iPad 2 Screen Thinner, Anti-Reflective, 1.2GHz Dual Core CPU?

[AidenShaw]

My point was there is a price associated with aesthetics, as was precisely stated.

Did I say not - in fact I agreed since I alluded to the issue with having useful ports can conflict with aesthetics.

1. I wasn't aware hardware had a natural lifetime with regard to its design.

If by "design" you mean engineering - there's no "natural lifetime". The lifetime of engineering is determined by when newer technologies make the current design less useful.

Style and fashion, however, need to be refreshed. How many different logos has Apple used since they started?

2. Your familiarity with Latin is inconsistent with your use of an empty word like "boring".

My Latin quote was about "taste" - and in my opinion the aluminum Apple laptops are quite boring. The Latin quote is quite appropriate. You can call it the epitome of design, I can call it boring - and we're both correct.

3. You cite the little (I'd use a different adjective) bump on the lid of your XT2 as function over aesthetics--I liken that "function" to that of the blue nipple & trackpad?

You've lost me here - the "little bump" is the raised part on the top right above the screen:

XT2's without builtin 3G don't have that bump, the top edge of the screen is flat from left to right. Of course, Apple users aren't used to having systems designed for good performance from their cellular antennae.

What does that have to do with the blue nipple?

 

[Snowy_River]

I've had my iPad since April 3rd 2010. Got it day one. Also got my iPhone 4 on launch day.

There really isn't a single thing that my iPad can do that my iPhone can't. iPhone can't run Pages, but there are plenty of other mobile office suites for the iPhone that could take its place.

However, I can think of a lot of things the iPhone can do that the iPad can't. And if the rumors are true, even when the iPad does get a camera, the iPhone 4 will still take significantly better pictures than the iPad.

The only "Advantage" the iPad has is the "full size keyboard". But even thats not realistic most of the time. You can't type on it nearly as fast as you can on a real keyboard. Plus you have to position yourself and the device absolutely perfect to be able to type on it.

That whole line in the iPad promo video "I don't have to change myself to fit the product, the product fits me" is a load of crap, since you DO have to sit in uncomfortable positions to be able to type properly or you get uncomfortable holding it in your hand and have to change your sitting position to be able to position the iPad on your person in a more comfortable way.

As neat as the iPad is, the more I use it, the more I realize its more of an inconvenience than a convenience product. Especially when I take it out of the house. Its much easier to take my Mac or HP notebook in my backpack than it is to hold the iPad in its little case all day.
...

That may all be true from your perspective, but I would take a very different perspective. Having had an iPod Touch for a number of years, and being exceptionally pleased with the capability of it, I was dubious of the usefulness if the iPad. I saw one use for it, and that was the ability to read PDFs easily while in meetings without the need of a full laptop in front of me. Because of that need, I got an iPad, roughly a month after release. Since then, my wife jokes that she never sees me without it. I use it for almost all of my email correspondence. I've written several reports on it. All using the virtual keyboard. I find that it is actually quite pleasant to use. While, perhaps, slightly less comfortable than a full sized keyboard, the portability of the iPad over even my MBP makes all the difference. I could never do on my iPod the kinds of things that I can do on my iPad. When I used to use my iPod for an occasional email, I would keep my message short simply because typing on the iPod was such a pain. The iPad, by contrast, is a dream.

Again, this is my position. My only point here is that just because you don't like it doesn't mean that it isn't any good...

... I mean honestly, when was the last time Apple put out a product that was truly best in class on a hardware, feature set? ...

Uh, that would be just about a year ago, right? I think it was called something like the "iPad".

Seriously, though, why don't you save your vitriol for the actual announcement, instead of taking rumors as gospel.

EXACTLY! iPad is one product cycle BEHIND the iPhone, which is sad. iPad needs to reach feature parity with iPhone so we can avoid this type of thing. How can Apple reconcile 1 GB of RAM on iPhone 5 (speculating) while its big screen cousin has only half as much memory? That's the situation with the current iPad and iPhone, I don't see why it would be different in 2011.

Apple should put both of these products on the same refresh cycle, and they should speed up their refreshes to twice per year in order to compete with what is undoubtedly going to be an avalanche of tablets this year.

