Intel Announces 'Sandy Bridge' Core Processors

[63dot]

You needn't spend time telling me how rad the OS is. If I didn't agree with you, I'd be buying an i7 laptop for the cost of a white MacBook, maybe less.



See, this is why I call you a fanboy. Because Fanboys don't just buy new things because they can. They also have zealous loyalty to what it is that they're fans of. And to put that much faith and emphasis into Apple's engineering to the point where you discount spec updates is either you being naive or zealously loyal. To say that the OS makes ALL of the difference is either naive or zealously loyal as well. I'm sorry. Either way, it's a somewhat ignorant position. Apple's machines could afford to be faster. Sure, the software is fast. And sure it goes well with the hardware. But it could always be better. And to suggest the stunting of its growth because it's plenty fast is just downright naive.




Incomplete definition of what a fanboy is, see above. You still qualify given your posts on these forums.



The software is nothing without hardware to run it. Snow Leopard's release is a testament to that as future features will require future hardware. Advances in features under the hood are just as important, if not more important, than the OS, despite the fact that the OS is the reason why we use the hardware. Apple sees itself as a hardware company, which is no different than Asus, Dell, Lenovo, HP, Toshiba or any of the others. Apple lures people in by being the only hardware manufacturer to ship a personal computer with a user-friendly alternative to Windows, let alone the only manufacturer to **** THEIR user-friendly alternative to Windows.



Uh, you clearly don't know much about Asus then. Good engineering does cost more. But their engineering really isn't THAT much better than the competition. Unibody and battery advances I'll grant. But otherwise, they're all using boards manufactured by Foxconn, just like the rest of the industry.

I pretty much agree with all your answers to the above poster.

However, in the second to the last paragraph (above) you go on to say what is under the hood is as, or more important than the OS? Did I hear you right? Do you mean that Apple sees itself as a hardware company? I don't get that at all. It's about the most ridiculous thing I have heard about Apple (post iTunes, post OS X) on these forums. Apple makes hardware, software, operates the very successful iTunes store, and means so much to so many people. If you want hardware, think of a hard drive company or a company that makes LCDs.

Fanboys or not, most people know that what makes Apple different is their OS. You can find plenty of white or silver laptops, and whether they copy Apple or the other way around, it's the lack of MS Windows which makes Apple great, or not so great depending on how one perceives their experience with the operating system.

Otherwise, I agree with about 99% percent of what you are saying.

 

[em.zarate]

Apple wants to make machines that work fast,stable and are beautifully engineered and designed. They don't focus only on the hardware like many other companies do. FAST HARDWARE ARE USELESS ON A BAD OS. This is how they think.

having the intel x1300 on my previous macbook was a very smooth experience for me. farmville ran perfectly

/sarcasm

 

[Yebubbleman]

I pretty much agree with all your answers to the above poster.

However, in the second to the last paragraph (above) you go on to say what is under the hood is as, or more important than the OS? Did I hear you right? Do you mean that Apple sees itself as a hardware company? I don't get that at all. It's about the most ridiculous thing I have heard about Apple (post iTunes, post OS X) on these forums. Apple makes hardware, software, operates the very successful iTunes store, and means so much to so many people. If you want hardware, think of a hard drive company or a company that makes LCDs.

Fanboys or not, most people know that what makes Apple different is their OS. You can find plenty of white or silver laptops, and whether they copy Apple or the other way around, it's the lack of MS Windows which makes Apple great, or not so great depending on how one perceives their experience with the operating system.

Otherwise, I agree with about 99% percent of what you are saying.

I, personally don't agree that they're a hardware company as the software is unarguably what makes their hardware special. It was something they were quoted as saying. I think Steve Jobs himself has said it a couple of times. Again, I don't agree, but they certainly do place more of an emphasis on their hardware as the self-enclosed experience of their software. Meh, it seems to be working for them.

