMac's components more like laptop's?

The GPUs have often been either Mobile versions or down-clocked to near-mobile frequencies for thermal constraints and some models used 2.5" mobile hard drives for space considerations, but in general the CPUs have been desktop series chips as has the memory and larger models have used 3.5" desktop HDD form factors.

 

[yurc]

For people talking about quick sync absent in iMac Pro, please read this PikerAlpha blog. It a bit technical but it will give some insight and tell you custom Xeon chip used by Apple for iMac Pro contain iGPU, probably for quick sync remedy?

 

[larrylaffer]

I would love to have more details about how you performed your FCP test.

For example, where were the source clips stored when the rendering begins? And were the settings exactly the same on all three installations?

And most important of all, are you sure it didn't pre-render some of the content in the background while you were setting up your camera?

 

[bobdobalina]

I'm thinking the base iMac Pro will be a good value if purchased used one year from today. Should be around $2700 second hand by then.

 

[Prime Mover]

I just don't trust Xeons for video encoding. My company made the mistake of buying me a Mac Pro to do 10hour video exports, and it was a total mistake. They turned around and got me a second 4K iMac, which blazes past that. Xeon's are great processors, but they don't have built-in H.264 hardware codecs like i7s and i5s. For a 10hour encode it was like 25hours+ on the Mac Pro, and like 4hours on the iMac. I'm sure the new ones are faster, but not THAT much faster.