Intel Launches First Eighth-Generation Core Processors, Paving Way For Quad-Core 13-Inch MacBook Pro

[0990848]

It's very confusing, but the planned 8th gen lineup appears to consist of:
Cannon Lake: Ultra Mobile processors
Kaby Lake refresh: The just announced 15W and 28W processors
Coffee Lake: The 35w and higher processors

I agree the roadmap is confusing but according to Wikipedia, Cannonlake will go all the way up to 95W. So if thats to be believed, Cannonlake might have some desktop parts. But I doubt it.

So I think what we'll see is

1) CFL being skipped since it won't support LPDDR4/GT3e graphics (at least it doesn't right now) and Apple goes to CNL for MBPs, which would debut next WWDC. And then, because CNL may not have desktop parts, Apple goes with CFL in the fall for the iMac refreshes or better yet, hopefully Ice Lake will be ready by then. Or

2) CFL chips with LPDDR4/GT3e graphics are made available next year which Apple will then use CFL for their MBP lineup, and CNL for their MacBook lineup (given they are ultra lower power). iMacs will remain unchanged, getting either CFL or Ice Lake, hopefully Ice Lake.


All in all though, I'm just hyped for quadcore 13'' MBPs regardless of whatever chip, eGPU support, and the rumoured Apple Display

 

[curmudgeonette]

These aren't going to use DDR4? [...] but DDR 4 is just plain nitpicking on Intel's part

DDR4 and LPDDR4 are totally different things. Please don't confuse them.

DDR3, DDR3L, and DDR4 are laptop/desktop memory. LPDDR3 and LPDDR4 are mobile phone memory. The memory interface of LPDDR3 is very similar to DDR3, and thus it is easy to make a memory controller that supports both. This allowed Apple to use LPDDR3 for its sleep mode power savings. Unfortunately, the interface for LPDDR4 is dramatically different. Hence, the lack of support by Intel for LPDDR4.

 

[Jayayess1190]

I agree the roadmap is confusing but according to Wikipedia, Cannonlake will go all the way up to 95W. So if thats to be believed, Cannonlake might have some desktop parts. But I doubt it.

So I think what we'll see is

1) CFL being skipped since it won't support LPDDR4/GT3e graphics (at least it doesn't right now) and Apple goes to CNL for MBPs, which would debut next WWDC. And then, because CNL may not have desktop parts, Apple goes with CFL in the fall for the iMac refreshes or better yet, hopefully Ice Lake will be ready by then.

2) CFL chips with LPDDR4/GT3e graphics are made available next year which Apple will then use CFL for their MBP lineup, and CNL for their MacBook lineup (given they are ultra lower power). iMacs will remain unchanged, getting either CFL or Ice Lake, hopefully Ice Lake.

I think:
Macbook's will use Cannonlake.
Macbook Pro 13.3 will use a 28W Kaby Lake Refresh.
Macbook Pro 15 will use Coffee Lake.

It is likely Cannonlake only is available in 4.5W Y series, Coffee Lake for parts above 15W, and then with Ice Lake it scales from 4.5W Y Series upwards.

 

[CWallace]

TDP?

Thermal Design Power. It's the maximum amount of heat generated by a CPU during "regular" applications and what most standard cooling systems are designed to dissipate.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_design_power

 

[Appleaker]

15 W.
[doublepost=1503351814][/doublepost]

Do we know this for a fact? This first batch doesn't have any parts suitable for MacBook Pros.

It has been leaking since August of 2016, while the models suitable for the 13” MacBook Pro have not been announced, I can guarantee at this point that the ones suitable will be quad-core. Although the information on 28W is scarce, you can bet those will be quad-core too. 45W is officially moving to 6-core.

 

[Ener Ji]

Malcolm Owen at AppleInsider mentioned that if Apple adopts Cannonlake, they could offer 32GB in the MBP and at least early-on Cannonlake was to be offered in desktop form-factors with TDPs in the 90W range (equivalent to the i5-7600 and i7-7700 used in the current 5K iMac). However, Intel has been changing their roadmaps on a regular basis, so who knows what will really ship in what process.