 

[Red33m]

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1. You can't call me a fanboy because you don't know how I spent my money and if they are being spent on Apple products. All I have from Apple is the iPhone 3GS and a Nano G1 2GB black. But I am using a Mac in almost daily basis. My PC runs Win7 and Ubuntu 10.4 .

2. You are a fanboy because you said it yourself in another reply to me.

3. I am not a fanboy just for accepting the truth. And it isn't hard to see the truth. I have( like most) been a PC user for years and I at last saw that the job on Windows OS is half finished. So of course I moved on to Linux. Which is absolutely amazing. The fastest startup out there for free. Have been using Ubuntu with Gnome desktop and KDE and both are astonishing. Only trouble is that they are unstable because I am not that good at programming..so I end up ruining the system in the end.

4. So after researching all the given choices to Windows I finally decided to move on to Apple and saw that it combines the base of Linux with the ease of Windows. I repeat. I don't own one. I just use one really often. I still can judge them though.

5.And don't BS me that I don't see what the other ones have to offer. Were you gonna change if you could? No. Exactly. I prefer like you a Mac over a Vaio. So I don't waste my time reserching what the others have to offer like I used to because I will end up disappointed by Windows and installing Linux once again. I have better things to do instead.

6. Even if Apple and Asus are using the same boards. Someone is doing his job better than the other one. Do you agree? I think you do. But you just disagree with me just because you want a flame war in the end.

 

[63dot]

I, personally don't agree that they're a hardware company as the software is unarguably what makes their hardware special. It was something they were quoted as saying. I think Steve Jobs himself has said it a couple of times. Again, I don't agree, but they certainly do place more of an emphasis on their hardware as the self-enclosed experience of their software. Meh, it seems to be working for them.

I think one of the great things about Apple is that it's hard to tell where one starts and the other begins. They are a very viable package on the inside and out, and their advertising isn't so bad, either. Even when they seem to mistake facts or diss Windows/Microsoft in unfair ways, Apple finds a way to do it with flair. Their "Hi, I am a PC and I am a Mac" guys was a brilliant ad campaign.

I love the part where the PC guy freezes. In reality, I haven't had any freeze-ups since Windows 95 and Windows 3.1, but probably only because I always had to maintain Windows 98. From Windows NT 4.0 and Windows 2000 on, things have been pretty good and it's not as bad as that dude who plays the PC on the funny Apple commercials.

 

[Red33m]

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I totally agree with you on that. This is why I just look at Macs. Because of the OS. But the other guy just doesn't seem to understand...Or he does it on purpose.

 

[Red33m]

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Apple wants to make machines that work fast,stable and are beautifully engineered and designed. They don't focus only on the hardware like many other companies do. FAST HARDWARE ARE USELESS ON A BAD OS. This is how they think.

having the intel x1300 on my previous macbook was a very smooth experience for me. farmville ran perfectly

/sarcasm

Fast smooth and reliable it was your MB.

But like all computers it has an expiration date. You can't use that statement you did as a comeback.

I mean Macintosh 1 isn't fast nowadays either right?

 

[nickane]

FWIW, a fanboi, to my mind, is someone who defends Apple even when they're clearly screwing us over more than usual and Red33m fits that bill a lot more readily than Yebubbleman, who I mostly agree with.

Apple's USP is the design. Whilst they excel at both hardware and software design, its the latter that sells their products, but since the OS comes free with the former, its hardware sales that directly generates their revenue.

I, for one, would not pay the Apple tax for the hardware design alone (ie if every computer ran Windows 7, I wouldn't buy a MBP), but would probably keep paying it if Apple's had ASUS-styling. Nevertheless, (and BACK ON TOPIC!!) I will not be getting my wife a White Macbook until the processor is less than a year old, cos what's under the hood contributes to the performance and longevity of what is undoubtedly an over-priced entry-level product.

 

[Yebubbleman]

1. You can't call me a fanboy because you don't know how I spent my money and if they are being spent on Apple products. All I have from Apple is the iPhone 3GS and a Nano G1 2GB black. But I am using a Mac in almost daily basis. My PC runs Win7 and Ubuntu 10.4 .

