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No. They should have moved to a common standard. That would have been the right way. The way to make money and gouge customers is the route Apple have taken.
Bluetooth is a common standard. And Apple can't actually gouge customers as long as competition exists.

The "Apple is doomed" crowd think that this change will cause a mass exodus from the iPhone. A few set themselves up as examples for others to follow (they say, "I've bought two of every single iPhone since the first one, but this year I'm switching to the Galaxy 7"). If they are correct, then Apple will lose money on this decision.

The "Apple is gouging" crowd thinks iPhone users are stuck with the iOS ecosystem and will grumblingly pay a few extra bucks here or there to stay in iOS, and that just isn't fair because switching is impossible.

There have always been alternatives to the iPhone. You didn't really need a smart phone in 2007. Other phones supported Flash websites, or had cut and paste before Apple did. Some had cool new features like cameras to automatically detect where you were looking and scroll automatically, or give you a pseudo-3D view through head tracking. Some phones had bigger camera bumps than Apple has ever had, and took astoundingly better photos. The option to take DSLR-quality photos has been available for a long time (all you had to do was carry a DSLR with you).
 
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If someone said, design me a shape that the human hand can grip easily and would not slip, you seriously think a smooth faced thin shape would be deemed the ultimate?

Think about anything ergonomic. It's designed to fit the hand, be grip-able, non slip etc.
These items are designed to LOOK simplistic, neat etc.
They are in effect a non finished item, that an end user then has to fit into a case to either give it grip, protect it from damage etc.

Just google the word:
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=e...ved=0ahUKEwiumZmg8sDOAhUFCcAKHUZtAg4Q_AUIBygC

The ideal shape is a shape that's designed for humans to use in their hands, to hold easy, to not slip from being held, to not break easy when dropped from a normal standing height.

These devices LOOK great to our current societies viewpoint on things, but in reality for a device held by a human that are about as bad as you can get.

While I totally agree with you -- and I also hate the ergonomics of recent smartphones -- I will play devil's advocate and point out that these devices are also meant to be carried comfortably in pockets (sometimes next to a wallet, etc.)... which wasn't the case with Sony Sports Walkmans, Game Boys, or [name your favorite durable old device that fit securely in the hand].
 
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Like on iPad Pro then. I have one of those. The sound is good on it. I'm dubious it will give any relevant effect on a 5" phone? Of course it will be louder.

But make an 'ornamental' design solution like having a face 'grill' for speaker is so confusing and not like Apple. Especially also if they want to make it water-proof?

The best speaker placement without any argument is, top and bottom of the device.
When playing back Movies/Video's and the vast majority of games the phone is in landscape orientation, and with a large phone, speakers at either end, can give a noticeable effective stereo effect.

If you are just playing music when the phone on your desk, then, 2 speakers should always give a better overall sound than one at one end also.

There really can be no argument for saying 1 speaker at one end is in any way better, one at each end is obviously superior for sound output.

Now, you can argue of course how those speakers are placed.

On the back (I hate that layout)
On the sides (better than on the back, but still not sending the sound to the users ears)
On the front (Without question the best location to send the best sound when you are facing the device)

I understand however that cosmetically some people do not like speakers on the front (where they should technically and naturally/obviously be) so function wins over form/quality on that one.
 
And if Wilbur and Orville were going to make an airplane, they would have put jet engines on it because those are better that propeller-based engines. Just because someone didn't do something in the past, under different circumstances and conditions, doesn't mean they won't do that thing in the future, for potentially different reasons, or because the tech is now easier to implement.

Except that wasn't the issue here. I don't refute that it's possible Apple may do this, but at the time Lightning was introduced, it was designed to provide exactly that functionality, to dynamically reassign pins to offer whatever signal was required of whatever was plugged into it. If they wanted to allow Lightning to output an analogue signal from the iPhone, they could have specifically developed that as part of the initial implemenatation -- especially since they knew they would need to adapt existing 30-pin equipment. In fact nothing would have been more possible or easier for Apple to do than to pass the analogue signal output to the 30-pin adapter, and lightning docks. What Apple seems to have done is seek to standardize the Lightning output from the iPhone. Developers may expect only a digital signal. Now a Lightning device meant to be plugged into an iPhone is a whole different deal, and it is uncharted territory as far as being adapted for use with analogue signals, so anything is truly possible there. But as you say, we shall see.

