iPod Possibilites?

[Poff]

Price of Flash-iPod.

As some others have pointed out, if you look at the prices of other flash-players, Apple will have a hard time making a $99 1GB player.

The cheapest 256MB player I've found is priced just below $45. WITHOUT screen, but with USB 2.0 (Apacer Audio Steno VA210)
The cheapest 512MB player I've found is priced just below $130. With a small screen and USB 2.0 (TwinMOS RedRock S21)


Apple allready has 128MB(?) flash in their players for skip-protection, so you could subtract their cost of the hard-drive and get a price-approximation on a 128MB flash-iPod. I, however, do not believe this will be made.

At 512MB, I don't see how Apple can sell it much below $149. They might be able to use their goodwill to persuade others to give them good deals. If most of the innards of the flash-player would be the same as in the iPod mini, the cost of screen would be peanuts. The click-wheel would probably cost a bit.


Those rambling on about a $99 1GB flash-player are just hilarious. Lets take an example on the iPod mini.

Apple sells the mini for $249.
I do not know how much they pay for the 4GB hard-drive, but lets assume it's $100.
So if we remove the 4GB drive and replace it with a $50 1GB flash-card, the cost will be $50 less.
The retail price? $199.

 

[clonenode]

My 2 cents

There is always a 6 - 12 month lag between when some "insider" speaks of Apple tooling up for a new product and the actual release of said product. Apple may have a new, flash-based player in production, but we will not see it until after January.

 

[izzle22]

Apple will NOT include XM radio on the iPod it would be a waste and an added piece of junk to a great product. If you want XM buy an XM player.
CASE CLOSED! Lets move on now. Thanks

 

[MacinDoc]

Those rambling on about a $99 1GB flash-player are just hilarious. Lets take an example on the iPod mini.

Apple sells the mini for $249.
I do not know how much they pay for the 4GB hard-drive, but lets assume it's $100.
So if we remove the 4GB drive and replace it with a $50 1GB flash-card, the cost will be $50 less.
The retail price? $199.

Exactly. Even a 256 MB iPod Flash would have to cost at least $149.

 

[Poff]

iPod mini

After giving this a little thought, I'm thinking that a secure way to market these new flash-iPods will be not to market them at all!

People like dissing flash-players. And we all know the iPod mini is a HD-player. So what if they just started to sell several versions of the mini?


iPod mini 4GB - $249
iPod mini 1GB - $199
iPod mini 512MB - $149


They won't even have to mention the word "Flash", just say they've made smaller and more affordable versions of the iPod mini.

If this is what they'll do, however, I doubt we'll see a 512MB model, since this would not look so good. A choice between a 4GB and a 1GB model would seem more tidy and attractive, I guess.

(crosses fingers for 1GB iPod mini at a $169 price-point)

 

[scottkle]

Apple will NOT include XM radio on the iPod it would be a waste and an added piece of junk to a great product. If you want XM buy an XM player.
CASE CLOSED! Lets move on now. Thanks

OK, so about this combined XM and Ipod ... It's a fantastic idea. First of all, all this whining about the $99 iPod that will never happen in my lifetime is annoying. The cheapest 1 GB card is like $89 (trust me, I know .. i buy them). Apple still needs to put all the other stuff into it and make a profit. $179 if you are lucky, $199 is it happens at all.

I love XM. The thought of being able to use the ITMS OR XM is a beautiful thought that I would be most anxious to get in on. XM is looking for a way to outshine Sirius after the Howard Stern deal. A deal with Apple would make that happen so fast, Sirius' satellites will spin. This would be a high-end iPod, though, with a color screen and a required subscription to XM that would be discounted.

I'm the creative type. Apple is creative, but not quite as creative as me. They need to think like this. You get something as cool as the iPod and add a satellite radio to it that works all across the country and BAM!

Sure, they can't market it in Canada or Europe since XM isn't over there, but you know what? I respectfully say "who cares." I love other countries, but not enough for it to affect my iPod. I'll spend money in Canada on a Coffee Crisp or seeing Niagara Falls, but I could care less when they get the music store.

Nuff said. Let the angry responses begin.

 

[Porchland]

And we all know the iPod mini is a HD-player. So what if they just started to sell several versions of the mini?


iPod mini 4GB - $249
iPod mini 1GB - $199
iPod mini 512MB - $149


They won't even have to mention the word "Flash", just say they've made smaller and more affordable versions of the iPod mini.