Interesting. I think he might be mistaken, but no one knows for sure until Intel confirms things. The take I most agree with (e.g. at AnandTech and Ars) is that Cannon Lake is going to be the first production architecture launched on 10nm+, and due to manufacturing difficulties it's going to be limited to the smallest and easiest to manufacture "Y" chips, which Apple doesn't use on the MacBook Pro. (Therefore, even if it does support more than 16GB of RAM, Apple won't be launching a "MacBook" with more than 16GB of RAM while the MPB stays at 16GB.)

Then, by the time Intel has figured out their 10nm+ process, Ice Lake should be ready to launch. So rather than expand Cannon Lake beyond ultra-low-power "Y" processors, Intel will jump straight to Ice Lake. This is all speculation, but it's informed speculation that makes a lot of sense to me.
[doublepost=1503354491][/doublepost]

I agree the roadmap is confusing but according to Wikipedia, Cannonlake will go all the way up to 95W. So if thats to be believed, Cannonlake might have some desktop parts. But I doubt it.

So I think what we'll see is

1) CFL being skipped since it won't support LPDDR4/GT3e graphics (at least it doesn't right now) and Apple goes to CNL for MBPs, which would debut next WWDC. And then, because CNL may not have desktop parts, Apple goes with CFL in the fall for the iMac refreshes or better yet, hopefully Ice Lake will be ready by then.

2) CFL chips with LPDDR4/GT3e graphics are made available next year which Apple will then use CFL for their MBP lineup, and CNL for their MacBook lineup (given they are ultra lower power). iMacs will remain unchanged, getting either CFL or Ice Lake, hopefully Ice Lake.

I think that Wikipedia info is way out-of-date, back before everything slipped by two+ years. The way Wikipedia works is you need sourced information to correct things, and there's been very little verifiable info recently that would specifically correct the "up to 95W" information.

I hope Apple doesn't skip Coffee Lake because it's supposed to be a fairly impressive bump for 15" MBP, increasing to six cores / 12 threads. I'm hoping for a "silent" update which updates the MBP this Fall with CFL and Kaby Lake refresh.

There's also that rumor about Apple offering a MBP with up to 32GB of "desktop" RAM this Fall, which is entirely possible based on available chips. Battery life would go down, but could be mitigated slightly if they figured out how to squeeze that previously planned extra-large battery inside and / or GZO display technology is ready, which saves on power.

 

[BWhaler]

ars technica measured 13 hours of Wi-Fi browsing battery life for the 2016 13-inch MacBook Pro.

And certainly more than that "while sitting idle".

That article refers only to the MacBook, not the MacBook Pro, which was the focus of my post.

 

[Falhófnir]

Well in theory Cannonlake is supposed to scale to 95W (so it could be used from the MacBook to the iMac), but who knows with Intel. I expect what is actually released as Cannonlake will depend on how successful the 10nm process is at launch and then we'll see either "Cannonlake-Refresh" or Icelake CPUs once the process is fully matured.

Yeah seems like intel has bungled it a bit on the clarity part, I mean Coffee Lake = 8th gen on 14nm and Cannonlake = 8th gen on 10nm (which was what I thought was happening) was alright, but introducing this Kaby Lake refresh, and having that as a part of the new generation, messing around with configurations and keeping stuff really vague is making this massively over complicated

Hoping they can pull it all back together on one uniform process with Icelake....

 

[bodonnell202]

AMD's Ryzen platform looks like it could provide real competition to Intel's Core series so I think Intel is scrambling a bit to get new stuff into the pipeline in a mix of pre-emptive and pro-active response.




Well in theory Cannonlake is supposed to scale to 95W (so it could be used from the MacBook to the iMac), but who knows with Intel. I expect what is actually released as Cannonlake will depend on how successful the 10nm process is at launch and then we'll see either "Cannonlake-Refresh" or Icelake CPUs once the process is fully matured.

