****ing Hackers and PSN

[tjb1]

And there are still plenty of reasons one may want to jailbreak a PS3. Remember how Sony allowed linux installs? Now they don't, and some just want that back.

And Sony removed that because it was a way of letting people inside and people were trying to get inside the console through this option...and here we go. Removed because they were pissing with the system in the first place now they use that as an excuse to hack it further. What were they to gain with jailbreaking when it had the OtherOS? Themes? I call bs, they arent hacking the system to put a theme on it. Believe all you want, they hack it to pirate the games.

Yes you bought the system and its yours but look at it this way.

-You buy a car with a warranty, you paid for the warranty some where in the price of the car. Lets say you put an aftermarket exhaust on, guess what? No more warranty on that unless you can return it to normal before going to the garage and the garage doesn't know/doesn't find out about it. So your warranty was just removed because you modified something you own, but a service offered to you that you paid for is now gone.

Now...you take your playstation and hack it. This allows you to play pirated games and even be able to hack the games your playing depending on what there servers check for. So you now modified the console to do something not intended from the factory...see where were going? Whoops, Sony banned you from PSN. Yes PSN is free, but isnt that what Sony is all about? They keep it free because thats an advantage over Live(NO TROLLS). PSN is not the baby it use to be when the console was $500-600 and I would say its damn near the size of Live. Does Microsoft see pity when you hack the console or a game? I remember on Halo the little message, "XXX is watching." No, they see you hacking and your banned simple as that.

I pay a lot of money for the console to play and then $60 for a game I never play offline, I hate campaign...I like playing against something intelligent. So when some jackasses come online and start hovering in the air or those ones that autoaim in blackops come in the room and completely tear a team apart it pisses me off to the point where I quit playing. The only thing I play on there is CTF, im pretty good at it and usually ranked >2000 and I play with a group that is also decent at it and then we get into a room with one of these *******s that are shooting you before they even come around a corner or sniping you across the map with a pistol. Sony should follow Microsoft, instant-permanent ban. End of story.

 

[steviem]

I agree with a lot of your sentiments, but I remember back with the original Xbox, people who cared about online gaming would have two xboxes, one which was hacked and another for online play.

The thing I don't like is when Sony took away OtherOS. Using a car analogy, this is like taking your sedan back to the dealer for a tune up and coming back seeing your back seats taken out with the back doors welded shut. They took away a feature of the console (one which was a reason for me to buy an older model because I wanted to try Linux on it) which it was shipped with and then just said too bad.

 

[chrmjenkins]

And Sony removed that because it was a way of letting people inside and people were trying to get inside the console through this option...and here we go. Removed because they were pissing with the system in the first place now they use that as an excuse to hack it further. What were they to gain with jailbreaking when it had the OtherOS? Themes? I call bs, they arent hacking the system to put a theme on it. Believe all you want, they hack it to pirate the games.

There are legitimate uses for having Linux on it. One great example is PS3 clusters for academic/military research.

-You buy a car with a warranty, you paid for the warranty some where in the price of the car. Lets say you put an aftermarket exhaust on, guess what? No more warranty on that unless you can return it to normal before going to the garage and the garage doesn't know/doesn't find out about it. So your warranty was just removed because you modified something you own, but a service offered to you that you paid for is now gone.

Irrelevant analogy. No one is complaining about their warranty being voided when they hack their console. They're complaining because Sony is trying to make it essentially illegal for them to do so.

Now...you take your playstation and hack it. This allows you to play pirated games and even be able to hack the games your playing depending on what there servers check for. So you now modified the console to do something not intended from the factory...see where were going? Whoops, Sony banned you from PSN. Yes PSN is free, but isnt that what Sony is all about? They keep it free because thats an advantage over Live(NO TROLLS). PSN is not the baby it use to be when the console was $500-600 and I would say its damn near the size of Live. Does Microsoft see pity when you hack the console or a game? I remember on Halo the little message, "XXX is watching." No, they see you hacking and your banned simple as that.

That's a risk you take. And again, people who hack aren't complaining because they're getting booted off the network. They full well recognize the risks.

I pay a lot of money for the console to play and then $60 for a game I never play offline, I hate campaign...I like playing against something intelligent. So when some jackasses come online and start hovering in the air or those ones that autoaim in blackops come in the room and completely tear a team apart it pisses me off to the point where I quit playing. The only thing I play on there is CTF, im pretty good at it and usually ranked >2000 and I play with a group that is also decent at it and then we get into a room with one of these *******s that are shooting you before they even come around a corner or sniping you across the map with a pistol. Sony should follow Microsoft, instant-permanent ban. End of story.