You know, I've been thinking about this. Someone posted recently pointing out the email ad that Apple has sent out encouraging getting an iPad as a Valentine's Day gift. This certain doesn't seem to be pointing to an imminent release for the iPad 2. So, what if they are doing exactly what you're suggesting? What if they're going to push the release of the iPad 2 back to be in the same rough time frame as the iPhone 5? Then, they could bring it to feature parity, without big concerns over having the iPad outshine their "flagship" product, the iPhone. (Of course, I think that whole notion is a bit absurd. With the iPod Touch, I can see it, but not so much the iPad. They are, after all, significantly different form factors. I mean, really, do they worry about the fact the the MacPro has significantly more processing power and memory than the iPhone? A clue... No. [/rant])

 

[dona83]

All I have to say is less rumours, more real product please. I'm ready to buy now.

 

[blu3]

We're not that different, you and me.

1. We agree that aesthetics impact price.

2. Definitions and tight language makes for better arguments. For example, you say "the lifetime of engineering is determined when newer technologies make the current design less useful." I can't respond as "useful" is too vague, "newer" isn't actually what you mean, and you don't differentiate between intrinsic (or natural) lifetime and the extrinsic lifetime you cite. But, I get your gist and we agree.

3. Style and fashion need to be refreshed, except when they don't. Elements of style and fashion are timeless, and particular styles and fashions are timeless. Style and fashion can exist in conflict--a timeless style can be as stylish as a completely contrary style. We agree.

4. I think little undersells (or perhaps misrepresents) the total size of the bump. I researched the XT2 because I was unfamiliar and saw that photography that you linked, and it was nothing like the mental image that formed when I read "little bump". We agree, however, that it's not overwhelming or downright awful.

5. We agree that cellular performance across handheld devices is a challenge, though I find it silly to label it an Apple problem.

6. RE the blue nipple: surely some users prefer it to the trackpad, and some users prefer the trackpad to the nipple. We agree that there is more total functionality with the inclusion of more technologies.

 

[blu3]

I'm sorry, but if the iPad 2 has anything less than 1G of RAM, Apple needs B*!#$% slapped.

The Nook Color has 512MB of RAM. Honestly really thinking about buying one and hacking it. It's guts have some glory. http://www.androidtablets.net/forum/nook-color-technical/3483-nookcolor-full-specifications.html

It would just be nice to see Apple treat the iPad as it's own device and not an oversized iPod Touch. I'm really interested in seeing the final products from Toshiba and Moto. Particularly Toshiba's tablet. It's looking pretty good (despite no pricing yet.)

I am kind over over singing, "I want more!" every time Apple releases something lately that everyone else already has. I think the only think that does keep me anchored is that I already am so invested in the Apple echo system with purchases. I mean honestly, when was the last time Apple put out a product that was truly best in class on a hardware, feature set? They really are lacking in innovation these days. The OS-es are the true shinning jewel for them, and the heat is getting turned up slowly but surely there. I almost feel like a traitor saying these things, but it's getting to be like marrying someone that seems so wonderful and different from everyone else to find out they're a controlling person that won't let me have what I want. All the features we've gotten the past few years: customizable backgrounds, folders, MMS, are all things that should have been there from the start. Basic phones had these things. And we have a parade when we get tech that's five years old in a device. The iPhone 4 was the first iPhone that felt like a complete device to me. I'm just wondering if the iPad is going to run this same old gauntlet. From the rumors of iPad 2, it's looking that way. First to market, last with features. If only the hardware had balls as big as Steve Jobs...

You use a lot of words. You lack understanding.

Best in class in terms of ... raw hardware? Raw feature set? I'll ask you: when did a mobile device have a better end-user experience than the iPhone? Where does Apple fall short or fail you with regard to your experience using its products?

Who is a true competitor to the iPad (released April 2010)? Do you own an iPad? Why or why not?

 

[AidenShaw]

We're not that different, you and me.

Agree...

6. RE the blue nipple: surely some users prefer it to the trackpad, and some users prefer the trackpad to the nipple. We agree that there is more total functionality with the inclusion of more technologies.

Agree - but note that many Dells ship with *both* nipples and trackpads standard.

 

[xraytech]

I'm sorry, but if the iPad 2 has anything less than 1G of RAM, Apple needs B*!#$% slapped.

The Nook Color has 512MB of RAM. Honestly really thinking about buying one and hacking it. It's guts have some glory. http://www.androidtablets.net/forum/nook-color-technical/3483-nookcolor-full-specifications.html

It would just be nice to see Apple treat the iPad as it's own device and not an oversized iPod Touch. I'm really interested in seeing the final products from Toshiba and Moto. Particularly Toshiba's tablet. It's looking pretty good (despite no pricing yet.)

