iPad 2 not really thinner

[Night Spring]

You're STILL arguing over semantics. This is what I've been trying to avoid from the first page where I first stated this. The whole thread is not about the title, but you keep making it out to be again and again.

I've said that the title is my opinion. If you decide to read it to mean that the iPad 2 is not physically thinner, then you need to check your reading comprehension because that's not what I've been saying.

Also, it's presumptuous to say that there is one and ONLY one way to read a sentence.

You asked where the contradiction is, and I explained that the contradiction is between the title of the thread and the contents of your posts, which do not say the same thing.

And while some sentences are complex and can be taken to have more than one meaning, some sentences are quite simple and can only have one possible meaning. Your thread title is a simple sentence with only one possible meaning.

But who am I to try and.convince you I am right and you are wrong? You think you are right and I can't change your mind. You'll go right on believing I'm wrong and you are right. Such is the nature of online discussion! Oh, well. I tried.

 

[vincenz]

This is where the whole thing falls apart. Your argument in this paragraph is:

- There's a "damn good" visual illusion. (note: visual illusion = look that deceives or contradicts the physical reality)
- Apple's doing a brilliant marketing job to make people either believe it's thinner or the thinness is significant (not sure what's your intention here)
- The visual illusion and brilliant marketing are making people giddy

However, the "visual illusion" isn't an "illusion" because it IS thinner. "brilliant marketing" is also meaningless because that implies Apple is doing something to spin it away from "reality," which isn't the case here.

Thus your argument if you include the last paragraph.

1) iPad 2 is physically thinner than iPad 1
2) However from the back it'll look thicker based on photos I've seen
3) Thus the thinness is not significant in real usage
4) There is visual illusion that makes people believe it's really thinner
5) Apple also doing a spin job with its marketing to make people believe it's really thinner or significant
6) Thus I don't understand excitement and I believe people are excited because of 4) and 5)

#4 either directly contradicts or has nothing to do with your point of #1-3. The only thing consistent is whatever Apple does regarding the new thinness isn't that important or isn't real.

What you SHOULD've written in the last paragraph is something like this:

"Thus because of a visual illusion that makes it look thicker than it really is, in real usage the benefit of thinness is questionable. I believe the main reason people are giddy is they do not understand this visual impact and Apple is doing the best marketing job to make people think the thinness matters."

My intention in saying “brilliant marketing” was twofold— firstly, I was complimenting Apple in that they were able to use that figure as a selling point because it sounds dramatic. Secondly, I was also hinting (but many people either missed out on it completely or were unable to see it) that that figure is not an accurate representation of how thin it will feel/look.

To understand this, you have to have already understood both the advantages and disadvantages of a heavy tapering. On one hand, it heavily minimizes how thick it looks, but at the same time, it causes a LOT of wasted space inside the body.

The “visual illusion” here was referring to that fact. If you put both iPads face-down on a table and drew a horizontal line from the back of the iPad 2 through the iPad, that’s probably where the components end also. But that’s making it more complicated than it really is. Regardless of how much empty space is in the iPad, the fact that it tapers all the way to the center causes it to look thinner from the back than the flat one of the 2.

I never stated the “visual illusion” to mean that it is MAGICALLY physically thinner when it isn’t. I’ve said again and again that it’s thinner, but just doesn’t look like it. Just where have I contradicted this fact??? You and others keep reading the “brilliant marketing” line in a negative connotation when that wasn’t the intention, then applying that logic to even read extra meaning into the title. There was no spin job in the first place.

If I had written the last paragraph the way you put it, I would have been putting that spin job in there and that was not my intention.

This is completely needless and absurd. If everyone needed to explain their posts the way you need them spelled out, people would stop reading and writing altogether...

 

[doramjan]

Y u no

iPad 2
Y U NO LOOK 33% THINNER!?!

 

[Xeperu]

After reading this entire thread the following on topic picture was the first thing that came to mind.

 

[dacapo]

Yes, in a nutshell, that's what I've been saying. I'm still wondering though: where I haven't been clear enough? From Post #1, I've been saying that it doesn't look thinner at all and I've expressed that throughout all the subsequent posts.

(Great website, btw)

If you mean what I think you mean about my blog, thanks!

To be honest, I'm not so sure about it being a great website yet, but it's a great website url for sure I think! Just got started a couple of weeks ago, but hopefully I can continue to shed some light on commonly misconceived notions about the Bible and such, without being too abrasive or unhelpful.

Let me fix it for you.

MACRUMORS: Where nerds will argue that 8.8mm is isn't really thinner than 13.4mm because from certain angle in photos it looks thicker and further argue people believe it's thinner because of Apple's marketing. (That's really what the OP argued, unbelievable)

MR Nerds FTW.