And sony following microsoft doesn't mean they have to sue the hackers of their consoles.

 

[0098386]

According to some article on Joystiq; this wasn't Anon but Sony's attempt to rebuild PSN after some hackers created a method for acquiring free games on PSN.

 

[tjb1]

There are legitimate uses for having Linux on it. One great example is PS3 clusters for academic/military research.



Irrelevant analogy. No one is complaining about their warranty being voided when they hack their console. They're complaining because Sony is trying to make it essentially illegal for them to do so.



That's a risk you take. And again, people who hack aren't complaining because they're getting booted off the network. They full well recognize the risks.



And sony following microsoft doesn't mean they have to sue the hackers of their consoles.

Ok you dont seem to follow simple logic.

1. PS3 had OtherOS
2. Little hacker kids like geohot found potential ways in via OtherOS
3. Sony removed OtherOS because of that
4. Now little kids crying because Sony shut that road down

And I didnt mean about losing warranty of the console, I mean when you get banned/removed from a service then tough luck. And Sony should be suing the hackers who found these keys, its illegal and it opens up a whole world of pirating whether you like to hear it or not...its what it is, PIRATING.

 

[steviem]

Ok you dont seem to follow simple logic.

1. PS3 had OtherOS
2. Little hacker kids like geohot found potential ways in via OtherOS
3. Sony removed OtherOS because of that
4. Now little kids crying because Sony shut that road down

And I didnt mean about losing warranty of the console, I mean when you get banned/removed from a service then tough luck. And Sony should be suing the hackers who found these keys, its illegal and it opens up a whole world of pirating whether you like to hear it or not...its what it is, PIRATING.

And no, 3 was exactly the wrong way of going about it. The update should have been to fight against the hack whilst keeping that feature. It's a shoddy way of protecting their interests by hurting the many because of the few.

It isn't little kids crying about a road being shut down, grown adults who know the difference between right and wrong, who know what they bought has had a feature stolen have been airing their grievance with Sony.

This should have been the chain of events:

1. PS3 had OtherOS
2. Little hacker kids like geohot found potential ways in via OtherOS
3. Sony fixes the vulnerability in OtherOS
4. People using OtherOS keep using it. People just learning about this great feature start using it too and learn about Linux.

Remember there is another event in your timeline which is missing. Geohot still found a way of hacking the PS3 despite OtherOS being absent. The moment this happened, Sony has made him promise never to hack their console again (wtf), they should bring back OtherOS because there were and are other vulnerabilities in their system in addition to those in OtherOS.

 

[Rapmastac1]

And Sony removed that because it was a way of letting people inside and people were trying to get inside the console through this option...and here we go. Removed because they were pissing with the system in the first place now they use that as an excuse to hack it further. What were they to gain with jailbreaking when it had the OtherOS? Themes? I call bs, they arent hacking the system to put a theme on it. Believe all you want, they hack it to pirate the games.

Yes you bought the system and its yours but look at it this way.

-You buy a car with a warranty, you paid for the warranty some where in the price of the car. Lets say you put an aftermarket exhaust on, guess what? No more warranty on that unless you can return it to normal before going to the garage and the garage doesn't know/doesn't find out about it. So your warranty was just removed because you modified something you own, but a service offered to you that you paid for is now gone.

Now...you take your playstation and hack it. This allows you to play pirated games and even be able to hack the games your playing depending on what there servers check for. So you now modified the console to do something not intended from the factory...see where were going? Whoops, Sony banned you from PSN. Yes PSN is free, but isnt that what Sony is all about? They keep it free because thats an advantage over Live(NO TROLLS). PSN is not the baby it use to be when the console was $500-600 and I would say its damn near the size of Live. Does Microsoft see pity when you hack the console or a game? I remember on Halo the little message, "XXX is watching." No, they see you hacking and your banned simple as that.

I pay a lot of money for the console to play and then $60 for a game I never play offline, I hate campaign...I like playing against something intelligent. So when some jackasses come online and start hovering in the air or those ones that autoaim in blackops come in the room and completely tear a team apart it pisses me off to the point where I quit playing. The only thing I play on there is CTF, im pretty good at it and usually ranked >2000 and I play with a group that is also decent at it and then we get into a room with one of these *******s that are shooting you before they even come around a corner or sniping you across the map with a pistol. Sony should follow Microsoft, instant-permanent ban. End of story.