I agree. There won't be an "iPod micro." If there's an iPod smaller than 4 GB, it will be branded an iPod mini. It probably wouldn't look any different from a mini and there's no reason to differentiate another brand into the marketing.

 

[gekko513]

I really don't understand where people get the cost Apple is paying for the 4GB drive in the iPod mini ... $100?? Why was there all these articles about how the cheapest retail way to get a 4GB microdrive was to buy an iPod mini and rip the drive out?

 

[zelmo]

A flash drive iPod mini helps Apple broaden the market for iTMS and AAC/Fairplay, in preparation for the coming DRM war with M$.

Rather that weaken the iPod brand, such a device DONE RIGHT might instill confidence to consumers who look at the current crop of 256/512 players as throwaway devices like portable CD players. My daughter went thru 2 a year at least. I wouldn't get her an iPod until she proved more responsible with her gear. Parents who shell out $99 for Gameboy, $149 for an Xbox or PS2, are going to like an Apple iPod at a low price point because they are used to paying those prices and they know that Apple is a well respected company. Twelve year old kids who have a small music collection don't need even 4GB, and they all grow up to be consumers.

A 1GB iPod mini for $139 and/or a 2GB iPod mini at $179? They'd sell like candy.

 

[Mainyehc]

I can't imagine Apple making any money on a $99 flash iPod when a 1 gb USB drive goes for $99. How do you add the battery, LCD, decoder chip, and a click wheel and make money off of a $99 player.

What about those people who bought minis, just to gut them out, because the CF-size 4GB HD inside it was actually *more* expensive than an iPod mini, when bought separately?? HA!

Perhaps the difference of price between bulk and retail as far as memory is concerned is substantially smaller than that of HD's? I don't know about that, but if it isn't, then, a $99-$149 iPod mini/micro/whatever is very feasible and profitable

 

[MacWhispers]

The right business move

Regardless of the validity of any of the current iPod rumors, there are certainly some important business issues to be faced by Apple and its new iPod division. And, those decisions must be made against whatever long-range positioning strategy Apple has in place with a variety of the company's products, including hardware, software, and services. Here's how it breaks down.

If Apple plans to make the portable hardware component of its growing A/V based operations the profit center for the company, then maintaining iPod prices and margins is the direction to go: No cheap iPods

If Apple plans on making its AAC/Fairplay franchise the future profit center, through growing downloads of both music and (eventually) video, then it is in the company's best interest to tilt all decisions now toward growing the raw number of AAC/Fairplay enabled devices in the market: Cheap iPods make sense

Wiht the Motorola cell phone deal, and with the aggressiveness with which Quicktime is being promoted to the cellphone industries, there are hints visible that Apple is leaning toward the idea of building its future revenue model around the ubiquity of its media encoding and DRM platforms. And, that approach would seem to make for a good business case.

Within the idea of growing the number of devices in the market that handle Apple's DRM system, it makes sense to carefully move into the flash-based music player space. As one poster here pointed out, everybody who buys a WMA based player today, and who then begins accummulating a DRM'd WMA based music collection is going to be a very, very difficult convert for Apple down the road. The reality is that whatever DRM platform a consumer chooses today is likely to remaim the DRM platform for that user, long-term. So, if Apple has designs on growing hugely into the content download business, its potential customer base for such future endeavors is shrinking today by every cheap flash player sold.

My judgment is that Apple should not be too terribly dazzled by the current revenue and profit numbers from the present iPod lineup to consisder making a well-crafted play for the flash based player space. The move should be done in Apple's typical high-road manner, and should not be a price-only move. After all, the distinguishing factors in the iPod's success as a hardware device are its trademark user interface and its "just works" operation wiht either Mac or Windows iTunes. Those features would have to be migrated, without compromise, to any flash based iPod version.

I've done some checking around the industry, and have concluded that at Apple's production volumes, they can hit their margin targets with a $149 1GB flash iPod. Doing so would require some modest price concessions (based on a long-term Apple volume commitment) from its flash supplier, and woould require using soldered flash on the new iPod's circuit board (rather than SD or other standard packaging), making the new iPod Micro a non-upgradable product (also within Apple's normal methods).

All of that now said, good research and solid reasoning support the notion of Apple coming to market with a $149 1GB flash based iPod, and soon. The click wheel interface can easily be scaled down to 2/3rd it present diameter and be wonderfully functional, as can the LCD display. So, my guess is that the micro will look like a neatly scaled down mini. No new efforts at reinventing the wheel are needed (no pun intended), as the scroll wheel interface and the display both work great at smaller sizes. And, the iPod mini "look," but at 2/3rd the footprint and one-half the thickness would be a killer design, especially at a $149 price. That iPod micro would instantly open a whole new swath of buyers.

Now, only time will tell if the good folks in Cuprtino are reading the tea leaves the same way I am reading them. However, what I've said here does make both good business sense and good technology sense.

 

[gekko513]

Creative Muvo Micro 1GB is around $189 so I wouldn't expect a 1GB Apple iPod mini to cost any less. If a 1GB mini is introduced it will probably be $199

Edit: Although I hope MacWhispers is right.

 

[Poff]

I really don't understand where people get the cost Apple is paying for the 4GB drive in the iPod mini ... $100?? Why was there all these articles about how the cheapest retail way to get a 4GB microdrive was to buy an iPod mini and rip the drive out?

I was just taking a guess. These drives did cost several hundred $ in regular stores, but I'm guessing this price was set by demand, not calculated from production costs. Apple is a totally different segment, and gets to buy them cheaper because the drives are calculated by another set of demand. Apple has a high profit-margin on their iPods. (though a lower one on the minis).

 

[wrldwzrd89]

Regardless of the validity of any of the current iPod rumors, there are certainly some important business issues to be faced by Apple and its new iPod division. And, those decisions must be made against whatever long-range positioning strategy Apple has in place with a variety of the company's products, including hardware, software, and services. Here's how it breaks down.

If Apple plans to make the portable hardware component of its growing A/V based operations the profit center for the company, then maintaining iPod prices and margins is the direction to go: No cheap iPods

If Apple plans on making its AAC/Fairplay franchise the future profit center, through growing downloads of both music and (eventually) video, then it is in the company's best interest to tilt all decisions now toward growing the raw number of AAC/Fairplay enabled devices in the market: Cheap iPods make sense

Wiht the Motorola cell phone deal, and with the aggressiveness with which Quicktime is being promoted to the cellphone industries, there are hints visible that Apple is leaning toward the idea of building its future revenue model around the ubiquity of its media encoding and DRM platforms. And, that approach would seem to make for a good business case.

Within the idea of growing the number of devices in the market that handle Apple's DRM system, it makes sense to carefully move into the flash-based music player space. As one poster here pointed out, everybody who buys a WMA based player today, and who then begins accummulating a DRM'd WMA based music collection is going to be a very, very difficult convert for Apple down the road. The reality is that whatever DRM platform a consumer chooses today is likely to remaim the DRM platform for that user, long-term. So, if Apple has designs on growing hugely into the content download business, its potential customer base for such future endeavors is shrinking today by every cheap flash player sold.

My judgment is that Apple should not be too terribly dazzled by the current revenue and profit numbers from the present iPod lineup to consisder making a well-crafted play for the flash based player space. The move should be done in Apple's typical high-road manner, and should not be a price-only move. After all, the distinguishing factors in the iPod's success as a hardware device are its trademark user interface and its "just works" operation wiht either Mac or Windows iTunes. Those features would have to be migrated, without compromise, to any flash based iPod version.

I've done some checking around the industry, and have concluded that at Apple's production volumes, they can hit their margin targets with a $149 1GB flash iPod. Doing so would require some modest price concessions (based on a long-term Apple volume commitment) from its flash supplier, and woould require using soldered flash on the new iPod's circuit board (rather than SD or other standard packaging), making the new iPod Micro a non-upgradable product (also within Apple's normal methods).

All of that now said, good research and solid reasoning support the notion of Apple coming to market with a $149 1GB flash based iPod, and soon. The click wheel interface can easily be scaled down to 2/3rd it present diameter and be wonderfully functional, as can the LCD display. So, my guess is that the micro will look like a neatly scaled down mini. No new efforts at reinventing the wheel are needed (no pun intended), as the scroll wheel interface and the display both work great at smaller sizes. And, the iPod mini "look," but at 2/3rd the footprint and one-half the thickness would be a killer design, especially at a $149 price. That iPod micro would instantly open a whole new swath of buyers.

Now, only time will tell if the good folks in Cuprtino are reading the tea leaves the same way I am reading them. However, what I've said here does make both good business sense and good technology sense.

That makes a lot of sense to me, MacWhispers. I could easily see a new iPod introduced at US$149 to enter a new market segment. What would be even more impressive is if Apple threw in another one at US$99 - but I don't think Apple is willing to drop the capacity enough to feasibly reach US$99 at their profit margins. Apple has repeatedly said in the past that it refuses to make a dinky 256MB flash player, since such a device doesn't hold enough music to be truly useful.

 

[MacWhispers]

No $99 iPod is possible.

What would be even more impressive is if Apple threw in another one at US$99 - but I don't think Apple is willing to drop the capacity enough to feasibly reach US$99 at their profit margins.

At 1,000,000+ purchase volumes the difference in price between a 512MB and 1GB flash chip is only about $5, which would translate to only about a $15 to $18 decrease in MSRP, assuming similar profit margins.

The sweet spot now (and looking a year out) is at 1GB/$149. So much of the iPod cost is the actual player, itself, regardless of the storage subsystem used, that the platform can't be scaled to $99, even with zero storage. Again, even with no flash or hard drive, the iPod platform cannot be built and sold for a retail price of $99, and meet Apple's profit margin requirements. Everyone here wishing for such a thing should move their expectations upward by $50.

 

[wrldwzrd89]

At 1,000,000+ purchase volumes the difference in price between a 512MB and 1GB flash chip is only about $5, which would translate to only about a $15 to $18 decrease in MSRP, assuming similar profit margins.

The sweet spot now (and looking a year out) is at 1GB/$149. So much of the iPod cost is the actual player, itself, regardless of the storage subsystem used, that the platform can't be scaled to $99, even with zero storage. Again, even with no flash or hard drive, the iPod platform cannot be built and sold for a retail price of $99, and meet Apple's profit margin requirements. Everyone here wishing for such a thing should move their expectations upward by $50.

I didn't know that the cost of the storage was insignificant at Apple's production levels, thus making a US$99 iPod impossible right now. Thanks for the info MacWhispers!

 

[izzle22]

OK, so about this combined XM and Ipod ... It's a fantastic idea. First of all, all this whining about the $99 iPod that will never happen in my lifetime is annoying. The cheapest 1 GB card is like $89 (trust me, I know .. i buy them). Apple still needs to put all the other stuff into it and make a profit. $179 if you are lucky, $199 is it happens at all.

I love XM. The thought of being able to use the ITMS OR XM is a beautiful thought that I would be most anxious to get in on. XM is looking for a way to outshine Sirius after the Howard Stern deal. A deal with Apple would make that happen so fast, Sirius' satellites will spin. This would be a high-end iPod, though, with a color screen and a required subscription to XM that would be discounted.

I'm the creative type. Apple is creative, but not quite as creative as me. They need to think like this. You get something as cool as the iPod and add a satellite radio to it that works all across the country and BAM!

Sure, they can't market it in Canada or Europe since XM isn't over there, but you know what? I respectfully say "who cares." I love other countries, but not enough for it to affect my iPod. I'll spend money in Canada on a Coffee Crisp or seeing Niagara Falls, but I could care less when they get the music store.

Nuff said. Let the angry responses begin.

So if I want a new iPod, it's not only going to have this XM crap taking up space for a potential loger lasting battery but now I have to PAY for a subscription to XM to use the service! NO THANKS! Leave the iPod alone it's a music player not a satelite receiver!

 

[wrldwzrd89]

So if I want a new iPod, it's not only going to have this XM crap taking up space for a potential loger lasting battery but now I have to PAY for a subscription to XM to use the service! NO THANKS! Leave the iPod alone it's a music player not a satelite receiver!

Actually, izzle22, I'd bet that IF the XM service was available to iPod users, a subscription to it wouldn't be required to use the iPod, and it would be tucked away as one of the menu items.

 

[gekko513]

Hey, MacWhispers, how do you know that the difference between 512MB and 1024MB is $5 with purchases of 1 000 000+ units. Are you in the business or are you also starting to pull numbers out of nowhere?

 

[izzle22]

Actually, izzle22, I'd bet that IF the XM service was available to iPod users, a subscription to it wouldn't be required to use the iPod, and it would be tucked away as one of the menu items.

I DID relize that, my point was the XM receiver would be taking up room in the iPod( I'm sorry but they can't tuck away a satelite receiver in a menu) and most people that just went out and spent $500 on an iPod are not going to want to spend $20 a month on crappy radio! And if you fully read my post you would see that I said I would have to pay to use the service not the iPod itself.

 

[Mainyehc]

Right, just like when, during the intro of the makeup-mirror iMac, Steve dissed the idea of making the computer part of the flat panel display. A horrible idea, Apple would never do it....

This is a bit off-topic, but anyway...