Many scenarios in which it would cost Apple more, e.g., Apple provides new lightning headphones with 3.5 adapter with new iPhone, or Apple provides new headphones and sells adapter at cost. We could go on all day, but I think the point is made.

Don't forget the inevitable loss of sales which Apple knows are coming. It's going to cost Apple a lot more than any subsidies they may offer.

Last month BT overtook wired headphones in sales revenue for the first time. New ones are released almost every day. Many of those already have as good or better sound than the existing ear buds.

Need to qualify this -- current BT may be as good or better than some low-quality earbuds, but I'd argue current BT isn't even as good as the earbuds bundled with the iPhone. Then again, Apple isn't likely removing the headphone jack without offering something much better than what we have now.

Completely wrong. There is currently no lossless Bluetooth codec, so any existing Bluetooth earbuds (even aptX Bluetooth, which Apple doesn't and won't ever support) will always sound worse than equivalent wired buds. And just add to that the issue of EMI and RFI noise, dropouts, the inconvenience of having to charge your wireless earbuds and the risk of them running out of juice during an important call.

From what I've read Apple already supports aptX under OS X. Noise and dropouts seem to be mostly a thing of the past, and people have to charge everything now. As for running out of juice during an important call, I'm not sure why that matters unless you're climbing Half-Dome at the time. If the battery runs out (which will give you advance warning), you switch to the handset, just like I do whenever I exit my car mid-call. Of course if you're listening to music, you just plug a cable into your wireless headphones. But it's a minor inconvenience for the enormous benefit of otherwise being able to listen to music and make phone calls without being tethered to a device.

If Apple was doing this as you intimate for purely technical progression and a "better" solution to a (unknown) problem, then it will be repeated on every single Apple from this point forward...wouldn't it? I suspect that will not be the case and we will see the headphone jack on their products for a long time to come. In reality, removing it would a much easier on virtually every other product they make to remove it rather than their phones? Why didn't they remove from the SE where the space is even more valuable?

What's clear is that Apple and other mobile device makers will increasingly move toward wireless connections, which is the future of everything. It's already the mobile standard for data. Audio is next, and then power. There's no argument that wireless is the future, especially for mobile devices. It's simple why the headphone jack wasn't removed from the SE -- Apple's not going to tip their hand before they're ready to launch a complete wireless audio solution on their flagship device. Besides, the SE didn't add any new hardware (aside from NFC), merely updated what was there. So there wasn't a substantial need to reclaim any space from what had already been engineered for that case. 3.5mm jacks aren't going away, but fewer manufacturers will likely make them an essential connection on products going forward as the standards change, and more devices gain BT and USB.

But if a device has room for both, I'm all for it. Apple is going about this the right way -- the iPhone is the highest selling product they make. It will be engine that drives change, many the Mac will support that change once it takes hold. People who use iPhones will want their Macs to have Lightning ports for convenience. But Apple also sells Macs to Android customers, so they can't just remove the headphone jack until Android has begun to offer other options. And there's no reason to, Macs have a lot of room to accomodate them, so do iPads.

quite clearly though that exhaust is at least attached from left to right?

Personally there is zero point having two speakers only half an inch apart producing left and right audio. Stereo will not affect your experience of music and might actually cause more audio artefacts. I don't see apple putting in two speakers especially if space is so tight they are considering removing the audio jack that takes up zero space comparatively. Removing the audio jack is a huge mistake IMHO and they will defo backtrack for the first time in apple history with the next one.

Actually if Apple were to backtrack, it most certainly wouldn't be the first time. The removal of FireWire from the MacBook was one such example -- it was back within a year. And there are others.
 
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You've got to read closer. There are undeniably some top quality BT headphones that sound superior to many of the wired headphones out there, including the Ear Buds.

You might want to try that same technique of reading "closer". I am not interested in lossy codecs, which all existing Bluetooth implementations are. Like for like, the exact same headphone drivers (whether dynamic, balanced armature, planar magnetic or electrostatic) will always sound worse via Bluetooth than they will via a wired connection. With Bluetooth, you also have to learn to tolerate interference noise and dropouts. I am not interested in headphones that have to be charged up and I am not willing to take the risk of them failing due to low battery while on an important call.

