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iPad Pro Outsells Microsoft Surface in Launch Quarter

gugy said:
Damn, I really like the iPad Pro. I just wished it was a bit cheaper. $100 less would help. I just think the price is too high and very close to entry level Macbooks.
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I think it's close. I haven't used one or seen one, but I would love to see a 64GB model available at $799. I have a 32GB iPad Air and consistently need to delete apps I only seldom use to keep storage open. I have a 64GB iPhone 6 and never have trouble with storage issues.

Unfortunately the time for me REALLY making good use of an iPad Pro may end soon. It would be great for textbooks because of the larger size. It would also be great for note-taking since the pencil sounds like it would work well for hand-written notes, which could go great on something like Notability with typed notes. I have to do some math stuff, and it's just hard to write out something like that with my finger in a timely matter. It was even worse trying to do it with my MacBook Air.
 
The surface pro is a nice machine but for me it's too limited. It's not a good tablet and is let down by a lack of apps. It's an adequate computer but for its price you can get for more capable laptops which wouldn't have the same limitations. The iPad pro is no more a computer than any of the previous iPads but at least it is a great tablet if you want something that size. If I were going to buy one it would be the iPad pro. However I currently prefer having my iPad Air 2 and MacBook Air.
 
Honestly, I personally really don't need tablets. I always have my iP6Splus with me and then I have my Mac Pro or my MB Pro. My iPad Air 2 is gathering dust 99% of the time. I'm not going to get another tablet until it converts into real laptop with real keyboard and dual boots iOS and OS X with desktop applications. Even then I just might skip it and just get new iPhone Plus or new MB Pro. My problem with tablets is that they are far too restricted and don't really do much more then iPhone with a big screen. Yep, that post PC era was short lived but this post tablet era might last bit longer...
 
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So what are the people who bought the Pro thinking? They like it or is it going to go the way of the G4 Cube?
 
bladerunner2000 said:
Bingo.

The fundamental reason anything iOS based will NEVER be a serious contender so as long as Apple continues to enforce these bone-headed 'features'. Who knows, maybe one day Apple execs will pull their heads out of their asses and implement what consumers NEED, nevermind want! The only question is; will it take them 30 years like it did with a 2 button mouse? Perhaps 20 years to have a cut/paste command to move files in the Finder? Or maybe close to 10 years to allow iPhone users select a different keyboard?

Ah well... one can dream, right?
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Yeah, they've got no idea what consumers actually want. Totally clueless.

But your position does make me wonder, what do you think they've done thus far to become the most wildly profitable consumer tech company in history if they keep making products that nobody needs or wants?
 
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GeneralChang said:
Yeah, they've got no idea what consumers actually want. Totally clueless.

But your position does make me wonder, what do you think they've done thus far to become the most wildly profitable consumer tech company in history if they keep making products that nobody needs or wants?
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Made pretty luxury items that technologically inept people can use. It all started with the iPod's success which was actually pretty good, but had it's limitations. Everything since then has been more and more limited. If you deny this, I will not continue this conversation.
 
ThisIsNotMe said:
"Desktop OS". What a faux argument. Please define "Desktop OS".

(Hint: You can't because it doesn't exist. An OS is an OS. iPad Pro runs just as much of a "Desktop OS" as a MacBook)
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I´m quite sure that you are the only one here who don't understand what I was referring to..
 
Michael Goff said:
I can tell you that I don't think 3D Touch should ever be on an iPad.
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I disagree.

The potential for 3D touch is to provide shortcuts, akin to a right click, to expose functionality without requiring multiple taps.

For the iPad, which lends itself to being more of a productivity device, with 3D touch and properly supported software, it could make using the iPad for work as much faster experience. Right now, too much of the interfaces are tap-heavy.

The biggest problem with 3D touch right now is the lack of affordance. It's not discoverable and it's too easy to forget about the functionality.
 
HenryDJP said:
I thought 3D touch was very well accepted. Why would it not be good on an iPad?
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I don't see it being a good fit because how it works. The fact that you have to put some pressure on the screen means that most of the mediocre kickstand wouldn't hold up. When a person uses it with a phone, they're generally holding it with one and applying pressure with the other.

Renzatic said:
After having spent some time pressing and holding for a right-click action on my SP4, I have to disagree with you on that. 3D touch could be an awesome thing on the iPad.
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It's the pressure I'm not seeing work. You can do a right click type thing without there being 3D Touch.

BWhaler said:
I disagree.

The potential for 3D touch is to provide shortcuts, akin to a right click, to expose functionality without requiring multiple taps.

For the iPad, which lends itself to being more of a productivity device, with 3D touch and properly supported software, it could make using the iPad for work as much faster experience. Right now, too much of the interfaces are tap-heavy.

The biggest problem with 3D touch right now is the lack of affordance. It's not discoverable and it's too easy to forget about the functionality.
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And then there's the fact that you have to put pressure on it and most of the kick stands wouldn't hold up too well with you pushing on it with any real pressure. There's that too.
 
Michael Goff said:
It's the pressure I'm not seeing work. You can do a right click type thing without there being 3D Touch.
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You don't have to apply a tremendous amount of pressure to it, just a little more than you otherwise would. After about an hour, you'd be able to differentiate between left/right style click with barely any thought behind it.
 
MS needs to change naming of surface, it has such a bad reputation from older models, people don't even know it's new. I love the iPad pro too but i feel like it shouldn't have had that pro moniker it's undeserved.
 
