iPhone 3G Hands On, Notes, and Questions

[jflash07]

This might be wishful thinking, but does anyone think that maybe MMS and copy/paste will be in the 2.0 software upgrade and maybe were not mentioned at the Keynote due to pride?

I realize that most everyone who is into phones knows the iphone didn't have these features before, but do you think maybe Jobs thought that it would be embarassing to spend time on talking about two features that are so standard with all phones?

Then again, GPS and 3G blow that theory out of the water.

Any thoughts?

 

[KaiMac]

MMS is inexcusable to be left out, unless the dev team is full of mentals this surely has to be in v3.0?!?

Come on, you know your love going to the viewmymessage.com website and trying to enter those cryptic usernames to see the picture mail from someone on a cellphone 2 years old that doesn't run a real OS but still has the ability to do MMS messages! When friends on old Sprint and Verizon phones realizes I can't send or receive MMS messages on my iPhone, they are just stunned. It is probably more complicated for ATT to set up this viewmymessage.com website and set up the message routing than it is to just build the function into the OS. Come on Steve, fix this....video....cut and paste already!

 

[markcc]

i didnt believe it either - the old iPhone gets bricked when you get your new iPhone

I didnt believe it either - your old classic iPhone will be locked before you leave the store with your new 3g iPhone. He said the iPhone is deauthorized and cannot be used as an iPod or WiFi device. I probed him about other terms and conditions and he was very informed, not just a recent hire. He was able to tell me about the $10 extra charge for the data and the fact that there would not be an extension of the two year contract for those who are trading up and paid full price for their iPhones.

I even expressed anger and disappointment with Apple at the guy when he told me that my old phone would be turned into a brick, and he understood what I was saying and he held firm, so it seems he has been briefed.

The sales people at the NYC Apple store have the info - call them to verify.

 

[Quillz]

I didnt believe it either - your old classic iPhone will be locked before you leave the store with your new 3g iPhone. He said the iPhone is deauthorized and cannot be used as an iPod or WiFi device. I probed him about other terms and conditions and he was very informed, not just a recent hire. He was able to tell me about the $10 extra charge for the data and the fact that there would not be an extension of the two year contract for those who are trading up and paid full price for their iPhones.

I even expressed anger and disappointment with Apple at the guy when he told me that my old phone would be turned into a brick, and he understood what I was saying and he held firm, so it seems he has been briefed.

The sales people at the NYC Apple store have the info - call them to verify.

Then what does AT&T expect people to do with their old iPhone... Throw it away? But, couldn't you just put in a new SIM card, and either set up a new AT&T plan or just unlock it?

 

[markcc]

the guy at the mac store encouraged me to sell it on ebay

Without the phone unlocked by AT&T, it reverts to the out-of-box state, in which nothing works.

The guy at the Apple store said I could sell my old phone on ebay.

Now lets do the math - I spent $599 for the phone, less the $100 Steve Jobs rebate, and now I am going to sell an old non-working phone against a subsidized $199 phone (that is clearly better), and other unlocked phones? I think your old locked iPhone will be worth $25-50, maybe.

 

[BuffaloTF]

-MMS - Still couldn't believe this was left off last year. Why? is this a software upgrade?

Steve Jobs, I'm almost certain, stated MMS is a dying, limited, technology. Don't ask me to quote, I can't, but I'm more than 75% certain I remember there being this asked with the original iPhone and this was the answer.

It isn't like you can't send pictures... just email it to someone's phone #... ex. 5558675309@vzwpix.com..... to send a picture... and of course they come in with that viewmymessage site. And they don't count as messages that way with the pitiful, over-expensive, AT&T messaging plans.

 

[Quillz]

Without the phone unlocked by AT&T, it reverts to the out-of-box state, in which nothing works.

The guy at the Apple store said I could sell my old phone on ebay.

Now lets do the math - I spent $599 for the phone, less the $100 Steve Jobs rebate, and now I am going to sell an old non-working phone against a subsidized $199 phone (that is clearly better), and other unlocked phones? I think your old locked iPhone will be worth $25-50, maybe.