What this argument comes down to seems to be flying right over people's heads. The "anon" isn't bringing the PSN down because some guy got banned for modding his console. They are attacking because Sony is taking legal action against him. Essentially saying he cannot do what he wants with what he owns.

This has nothing to do with him getting banned from the PSN, that's a given. This is about consumer rights and being able to do what you want with what you pay for.

Your analogy would make more sense if after you put on your aftermarket exhaust, the car company not only took away your warranty but then tried to take you to court for modding the exhaust in the first place. That is just wrong. That's what this whole thing is about.

 

[chrmjenkins]

Ok you dont seem to follow simple logic.

1. PS3 had OtherOS
2. Little hacker kids like geohot found potential ways in via OtherOS
3. Sony removed OtherOS because of that
4. Now little kids crying because Sony shut that road down

And I didnt mean about losing warranty of the console, I mean when you get banned/removed from a service then tough luck. And Sony should be suing the hackers who found these keys, its illegal and it opens up a whole world of pirating whether you like to hear it or not...its what it is, PIRATING.

And you don't seem to grasp the concept of logic. I've told you repeatedly that the consequences of jailbreaking are irrelevant when it comes to the legality/entitlement of users doing it.

In fact, the government has gone so far as to make a law legalizing it.

http://www.appleinsider.com/article...phone_jailbreaking_for_unauthorized_apps.html

Of particular note:

Other exemptions announced Monday allow people to break protections on video games to investigate or correct security flaws;

 

[tjb1]

Because they are doing that to find security flaws in the game...

You believe everything you read in the news or do you actually have some common sense?

 

[chrmjenkins]

I believe in the rights of the consumer, it's as simple as that. Most others do too.

 

[tjb1]

So you believe some little ass can hack the console, distribute the key to everyone then 30% of the online community is running hacked then in games like Black Ops they are shooting semtex out of a smg?

 

[kidwithdimples]

Does the PS3 even have worthwhile games? Also, use your computer to play online. You'd be surprised how much better things look and gamePlay is.

pretty sure most users have a mac here. mac and gaming doesn't go together quite well.

 

[chrmjenkins]

So you believe some little ass can hack the console, distribute the key to everyone then 30% of the online community is running hacked then in games like Black Ops they are shooting semtex out of a smg?

It's the console manufacturer's fault for making their system exploitable and for not banning him sooner rather than later.

 

[jav6454]

And I was right. Sony just admitted hackers may have stolen credit information and other things. They also admit they found about it during a two day span.

Sony is ridiculous. They should take their no-games console of market and be sued into oblivion by users. (the later statement is just a matter of when not if). Sony should have seen this coming, should have prepared like all major companies do when they hold financial and personal information like that.

#FAIL

 

[Abyssgh0st]

Here's what Sony UK indicates was exposed:

Name
Shipping address
Billing address
Country
E-mail address
Birthdate
PSN/Qriocity ID
PSN/Qriocity password
PSN/Qriocity security question and answer
Purchase history

Source

 

[mikelegacy]

You're an idiot if you think Anonymous did this. They are about the people, and they could care less about your personal information (which is what was hacked into). They took down the PSN multilpe times in the few weeks leading up to this, but it was ALWAYS a DDoS attack (which just overloads the servers and shuts them down temporarily). Most likely a hacker took the opportunity to do this so it looked like it was them.

Even after Sony's announcement today, I STILL believe that they screwed up their network because of the Portal 2/Steam merger. I bet they are just covering their asses.

 

[mikelegacy]

Ok you dont seem to follow simple logic.

1. PS3 had OtherOS
2. Little hacker kids like geohot found potential ways in via OtherOS
3. Sony removed OtherOS because of that
4. Now little kids crying because Sony shut that road down

And I didnt mean about losing warranty of the console, I mean when you get banned/removed from a service then tough luck. And Sony should be suing the hackers who found these keys, its illegal and it opens up a whole world of pirating whether you like to hear it or not...its what it is, PIRATING.

Obviously you know nothing. Geohot originally jailbroke the PS3 in order to bring back options that have been available, or should be available, like playing PS2 games. The hardware is there, SONY is just to cheap to write the software for it.

What Geohot did was not illegal, and that is proven in the fact that there was a settlement in court (he basically got a slap on the wrist). If Sony's million dollar lawyers thought they could have won, they would have taken the case to court, not settled behind closed doors.