How you spend your money doesn't affect how much of a fanboy you are.

2. You are a fanboy because you said it yourself in another reply to me.

You're right. I am an Apple fanboy. Though, like you, I don't own every Apple product, and I believe that I originally said that your post made you look like a tool, not a fanboy.

3. I am not a fanboy just for accepting the truth. And it isn't hard to see the truth. I have( like most) been a PC user for years and I at last saw that the job on Windows OS is half finished. So of course I moved on to Linux. Which is absolutely amazing. The fastest startup out there for free. Have been using Ubuntu with Gnome desktop and KDE and both are astonishing. Only trouble is that they are unstable because I am not that good at programming..so I end up ruining the system in the end.

I have a Toshiba laptop running Ubuntu fairly reliably with no trouble. You don't need to be a programmer to run Ubuntu, you just need to be able to read forums and follow directions. It's just as stable as Mac OS X, just sans the apps.

4. So after researching all the given choices to Windows I finally decided to move on to Apple and saw that it combines the base of Linux with the ease of Windows. I repeat. I don't own one. I just use one really often. I still can judge them though.

Fair play, though I lol at "ease of Windows".

5.And don't BS me that I don't see what the other ones have to offer. Were you gonna change if you could? No. Exactly. I prefer like you a Mac over a Vaio. So I don't waste my time reserching what the others have to offer like I used to because I will end up disappointed by Windows and installing Linux once again. I have better things to do instead.

When I can build a Hackintosh with way faster innards for a third of the cost and the end result is that I'm running the same Mac OS X that we all know and love just on a way faster computer, it is absolutely fair to compare Apple's hardware to what could be inside instead. To blindly assume that they are doing their best is ignorance and stupidity. I'm sorry.

6. Even if Apple and Asus are using the same boards. Someone is doing his job better than the other one. Do you agree? I think you do. But you just disagree with me just because you want a flame war in the end.

It is my personal wish that everyone get along, online and offline. I don't like flaming people. Nor do I like disagreeing with people, let alone people who don't see all sides of the issue. Yes, Apple's engineering is rad. Yes, Apple's software is rad, but I (a) completely disagree that alone shouldn't justify that price for the complete package, no matter how amazing it is, and (b) firmly believe that with better hardware on the market, the $2,000 that I was going to spend on my soon-to-be MacBook Pro should be a better MacBook Pro than it currently is today. As for your counter-comparison regarding Apple and Asus, if both manufacturers are using boards made by Foxconn, then how can you say that one was better or worse engineered than the other; THEY WERE MADE BY THE SAME COMPANY!

I totally agree with you on that. This is why I just look at Macs. Because of the OS. But the other guy just doesn't seem to understand...Or he does it on purpose.

You're insane. I love the OS, but I'm not so shortsighted that I don't focus on hardware running the OS. Sure, the OS is what's amazing, but it's the hardware that Apple is charging me the arm and a leg for. I work hard for that arm and that leg, therefore I don't see it as being unreasonable to both follow and gripe about the hardware I'm paying that for.

 

[Red33m]

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Dude..you have pretty fair points there against me.

What though I want you to answer is that: How come Apple is screwing all of us over? I mean MBP are not fast enough? Yes they are. Don't tell me that a 17" MBP doesn't fit everyone needs in power...It's just that a really fast MBP is really expensive.But this is how Apple have always been. Real fast machines cost $$.

I can see nothing bad about that..neither a screw up here. It's like Mercedes. The "cheap" models which cost a fairly more than it's rivals are not even closely as fast as for example a Mustang which costs far less and has much more bhp. But in the end the Mercedes is a better car..though is you want a fast Merc. You have to have loads of cash.

Please tell me if you disagree because I can see nothing wrong in the way Apple acts right now.

 

[Eidorian]

Dude..you have pretty fair points there against me.

