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All iPads iPad in Aviation NEWS THREAD

B737,

Can you still use it enroute, once you are above 10,000? Do you have an iPad AND a chart case, or just a chart case?

I am just a student pilot, but I can imagine that not being able to use ipad for landing charts and other things that I may not have a clue about, is inconvenient.
 
It's the paper iPad redundancy that's most frustrating.

We will be carrying our normal compliment of charts (those 50 pound black square bags) plus an iPad with all the same information all at the same time. Once we are above 10, we can use the iPad. And honestly most guys will prob NOT use them below 18,000 feet as we are typically more conservative when it comes to distractions and having everything ready for the arrival well in advance since we're going to be using paper charts anyways.

Our ops specs state that we can only use them above 10,000' or on the ground while the parking brake is set. Two reasons, one is the distraction factor while taxiing and the below 10 restriction is due to the iPad not being hard mounted into the aircraft with a power source. The iPad "victory" only ended up being just one more thing to lug around and be responsible for. Sure it's handy if you need to look something up while parked at the gate but it's really business as usual, paper charts and books when it comes down to it.

Such a waste. Leave it to the FAA and airline management to screw up something as easy as an iPad. It was such a technological opportunity that will end up being totally squandered.

As an aside, while they will be issued to the individual pilot, they are not for personal use. Many of us would rather they just be fastened to the aircraft with locks and would rather not be responsible for lugging it around having it stolen or damaged. Would you like to be waiting outside the airport for hotel van pick up in a poor 3rd world country while scrupulous minds know each pilot (at least 2 sometimes 3) is carrying a $800 device? no thanks.

It would also make financial sense to affix iPads directly to a few hundred aircraft rather than hand them out to 10,000 pilots... But what do we know ;)
 
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FloatingBones said:
Flash is fine for dedicated apps. With Adobe's new packaging, Flash also works fine in the iOS App Store, Android App Store, etc. Flash was poorly-suited to deliver web content; Adobe's dropping of support for Flash on handhelds should be the last nail in that coffin.



When you've got a hammer, everything looks like a nail. To Flash developers, the web looked like a nail. So many little websites have unnecessary Flash. And Flash-based banner ads are a failure: the only people who see 'em are the folks who don't know about click-to-flash blockers.



The "Flying with the iPad: Apps & Accessories" webinar video is viewable on sportys.com/webinars. Sporty's video player is flash-based. Perfect. :D
Click to expand...

Well I just watched the Sportys video. Awesome! I am pretty savvy with the ipad and foreflight. Most of the info was not new but it was great to watch it anyway. I am taking my first flight with my ipad as PIC this weekend. I am stoked!
 
B737 said:
Our ops specs state that we can only use them above 10,000' or on the ground while the parking brake is set. Two reasons, one is the distraction factor while taxiing and the below 10 restriction is due to the iPad not being hard mounted into the aircraft with a power source. The iPad "victory" only ended up being just one more thing to lug around and be responsible for. Sure it's handy if you need to look something up while parked at the gate but it's really business as usual, paper charts and books when it comes down to it.

Such a waste. Leave it to the FAA and airline management to screw up something as easy as an iPad. It was such a technological opportunity that will end up being totally squandered.
Click to expand...

These are interesting posts. The funny part is that the airline will receive none of the benefits of using an iPad as long as they carry the paper charts. I can't see why they would drive for iPads -- unless they can get those other restrictions removed.

It would also make financial sense to affix iPads directly to a few hundred aircraft rather than hand them out to 10,000 pilots... But what do we know ;)
Click to expand...

Again quite interesting. It certainly makes sense to have them be a dedicated appliance permanently attached to the cockpit. Maintenance workers could use some sort of portable WiFi drive to refresh the charts.
 
Yes maintenance managing them makes the most sense (but also not going to happen). They'd stay up to date by connecting to the aircrafts on board wifi (also..."coming soon" ha!!)

Exactly right Bones. These guys have meetings to shave a pound off the airplane and do things like eliminate blankets... The industry is messed up because it's managed by egos, greed and bureaucracy. They know the cost of everything and the VALUE of nothing.

Getting the iPad right in the commercial sector would be a big win. But right now it's an epic fail.

All well, at least most of us around here have our own iPads to enjoy in the meantime ;)
 
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B737 said:
Yes maintenance managing them makes the most sense (but also not going to happen). They'd stay up to date by connecting to the aircrafts on board wifi (also..."coming soon" ha!!)