Actually, I disagree. Considering how easy it is to unlock the old iPhone, I think it will still command a high price. People will want them to unlock, since they do want the new, locked iPhone 3G, no matter how much better it might prove to be.

 

[markcc]

i've never jail broken my phone

I have never jail broken my phone, but my understanding is that you first have to get AT&T to authorize the phone before you can install the jailbreak software, right?

If AT&T takes off the authorization, the Jail Break software cant be installed right?

 

[Solkar]

I think you are misunderstanding things. Your phone doesn't use the 3G radio for voice data. Hence why you're able to receive data while on a call. The communications protocol for GSM has been around for a long time, well before data on a cell phone was prolific. There is a separate chip inside the phone that communicates on the quad-band GSM protocol. Note the tech specs on the iPhone 3G:

# UMTS/HSDPA (850, 1900, 2100 MHz)
# GSM/EDGE (850, 900, 1800, 1900 MHz)

Those are separate chips (why you can turn off the 3G radio and still make calls). Now, the EDGE protocol works over the same frequencies as GSM voice protocols (hence you can't receive data and talk at the same time).

In summary, the 3G radio is used ONLY for data so don't worry about the battery life there. Now if you're going to use VOIP (can 3G even handle the bandwidth requirements of VOIP?), then you may have some issues.

I wish you could explain that to my battery. All I know is since 3G came to town, my Blackjack can barely survive a day. On standby, I used to manage 2 days on Edge. And if I talk for more than 10 minutes during the work day, my battery will die in less than 12 hours. And this isn't an aging battery issue - the problem became apparent the first day 3G went live in my town. A dramatic performance hit in one day.

 

[chicagdan]

Without the phone unlocked by AT&T, it reverts to the out-of-box state, in which nothing works.

The guy at the Apple store said I could sell my old phone on ebay.

Now lets do the math - I spent $599 for the phone, less the $100 Steve Jobs rebate, and now I am going to sell an old non-working phone against a subsidized $199 phone (that is clearly better), and other unlocked phones? I think your old locked iPhone will be worth $25-50, maybe.

There's still a strong market for the first gen iPhones on eBay. Other posters are correct that they fetch more money if you unlock them, but even locked first gen 8 gig phone are selling for $200 to $300.

What I wonder is this -- I have a family plan with AT&T, will then let me transfer ownership of the first gen iPhone to my wife and let her continue with the current pricing scheme, then allow me to add an iPhone 3G?

 

[diamond.g]

I wish you could explain that to my battery. All I know is since 3G came to town, my Blackjack can barely survive a day. On standby, I used to manage 2 days on Edge. And if I talk for more than 10 minutes during the work day, my battery will die in less than 12 hours. And this isn't an aging battery issue - the problem became apparent the first day 3G went live in my town. A dramatic performance hit in one day.

I still don't think that persons explaination is right. If it was the iPhone couldn't work in a place like Japan since there is no 2G/EDGE network to speak of. When on a 3G network your calls are in 3G. The 2G stuff is there as a fall back. Ironically enough W-CDMA (UTMS) can run on top of almost any network (again using Japan as basis for example).

 

[egor]

Steve Jobs, I'm almost certain, stated MMS is a dying, limited, technology. Don't ask me to quote, I can't, but I'm more than 75% certain I remember there being this asked with the original iPhone and this was the answer.

It isn't like you can't send pictures... just email it to someone's phone #... ex. 5558675309@vzwpix.com..... to send a picture... and of course they come in with that viewmymessage site. And they don't count as messages that way with the pitiful, over-expensive, AT&T messaging plans.

Well, if thats Jobs' position I guess we won't be seeing MMS. This means I won't get an iPhone because it isn't a dying technology (I get MMS all the time).

To do it via email takes alot longer, required me to know the carrier of the person I'm calling (plus the domain) and it also relies on them having mobile email set up (which I doubt many use).

In any case I hope this isn't true, I'm not the only one who won't buy an iPhone because it doesn't include a basic feature and as a shareholder this concerns me. My only hope is that there is going to be something that will supersede MMS, but I haven't heard of it.