Renzatic said:
After having spent some time pressing and holding for a right-click action on my SP4, I have to disagree with you on that. 3D touch could be an awesome thing on the iPad.
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Being taught technic over force like in aiki jujitsi I don't like anything that requires more physical effort. Hate the force click on 12" Macbooks and turn it off in favor of effortless tap. 3D touch is another silly gimmick compared to long touch menu selection. Another point against 3D touch is applying too much force on the display causes distortion.
 
mi7chy said:
Being taught technic over force like in aiki jujitsi I don't like anything that requires more physical effort. Hate the force click on 12" Macbooks and turn it off in favor of effortless tap. 3D touch is another silly gimmick compared to long touch menu selection. Another point against 3D touch is applying too much force on the display causes distortion.
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Gotta disagree. My problem with long touch click is that it takes too long to do, making processes that were once near instantaneous something of a stilted chore. I think force click is a great alternative, since it'd work about as well as a right click for touchscreen based machines.

As for screen distortion, well...the styluses (stylii...whatevs) already do that, and yeah, it's kinda scary. Hopefully, a force click wouldn't require quite that much pressure, though.
 
bladerunner2000 said:
Made pretty luxury items that technologically inept people can use. It all started with the iPod's success which was actually pretty good, but had it's limitations. Everything since then has been more and more limited. If you deny this, I will not continue this conversation.
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If you continue to address every possible use case with sweeping generalities based on your limited experience, I won't continue this conversation.

Depending on what you qualify as limitations, obviously everything since the iPod (and everything before it) has had limitations. Sure. I'm finding fault with your suggestion that Apple doesn't know what consumers want*. Because, clearly, they do. It might just be that consumers in general don't want the same things that YOU want, in which case feel free to complain about that. But make sure you bracket your opinions with things like "I may not be a typical consumer, but..." and "...for me." Example: "I may not be a typical consumer, but the iPad Pro seems pointless, especially compared to the utility of something like a Surface Pro. The fact that the iPad Pro might have outsold the Surface makes no sense to me."

It will improve the accuracy of your communication.

*And when I suggest this, realized I'm talking about market trends and desires. Apple has obviously done the research needed to understand what target user audiences they are going to get the most money from, as well as what markets they are going to sell the most devices in, and designed their products to target those groups. Are you a member of those groups? I don't know. But if not, it would suggest a pretty compelling reason for why you think Apple doesn't sell devices people would want. Am I a part of those groups? A few of them. And the products that were designed to target the groups I'm a part of don't feel limited to me in any way. However, they absolutely do make some products targeted at groups I am NOT a part of, and I agree, from my perspective those products seem to be really rather limited. Personal use case. Nothing else matters. Thank heavens there are multiple options for pretty much any consumer device you could want.
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Michael Goff said:
I don't see it being a good fit because how it works. The fact that you have to put some pressure on the screen means that most of the mediocre kickstand wouldn't hold up. When a person uses it with a phone, they're generally holding it with one and applying pressure with the other.
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While I personally think 3D touch would be awesome on an iPad, this is a good point. Based on how the iPad is sitting (flat or in hand vs. on a stand), 3D touch would be impractical.

I typically use mine flat or in hand, though, so I'm still hoping they add 3D touch to the iPad line. 😀
 
Renzatic said:
You don't have to apply a tremendous amount of pressure to it, just a little more than you otherwise would. After about an hour, you'd be able to differentiate between left/right style click with barely any thought behind it.
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I suppose you might be right. It might just be how I use it that's making me think the way I am.
 
Michael Goff said:
I suppose you might be right. It might just be how I use it that's making me think the way I am.
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I usually end up pressing down too hard anyway, especially when I'm waiting for the right-click menu to show up. Usually I'll say something like "GO, DAMNIT, GO!" to make it feel like it's going faster.

So yeah, it's a natural fit for me. 😛
 
RamGuy said:
I do agree that the spacing between the icons on the iPad is starting to look rather ridiculous. But I'm pretty sure that Apple is well aware of how little time users actually spend looking at the home screen / springboard and therefore see no real reason to dedicate resources to change something that most people on spend a split second looking at before entering whatever app they want to use at the time.


I can't for the life of my think of any time or reason why I would look at the home screen on my iPhone? When I pick up my phone, it's because I want to do something specific, and that will be within an app 99,99% of the time.

I've got friends with Android tablets and while "widgets" might make things look more fancy none of them find any of those widgets any useful. They also pick up their tablet and go directly into a app. The only thing they might find somewhat useful is a weather widget, and that's pretty much it.


It would make much more sense and go down the route that Microsoft tried but completely failed to establish. Having dynamic and interactive app icons that can act like small widgets and provide you with small portions of relevant information at a glance before you launch the app could be somewhat useful and would pretty much kill any reason for having widgets in the first place.
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I just want the ability to have the news app show headlines on the main page instead of having to open it each time. I want the ability to see information I want like live tiles, instead of just having a number showing how many notifications that app has.

These are valuable things, so are weather widgets and email widgets etc etc.
 
Michael Goff said:
And then there's the fact that you have to put pressure on it and most of the kick stands wouldn't hold up too well with you pushing on it with any real pressure. There's that too.
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That's a good point. I still would want it for in your hands and on the table work, e.g. drawing.
 
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