I respect your right to not care about audio quality. Why can you not reciprocate for those that do? Unless you're a paid Apple shill, why would you spend your life constantly posting on a forum whose subject you simply don't care about?
 
We will have to wait and see what Apple announce and say at the keynote. How many people use the headphone jack anyway, if wireless headphones are becoming more popular, it makes sense to remove the headphone jack.
More popular does not mean all. Besides, to date, Apple hsa included support for both. There are billions of wires headphones, cars, audio speakers, radios, etc... sold every year. Those people are now locked out of the iPhone 7 and onward.

This isn't a floppy drive, this isn't a CD-ROM

Most of those devices do not require daily charging. But in Apple's new direction, they all will require daily charging or be plugged in.

Bluetooth/wireless tech isn't there yet, to replace all the conveniences of the 3.5mm plug. No matter how much you and the rest of the Smugs try to convince people otherwise.
 
More popular does not mean all. Besides, to date, Apple hsa included support for both. There are billions of wires headphones, cars, audio speakers, radios, etc... sold every year. Those people are now locked out of the iPhone 7 and onward.

This isn't a floppy drive, this isn't a CD-ROM

Most of those devices do not require daily charging. But in Apple's new direction, they all will require daily charging or be plugged in.

Bluetooth/wireless tech isn't there yet, to replace all the conveniences of the 3.5mm plug. No matter how much you and the rest of the Smugs try to convince people otherwise.

Nobody is locked out of the iPhone 7, people can buy wireless headphones. I know it isn't a floppy drive or a CD-ROM, but it's still an old technology that will eventually get replaced, if not now, a few years down the line. Apple are probably not the only ones who are thinking about this, Apple will get rid of the headphone jack and other companies will follow, how long before Samsung copies Apple's move? despite what they may of said at their keynote.

The last point, i'm not trying to convince anyone, i have stated my own opinion i don't expect everyone to agree. Nobody is forcing you or anyone else who doesn't like it, to buy the iPhone 7, in fact the less people buy it the quicker i can pre-order and get mine :D
 
Bluetooth is a common standard. And Apple can't actually gouge customers as long as competition exists.

The "Apple is doomed" crowd think that this change will cause a mass exodus from the iPhone. A few set themselves up as examples for others to follow (they say, "I've bought two of every single iPhone since the first one, but this year I'm switching to the Galaxy 7"). If they are correct, then Apple will lose money on this decision.

The "Apple is gouging" crowd thinks iPhone users are stuck with the iOS ecosystem and will grumblingly pay a few extra bucks here or there to stay in iOS, and that just isn't fair because switching is impossible.

There have always been alternatives to the iPhone. You didn't really need a smart phone in 2007. Other phones supported Flash websites, or had cut and paste before Apple did. Some had cool new features like cameras to automatically detect where you were looking and scroll automatically, or give you a pseudo-3D view through head tracking. Some phones had bigger camera bumps than Apple has ever had, and took astoundingly better photos. The option to take DSLR-quality photos has been available for a long time (all you had to do was carry a DSLR with you).
So what. If the government suddenly tell you that public roads are off limits, guess what? There are always private roads right.
Apples business model, is gouging. Works for them. For now.
Another one that people didn’t think about initially. The Appstore. Means you can’t sell on any music or software. No thanks, I always buy mine outside of that eco system. Means I also get the advantage of sales and trials.
 
Nobody is locked out of the iPhone 7, people can buy wireless headphones. I know it isn't a floppy drive or a CD-ROM, but it's still an old technology that will eventually get replaced, if not now, a few years down the line. Apple are probably not the only ones who are thinking about this, Apple will get rid of the headphone jack and other companies will follow, how long before Samsung copies Apple's move? despite what they may of said at their keynote.

The last point, i'm not trying to convince anyone, i have stated my own opinion i don't expect everyone to agree. Nobody is forcing you or anyone else who doesn't like it, to buy the iPhone 7, in fact the less people buy it the quicker i can pre-order and get mine :D

Samsung will absolutely capitalize on Apple dropping the headphone jack to win customers back, even if a year later they drop it from their own flagships. However, I wouldn't be surprised if Samsung continues to make their phones a little larger to accomodate the headphone jack for much longer just to pick up whatever die hard 3.5mm headphone jack enthusiasts left behind.