 

[maflynn]

Here's what Sony UK indicates was exposed:

Name
Shipping address
Billing address
Country
E-mail address
Birthdate
PSN/Qriocity ID
PSN/Qriocity password
PSN/Qriocity security question and answer
Purchase history

Source

You forgot Credit card number and expiration date

If you have provided your credit card data through PlayStation Network or Qriocity, to be on the safe side we are advising that your credit card number (excluding security code) and expiration date may also have been obtained.

 

[cuestakid]

Out of curiosity, I called sony today and I learned a couple things

1. Sony obviously cannot delete anyone's data right now (no surprise) and even if they could, parts of that data would remain (though also not surprising to geeks, will anger others).

2. When people call, Sony has prepared a statement for their people to read (not at all shocking) and sounded beyond rehearsed.

3. While they are doing a best effort to establish who specifically has been effected, that is all it is-they may not get everyone and they very likely will miss people and are simply asking people to check their credit activity.


I don't frequently use the Playstation Network in any real manner-I have bought a couple things but thats it. I don't play online or engage in anything like that. Nevertheless, this is a major breach and the amount of data that may have leaked is significant and the fact that someone could get in so easily and shutdown a worldwide network for almost two weeks is scary.

 

[cuestakid]

You forgot Credit card number and expiration date

and SSN-since they already have who i am, they mine as well get my paychecks

 

[GFLPraxis]

The **** with geohot has been settled and they continue to **** with Sony and it's users. This leaves a bad taste in my mouth for the morons that are doing this.

Hold on now. Anonymous has decried involvement, and in fact specifically were targeting Sony sites and NOT PSN. Further, the hacks don't seem to be motivated in protest. The hacks stole information. Sounds like a criminal, not someone proving a point.

They're are many many users on PSN and to do this because SONY had every right to put that idiot Geohot in his ****ing place and they feel that they need to get revenge on the entire PSN. What tools.

Hold the phone. Sony had no right to sue Geohot. Geohot opened up the PS3 to user modification and nothing else. This is legal, unless you think iPhone unlocking should be a felony. Other people- people Sony SHOULD sue- made tools based on Geohot's work to pirate. Geohot did nothing wrong, and never even agreed to the EULA.

If he'd won his case, it'd have been fantastic for consumers, giving us the right to modify our own devices. Sadly, we'll never know, due to the settlement, but it was the best move for Geohot.



Hopefully they catch whoever hacked PSN; whoever it is is a criminal and I'm nervous about my potential information being stolen. :/

 

[GFLPraxis]

You're an idiot if you think Anonymous did this. They are about the people, and they could care less about your personal information (which is what was hacked into). They took down the PSN multilpe times in the few weeks leading up to this, but it was ALWAYS a DDoS attack (which just overloads the servers and shuts them down temporarily). Most likely a hacker took the opportunity to do this so it looked like it was them.

Even after Sony's announcement today, I STILL believe that they screwed up their network because of the Portal 2/Steam merger. I bet they are just covering their asses.

If Anonymous was behind this, we'd find all our personal information up on a torrent. xD

Historically, on the rare occasions anyone in Anonymous actually hacked (as opposed to DDOS'ing) anything (almost always a poorly secured server), they dumped all of the contents on to a torrent for the public to disseminate. See HBGary.

 

[tigres]

This is major.

Sony may have a very hard time digging out of this one. Reports are stating this could cost them an avg of 384 per person, or 24bil.

And a black eye. I still have not received an email notifying me of the potential threat of my information being compromised.

Wtf are they thinking over at HQ? Keep quiet and it will go away?

 

[Pink∆Floyd]

Dudeeeeeeeeeeee, its been forever now!

I hope the kid who has been playing Black Ops nonstop since it first came out managed to get a gf by now....lol I can imagine him sitting in his couch with his hands trembling

Sony herrrrrooooooooo! Big boi!!! like a somebooooooooottyyyyyyyyyyyy!!

 

[cuestakid]

This is major.

Sony may have a very hard time digging out of this one. Reports are stating this could cost them an avg of 384 per person, or 24bil.

And a black eye. I still have not received an email notifying me of the potential threat of my information being compromised.

Wtf are they thinking over at HQ? Keep quiet and it will go away?

If you are indeed compromised-that is your CC or other similar information, they must do it in writing-this is a federal law so while email is nice, they must legally let you know in writing. So the best you can do until PSN is up or you get a notification is to check your financials every day and report any weird charges.

But until either of those happens we can all only wait for the network to come back up and hope that we don't see charges for a "sport fishing Magazine".