verces said:
Fridge...cool....I get it!
1GB mini $139
and/or
2GB mini $179
my credit card is ready and waiting, Apple
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iPod Possibilites?
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Fridge...cool....I get it!
1GB mini $139
and/or
2GB mini $179
my credit card is ready and waiting, Apple
If Apple brings out a 6GB iPod mini I will be buying one tomorrow. I don't need all of my stuff with me but as of right now my playlists occupy just over 5GB.
SiliconAddict said:
right, it's a privledge to own an ipod
or that's what apple wants you to think. curse them and there elitist attitude
Apart from its general coolness factor and beautiful industrial design, the one key feature that made the iPod successful over earlier digital music players was its capacity. This is true even for the iPod mini -- there are plenty of players as small or smaller, but no real competition in that size as far as capacity.
I may be wrong, but I really can't see Apple going to a yet-smaller capacity player (and yet-smaller margins). Just as Apple has repeatedly refused to compete in the bottom-end commoditized PC market segment, I think it will avoid the bargain-basement end of the digital player market as well.
Despite claiming that it's "for the rest of us", Apple has never been about cheap -- it has been about value. Apple pushes new tech down the price curve, but it doesn't use old tech, or reduction in features, to drop prices.
As far as partnering with XM, unless there are hooks into iTMS (and it's hard to see how that would work on the iPod, unless it would download the song when synced), I can't see Steve doing it.
I may be wrong, but I really can't see Apple going to a yet-smaller capacity player (and yet-smaller margins). Just as Apple has repeatedly refused to compete in the bottom-end commoditized PC market segment, I think it will avoid the bargain-basement end of the digital player market as well.
Despite claiming that it's "for the rest of us", Apple has never been about cheap -- it has been about value. Apple pushes new tech down the price curve, but it doesn't use old tech, or reduction in features, to drop prices.
As far as partnering with XM, unless there are hooks into iTMS (and it's hard to see how that would work on the iPod, unless it would download the song when synced), I can't see Steve doing it.
I'm afraid to say it, but since the iPod is in such a dominant position at the top of the market, Apple doesn't need to do much to improve it at the moment. It's just like Tesco in the UK being the top supermarket by far - they don't need to offer good payback rates on their loyalty card or "refund and replace" offers for bad goods.
The iPod's style and status all adds to that. Its iconic status (helped by all the stars and celebs having one) makes people who have any other player feel they've got second best. I freely admit that an iPod is out of my price range. The only reason I'm getting one is because the cram and jam offer enabled me to get a 20GB 4G iPod for £70 (instead of £220) with my brother's iBook purchase. Likewise, he got his iPod for cheap when I got my PowerBook under a similar promotion last year. A cheap iPod could jepadise all this. Then there's the fact that Apple still has to be able to make any flash based one profitable.
The iPod's style and status all adds to that. Its iconic status (helped by all the stars and celebs having one) makes people who have any other player feel they've got second best. I freely admit that an iPod is out of my price range. The only reason I'm getting one is because the cram and jam offer enabled me to get a 20GB 4G iPod for £70 (instead of £220) with my brother's iBook purchase. Likewise, he got his iPod for cheap when I got my PowerBook under a similar promotion last year. A cheap iPod could jepadise all this. Then there's the fact that Apple still has to be able to make any flash based one profitable.
scottkle said:
Well GASP YOU! $20.00 or $10.00 who cares it's still extra cash just to use ALL the features of a never going to happen iPod. And while you are at it why don't you ask for a phone in the iPod(GASP!) or maybe cable tV(GASP! AGAIN) Whatever. I've done my homework! maybe you should do yours before you even think Apple can fit a satelite receiver in an iPod(GASP! ONCE AGAIN) and as far as me being closed minded, I'm just old enough to be realistic, and your how old? 12 maybe(GASP! 1 More Time for my new FAN)
Porchland said:
Nope, that only means Apple would have three different price points for the iPod (20GB, 40GB and 60GB), and three different price points for the iPod mini (1GB, 2GB, 4GB).
Because if you want to put the iPod and iPod mini in the same group, then start yelling about how Apple *currently has* SIX different price points for their laptops (iBook + PowerBook).
Porchland said:
But aren't the rumors about availability based on the scarcity of the 4GB HD? If they can produce the rest of the iPod mini in mass quantity, adding a 1GB Flash iPod mini to the lineup (same internals, same casing, same everyhing) would be a very fast "to-market" time (before Xmas) and would completely over-sell all the other flash players (except the crummy 128MB ones that sell for 50-75$US).
Last point: Apple, where's my miniBook?
iGary said:
But also note he only spoke badly about the flash players because of their low capacity.
How much do you want to bet that when they made their survey about the quantity of musics people have (which led to the creation of the iPod mini with "only 4GB"), a large group could still use a 1GB Flash iPod mini?
