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Who cares about all of this? If I want to be shooting movies or putting together photo albums, I'll get a videocam or SLR.

This is a phone. It's a communication device. Where's HD voice? Improved speakers so I can hear speakers on the other end? What about improvements in antenna and reception? Speakerphone? WiFi hotspot ease of use?

How about wifi-calling across all wireless carriers? Where was additional presentation about ios7 improvements and how they work with the new iPhone. Any improvements in Mail, instant messaging, voicemail, anything at all that improves the iPhone as a communications device?

Presentation sucked, all I saw was junk about video games and dual flash for photos that no one cares about. Candy for people who like to waste time. This is a phone.

Get off my lawn kids!!!!! AAARRRRGGGGG!!!!
 
The 120FPS is going to be great for capturing videos of dogs. Imagine Fido leaping through the air in slo-mo. :D

Don't have high hopes. There is a huge chance 720p120 will have half the resolution because of the pixel binning - which saddled the 4S / 5 too (in 720p60).
 
Oh please, don't compare it to a DSLR

Me too. The main reason i won't upgrade from the 5. I'll get the LG G2 instead, which has both OIS, stereo audio and 1080p60. Unlike the 5s.

Dude, go buy a real camera if you care about quality. No smartphone will ever match a proper DSLR with good optics. Hell, even a so-so DSLR with plastic kit lens will outdo anything any smartphone can ever produce. It's simply physics.

The main thing about a camera-phone is that you always have it with you. Apple needed to address the basic stuff: smartphone pics are very often blurry, cannot capture fast-moving stuff like kids and pets and the flash is horrible. They worked on all three, meaning that your everyday snapshots just got a little better.

If you want to take real pictures, use a real camera.
 
That's funny, I have the S95, and I was wondering if the iPhone 5S camera spec is advanced enough that it might finally compete with the low light quality of the S95 to S120 line. I seriously doubt it though. I'm actually awaiting reviews of the upcoming S120 to see if it's worth an upgrade. The wifi would make it easy to transfer photos to the iPhone so even if I shoot with my Canon, I can still socially share it on the iPhone without the need for additional accessories.

It won't. All you have to know is that the 5S still uses an LED flash

Which means if the subject is more than 1.5 meters away, the flash is useless because it's not bright enough. And if something is moving in the picture, it's an automatic blur because the pulse is too long
 
????

Who cares about all of this? If I want to be shooting movies or putting together photo albums, I'll get a videocam or SLR.

This is a phone. It's a communication device. Where's HD voice? Improved speakers so I can hear speakers on the other end? What about improvements in antenna and reception? Speakerphone? WiFi hotspot ease of use?

How about wifi-calling across all wireless carriers? Where was additional presentation about ios7 improvements and how they work with the new iPhone. Any improvements in Mail, instant messaging, voicemail, anything at all that improves the iPhone as a communications device?

Presentation sucked, all I saw was junk about video games and dual flash for photos that no one cares about. Candy for people who like to waste time. This is a phone.

You, my friend, are in a small minority. You obviously didn't see most of the presentation. Did your eyes open just on that part? I seem to have seen a lot more.
 
Dude, go buy a real camera if you care about quality. No smartphone will ever match a proper DSLR with good optics. Hell, even a so-so DSLR with plastic kit lens will outdo anything any smartphone can ever produce. It's simply physics.

The main thing about a camera-phone is that you always have it with you. Apple needed to address the basic stuff: smartphone pics are very often blurry, cannot capture fast-moving stuff like kids and pets and the flash is horrible. They worked on all three, meaning that your everyday snapshots just got a little better.

If you want to take real pictures, use a real camera.

Look, I know quite a lot about shooting - actually, I've authored tons of photo / video-specific articles. So I know what I'm talking about.

1, I in no way stated I need DSLR quality because I too know it's impossible to have in such small a package.

2, however, OIS can work wonders in even smartphones, as was proved by the Nokia 920 / 925 / 928 / 1020 - and, hopefully, also the G2. This is why photo geeks are really disappointed by Apple's not including OIS in the 5S.

3, "Hell, even a so-so DSLR with plastic kit lens will outdo anything any smartphone can ever produce.", you state. DR- and noise-wise, sure. Resolution / video moire / aliasing-wise (which may be more important under certain circumstances), not necessarily.