I think initially they are only going to make 2+2 cores with Cannon Lake (thus Y series and maybe some lower end U series) since it is easier to focus on smaller chips until yields improve. We may see other versions of Cannon Lake later, but I think Coffee Lake is meant to fill that gap and they'll just bring everything to the same process with Ice Lake (sort of like what they did with Broadwell, were they focused on mobile chips and continued to sell Haswell as well, and then brought everything back to the same architecture with Skylake.

 

[Mrumors]

The processors announced today aren't likely to appear in any Apple product. With GT2 graphics they're not going to be used in a 13" MacBook Pro, and with a 15W TDP, they won't appear in a MacBook either.

It does look like a future Surface Book would be well suited for them. Even Intel's marketing video thinks so.

 

[Honumaui]

I miss the days of hearing about new chips and you can get them first in a mac

I hate the windows interface or I would jump and the hackintosh is to crippled and pain for serious work for me IMHO others might be fine

really sad what has happened to apple on the computer side

the laptops are the best of the best by a long shot though but to bad they are not cutting edge anymore

almost at the point of going to both windows for heavy lifting of photos and graphics and my video needs are minimal and use laptops for business and daily chores which sucks as the mac pros did so well for 10 years and last 3 all of us have been limping hoping for rescue to only realize we are abandon

 

[bodonnell202]

Intel marketing's ability to make even the simplest things absolutely inscrutable never ceases to amaze me. Would it have killed them to have one "lake" for the eighth generation? And to at least pre-announce whether Iris Plus 15W parts are coming at all?

Honestly, I was ok when I thought the 8th gen lineup would include Cannon Lake for the ultra mobile chips and Coffee Lake (with more cores, and from my understanding, the same features as Cannon Lake on a mature 14 nm process) for everything else. Now throwing in a Kaby Lake refresh and calling it 8th gen as well makes it seem messy from my perspective. Sure, give us quad core 15 w Kaby Lake processors, but they should still be 7th gen.

 

[Falhófnir]

(sort of like what they did with Broadwell, were they focused on mobile chips and continued to sell Haswell as well, and then brought everything back to the same architecture with Skylake.

Maybe that's what's causing confusion, I believe they did eventually bring out broadwell H series but they were only on the market for a month or two before being superseded. In this case I don't think cannonlake will be getting any models higher than 15w U series, as you noted.

 

[920R]

Hear me out: when the next Mac Pro is finally here, they'll rename the mini to: Mac. With the iPhone and iPhone Pro, there entire line will have Pro and regular variants.

The are saving the mini for this

No, they are letting the Mini die on the vine like bad grapes. There are other more competent options right? Why are they not available. Why does the Mini sit out 3-5 generations of chip advances before they update it? It's the redheaded stepchild of the line.

 

[usarioclave]

My MBP 2011 i7 is still chugging away. I'd like the faster CPU, but this MBP has so much stuff that it's now irreplaceable. I slapped an SSD into it, and for daily use it's no slower than my wife's RMBP.

Too bad I can't drop a CPU into it.

 

[Appleaker]

The processors announced today aren't likely to appear in any Apple product. With GT2 graphics they're not going to be used in a 13" MacBook Pro, and with a 15W TDP, they won't appear in a MacBook either.

It does look like a future Surface Book would be well suited for them. Even Intel's marketing video thinks so.

I don’t think you are understanding this, they didn’t mean those specific models are suitable but there are many variations of chips that are 15W, the point was that Intel has announced 15W quad-cores, and they are suitable for the 13” MacBook Pro. There will be models of U-series it’s gen chips that have GT3e graphics, more information will be released in the coming weeks.

 

[Matt Leaf]

Excuse my ignorance but how come PC laptops already have LPD4 and 32gb but Macs seemingly can't

 

[satchmo]

Put it in a Mac mini. Please.

Maybe Apple was just waiting for a suitable quad-core processor before updating the Mac mini.

Sadly, I don't see it happening.

 

[TheAppleFairy]

Of course! I just bought my MBP a week ago so it makes sense a new one is right around the corner... Oh well. Can't say I'm longing for more performance considering my work flow.

There is always a new computer right around the corner. That being said I just bought a 15 inch MBP a month ago, I would have gotten a 13 inch if a quad core with similar specs was available. I guess maybe my next computer in 5 years or so.

 

[tedthedev]

So, two things.

One, if that's true, it makes no sense for them to launch the 12-inch Retina MacBook, or the 13-inch MacBook Pro without Touch Bar. Those will eventually move to around $999-1299, competing with the iPad Pro.

Two, while there's clearly some overlap between a tablet with keyboard accessory and a laptop, surely there's virtually no overlap whatsoever between a tablet and a desktop.

First, Apple doesn’t seem interested in dropping the current gen MacBook to $999. It’s been 3 generations at he $1299 entry point, and Apple seems pretty happy with sales of MacBooks so I doubt they will drop it.

Second, if you compare the Mini and the iPad from a mobile perspective, you are right - there isn’t much overlap.

But there is a lot of overlap in the types of customers who buy the mini and the iPad. Both aren’t power users and are probably cost conscious. They’re primary usage for a mini/iPad is probably email, web surfing and watching YouTube videos.

Clearly Apple sees the benefit of raising the cost of entry in to the Mac ecosystem to $1299 (right outside the most expensive iPad Pro combo pkg) and leaving the $500-1300 window for iPads. Obviously, this doesn’t account for the Air, which exists as a zombie in the lineup so Apple can have a low cost laptop for students.

 

[Ener Ji]

No, they are letting the Mini die on the vine like bad grapes. There are other more competent options right? Why are they not available. Why does the Mini sit out 3-5 generations of chip advances before they update it? It's the redheaded stepchild of the line.

Yep, just like the Macbook Air.

Excuse my ignorance but how come PC laptops already have LPD4 and 32gb but Macs seemingly can't

They aren't, those laptops with 32GB of RAM are using regular DDR4 memory that provides worse battery life. Apple is (thus far) apparently unwilling to make that compromise. There is an analyst rumor that says they might be changing their mind on that, so we'll see.

 

[DeepIn2U]

You're not going to see an updated Mac mini, for one simple reason.

The Mac mini occupied the $499 - $1299 price point. The main reason Apple hasn't updated the Mac mini in so long is because it wants to push Mac users who are looking to spend that amount of money over to an iPad/iPad Pro. Apple has doubled down on the iPad and pulled out all the stops to stem the steady decline in sales, and with the slight bump they got this last quarter, seem to have finally moved the needle, if only slightly.

Apple clearly sees that price point as needed to be vacant on the Mac so they can goose the iPad sales.

So I wouldn't hold my breath for an updated Mac mini.

new MBP for me until there's one with 32GB. It's a little bit silly at this point. I'm rarely away

To quote a movie ....

On the iPad Pro ... we/you/nobody can code using XCode or Swift completely natively, not yet. Close with Playgrounds. Also cannot install SDK's from other environments like that for Hexa. Unless Apple makes a 17" iMac with current i5 Core and specs - I don't want an iMac. Not really ... iMac Pro looks BITCHING but at the cost of regular and Pro iPad I might as well get a MBP 13" TB with 512GB PCIe storage and Core i7 16GB RAM.

 

[2IS]

But there is a lot of overlap in the types of customers who buy the mini and the iPad. Both aren’t power users and are probably cost conscious. They’re primary usage for a mini/iPad is probably email, web surfing and watching YouTube videos.

Pretty much. Web, email and YouTube make up about 80% of my iPad usage. The remaining 20% going towards apps for my DJI drones.

 

[efktd]

No new MBP for me until there's one with 32GB. It's a little bit silly at this point. I'm rarely away from a power outlet for more than an hour at a time, and would gladly sacrifice half of that 10 hours of battery life in return for increased memory capacity.

I was shopping for a new MBP for this upcoming fall semester. I went with a used 2015 spec'd out 13". Paid $1200 for it.

 

[ls1dreams]

What's the big deal for Cannonlake from the user's perspective? I know it's 10nm, but are we really expecting much performance jump? I mean getting 2 more cores on the kaby lake refresh/coffee lake seems like a huge jump on its own.

On the other hand, I am trying to hold out for AV1 hardware decoding if I can.