 

[markcc]

wait for the 3g and how it impacts ebay pricing

right now is different than a month from now, with no 3g $199 phone, todays ebay phones compete against the $299 and $399 iphones out today. With the subsidized introduction of a better phone, those numbers are unlikely to work.

 

[diamond.g]

I didnt believe it either - your old classic iPhone will be locked before you leave the store with your new 3g iPhone. He said the iPhone is deauthorized and cannot be used as an iPod or WiFi device. I probed him about other terms and conditions and he was very informed, not just a recent hire. He was able to tell me about the $10 extra charge for the data and the fact that there would not be an extension of the two year contract for those who are trading up and paid full price for their iPhones.

I even expressed anger and disappointment with Apple at the guy when he told me that my old phone would be turned into a brick, and he understood what I was saying and he held firm, so it seems he has been briefed.

The sales people at the NYC Apple store have the info - call them to verify.

Why wouldn't the 3G iPhone SIM work in the 2G/EDGE iPhone? Locking that feature out makes no sense.

 

[markcc]

not clear what is going to be done between the old and new iPhone activation

It is not clear what the upgrade path between the old iPhone and new iPhone really is. I didnt ask if it was the same or different sim card. Also, it seemed from the conversation, that AT&T is going to do something to your old phone to get the new one working, perhaps porting your old data to the new one?

If this is true, I suspect that there will be a lot of "lost" original iPhones in July.

 

[danny_w]

Well, if thats Jobs' position I guess we won't be seeing MMS. This means I won't get an iPhone because it isn't a dying technology (I get MMS all the time).

To do it via email takes alot longer, required me to know the carrier of the person I'm calling (plus the domain) and it also relies on them having mobile email set up (which I doubt many use).

In any case I hope this isn't true, I'm not the only one who won't buy an iPhone because it doesn't include a basic feature and as a shareholder this concerns me. My only hope is that there is going to be something that will supersede MMS, but I haven't heard of it.

Jobs' position for several years now has been that 4:3 tv's were not only a dying breed (which I can agree with) but were already dead. Why else would the original TV not have 4:3 support when every IPod, console, dvd player, and set top box out there does have it? That is certainly one reason why the TV 'hobby' has not really taken off yet - not everybody has the technology necessary to make use of the device. Unfortunately when he gets something into his mind it stays that way, and to heck with anybody who might tend to think differently. So no, MMS on the iPhone is about as likely as 4:3 support on the TV (and I wouldn't hold my breath for either one right now).

EDIT: And yes, I do have an TV, but only for audio. To me it was worth it just for the menu system compared to the Roku Soundbridge that I had before it that only had a small display. But I really wish they would add a search tool and decent sorting to make things easier to find. It seems these things really don't get much attention.

 

[diamond.g]

It is not clear what the upgrade path between the old iPhone and new iPhone really is. I didnt ask if it was the same or different sim card. Also, it seemed from the conversation, that AT&T is going to do something to your old phone to get the new one working, perhaps porting your old data to the new one?

If this is true, I suspect that there will be a lot of "lost" original iPhones in July.

That stinks. I was gonna use my Og iPhone as a backup (and possibly unlock it for when I do overseas).

 

[Paladin]

Call me old-fashioned, but I can't figure out what functionality MMS gives you above and beyond email. The only thing I can figure is that most phones have pretty crappy email support, so iPhone users want a lesser feature added to be able to send MMS messages to friends with lesser phones. In addition, they want to pay more per month (Unlimited or extra Text Messages) for the privilege of doing so. You are already paying for a data plan with your iPhone, so you might as well send emails that don't cost anything extra and provide arguably more functionality.

 

[BranzLS]

My question is...

If you already are in contract with AT&T, do you still get the new iPhones for $199 and $299? Or do you pay "full retail" as you would with any other phone?

 

[egor]

Call me old-fashioned, but I can't figure out what functionality MMS gives you above and beyond email. The only thing I can figure is that most phones have pretty crappy email support, so iPhone users want a lesser feature added to be able to send MMS messages to friends with lesser phones. In addition, they want to pay more per month (Unlimited or extra Text Messages) for the privilege of doing so. You are already paying for a data plan with your iPhone, so you might as well send emails that don't cost anything extra and provide arguably more functionality.