I'm still sticking with the 1GB Flash iPod mini at 129$~149$US. Steve *did* say they wanted to be able to lower the iPod price. That would be one way to do it (and 1GB is still "250 songs in your pocket" at 4MB each, or "25 CDs in your pocket" at an average of 10 songs per CD). It would also make a very strong "upsell" since for less than twice the price you'd get four times the storage (1GB iPod mini for 129$~149$US or 4GB iPod mini for 249$US...)
And at 129$US, they would completely *own* the market and get people hooked to the AAC format (and ITMS, if available). Apple wants (and needs) to own that market, or else they'll lose to WMA (which would be a repeat of MacOS vs Windows all over again).
johnnyjibbs said:
The iPod IS in a dominant position here, but the digital player market is far from mature. Apple would be foolish to think that they will continue to dominate without doing anything to secure the rest of the market as it develops. By that I mean the people who don't really need a $250 iPod mini now, but want to get a small (inexpensive) player because they are tired of replacing cheap CD players every year, or for whatever other reason (there are many good ones). Someone pointed out earlier in this thread that whichever DRM/file format someone starts life with is very likely to be the format they stick with down the road. A very strong point, and one that Apple simply cannot ignore if they want to be a long-term player here. If people can't purchase iTMS songs to play on their 512MB player now, what are the odd's that they will just abandon their purchased music to switch to iPod in a year or two? There is a huge market burgeoning out there (that the iPod helped create), and Apple doesn't provide a low cost entry into it. Lots of other people do, though. Apple may not have a flash drive iPod tomorrow, or anytime soon, but if they are smart they will have a sub-$200 player available to capture people early on. Sub-$150 would be better.
powermac666 said:
I agree with your whole post, just wanted to comment on the price a bit.
Nintendo GameBoy Advance SP: 79$US
Nintendo Gamecube: 99$US
Sony Playstation 2: 149$US
Microsoft XBox: 149$US
If Apple are really smart, they'll price it sub-150$US indeed. Or else people are faced with the "PS2, Xbox or iPod micro" choice. At 129$US, the choice is easier to make ("20$US less"). As far as Nintendo's prices, well, people who want a Nintendo are like people who want a Mac (In fact, Apple and Nintendo are really alike, as far as companies go).
And even if Apple only breaks even at 129$US, they should still do it (to get more people on the AAC side).
Tulse said:
true, true, true, true.
apple has always had a "you get what you pay for" kind of attitude (even when we were paying more for what we got). it would make sense to make a cheap flash player IF they're doing it to make AAC the dominant format, but they haven't really pushed that to my knowledge. hmm, i'm very interested how they could make a cheap player and then justify it.
XM? just don't see it. apple's music store is online, not broadcast. unless there was a feature of a button you could click to earmark a song you heard on XM to purchase from iTMS later, i don't see where the crossover would be.
now the color 60GB?? my VISA is ready & waiting...
Yvan256 said:
maybe, but those are all OLD technologies. i could get an Atari 2600 pretty cheap on ebay, but i would rather drop some extra $ on the Xbox. my Xbox was $400 when i bought it. seems steep almost 3 years later, but you pay for new technology.
a 1 or 2GB flash player is new tech. that memory is still pretty costly. don't get me wrong, if Apple comes out w/ a flash player, i think $125-$150 is a fair price, but kind of hard to compare a brand new product's price w/ an already dated gamecube.
Yvan256 said:
I recall reading about a study that determined that $199 was a price point at which the typical consumer would entrtain an impulse purchase. Prices higher require more reflection and planning. The console sales of the past couple of rounds ( first with Saturn, PlayStation, N64, then again with Dreamcast, PS2, Xbox, Gamecube) sure bear this out. Once the price breaks below $200, sales really take off and the market is penetrated beyond the leading edge consumer. Apple needs to get there to stake their place. Sure, lower is better for the consumer, but Apple has always been about maximum dollar for maximum quality. They don't NEED to go much below $199 unless competition forces them there, so they won't.
Sony launches Flash-based MP3 Walkmans
Holy cow, Sony just launched in Europe today, a 512 mb flash-based walkman for 200 euros, and a 1 gig for 240 euros (about $300 US). At least these supposedly play mp3 files, but holy cow, that seems a little spendy doesn't it? If you ask me though, this adds some validity to the possibility of Apple releasing a flash ipod. And if Apple could get the price down to $149 for a 1 gig they would absolutely humiliate Sony........um again, I mean.
Holy cow, Sony just launched in Europe today, a 512 mb flash-based walkman for 200 euros, and a 1 gig for 240 euros (about $300 US). At least these supposedly play mp3 files, but holy cow, that seems a little spendy doesn't it? If you ask me though, this adds some validity to the possibility of Apple releasing a flash ipod. And if Apple could get the price down to $149 for a 1 gig they would absolutely humiliate Sony........um again, I mean.
In general, Sony always overprices.. Again it's partly to do with the strength of the brand (like I was saying about iPod a little bit earlier). The problem for Sony is they charge too much more than their brand dictates in my opinion...jch200 said:
I have owned a bunch of these and iPod is the best. Just got a 4G 40 (my thirds iPod) on the weekend - it is sitting un-opened till I hear what is happening tomorrow.