There's no doubt that for some segment of the population, the loss of the 3.5mm Jack is going to cause some reasonable inconvenience. But that won't be me, nor will it be Apple's core business.

As has been pointed out, BT headphones have for the first time earned more profit than wireless headphones. And that's significant as it mirrors Apple's model. Apple currently only has less than a 15% share of the worldwide smartphone market, yet they're one of the most profitable businesses on the planet.

I think what's happening here is that some folks are suddenly finding themselves on the fringe of Apple's ecosystem and they don't like it, as Apple focuses on, and services the most profitable market segment of its business first, and everyone else second -- the way they always have done.

I mean, yes there are billions of wired cars, radios, speakers and headphones sold every year, but the most profitable ones include BT, and USB. In fact, is there a single car sold today that doesn't have BT, or at least USB? People just ignore these facts. Also, the computer industry is moving toward mobile laptops -- the only profitable segment of the market. And laptops need to be charged. So even though you don't have to charge external DVD players and external floppy disks (when they were used), you still had to power them from a device that had to be charged or powered itself. Seriously, in a mobile world that offers the convenience of wireless connectivity, complaining about charging is ridiculous. To those people I'd say a hard wired telephone, and Ethernet connection would be far better quality than anything the iPhone offers. The compromise? You have to stop at a roadside diner and plug them into power and phone and Ethernet lines.

And I think we can all agree that BT isn't there presently. But most of these arguments against a rumor of speculated changes, predicate their entire position on only what they are aware of which currently exists, rather than what Apple is likely to do as well. And much of that current technology, is only what they experienced the last time they tried it, which may have been years ago. It's incongruous at best.
 
It seems like for the last several years every iPhone release has had it's major controversies.
 
Judging from the other rumour about the screen being flipped upside down, wouldnt the removal of the headphone jack just open up room for a bigger camera module? If so, then it makes this rumour true i guess. They'll use that space for the mic (most likely?) and the power connector for the screen. Hence, that room won't go to waste. I could be totally wrong but we'll soon find out i guess, with tear downs and what not.
 
iPhones sales will fail to meet analysts estimates. Watch.

Yes, Apple is going to sell a crapload of iPhones, but it's going to be considerably less than before. And the trend will continue. And stock prices will drop.

The iPhone is indisputably inferior to the competition. It's really as simple as that. Anyone who claims otherwise is willfully blind.

Apple is acting like Sony in the 90s, and it's going to bite them in the ass. Don't take my word for it, though. Just wait and see what happens over the next year.

It's useless to get into arguments with people over which phone is superior. There are an ever increasing multitude of phones and what is important to each person in each phone is so variable that any discussion rapidly devolves into nonsense. For example, the increased privacy and security of the iPhone may not matter to you, but matters to many.

Stock predictions and sales are equally difficult and risky territory. You mention trends--Apple's stock price is up for the year. You mention analysts' estimates -- Apple exceeded those for both revenue and iPhone sales in the latest reporting.
 
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To those people I'd say a hard wired telephone, and Ethernet connection would be far better quality than anything the iPhone offers. The compromise? You have to stop at a roadside diner and plug them into power and phone and Ethernet lines.
I love the image of roadside diners offering ethernet jacks. :D

For most of its lifespan, the traditional wired telephone was supplied a signal by Ma Bell that was very limited in frequency range (300 to 3300 Hz), so not really better sound quality, FWIW.
 
people buying BT have no idea what BT standard their phone or heaphones are. A very very small minority who follow tech will buy headphones due to BT 5.0, more likely they will just be upgraders.

Wired will not get swamped .

Exactly the point. People upgrade because they care about performance, which is improving exponentially.
people buying BT have no idea what BT standard their phone or heaphones are. A very very small minority who follow tech will buy headphones due to BT 5.0, more likely they will just be upgraders.

Wired will not get swamped .


Of course most people don't follow the new BT standard by number, (although BT 5.0 will get a lot of publicity due to the tremendous increase in capability, and you'll see it advertised in product ads), but they do want to upgrade to a better experience. Just like how BT keyboards have swamped wired ones, get ready for wired headphones to be a distinct minority. As I indicated, wireless capabilities are increasing exponentially and wait until you see what Apple has been doing with it.
Then shut up.

Note the italics.

Come on, don't give up so easily. Take a break and come back with something thoughtful.
 
Nobody is locked out of the iPhone 7, people can buy wireless headphones. I know it isn't a floppy drive or a CD-ROM, but it's still an old technology that will eventually get replaced, if not now, a few years down the line. Apple are probably not the only ones who are thinking about this, Apple will get rid of the headphone jack and other companies will follow, how long before Samsung copies Apple's move? despite what they may of said at their keynote.

The last point, i'm not trying to convince anyone, i have stated my own opinion i don't expect everyone to agree. Nobody is forcing you or anyone else who doesn't like it, to buy the iPhone 7, in fact the less people buy it the quicker i can pre-order and get mine :D
Or they can choose not to, because they don't want YET ANOTHER items that needs to be recharged daily, and that can run out of juice at a moments notice, and leave you in the lurch. Especially when there are thousands and thousands of options available today, that provide better sound quality, and do NOT require daily recharging, and that do NOT stop working due to the lack of needing to be recharged.

Those people are locked out. No matter what you try to claim. Sure, they can give bluetooth a try, or get lightening headphones. But they could have already done that with the prior iPhones, and they chose NOT to do so. Floppy Drives and CR-ROMs were old technology, 3.5mm is an ubiquitous standard. The two shouldn't be mentioned in the same category - No matter what you try to claim.

I sense a theme here.
 
Or they can choose not to, because they don't want YET ANOTHER items that needs to be recharged daily, and that can run out of juice at a moments notice, and leave you in the lurch. Especially when there are thousands and thousands of options available today, that provide better sound quality, and do NOT require daily recharging, and that do NOT stop working due to the lack of needing to be recharged.

Those people are locked out. No matter what you try to claim. Sure, they can give bluetooth a try, or get lightening headphones. But they could have already done that with the prior iPhones, and they chose NOT to do so. Floppy Drives and CR-ROMs were old technology, 3.5mm is an ubiquitous standard. The two shouldn't be mentioned in the same category - No matter what you try to claim.

I sense a theme here.

Don't buy them then, I did say that previously. but Apple haven't even held the keynote yet and unvailed the new iPhone. You always have a choice, that's up to you, but there are also people like myself who are willing to give it a try.
 
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Don't buy them then, I did say that previously. but Apple haven't even held the keynote yet and unvailed the new iPhone. You always have a choice, that's up to you, but there are also people like myself who are willing to give it a try.
Enjoy!!

You are fortunate to NOT have Apple remove a port/feature that is key to your daily routine, nor for Apple to enforce a new routine when the current one has been working wonderfully.
 
Exactly the point. People upgrade because they care about performance, which is improving exponentially.

Of course most people don't follow the new BT standard by number, (although BT 5.0 will get a lot of publicity due to the tremendous increase in capability, and you'll see it advertised in product ads), but they do want to upgrade to a better experience. Just like how BT keyboards have swamped wired ones, get ready for wired headphones to be a distinct minority. As I indicated, wireless capabilities are increasing exponentially and wait until you see what Apple has been doing with it.

I would also add that Apple takes the specter of dealing with "specs" away, by branding their technologies. So instead of new and improved BT 5.0, it will be something like AirSound™ which will be backward compatible with BT 3 & 4, so it will work with your existing BT headphones. And this won't be some proprietary thing, it'll be Apple's branding of their BT 5 implementation like they did with Firewire -- heck even I don't know what the generic PC name for it is (IEEE 13-something?). So customers will come in looking for AirSound in their products, and won't have to worry about BT 4.x, 5.x compatibility, etc., nor whether what they already have will work with it. Instead of buying BT 5.x compatible headphones, customers will buy AirSound compatible headphones. And they will know as long as they buy AirSound headphones, they will always get the best quality available. And if Apple updates it, it will be AirSound 2. So simple even my 85 year old mom gets it and knows to upgrade.
 
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