Although I still can't say I agree with the OP about the iPad 1 actually 'being thinner' or 'seeming thinner', it's actually made me scrutinize those sides quite a bit. And now, I actually do wonder if I'll find acceptable how the iPad 2 will actually feel in the hands.

With the iPod Touch 4G, I've found it to be too thin to be comfortable. And in comparison to my iPhone 3GS, the thinness actually ends up making the speakers sound much tinier. We'll have to see, but I hope Apple hasn't sacrificed too much usability/comfort just for the sake of making it thinner.

 

[fobfob]

So have we reached a conclusion yet?

 

[darngooddesign]

So have we reached a conclusion yet?

The iPad 2 is physically thinner. How much thinner it looks depends on the angle you are viewing it from.

 

[dacapo]

The iPad 2 is physically thinner. How much thinner it looks depends on the angle you are viewing it from.

Yup, conclusion = YMMV.

 

[ehoui]

The only conclusion I can draw from this thread is that the OP believes that perception is reality. It's a philosophical debate and a point of view which I do not share, but to each his/her own (reality).

 

[lozpop]

Why is everyone so excited about the iPad 2 being 8.8 mm? I mean, other than the surprising fact that it's just a little thinner than an iPhone 4, in real world use, it will LOOK thicker than the original iPad.

If you look at the picture, you can see that the entire width of the 2 is thicker than the sides of original iPad, which because of the heavily-tapered back is technically all that you see when someone is using it in the real world.

It's a visual illusion and a damn good one, that coupled with equally brilliant marketing, has everyone giddy over it. In reality it'll actually look thicker.

Vincenz.. Are you really serious about this?

 

[highdough]

Let's not get into semantics here guys..

Isn't that EXACTLY what you are doing?

As has been pointed out, your title says that the iPad 2 is not really thinner. And as has been pointed out, that is patently false.

Of course, the title of the thread seems to have no relation to your actual point, which is the iPad 2 doesn't LOOK any thinner.

To this I say, "who cares?"

It makes no difference to me whether something I am holding LOOKS .34" or .5 ". It's thin.

 

[ReallyBigFeet]

So let me get this straight... you buy things based on how they look to other people around you rather than how they feel in your own hand?

That's what she said.

I'm so sorry but this whole thread just reeks of frat-boy size jokes.

 

[MacDaddy80]

Ha Ha They fooled everyone....

It's not really faster either. They just use a different measuring tool.

The same tool they use to measure the thickness.

They will also, tell you your wallet isn't thinner after March 11th.

As, a matter of fact it only really look really thin next to Steve.....

No seriously, your argument is thin

agreed

 

[Roadking]

How about this illusion?

 

[darngooddesign]

Vincenz.. Are you really serious about this?

Did you seriously reply to the first post on page 8?

 

[fobfob]

The only conclusion I can draw from this thread is that the OP believes that perception is reality. It's a philosophical debate and a point of view which I do not share, but to each his/her own (reality).

I think it's worth unpacking the epistemological complexities inherent in this debate. After all, what do we have to go on, except perception? We all know the problem of induction, which leaves empiricism as our only hope. But even that is trapped within our perception of reality. For example, how can we really trust the ruler used to measure the thickness of the iPad 2? It is not entire irrelevant that it came from Walmart or elsewhere, as innocently requested earlier in this thread.
Finally, in this post modern world, it is entirely relevant that fashion is as equally valid as say, the law, or physics. Hence if the iPad 2 looks thicker and thus less fashionable, clearly then it is inferior. We can take all the "measurements" we want, but if our ontology cannot be changed, our current worldview prohibits an alternate interpretation.

 

[TroyBoy30]

The iPad 2 is physically thinner. How much thinner it looks depends on the angle you are viewing it from.

We have a winner!

 

[vincenz]

In the end, both sides will agree to disagree. It's the only "peaceful" solution in a non-utopian world, yes?

The only conclusion I can draw from this thread is that the OP believes that perception is reality. It's a philosophical debate and a point of view which I do not share, but to each his/her own (reality).

That's not entirely fair... I'd say that perception heavily influences reality is more accurate. In order to say perception is reality, one would have to delude oneself into believing that, for instance, the iPad 2 is physically thicker.

Vincenz.. Are you really serious about this?

No, I'm not serious at all. The whole thing was simply a social experiment-- I wanted to see how far I could troll.