What though I want you to answer is that: How come Apple is screwing all of us over? I mean MBP are not fast enough? Yes they are. Don't tell me that a 17" MBP doesn't fit everyone needs in power...It's just that a really fast MBP is really expensive.But this is how Apple have always been. Real fast machines cost $$.

I can see nothing bad about that..neither a screw up here. It's like Mercedes. The "cheap" models which cost a fairly more than it's rivals are not even closely as fast as for example a Mustang which costs far less and has much more bhp. But in the end the Mercedes is a better car..though is you want a fast Merc. You have to have loads of cash.

Please tell me if you disagree because I can see nothing wrong in the way Apple acts right now.

Everyone loses when you bring in a car analogy.

 

[AidenShaw]

It's just that a really fast MBP is really expensive.But this is how Apple have always been. Real fast machines cost $$.

Yes, an infinite amount of money still can't buy a quad core Macbook Pro....

Seriously, the MBPs are OK for midrange laptops - except that their prices are top end.

Keep the MBPs, but someone needs to tell Apple that there's a market for a high-end range of systems where performance, storage, and connectivity are more important than "thin" and "long battery life".

That, and add a Blu-ray burner and full support for BD playback.

The Starbucks crowd won't buy these systems, but a boatload of professionals in imaging/video/audio will.

 

[Red33m]

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I just see no SLOW MBP.

I mean what the heck do you want to run with the MBP that is so hard that even an i7 can't handle it? Games.? I think you are in the wrong place. Always a PC is better on that section(only on that section) because you can always upgrade (A LOT). Autocad? It can run like a charm. There is nothing that can't run fast on a Mac so I see no reason of disappointment. Though if you want to run autocad on a MBP 13"..of course you can't.

Now these guys who just start winning about the fact that it could have been faster guess what..it can always be faster...if you want something else built it on your own. No one forces you to buy Mac...so there is just no point at all in complaining. You don't like it don't buy it. That simple.

If a fanboy in here is the one accepting that truth. Heck..I am a fanboy.

 

[Red33m]

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It's just that a really fast MBP is really expensive.But this is how Apple have always been. Real fast machines cost $$.

Yes, an infinite amount of money still can't buy a quad core Macbook Pro....

Seriously, the MBPs are OK for midrange laptops - except that their prices are top end.

Keep the MBPs, but someone needs to tell Apple that there's a market for a high-end range of systems where performance, storage, and connectivity are more important than "thin" and "long battery life".

That, and add a Blu-ray burner and full support for BD playback.

The Starbucks crowd won't buy these systems, but a boatload of professionals in imaging/video/audio will.

Have you actually talked to an actual professional? My friend is a student architect and all of his proffessors have MBP and MP. He has a 21" iMac. They never ever complain about the power because it is enough for running what they need it to.

Real Pros don't give a damn if the machine they work on could have been faster IF THE ONE THEY USE FITS THEIR NEEDS.

 

[Eidorian]

Have you actually talked to an actual professional? My friend is a student architect and all of his proffessors have MBP and MP. He has a 21" iMac. They never ever complain about the power because it is enough for running what they need it to.

Real Pros don't give a damn if the machine they work on could have been faster IF THE ONE THEY USE FITS THEIR NEEDS.

Education is a rather bad example given the number of acquisition loopholes and grant money. Failing that, there usually a session logged into something churning away in a closet somewhere. Even thin clients are a remote session away from 4 or more processors.

Time is money and money buys processing power. There are certain things that you just can't get from Apple even with infinite money.

 

[Red33m]

Yes, an infinite amount of money still can't buy a quad core Macbook Pro.... .

This is exactly your problem. You don't see what Apple has to offer..you wish Apple had this to offer.

This is not how stuff works though mate..you like the product you buy it..you don't like it..then don"t buy it.

 

[Red33m]

Education is a rather bad example given the number of acquisition loopholes and grant money. Failing that, there usually a session logged into something churning away in a closet somewhere. Even thin clients are a remote session away from 4 or more processors.