I am kind over over singing, "I want more!" every time Apple releases something lately that everyone else already has. I think the only think that does keep me anchored is that I already am so invested in the Apple echo system with purchases. I mean honestly, when was the last time Apple put out a product that was truly best in class on a hardware, feature set? They really are lacking in innovation these days. The OS-es are the true shinning jewel for them, and the heat is getting turned up slowly but surely there. I almost feel like a traitor saying these things, but it's getting to be like marrying someone that seems so wonderful and different from everyone else to find out they're a controlling person that won't let me have what I want. All the features we've gotten the past few years: customizable backgrounds, folders, MMS, are all things that should have been there from the start. Basic phones had these things. And we have a parade when we get tech that's five years old in a device. The iPhone 4 was the first iPhone that felt like a complete device to me. I'm just wondering if the iPad is going to run this same old gauntlet. From the rumors of iPad 2, it's looking that way. First to market, last with features. If only the hardware had balls as big as Steve Jobs...

So this is your special way of saying, "I'll wait for Revision 3"

Hey if 1GB of ram is good, how about 2 or 4. Heck let's run Snow Leopard on the darn thing and use 8GB of ram.

 

[GnillGnoll]

If the iPad 2 and iPhone 5 use the SGX543, the iPad 3 (w/ retina) will need the SGX543MP4 to run it at the same performance as the iPad 2 and the iPhone 5, if they used the SGX543MP2, the iPad 3 would need the SGX543MP8 which is 8 GPUs...!

Yet Apple increased the resolution in iPhone 4 without a GPU upgrade.

Granted, it helped that devs hadn't really taken full advantage of the SGX535's capabilities, but developers won't just ignore iPad 1 users once the iPad 2 is out either. More importantly, though, there is no strict requirement for apps to be updated for a new and improved resolution. Anything that's not stressing the GPU (i.e. 99% of non-game apps plus a large number of games) should be fine running at the higher resolution, but if the new resolution is too much, simply use something lower and scale up.

Sure, it would be great to have higher resolution so that you couldn't even make out a pixel, but it's obvious that Apple couldn't double the screen resolution so early in the life of of the iPad. That would cause all of the thousands of current apps to be pixel doubled and look like crap and the new display not to mention the current iPhone apps which obviously wouldn't even be usable

Time does not make these problems any easier to solve. If anything, the later Apple increases the resolution the more apps will be out that need to be updated.

There are very few sensible complaints about the ipad's screen resolution.

What would you consider a "sensible complaint"?

 

[MythicFrost]

So the question is to those who sold their iPad 1 in preparation for the iPad 2.

Is it worth the wait? A low quality camera, thinner iPad, dual core and anti-reflective?

They're nice additions, and it fits with apple's small updates. Apple has a history of taking small steps when updating its products. Once established, they slowly improve it. I don't see a radical change coming to the iPad in version 2.

I wonder how a thinner iPad along with a dual core processor is going to impact battery life. I mean there will be even less room for a batter and so they may decrease the battery size.

It's a thinner screen isn't it? That means the iPad will be a little thinner but the battery shouldn't need to change; also, the dual-core CPU will improve battery life.

Yet Apple increased the resolution in iPhone 4 without a GPU upgrade.

And why does that matter? The SGX535 can handle that resolution and the iPad's 1024x768 resolution just fine. Although, it is in need of an upgrade; games like Infinity Blade could have a higher FPS, as well as better graphics which are sure to come.

Granted, it helped that devs hadn't really taken full advantage of the SGX535's capabilities, but developers won't just ignore iPad 1 users once the iPad 2 is out either. More importantly, though, there is no strict requirement for apps to be updated for a new and improved resolution. Anything that's not stressing the GPU (i.e. 99% of non-game apps plus a large number of games) should be fine running at the higher resolution, but if the new resolution is too much, simply use something lower and scale up.

To put it simply: if an app (game) gets 40 FPS on the iPhone 5 (SGX543MP2), it'll only get ~10 on the iPad (w/ retina) with the same GPU.

Apple needs the iPad to run whatever the iPhone 5 can, the same, if not a little better.

This is why I think the SGX543 is more likely than the MP2, I don't think there is a GPU with 4x the MP2's performance that won't use too much more battery life, generate too much heat, etc.

 

[phpmaven]

De gustibus non est disputandum...

And I'll argue that the boring MacBook design is very old and stale - and has far outlived its natural lifetime.

I like the new Dell Latitude E-series (and XT2) with the black brushed magnesium alloy cases far more than the boring Apple 'books.

It's also quite significant that Dell doesn't worry that having some useful ports on the laptop will harm its aesthetics - function takes precedence. (Like the little "bump" on the lid of my XT2 for the antenna for the internal 3G card.)