Exactly right Bones. These guys have meetings to shave a pound off the airplane and do things like eliminate blankets... The industry is messed up because it's managed by egos, greed and bureaucracy. They know the cost of everything and the VALUE of nothing.

Getting the iPad right in the commercial sector would be a big win. But right now it's an epic fail.

All well, at least most of us around here have our own iPads to enjoy in the meantime ;)
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Ah, I thought things where going too easily, but I think there is a lot of optimism to be found.

The iPad is making its way in all sectors of aviation, and if the organizations like the AOPA, IATA, EAA, NARA, GAMA and other acronym types get together they will pressure FAA to make exceptions or change the rules. A few letters to congressmen can also get things going. It takes time to convince ultra cautions types of new concepts.

Meanwhile another device to make iPad displays more accurate:
Levil AHRS G mini can be mounted in the aircraft with just two screws. It provides pitch and bank information to iPads, iPhones, or other tablets via a wireless connection. While not certified, it will help pilots with redundancy and options in analyzing flying conditions.
 
PracticalMac said:
The iPad is making its way in all sectors of aviation, and if the organizations like the AOPA, IATA, EAA, NARA, GAMA and other acronym types get together they will pressure FAA to make exceptions or change the rules. A few letters to congressmen can also get things going. It takes time to convince ultra cautions types of new concepts.
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What kind of FAA exception... or possibly, an airline procedural change in this case... are you looking for?

Is it just to optionally use an iPad as a kneepad chart display during the actual approach instead of using paper?

Or are you wanting to totally get rid of paper and only rely on electronic charts? I don't see that happening yet, since history has taught us that devices will fail at the worst possible time.

Meanwhile another device to make iPad displays more accurate:
Click to expand...

Yep, it works with any computer or tablet. $800 to $1,000.
 
kdarling said:
What kind of FAA exception... or possibly, an airline procedural change in this case... are you looking for?

Is it just to optionally use an iPad as a kneepad chart display during the actual approach instead of using paper?

Or are you wanting to totally get rid of paper and only rely on electronic charts? I don't see that happening yet, since history has taught us that devices will fail at the worst possible time.
Click to expand...
Some proposals come to mind for this to be acceptable:

*First off their will need to be exception to the 10K rule for devices needed for navigation.
*Second is the allowance for running the device on battery only during landing and take off cycles, provided it has at least 40% power or 2 hours of run time.
*At least 2, maybe 3 iPads in the cockpit
*Secure mounting locations (able to resist 3G of dynamic force)
*Set of paper charts in aircraft, limited to the area operated by airline and surrounding area (save pounds of paper).

Apps could include some not directly for flight, such as conversion calculators, communication (FaceTime, Skype), calanders, Google Earth or such earth viewing app.

Yes, their is much that needs to be looked at, and does need a joint effort by all to put airlines into the 21st cent.
 
iPad is getting more exposure in Aviation mags.
Huge amount of aviation related accessories too, nothing I have seen for any Android tablet.

For aircraft (or any vehicle) with 24V power systems, Scosche offers a number of 12~24V power adapters (specs on all list 12~24V)

reVIVE II - Dual USB, either 1A, 2A, or one each
powerPLUG - Low-Profile USB 1A or 2A

Another:
Merkury offers a 12~24V as well, according to box. Need to verify to be sure.
 
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The company I work for 91K is now doing official training with the iPad, six months ago we all used it in the sim under a test program.

Latest info we have: Our approach plates will be removed from the planes in July/Aug, we are keeping the enroute charts for now. We are using the Jeppesen app.

iPad must be stowed for to/land, but no altitude specified (after breakout on appch is fine, so if we see the appch lights and descent to 100' above TDZE, I guess lower than that.)

Each pilot will be issued their own iPad, no word if we can go paperless with one of two ipads inop. (We currently operate with one set only of us/can/lam/Hawaii.)

The version we will get is a wifi only iPad 2. (Big mistake in my opinion, as with a gps ipad we could have GeoRef SafeTaxi charts, big safety advantage for a 91k operator who goes to lots of unfamiliar airports.)

Interesting times. Some of the pilots I am flying with who own planes are looking at using an ads-b receiver and iPad vs Garmin with XM weather, to save the cost of the subscription.
 
Richdmoore said:
The company I work for 91K is now doing official training with the iPad, six months ago we all used it in the sim under a test program.
...

The version we will get is a wifi only iPad 2. (Big mistake in my opinion, as with a gps ipad we could have GeoRef SafeTaxi charts, big safety advantage for a 91k operator who goes to lots of unfamiliar airports.)