The new Sony HD walkman is nice. 20 gb and way smaller than a 4G ipod - WAY smaller (close to a mini in size IMO). It costs more than the iPod 20 but comes with all the accessories - remote, dock, etc.
But it only plays stupid Atrac3 - good thing for Apple. And the interface sux. And there are buttons everywhere... including a strange 'use internal battery' switch???
Why just a 6 GB mini? I wants a 15 gb mini (three platter drive). I need top carry at least 11 Gb of tunes.
Flash iPod would rule too - BATTERY LIFE!
I wonder if HP iPod Tatoos are a tell... maybe the same tech is used for U2 iPod? If the U2 website graphics are used on the U2 iPod I sure hope I can get one. That would be cool.
Whatever Apple does tomorrow will be cool - it is in their nature.
The new Sony HD walkman is nice. 20 gb and way smaller than a 4G ipod - WAY smaller (close to a mini in size IMO). It costs more than the iPod 20 but comes with all the accessories - remote, dock, etc.
But it only plays stupid Atrac3 - good thing for Apple. And the interface sux. And there are buttons everywhere... including a strange 'use internal battery' switch???
Why just a 6 GB mini? I wants a 15 gb mini (three platter drive). I need top carry at least 11 Gb of tunes.
Flash iPod would rule too - BATTERY LIFE!
I wonder if HP iPod Tatoos are a tell... maybe the same tech is used for U2 iPod? If the U2 website graphics are used on the U2 iPod I sure hope I can get one. That would be cool.
Whatever Apple does tomorrow will be cool - it is in their nature.
Yvan256 said:Nope, that only means Apple would have three different price points for the iPod (20GB, 40GB and 60GB), and three different price points for the iPod mini (1GB, 2GB, 4GB).
Because if you want to put the iPod and iPod mini in the same group, then start yelling about how Apple *currently has* SIX different price points for their laptops (iBook + PowerBook).
But aren't the rumors about availability based on the scarcity of the 4GB HD? If they can produce the rest of the iPod mini in mass quantity, adding a 1GB Flash iPod mini to the lineup (same internals, same casing, same everyhing) would be a very fast "to-market" time (before Xmas) and would completely over-sell all the other flash players (except the crummy 128MB ones that sell for 50-75$US).
Last point: Apple, where's my miniBook?
The drives in these little MP3 players is usually just a CF card HD (like the Creative). I suspect it would take ZERO negineering to add a flash drive. 1 and 2 GB CF cards are DIRT cheap and FAST.
APPLE IS GOING TO RELEASE aacPLUS Tomorrow
read the article here:
http://www.apple-x.net/modules.php?...=article&sid=1162&mode=thread&order=1&thold=0
It's going to feature 5.1 surround sound at 160 kbps. The secret feature on 4th generation ipods is that the Audio Out is similar to the one found on Airport Express - it is also an optical audio out.
YAY!
read the article here:
http://www.apple-x.net/modules.php?...=article&sid=1162&mode=thread&order=1&thold=0
It's going to feature 5.1 surround sound at 160 kbps. The secret feature on 4th generation ipods is that the Audio Out is similar to the one found on Airport Express - it is also an optical audio out.
YAY!
IMO:
mini 6 GB - $249
mini 4 GB - $199
mini 2 GB - $179 (smaller but 30 hour battery life)
mini 1 GB - $129
20 - 299 (U2 SE same price but only 10,000 of them)
40 - 399
60 - 499
mini 6 GB - $249
mini 4 GB - $199
mini 2 GB - $179 (smaller but 30 hour battery life)
mini 1 GB - $129
20 - 299 (U2 SE same price but only 10,000 of them)
40 - 399
60 - 499
agentmouthwash said:
My old company QSND just did a deal with VOD to supply surround audio technology. VOD are serious about pushing this. Very cool.
Part of the 'cool' factor with the ipod is that not everyone can afford one, and therefore not everyone has one. If Apple were to introduce a $149 version, it would simply canibalize sales of the higher priced ipods. Why save up to buy a $249 ipod when you can save $100 and still say you have an ipod? It would kill the cool factor and the prestige of the product.
Apple seems to be using a similar model to their computers - stay out of the low-end of the business. The high-end is where the profit is.
I could see them introducing a 6GB mini for $249, and the price of the remaining stock of 4GBs would fall to $199. But I don't see Apple introducing a sub $200 model.
Apple seems to be using a similar model to their computers - stay out of the low-end of the business. The high-end is where the profit is.
I could see them introducing a 6GB mini for $249, and the price of the remaining stock of 4GBs would fall to $199. But I don't see Apple introducing a sub $200 model.
Maybe I should wait until tomorrow before ripping any more music then. I'd LOVE to try out this new aacPlus codec. AAC is pretty darn good - if aacPlus is significantly better, I'll switch to it.agentmouthwash said: