Investor Carl Icahn Dumps Apple Shares Over China Concerns

[pondhopper]

So Apple turns itself around, innovates.
Investors perk up their ears...throw money at Apple
then crush innovation.
Rinse.
Repeat.

 

[shk718]

Not trying to force my views upon you, but there's a certain presidential candidate that would like to stop the unfair trade we have with China.

I don't think we should stop trade with China, but, I think we need to send them a strong message.

 

[mytdave]

Excellent. Now maybe Apple can operate with less antagonistic influence, and can maybe reverse some of their more stupid decisions.

 

[shk718]

Maybe it's because they're sick of the US spying on them and trying to turn protesters into rebels?

As if they're not spying on us????

 

[bekiil]

Icahn by doing this basically says that money talks, and freedom walks.

 

[maxsix]

I'm going to get hate but Tim was the best choice given the death of Steve Jobs. The future of Apple depends on a visionary at the helm. Steve was the visionary and the worlds best salesman.

You are absolutely correct!

It's easy for the layman to sit back and take shots at Tim, this forum is filled with "experts". However the fact is... he not only performed in a stellar fashion earning Steves confidence and respect, but he had the courage to take the challenge of stepping in upon Steves death.

A daunting task, facing legions of Jobs worshippers...

No man or woman following in Jobs footsteps would be welcomed. All would be scrutinized, and here we are years later with what essentially is (still) a very successful mega corporation, a giant amongst it's peers.

Steve... The Worlds Best Salesman? Yes Indeed!

The warm fuzzy myth of SJ as the tech guru is far less accurate than the fact that he built Apple primarily via his outstanding world class sales expertise. He created the priceless cult like Followers that would buy anything Apple, and would submit to being told Steve knew better than they did. Like little kids they looked up to their God, worshippers that to this day still regurgitate his sayings.

He selected and nurtured certain individuals, turning them into customer facing "experts". David Pogue, greybeard Walt Mossberg the NY Times / Wall St. Journal "Tech Expert" and Pro-Apple shill. It goes on and on.

Perhaps the finest salesperson in the entire world... Steve Jobs built the Apple we know today.

The future is but a huge question at this juncture. One things for certain, Apple is filled with talent, Apple has the ability to attract the best talent in the world, Apple has massive cash reserves, Apple is the world's best Brand.

Apple will be just fine.

 

[RogueWarrior65]

From the asshat who wanted Apple to increase its buyback program to drive up the price so he could dump it afterwards. The man has zero interest in the company or its products. Buh bye.

 

[v0lume4]

I don't think we should stop trade with China, but, I think we need to send them a strong message.

Oh for sure. I agree with you. I wasn't trying to imply we should stop trade with anyone. But we should make things more fair. "Fair trade" doesn't seem so "fair" between us and some of our trade partners.

 

[shk718]

We're not "giving" them money. We're paying them for their work (from which we benefit much, much more than they do).

Company owners often talk like that, too, as if they are handing out charity when they sign pay checks. It always makes me mad.

How about rephrasing it: " Why should American companies choose to employ "cheap" Chinese manufacturing firms when they, at a moments notice can disrupt our busines/economy?" Apple makes phones in China and has to go thru hoops to sell them there. And lets not forget the time and money spent monitoring them for human health violations. China abuses its own citizens, its own corporations and American corporations.

 

[theluggage]

I have never been able to understand AAPL's valuation and strange price movement (relative to comparable stocks).

To quote a comment allegedly found in the Unix source code: "You are not supposed to understand this."

There was an episode of Sliders set in a world where the finance industry consisted of rooms full of expensively suited and booted men sitting around poker tables. That's totally unrealistic of course: game theory is quite advanced and the science of poker is far better understood than the chaos of the stock market

 

[H2SO4]

This guy is as evil as it gets. He buys enough shares to have an influence and makes a quick buck in expense of the companies future. He probably talked Tim into buying back extra 50 billion dollars worth a shares or more. So he could make his 2 billion and peace out. Thank guys like him for 16gb iPhones, 5400rpm iMac, etc...

Fail. If Tim allowed himself to be talked around then more fool him. What you’re telling me is that you can see through him but Timmy and his minions can’t?
Apple have always wildly over charged for memory and drives and anything else you can think of, in fact long before Icahn was around.

Get a grip man.

 

[Toltepeceno]

Fail. If Tim allowed himself to be talked around then more fool him. What you’re telling me is that you can see through him but Timmy and his minions can’t?
Apple have always wildly over charged for memory and drives and anything else you can think of, in fact long before Icahn was around.

Get a grip man.

Won't happen, its the us. No more personal responsibility. If its good news then people are drooling on cook, if its bad then its the fault of everyone else in the world.

Selling stock because its falling is normal, I have yet to see where this guy is running apple.

Some people stay and get rich because they know how it works, I think if most posters here had a billion dollars to put in the market they would be broke again in no time.

 

[Shlooky]

Good riddance!

 

[Rocketman]

It's time for regular people to buy Apple now down near $92-3. AAPL starts its new buyback program today.

Put a trailing stop at 135. Target 45% return in a year. 2.4% yield while you wait.

 

[Costino1]

Apple's bubble has burst sadly, the lack of innovation is showing - I got an iPhone 6S and there is no ground breaking technology in it as such - Pressure sensitive screen is nice but still I rather it be waterproof or bigger battery. 16 GB is stupidly small also...
I remember having a iPad 3 and it's probably my pinnacle Apple Product. It never Crashed, it was lighting fast (not as slow as its now), it looked good (still does I think) and I used it and loved it!
My Macbook Pro crashes randomly, It feels incomplete in some places in the os (looking at you app store, iTunes, external keyboard, mouse support), but then again I prefer it to my Windows 10 laptop (god that is just awful)
My iPhone works mostly but the batter is no where special on it, the camera could have been better and should have been more waterproofed (like they are more water proof than iPhone 6 but I mean Apple Watch quality). The Samsung Galaxy S6 edges out the iPhone I hate to say and I could have well ended up with a Samsung Galaxy S6.

Apple - "Forward Thinking" and "Think different" seems to fade away

Apple's innovation came with Tablets and phones. Not much more to innovate in those two key segments. Phones are thin enough. The screens are sharp enough. They're fast enough. They're not exciting anymore.

The backseat approach Apple is taking on their computers is also lackluster. Im an owner of the new Macbook, and again its simply the Macbook Air put through a hydraulic press to make it slimmer. Apple's form of innovation today is thinner and lighter....that's it.

People want the next big thing.... the next big thing to shake up the market. I have no clue what it will be. It won't be a car. The general public can't afford a $40k electric car like they can afford a subsidized $199 iPhone.

Apple has so much cash in the bank they'll be safe for quite some time, but how long til they get boring like IBM...like Microsoft? I can remember when I couldn't wait for the new Windows to come out and make my computer feel like a brand new computer. MS got stale and that feeling went away with each new update, just like the iPhone updates.

 

[procksa49er]

I'm am SO much looking forward to that happening. Then it will be time for China to pay the piper!

Trump: "China your all *hand gesture* HUUUUUUUGE Idiots we are not trading with you any longer!
China: "Okay so, please remit all debts owed us immediately"

Us trying to stick it to them vs them calling in all debts.... YEhhhhhhh USA loses that battle badly, so I hope there is something besides Trump's you suck message.

 

[Toltepeceno]

For folks who think Apple is done innovating I have one point to make.

2Q 2015: R&D $1.9 billion
2Q 2016: R&D $2.5 billion

$600 million more was spent in R&D last quarter than a year ago. And this trend of increased R&D spend has been going up for a while. Apple is cooking up some stuff. There is no doubt about this. We all know it is a Car. But it is probably several other things done and at a large scale. By way of comparison, Tesla's R&D in a YEAR is $700 million. Apple is increasing every quarter its R&D (on a year by year comparison) by a Tesla basically. They aren't spending that kind of money so they can make a thinner keyboard for the MacBook.

Point made. Apple is not done spending money in the R&D department. LOL

Seriously though I would not go by the numbers, R&D is a tax write off that a lot of companies take advantage of. I think it would be dumb to say they have no research and development, but I would not completely go by the numbers companies report.

 

[TallManNY]

You're wrong. Only the top 10% have any appreciable ownership of stocks and real estate. The 90% live paycheck to paycheck and earn 0% on their savings. They have been left out of this so called recovery.

Right. But the bottom 90% are not part of the "savers". The start of this conversation was that the US government had done wrong by the savers. And that isn't true. The savers are doing fine as the stock market and real estate holdings have increased in value while inflation has been low for nearly 30 years now.

 

[Toltepeceno]

Trump: "China your all *hand gesture* HUUUUUUUGE Idiots we are not trading with you any longer!
China: "Okay so, please remit all debts owed us immediately"

Us trying to stick it to them vs them calling in all debts.... YEhhhhhhh USA loses that battle badly, so I hope there is something besides Trump's you suck message.

Point out where Trump as ever said he would stop all trade with china. Waiting. Being spoon fed is always better than investigating, right?

We will cut a better deal with China that helps American businesses and workers compete.