I think it's worth unpacking the epistemological complexities inherent in this debate. After all, what do we have to go on, except perception? We all know the problem of induction, which leaves empiricism as our only hope. But even that is trapped within our perception of reality. For example, how can we really trust the ruler used to measure the thickness of the iPad 2? It is not entire irrelevant that it came from Walmart or elsewhere, as innocently requested earlier in this thread.
Finally, in this post modern world, it is entirely relevant that fashion is as equally valid as say, the law, or physics. Hence if the iPad 2 looks thicker and thus less fashionable, clearly then it is inferior. We can take all the "measurements" we want, but if our ontology cannot be changed, our current worldview prohibits an alternate interpretation.

Right, and you do deserve credit for trying to break it down more.

It's why I kept repeating to so many people that at first glance, it looks even thicker. Without knowing beforehand that the iPad 2 is 4.6mm thinner, without that piece of information in the back of your head, you'd think it's thicker.

Imagine those millions of people who don't refresh MacRumors and all the other tech sites on the internet. All those people oblivious to the fact that the iPad 2 has even been announced. Now imagine how they'd react if they see it for the first time at those angles we discussed.

We trust what we know-- it's only natural. We know that the iPad 2 is physically thinner. It's not difficult to apply this prejudice when going to look at it for the first time. Now think about the people who DON'T know.

Does a certain percentage of people never upgrade from one product to the next because they don't like how its successor looks? Probably. Is it a majority? Probably not. But they still exist. If you don't like something, you just don't like it. Are you free to state why you don't like it and offer evidence to support your opinion/claim? I do hope so...

 

[tonyunreal]

OP obviously never used the 4th generation model of iPod touch.

Yes the borders are in different shapes now but the whole thing definitely feels dramatically thinner.

 

[ehoui]

I think it's worth unpacking the epistemological complexities inherent in this debate. After all, what do we have to go on, except perception? We all know the problem of induction, which leaves empiricism as our only hope. But even that is trapped within our perception of reality. For example, how can we really trust the ruler used to measure the thickness of the iPad 2? It is not entire irrelevant that it came from Walmart or elsewhere, as innocently requested earlier in this thread.
Finally, in this post modern world, it is entirely relevant that fashion is as equally valid as say, the law, or physics. Hence if the iPad 2 looks thicker and thus less fashionable, clearly then it is inferior. We can take all the "measurements" we want, but if our ontology cannot be changed, our current worldview prohibits an alternate interpretation.

Perhaps it's a question of not being smart enough... perhaps, we only believe the iPad 2 is thinner because that is what our limited brains tell us, when in fact it is really thicker. Perhaps, the OP is an alien possessing thinking capacity way beyond our own? We (humans) just don't understand the concept of thickness. Because we can't actually grasp the concept of thickness, then we are limited to our perceptions and come to the incorrect conclusion.

 

[aughsum]

Why is everyone so excited about the iPad 2 being 8.8 mm? I mean, other than the surprising fact that it's just a little thinner than an iPhone 4, in real world use, it will LOOK thicker than the original iPad.

If you look at the picture, you can see that the entire width of the 2 is thicker than the sides of original iPad, which because of the heavily-tapered back is technically all that you see when someone is using it in the real world.

It's a visual illusion and a damn good one, that coupled with equally brilliant marketing, has everyone giddy over it. In reality it'll actually look thicker.

Dude... wait, what?

 

[adnoh]

They will also, tell you your wallet isn't thinner after March 11th.

It wort be if I use my credit card.

 

[iMattcotv]

I agree with the OP.

From far away, the iPod will look thicker.

That is, unless someone finds a way to cover the entire back in black, except for a tiny 2mm thin aluminum rim on the sides.

THEN it would look thin as ****!

 

[xraytech]

Why is everyone so excited about the iPad 2 being 8.8 mm? I mean, other than the surprising fact that it's just a little thinner than an iPhone 4, in real world use, it will LOOK thicker than the original iPad.

If you look at the picture, you can see that the entire width of the 2 is thicker than the sides of original iPad, which because of the heavily-tapered back is technically all that you see when someone is using it in the real world.

It's a visual illusion and a damn good one, that coupled with equally brilliant marketing, has everyone giddy over it. In reality it'll actually look thicker.

Laying flat the iPad 1 stands taller than the iPad 2.

Imagine yourself as a tiny little person about the size of a poppy seed, standing on the edge of an iPad. Wouldn't you fall a further distance to your death off the iPad 1? Now if both iPads were laying face down it would be a different story. On the iPad 1 you'd still plummet to your death while on the iPad 2 you'd just simply step down.

I'm sorry, the iPad 2 looks thinner to me.

XD

 

[Chadillacc]

Smart

This might be the best post of the day... ITS ALL AN ILLUSION, ITS ACTUALLY THICKER BUT THEY MADE IT THINNER SO THAT WAY ITS THICKER IN ITS THINNESS. GET IT?

seriously. watch the keynote. can see from a mile away its much more thin.