Interesting times. Some of the pilots I am flying with who own planes are looking at using an ads-b receiver and iPad vs Garmin with XM weather, to save the cost of the subscription.
Click to expand...

Part 91?

Get them to get eternal GPS units, especially the BT type Dual and others.
Maybe that is plan, to use feature rich GPS units BT to iPad?
 
PracticalMac said:
Part 91?

Get them to get eternal GPS units, especially the BT type Dual and others.
Maybe that is plan, to use feature rich GPS units BT to iPad?
Click to expand...

They have ops under 91, 91K, & 135 actually. When I said 91K, I meant I work for a fractional (shared aircraft) operator. I doubt bluetooth would be a viable option without approval by the FAA, and they would be very leery..

I will also be interested to see how locked down the the company issued iPad's are, I would expect that almost everything they can lock out on the unit will be, based on my current experience with the blackberry cell phones we were issued. I suspect we will have no ability to install our own apps, connect with our personal iCloud accounts, load our own files, and other limitations as determined by corporate it.

Oh, and I am way to far down on the totem pole to have any impact on what tech they acquire, I'm just an indian, not a chief..... I just have to work with what they give me.

Most of the pilots I know are planning to carry both their company issued iPad, and whatever else they normally use right now for internet during a tour (personal iPad, Laptop, Netbook.)
 
Richdmoore said:
Interesting times. Some of the pilots I am flying with who own planes are looking at using an ads-b receiver and iPad vs Garmin with XM weather, to save the cost of the subscription.
Click to expand...


Still cannot use it for IFR, if you are replacing in-dash GPS. But if they do not plan to use it for IFR, it may be worth it. Cheaper too, considering the cost of in-dash GPS unit...

The trainer I fly (C152), someone joked that the avionics package worth more than the plane itself. All new equipment, and Garmin GNS430
 
logo.png

Annual Sun n' Fun show is going in Florida right now, and more iPad stuff is showing up!

Formally "Pilot My-Cast", Garmins app is updated and now called Garmin Pilot.

Anywhere Map® released a new version of its software as well.

The biggest news may be the Stratus , providing free weather, WAAS enabled GPS, even ADS-B support.

Much more, more to come, just some tidbits
 
No major news for a while, but the list of software for iOS is growing, so I include here.


Here is listing and opinions about the PLANNING SOFTWARE, (chart a path from point A to B, provide basic route info, more). Does not list the hundreds of non planning apps needed for flying (weight and balance, log books, currency, etc).

iOS (iOS 4.3 and newer, iPad, iPhone, iPod Touch)

Reader Plates comes with monthly subscription only.

SkyCharts one time payment with NO monthly subscription! (lean but very nice.)

AOPA's FlyQ included with AOPA membership, replaces earlier AOPA "Airports" directory app.

SkyRadar very low cost 6 and 12 month subscriptions.

Fore Flight offers 30 day free trial, then monthly to yearly subscription.

WingX Pro (Hilton Software) monthly to yearly subscription.

Jeppesen Mobile (FliteDeck and TC) monthly to yearly subscription.

Garmin Pilot offers 30 day free trial, then monthly to yearly subscription. (Was "Pilot My-Cast", Android not fully supported)

Fltplan.com Mobile App v3.0 (4/2012) TOTALLY FREE! Do not mistake for a simpler version v1.1 that may be a 2ed or 3ed party design called Fltplan Mobile v1.1.


Android (NOTE: a small number of Android devices will NOT run these titles! Please post if one has issues on tablet).

Avilution offers 30 day free trial, then monthly to yearly subscription.

Express (RMS Tek, NEW)

Naviator offers 30 day free trial, then monthly to yearly subscription.


Windows (all, including "WindowsPC" (aka "PocketPC") and new "Surface")
Flightsoft (RMS Tek) Various subscription based.

Vista (RMS Tek) Various subscription based.

MountainScope

Voyager (also with hardware package SkyPad).

Jeppesen offers variety of Windows based software Various subscription based.


Multi platform and Browser Based:(iOS, Android, Windows, Macintosh)
Anywhere Map (and stand alone tablet hardware)

Fltplan.com (browser version) FREE!
 
Not iPad directly, but iPhone used as HUD for IFR (in clouds) flying.
NOTE, the iPhone uses a 3ed party systems (Levil Technology attitude and heading and reference system (AHRS)) to provide added data for more accurate flight info.

The rumored iPad Mini might be a candidate for this.
 
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