Check out, for example, http://www.gsmarena.com/piccmp.php3?idType=1&idPhone1=5543&idPhone2=5371&idCamera3=30005 - the Samsung Galaxy NX with kit lens vs. the GS4 and the LG G2. While the Samsung has a 20 Mpixel sensor, it delivers about the same effective resolution as the GS4 (and somewhat higher than the G2).
 
Who cares about all of this? If I want to be shooting movies or putting together photo albums, I'll get a videocam or SLR.

This is a phone. It's a communication device. Where's HD voice? Improved speakers so I can hear speakers on the other end? What about improvements in antenna and reception? Speakerphone? WiFi hotspot ease of use?

How about wifi-calling across all wireless carriers? Where was additional presentation about ios7 improvements and how they work with the new iPhone. Any improvements in Mail, instant messaging, voicemail, anything at all that improves the iPhone as a communications device?

Presentation sucked, all I saw was junk about video games and dual flash for photos that no one cares about. Candy for people who like to waste time. This is a phone.
Exactly. If I want a decent pic in low light I reach for my Canon (which cost about as much as an iphone!)
I'd love to see some enhancements to the PHONE part of the iphone too. Maybe multi-select emails so I can move or delete multiple messages?
Or how about a frickin microSD slot?
And I still cannot believe that Aplpe still hasnt revisited the other buttons on its phones. I have had iphones for years and still fumble with the volume and vibrate switch. I simply cannot tell by touch which is which.
(and I have pretty nimble fingers)
 
You think that smartphones have become successful because they're better phones?

Smartphones are successful because they are portable computers that just happen to offer telephony, cameras, sensors and wireless, high-speed internet connections.

Presentation sucked, all I saw was junk about video games and dual flash for photos that no one cares about. Candy for people who like to waste time. This is a phone.
 
I'm glad to see them keep the megapixels the same as they try and improve the quality of photos. f/2.2, bigger pixels and a color adjusting flash should make a lot of pictures much better.

QFT. I posted many times that I hope they take this route. They made the best decision in regards to the camera.
 
It won't. All you have to know is that the 5S still uses an LED flash

Which means if the subject is more than 1.5 meters away, the flash is useless because it's not bright enough. And if something is moving in the picture, it's an automatic blur because the pulse is too long

....and, as I'e also pointed out above WRT the S90, even the oldest Canon S model (the S90) is a better photographic tool than the 5S because of

- RAW
- manual modes (heck, you can't even set the WB of the 5s, let alone other parameters!)
- 28mm WA (and zoom if you like)
- significantly larger sensor and somewhat brighter lens at WA

etc.
 
Who cares about all of this? If I want to be shooting movies or putting together photo albums, I'll get a videocam or SLR.

This is a phone. It's a communication device. Where's HD voice? Improved speakers so I can hear speakers on the other end? What about improvements in antenna and reception? Speakerphone? WiFi hotspot ease of use?

How about wifi-calling across all wireless carriers? Where was additional presentation about ios7 improvements and how they work with the new iPhone. Any improvements in Mail, instant messaging, voicemail, anything at all that improves the iPhone as a communications device?

Presentation sucked, all I saw was junk about video games and dual flash for photos that no one cares about. Candy for people who like to waste time. This is a phone.
Easy there. It's *called* a phone. However, nowadays, that means so much more than just calling people. After all, in the beginning, PC's were designed for spreadsheets and word processors. Eventually there were games. And then publishing software. Graphic design software. More games. Then the internet happened and functionality of the PC grew even more.

The usage of a product is not limited to its label. Nowadays, I would argue that a significant portion of people's communication takes place via txting or e-mail, not talking. I'm puzzled by your soap box. How much more room for improvement do you think there is? Why would wireless carriers want to support WiFi calling?
 
"Hell, even a so-so DSLR with plastic kit lens will outdo anything any smartphone can ever produce.", you state. DR- and noise-wise, sure. Resolution / video moire / aliasing-wise (which may be more important under certain circumstances), not necessarily.

Check out, for example, http://www.gsmarena.com/piccmp.php3?idType=1&idPhone1=5543&idPhone2=5371&idCamera3=30005 - the Samsung Galaxy NX with kit lens vs. the GS4 and the LG G2. While the Samsung has a 20 Mpixel sensor, it delivers about the same effective resolution as the GS4 (and somewhat higher than the G2).

The Galaxy NX is a Mirrorless camera. It's not a DSLR.
 
The Galaxy NX is a Mirrorless camera. It's not a DSLR.