You're not wrong, I'm not wrong. You can't argue.

If you are talking about the MacBook Pro, then I would argue that it is thing of beauty that I'm proud to own. I think it's a work of art, and the performance is fantastic. I use it as my main computer at work every day and I couldn't be happier.

 

[AidenShaw]

If you are talking about the MacBook Pro, then I would argue that it is thing of beauty that I'm proud to own. I think it's a work of art....

...and I think that it's a boring slab of aluminum.

And we're both right.

 

[cb911]

Nnoooo!!

We need more resolution!

I have been interested in the iPad, but after using an iPhone 4 for so long now - I can't help but look at the iPad screen and think how prehistoric it looks. Damn, I keep staring at the pixels! Apple have moved it up a level with the iP4 Retina display - time to maintain with the iPad!

 

[dlundgren]

i don't understand why people have a problem with the ipads current resolution.
have you tried watching HD video on it?
or playing HD games on it?
The current resolution is great! a doubled resolution would be unbelievable...... or magical

Yes I have. The current resolution is fine for watching video. The current resolution sucks for consuming written content, though, and looks like garbage compared to all other current iDevices.

 

[macgeek18]

Apple doesn't make adjustments to price like others do, so "older" hardware is "more" expensive later in its life cycle. When a product refreshes, it is (and has been) quite competitively priced. The fact that you value component cost and do not value form, function, aesthetics and battery life means you're not an ideal Apple purchaser.

Don't get me wrong, I love Apple, I love the look of the machines and battery life has been great even on my 8 year old PowerBook. I just don't like the thought of paying $1200 for a C2D and a 250GB HD that I had in a laptop in what? like 07?? But oh well, Mac OSX makes better usage of RAM and hard drive space. And hey, being a media major I LOVE Mac's for Adobe over Windows. I just can't afford an Intel Mac at the moment and am stuck with Windows.

 

[zenoran]

I seriously hope they reconsider not touching the resolution. That was one of my biggest gripes about the iPad which led me to sell it and wait for a new one to come out. The resolution is horrible for a reading device.

 

[SLBear]

My Mac Pro isn't a real computer? Interesting. Does this mean I was paid fake money for all the fake work I've used it for?

Essentially.

 

[MikeDTyke]

Alerts are just that - alerts. Active business professionals don't want alerts, they want to see their day at a glance. Where on the home screen can I see my upcoming appointments for today? Where can I see a snapshot of my new emails? I can't do any of this unless I wait for an alert or launch the app that has the badge notification. It's a stunningly bad implementation that made sense when Apple wanted to push apps, but as users get more serious and business oriented Apple needs to deliver.

You think i'm whining by simply saying it would be nice to have business oriented features? Perhaps you should pop that bubble that you're in so you can see the rest of the world. According to you, nobody should talk about "what could be" or "what should be" because that's considered "whinging" (I assume you meant "whining"). We should all just wait for Apple to do it, and until then it's a non-issue right?

You are under the missconception that i disagree. I do think the notification system in iOS is incredibly clunky, but to claim it's not fit for business is B.S.

Based on the patents apple has filed for lock screen panels, it's clear they've been examining this problem for the last couple of years, i can only surmise that like copy and paste, they are taking their time to do it right.

 

[valanchan]

I spoke with an in-store Apple representative who informed me that you can download to iPad and later sync the iPad to the computer.

Is this not true?

This is the problem.

The iPad is still reliant on a computer.

The iPad should stand alone. All stuff can already be downloaded fine but it still needs to be connected to a computer for a firmware update and initial startup.

 

[GnillGnoll]

And why does that matter? The SGX535 can handle that resolution and the iPad's 1024x768 resolution just fine. Although, it is in need of an upgrade; games like Infinity Blade could have a higher FPS, as well as better graphics which are sure to come.

The point is, if someone wrote a game that uses the full potential of the iPhone 3GS, a Retina update for iPhone 4 would be out of the question, no matter how well SGX535 "can handle that resolution". Yet Apple had no problem with that.

The rumored SGX543MP2 can handle 2048x1536, too. It certainly could do the simple UI zomming and panning at 60 fps.

To put it simply: if an app (game) gets 40 FPS on the iPhone 5 (SGX543MP2), it'll only get ~10 on the iPad (w/ retina) with the same GPU.

Apple needs the iPad to run whatever the iPhone 5 can, the same, if not a little better.

No, the game would still run at 40 fps because it would still use the old resolution until the developer publishes a "Retina update" - which they won't if it runs badly.