Time is money and money buys processing power. There are certain things that you just can't get from Apple even with infinite money.

Yeah right..this is it 30 minutes faster rendering in videos is going to make you money..

Guess what pal..if you buy and buy and buy all the time by hoping that a faster computer will give you better working efficiency then you are so naive..BECAUSE ALL YOU DO IS LOSE YOUR OWN MONEY AND MAKE STEVE HAPPY!

In order for an arcitect to succeed all is needed except a decent amount of processing power is IMAGINATION..and that my friend money can't buy

 

[Hellhammer]

Yeah right..this is it 30 minutes faster rendering in videos is going to make you money..

It is if you have a dozen of other videos and clients waiting.

BECAUSE ALL YOU DO IS LOSE YOUR OWN MONEY AND MAKE STEVE HAPPY!

Nobody said anything about Steve or Apple.

In order for an arcitect to succeed all is needed except a decent amount of processing power is IMAGINATION..and that my friend money can't buy

Last time I checked, architects weren't the only professionals who use a computer for work purposes. You don't need much imagination when working with video or audio for example, but you sure appreciate the every extra bit of processing power that you can get.

 

[Eidorian]

Yeah right..this is it 30 minutes faster rendering in videos is going to make you money..

It does for me. Not that I make enough for a living on it.

Guess what pal..if you buy and buy and buy all the time by hoping that a faster computer will give you better working efficiency then you are so naive..BECAUSE ALL YOU DO IS LOSE YOUR OWN MONEY AND MAKE STEVE HAPPY!

Never read Barefeats and avoid the Mac Pro forums. They might even go down your throat there.

Frankly, I don't see anything wrong with Uncle Steve making money if his company has earned it. On the other hand if you're reading Barefeats and are concerned about performance you're more than likely making plenty of money, just love looking at benchmarks to be informed, or both.

In order for an arcitect to succeed all is needed except a decent amount of processing power is IMAGINATION..and that my friend money can't buy

Here we go again with the usual heart of an artist trip.

I'm not an artist and if Apple could get its UI consistency together instead of having people drool over it (or bemoan the inconsistencies) maybe they'd realize how gray and utilitarian it is. Straight lines with a few curves never got more attention as art. I'm a fan of Baroque and Neoclassicism. Then again I'm just a Liberal Arts major working in IT.

The more you know. Broaden your horizons a little.

 

[Red33m]

Trying to prove what pal?

As you can see..you are way out of subject.

I proved that maximum working efficiency isn't succeeded just because you have a fast computer and then you come with some Baroque bs to prove what?

 

[Red33m]

It is if you have a dozen of other videos and clients waiting.

Buy a Mac Pro then..this can handle it..for sure. It is a wrong buy if you choose MBP in this occasion..someone with that many needs sure have the money to buy one right?

 

[John.B]

Everyone loses when you bring in a car analogy.

I LOL'ed!

 

[Yebubbleman]

Dude..you have pretty fair points there against me.

What though I want you to answer is that: How come Apple is screwing all of us over? I mean MBP are not fast enough? Yes they are. Don't tell me that a 17" MBP doesn't fit everyone needs in power...It's just that a really fast MBP is really expensive.But this is how Apple have always been. Real fast machines cost $$.

I can see nothing bad about that..neither a screw up here. It's like Mercedes. The "cheap" models which cost a fairly more than it's rivals are not even closely as fast as for example a Mustang which costs far less and has much more bhp. But in the end the Mercedes is a better car..though is you want a fast Merc. You have to have loads of cash.

Please tell me if you disagree because I can see nothing wrong in the way Apple acts right now.

They're not as fast as they can be and therefore they are not as fast as they SHOULD be. Apple should be putting out the best product that they possibly can. I don't think even they disagree with this sentiment, they just have really good marketing which allows for them to not go all the way in that regard and still sell tons for the cost.