The Trump Plan Will Achieve The Following Goals:

1. Bring China to the bargaining table by immediately declaring it a currency manipulator.
2. Protect American ingenuity and investment by forcing China to uphold intellectual property laws and stop their unfair and unlawful practice of forcing U.S. companies to share proprietary technology with Chinese competitors as a condition of entry to China’s market.
3. Reclaim millions of American jobs and reviving American manufacturing by putting an end to China’s illegal export subsidies and lax labor and environmental standards. No more sweatshops or pollution havens stealing jobs from American workers.
4. Strengthen our negotiating position by lowering our corporate tax rate to keep American companies and jobs here at home, attacking our debt and deficit so China cannot use financial blackmail against us, and bolstering the U.S. military presence in the East and South China Seas to discourage Chinese adventurism.

I'm not even in the us or a voter and I am smart enough not to fall for the taking points from those that will lie to promote their agenda.

I'm not a trump fan but I don't fall for the moveon.org talking points either. I do think the us needs a more level playing field with china. I also do not think clinton or sanders would provide that.

You are the one that brought politics into it.

 

[TallManNY]

Point made. Apple is not done spending money in the R&D department. LOL

Seriously though I would not go by the numbers, R&D is a tax write off that a lot of companies take advantage of. I think it would be dumb to say they have no research and development, but I would not completely go by the numbers companies report.

These are fully audited numbers, first by Apple's accountants and then, later by the US government's accountants. You can trust these numbers as much as you can trust any financial numbers from a company. And since Apple is not at all under financial duress they have less incentive to fudge numbers than some other companies, so I'd trust them more than average.

The main point is that amount of R&D is enormous and also increasing a significant rate year over year. Not long ago at all (like four years ago) Apple used to have yearly R&D spend that was about what they spend quarterly now.

 

[Toltepeceno]

TYou can trust these numbers as much as you can trust any financial numbers from a company.

LOL, my point exactly. They ALL do it. Apple is not a god, they are a company in it for the money. They are ALL fully audited numbers. LMAO

 

[Dmunjal]

Right. But the bottom 90% are not part of the "savers". The start of this conversation was that the US government had done wrong by the savers. And that isn't true. The savers are doing fine as the stock market and real estate holdings have increased in value while inflation has been low for nearly 30 years now.

So just screw the 90%? The 10% have discretionary savings and they smartly put it into real estate and equities. The 90% tries to save what they can but are getting screwed by Fed with 0% interest on their savings.

http://seekingalpha.com/article/174993?source=ansh

"The drop in interest rates from 5% to 1% represents an annual income loss to savers of $400 billion dollars per year."

That went straight into the banks and Wall Street. That's a transfer of wealth driven entirely by misguided policy.

 

[TallManNY]

Trump: "China your all *hand gesture* HUUUUUUUGE Idiots we are not trading with you any longer!
China: "Okay so, please remit all debts owed us immediately"

Us trying to stick it to them vs them calling in all debts.... YEhhhhhhh USA loses that battle badly, so I hope there is something besides Trump's you suck message.

Debt doesn't get called that way. It is due when the bonds are due, not whenever you feel like it. China can stop buying new US debt, but they will still have huge amounts of US dollars from their trade surplus and they have to put those dollars somewhere. And the US is not dependent on foreigners buying US debt because the U.S. has the ability to issue as many US dollars as it wants. Issuing more US dollars would cause inflation (but that has been low for decades) and would weaken the US dollar abroad (but the US dollar is really strong and weakening it would make the US products more competitive internationally which is not something China wants).
[doublepost=1461944183][/doublepost]

So just screw the 90%? The 10% have discretionary savings and they smartly put it into real estate and equities. The 90% tries to save what they can but are getting screwed by Fed with 0% interest on their savings.

http://seekingalpha.com/article/174993?source=ansh

"The drop in interest rates from 5% to 1% represents an annual income loss to savers of $400 billion dollars per year."

That went straight into the banks and Wall Street. That's a transfer of wealth driven entirely by misguided policy.

I'm not saying that. I'm liberal and believe the US government should do more for the little guy and the middle class. I'd like to see more inflation and better returns in savings banks and such. So I think we are on the same page there.

 

[BornAgainMac]

After watching the scene where he fought Master Yoda, I think he would have lost more than his Apple shares if he didn't use the Force to distract Yoda with saving Ben and Anakin from being crushed.

 

[wschutz]

I'm actually happy that he's gone.

Next up: get him off of eBay.

He will be back. This guy is amazing... he made some cash, and he has been waiting to buy again (to make more cash) and clearly he is not happy with the projection of cash he could make so he, in his regular speech, makes some statement to make people sell a bit more so that he can buy cheaper.

Speculation they call it... and he will be back to AAPL as soon as the price is good enough for his pocket. And we will hear about him with some crap of the potential that the share so that he reaches his objective price to sell again. And on... and on...