You are assuming that an app needs to run at the native resolution - it does not. If a hypothetical "Retina iPad" had 4x as many pixels but only a 2x faster GPU, developers would update their existing games to use something like 1440x1080 or 1280x960 with antialiasing, and simply scale up. That would still be better than what the previous model can do. And anything that does not stress the GPU would have no problem running at the native resolution.

 

[Kissaragi]

This is just embarrassing. The newly announced PSP2 thats shipping this year is going to have:

Quad Core A9 CPU
Top of the line Quad Core SGX GPU with raised clock speeds
512/1GB of RAM
GPS
Six axis motion sensing system
Front 5 inch OLED touch capacitive display
Back capacitive touch pad
Front and back camera's
more

And its expected to be around $300 while the iPad is going to cost $200 bucks more, and is much less powerful. $200 bucks more for a big screen that is still the same resolution? Thats all I wanted and I was willing to pay the Apple tax for it!

Consoles are normally always sold for less than they cost to make for the first couple of years because the profit comes from selling games. Nintendo are a bit of an exception, with the last few handhelds and consoles i think they made a profit on each wii sold from day one.

 

[Minimoose 360]

I love all the Sony hating in here. The NGP ***** all over the iPad 2.

 

[revelated]

(but great for business)...

Don't see how, now that the Asus is in the wild. For businesses it really is the best option right now.

 

[MythicFrost]

The point is, if someone wrote a game that uses the full potential of the iPhone 3GS, a Retina update for iPhone 4 would be out of the question, no matter how well SGX535 "can handle that resolution". Yet Apple had no problem with that.

The rumored SGX543MP2 can handle 2048x1536, too. It certainly could do the simple UI zomming and panning at 60 fps.

I'm a bit lost, I don't really understand what your point is, the SGX535 probably just wasn't being utilised enough; I imagine it is now, or is very close to, at 960x640. I've even found a few games that get a bit choppy on my 3GS at a certain point, unfortunately the same is true with that iPhone app on my iPad, seeing as they use the same GPU.

No, the game would still run at 40 fps because it would still use the old resolution until the developer publishes a "Retina update" - which they won't if it runs badly.

My point is: "which they won't if it runs badly.", if an intensive iPhone game gets 100 FPS at 960x640 with an SGX543MP2, the iPad will only get ~20 FPS if that game is made for iPad at 2048x1536, using the same graphics, etc., as on the iPhone.

You are assuming that an app needs to run at the native resolution - it does not. If a hypothetical "Retina iPad" had 4x as many pixels but only a 2x faster GPU, developers would update their existing games to use something like 1440x1080 or 1280x960 with antialiasing, and simply scale up. That would still be better than what the previous model can do. And anything that does not stress the GPU would have no problem running at the native resolution.

It would either need to run at 1024x768 or 2048x1536 for the best appearance, running on a resolution in-between would like just like it does on the computer: terrible. Not running games at native isn't a great experience.

Better Apple uses the SGX543 in the iPhone 5, and the SGX543MP4 in the retina iPad. Like I said, I just think the SGX543MP2 is overkill, I want it in there, but don't think that's going to happen.

 

[GnillGnoll]

I'm a bit lost, I don't really understand what your point is

My point is that Apple didn't care about the possibility of some apps running worse at native resolution on the iPhone 4 than on the 3GS. They increased the resolution anyway.

It would either need to run at 1024x768 or 2048x1536 for the best appearance, running on a resolution in-between would like just like it does on the computer: terrible. Not running games at native isn't a great experience.

Of course scaling isn't ideal, but I disagree that it's terrible. IMO non-retina games on the iPhone 4 look slightly different but not much worse next to a 3GS. Upscaling is pretty common on consoles, and even with odd scale factors 720p looks better than qHD (960x540) when scaled to 1080p.

 

[MythicFrost]

My point is that Apple didn't care about the possibility of some apps running worse at native resolution on the iPhone 4 than on the 3GS. They increased the resolution anyway.

Oh, I doubt they would have updated (or they'd have used a better GPU) if the SGX535 couldn't handle everything at 960x640 and 1024x768, they would've thoroughly checked it, benchmarked it, tested it, to make sure it can handle it.

Of course scaling isn't ideal, but I disagree that it's terrible. IMO non-retina games on the iPhone 4 look slightly different but not much worse next to a 3GS. Upscaling is pretty common on consoles, and even with odd scale factors 720p looks better than qHD (960x540) when scaled to 1080p.

I just can't see it happening, that is, Apple, using a GPU which will consume about twice the power of the previous to get 4x performance rather than just 2x.