I just see no SLOW MBP.

I mean what the heck do you want to run with the MBP that is so hard that even an i7 can't handle it? Games.? I think you are in the wrong place. Always a PC is better on that section(only on that section) because you can always upgrade (A LOT). Autocad? It can run like a charm. There is nothing that can't run fast on a Mac so I see no reason of disappointment. Though if you want to run autocad on a MBP 13"..of course you can't.

Now these guys who just start winning about the fact that it could have been faster guess what..it can always be faster...if you want something else built it on your own. No one forces you to buy Mac...so there is just no point at all in complaining. You don't like it don't buy it. That simple.

If a fanboy in here is the one accepting that truth. Heck..I am a fanboy.

You're a fanboy for being that pro-Apple, but you're a tool for claiming it to be appropriately fast for the cost. And I know that I have the option of not buying it, you serve no purpose to remind me of that. I'll buy one anyway, but given the money I'm spending versus what the competition could've provided me, I think I'm justified in griping.

That said, if I wanted to run a program that was cross-platform (like Photoshop, or Premiere), I could have a much faster PC laptop running it for the same cost as a low-end MacBook. $1000 buys a Core i7 laptop from Asus and a Core 2 Duo (white) MacBook from Apple. That's not cool.

Have you actually talked to an actual professional? My friend is a student architect and all of his proffessors have MBP and MP. He has a 21" iMac. They never ever complain about the power because it is enough for running what they need it to.

Real Pros don't give a damn if the machine they work on could have been faster IF THE ONE THEY USE FITS THEIR NEEDS.

I AM a professional. I use my Mac for video editing AND gaming AND EVERYTHING! Even after I off-load the gaming duties to my PC tower (which is twice the power of a 27" iMac for half the cost, mind you), it'd still be nice to do all of those other tasks with minimal lag. And as software evolves, so must the hardware that runs it. So, yeah, it fits my needs now, but if I'm spending $2000 on it, I want it to fit my needs FOR YEARS, and the best way to do that is to run it on updated hardware.

This is exactly your problem. You don't see what Apple has to offer..you wish Apple had this to offer.

This is not how stuff works though mate..you like the product you buy it..you don't like it..then don"t buy it.

At this point, you are impossible to take seriously. I have NO OTHER CHOICE! If I want to buy a Mac laptop with a discrete GPU, my only option is the MacBook Pro. That's it. I have no choice. There is no choice. I'd like it to be better, but I have no choice but to buy it. Though as a paying customer, I can and will complain. I fail to see how you don't understand that.

Guess what pal..if you buy and buy and buy all the time by hoping that a faster computer will give you better working efficiency then you are so naive..BECAUSE ALL YOU DO IS LOSE YOUR OWN MONEY AND MAKE STEVE HAPPY!

What does that even mean?!

 

[Hellhammer]

Buy a Mac Pro then..this can handle it..for sure. It is a wrong buy if you choose MBP in this occasion..someone with that many needs sure have the money to buy one right?

Some people need portability and Mac Pro does not offer that. If you have the $, then you will likely have both, Mac Pro and MBP but not everyone can afford two computers. Even if you have a Mac Pro, you might prefer the fastest MBP you can get if you need to do your work while on the go.

Just because you don't need more CPU speed doesn't mean that nobody does.

 

[pr5owner]

I LOL'ed!

i agree its ridiculous to even have a car analogy unless all the engines were standardized to no more than 5 models, the brakes all need to be identical, the wheel sizes, the make and manufacture of the rubber needs to be cut down to 1-3 choices

a core i7 running at 1.7GHz is going to have an identical benchmark with every other i7 cpu of the same model and same speed

a 3.8L V6 is not going to be the same as the next

Hyundai's 3.8 puts out 312HP
buick's pos 3.8L only puts out like 205HP

same with V8's,
Ferarri 4.3L = 500+HP
Mercedes 4.3L V8 = 429HP

not even close