As I outlined in a previous post, I don't know the email address people use on their phones or if they have them set up. If people get an email message they can't just "call back" either. Its unpopular, I've never once used mobile email.

Fact is, SMS is far more popular than email and voice calls.

 

[markcc]

contract

I own an iPhone, so only discussed that, the sales guy said that I would get the $199 and $299 price without extending my contract.

 

[chicagdan]

Call me old-fashioned, but I can't figure out what functionality MMS gives you above and beyond email. The only thing I can figure is that most phones have pretty crappy email support, so iPhone users want a lesser feature added to be able to send MMS messages to friends with lesser phones. In addition, they want to pay more per month (Unlimited or extra Text Messages) for the privilege of doing so. You are already paying for a data plan with your iPhone, so you might as well send emails that don't cost anything extra and provide arguably more functionality.

Of course Apple is using a superior technology with iPhone e-mail. The problem is RECEIVING the damn MMS messages. I don't want to be able to create them, but I sure as hell don't want to be stuck in AT&T's pathetic MMS viewing system whenever my sister sends family pictures via MMS.

 

[BuffaloTF]

Jobs' position for several years now has been that 4:3 tv's were not only a dying breed (which I can agree with) but were already dead. Why else would the original TV not have 4:3 support when every IPod, console, dvd player, and set top box out there does have it? That is certainly one reason why the TV 'hobby' has not really taken off yet - not everybody has the technology necessary to make use of the device. Unfortunately when he gets something into his mind it stays that way, and to heck with anybody who might tend to think differently. So no, MMS on the iPhone is about as likely as 4:3 support on the TV (and I wouldn't hold my breath for either one right now).

EDIT: And yes, I do have an TV, but only for audio. To me it was worth it just for the menu system compared to the Roku Soundbridge that I had before it that only had a small display. But I really wish they would add a search tool and decent sorting to make things easier to find. It seems these things really don't get much attention.

The first iMac lacked floppy disk support too, which was his belief that the floppy would no longer be used going into the future. It may have taken quite some time, in fact my brand new work computer still has one for some random reason, but he was right.

I understand the inconvenience of needing to use emails... but let's get serious here -- You're paying good money for something that rounded to the nearest whole number, costs any and all Cell carriers $0.00 to send and receive. For all this talk about how we're getting robbed on the new phone, I think good ol' Steve-o is doing us all a favor where, by default, we'd need to use the website to receive or send an email to send one, all for "free". Worst case scenario, there will be an app you can use like SwirleyMMS.

I also think there's a misunderstanding iof the email option. Sending an email to their phone number will come thru as an actual text/picture/video message... not as an email. SMS and MMS is really nothing more than a character-limited email, and cell carriers switch it for you when you send one or receive one. You can add their numbers for this purpose to the contact list under 2nd emails... and they can reply to you.

Conversely, you can take any SMS/MMS enabled phone and enter an email address, and send an email that way... and if you reply to the "text" you got in your email, replying will send a text back to the phone that sent it. So we're all using mobile email, we just all don't realize it.

 

[danny_w]

The first iMac lacked floppy disk support too, which was his belief that the floppy would no longer be used going into the future. It may have taken quite some time, in fact my brand new work computer still has one for some random reason, but he was right.

I understand the inconvenience of needing to use emails... but let's get serious here -- You're paying good money for something that rounded to the nearest whole number, costs any and all Cell carriers $0.00 to send and receive. For all this talk about how we're getting robbed on the new phone, I think good ol' Steve-o is doing us all a favor where, by default, we'd need to use the website to receive or send an email to send one, all for "free". Worst case scenario, there will be an app you can use like SwirleyMMS.

Sorry, but "good ol' Steve-o" is certainly not doing his customers any favor when he makes the look like idiots to their friends that want to or need to use MMS on their 'silly' free phones.

 

[a104375]

return the iphone if youre paying the cancellation?

yeah I was questioning that as well no only do you have to pay a early cancellation fee you have to send the phone back... seems fishy.. oh well I dont plan to get an iPhone anytime soon so..