IQ-wise, it is in the DSLR territory, as are other, top-of-the-line ILC's like the E-M5 - large sensor, large lens. It's, basically, only the different method of focusing (helped by the mirror in DSLR's) that are different between them.
 
For social shots / self-portraits (and most smartphone shots belong to this category), there is.
Still, that's no clear advantage for me. It's your preference. I like it the way it is.

1, it's not an overkill if the hardware (lens, storage speed etc.), otherwise, makes it possible to make true use of the resolution. If you want to shoot 4K because you need as detailed image as possible, why not?
Because you could just blow up a 1080p image and add a bit of grain to get the same level of details. It's really hard to produce 4k videos that don't look messy. Even DSLR camera manufacturers are struggling with that. 4k are more than 8 megapixels per frame and even still photographs by smart phone cameras in bright sunshine don't really get you 8 megapixels of detail. The optics just can't handle that.

2, WRT 1080p, all iPhones starting with 4 made full use of the maximal resolution (the 4 of 720p) and many other models too. That is, not even 720p/1080p is useless on most smartphones (incl., again, all A4+ iPhones).
Again, there is a difference between resolution and level of detail. You don't need to record 1920x1080 pixels if the image is all blurry and grainy.
 
the best camera is the one you have with you.

I shoot a lot with my SLR, but most times I'm just out with friends i'm not gonna lug it around, but I will have my phone with me and if it captures a better photo than all the better

This. I have a dslr with multiple lenses and a compact with full manual controls. The iPhone captures the best moments because I always have it accessible. The better the pics the better.

To those saying its just a phone, it's not. It's a pocket computer that happens to make calls. I use 1200 minutes/month calling time. I use the rest of the device much more.
 
Nokia likes to claim they have 41 megapixels in their Lumia...

This just goes to show that more is not always better.
 
Still, that's no clear advantage for me. It's your preference. I like it the way it is.

For you, maybe. For a LOT of customers, it definitely is. I've authored the full sensor oversampler JB tweak for the iPhone 4 / 4S / 5 and they were popular among the JB crowd, despite their framerate-related problems (see for example https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1538193/ ). Simply because people wanted much wider FoV's than the rather narrow ~40mm equiv when shooting 1080p.

Also, there's a reason a lot of manufacturers emphasize their phones have WA lens. (As I've explained in one of my prev. post above.)

Because you could just blow up a 1080p image and add a bit of grain to get the same level of details. It's really hard to produce 4k videos that don't look messy. Even DSLR camera manufacturers are struggling with that. 4k are more than 8 megapixels per frame and even still photographs by smart phone cameras in bright sunshine don't really get you 8 megapixels of detail. The optics just can't handle that.

Wrong. The optics of the iPhone 4S / 5 or the GS4 can easily resolve 8 Mpixels. With a semi-decent optics, it's not the optics that is the main bottleneck with 4K recording but the general throughput and H.264 encoding capacity of the system. When the latter are OK, 4K streams can indeed have vastly better resolution than 1080p.


Again, there is a difference between resolution and level of detail. You don't need to record 1920x1080 pixels if the image is all blurry and grainy.

Let me point out again that, as has also been proved by my resolution measurements (see my latest ones at https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1601763/ WRT lossless zooming in iOS7), flagship smartphones can easily resolve 1080p in the stored footage. If you don't believe me, check out my past articles, I've published many on all iPhone models starting with the 4 (and also the iPad 2/3) where I did measure the true, effective resolution of the video recordings of these phones. I certainly know what I'm speaking about.

----------

I love my iphone (and its camera) but not even close. Have you ever used a DSLR?

Apparently not. Otherwise, he could have spotted the oversharpening halos and the visible noise in all color channels evident in all Apple's shots.

They aren't as bad as with the Sony "Honami" Z1 but still not DSLR level.
 
I am pretty sure I read that the iPhone 4s also supports HD voice on t-mobile as well.

This is a case by case basis depending on the carrier the first iPhone to have HD voice was the iPhone 5 for T-Mobile when it launched last spring. HD voice is going to take a few more years to be available on all carriers, because currently only Sprint and T-Mobile use it, and both are via different technologies, and also only work for their respective carriers.
 
SloMo mode was presumably inspired by the fact that there's been no significant features added to the iPhone since the iPhone 4 was launched 39 months ago...
 
Having a 33mm vs the better 28mm wider angle is a definite black eye.

How often do people take pics of things that are closer, groups of people, and the like?

All the time.
 
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