My old iMac was a 17'' G4, 1,25 GHz, the very last swing-arm iMac model produced (and the one with the better-looking proportions, the 20''er seemed kind of... unbalanced and clumsy, IMHO). Now, I'm using a 20'' iMac G5, and yes, it's gorgeous, great, whatever you call it.
But I'm kinda sad that things turned out this way. While it was still being produced, the flagship flat-panel iMac, even though sometimes people made fun of it, was still... how should I put this... respected.
I was expecting the older iMac to have a "cube-like" future: to become a cult-machine, that damn old computer in which people keep cramming faster processors and weird cooling systems. It makes me sad, it was a great-looking (and over-priced, just like the Cube ) machine, and now everyone (who dind't particularly enjoyed it's shape, whether because they never tried one or were envious because they never owned one) treats it like if it was a design aberration.

-------------

About the blatant incoherence resulting of Steve Jobs' RDF, I don't give a damn, it's great that the iMac G5 was developed, even though I liked the old iMac's looks, this one is much more functional (the viewing angle of the 20''er is great, so not having the vertical and horizontal screen adjustment isn't a big deal). My only gripe with it is the defective buzzing PSU, which I'll hopefully replace soon.

Apple, bring us the Flash-based iPod, I know a lot of people who would buy it the next second! A flash-based *iPod* wouldn't be dingy, just by bearing the name "iPod" and by having a scroll wheel and a nice large LCD screen (assuming that Apple would never EVER design a weird-shaped horrible-looking device with empty CF or SD slots, and lots and lots of seams, and would instead keep the most basic iPod design principles).

Think about it... Have you ever hold one of those... "thingies"? They're awfully shaped and have weird, small controls. Carrying less than 1K songs is not a problem, if you can load/unload them fast, and if the navigation system is based on the same great click-wheel. As for its size, it is possible to make it smaller. If you compare the new click-wheel with the old 3G iPod's scroll-wheel, you will notice that the latter is a little smaller, still, it's very usable.

So, I'm hoping, 2GB Flash iPod micro - $149, 6GB HD iPod mini - $249. And of course, the 60GB colour-screen iPod - $499

 

[wrldwzrd89]

I DID relize that, my point was the XM receiver would be taking up room in the iPod( I'm sorry but they can't tuck away a satelite receiver in a menu) and most people that just went out and spent $500 on an iPod are not going to want to spend $20 a month on crappy radio! And if you fully read my post you would see that I said I would have to pay to use the service not the iPod itself.

I guess I misunderstood you. I was thinking that the OPTION for XM services would be tucked away in a menu - I wasn't considering the hardware side of things. If you consider that the current smallest XM receiver is bigger than the current iPod, there's no way XM and iPod would meet right now.

 

[Mainyehc]

Two, 3, or 4 slots for small, standard memory cards. Let's say two. The key here is the unit can be cheap because it has no flash in it, yet you can say it has a max capacity of 4GB, 8GB, or whatever the max capacity of the cards can be.

Apple would NEVER do this... What about the iTunes synchronization simplicity?? This would totally ruin that!! You would have to *phisically* manage your music!! Even worse, you could eventually end up with duplicate files in the same library... Baaaaad idea... I could use an iPod micro with only ONE CF or SD slot. It would be akin to using a Sony HiMD player. Multiple libraries, which you can switch as desired. Now that would be kind of "retro", as far as the "carry your whole library in your pocket" philosophy is concerned, but who cares (some people can't already fit their whole libraries even in their 40GB iPods!!)! It would beat the cr*p out of Sony's HiMD and all those "dingy" flash players out there.

I used an ATRAC3 Sony MD recorder (YES, only 74min in a 74min disc), and had 32 MD's which I carryed around in three "small" boxes. I had to record them one at a time, at 1X SPEED! I inserted the discs' and tracks' names manually, CHARACTER BY CHARACTER! And I was happy with that system.

To get my very own iPod was like seeing the light. However, I wouldn't go with anything more complicated than the MD/HiMD system. And to have multiple cards plugged at the same time *would* be more complicated, IMHO. And it would also mean another gap, more seams, etc.

I could imagine an iPod with a small gap below the dock connector, it wouldn't look all that weird and ugly; I still can't understand what's the big deal with gaps anyway. Too many seams and mold lines (remember the Cube ) look ugly, but not gaps. I have one gap in the top right side, one in the bottom, and another in the back of my iMac G5 and the thing looks great all the same However, keep in mind that "the thing looks great" because it has ONLY the necessary gaps and seams; no more, no less. Just like an iPod: stereo minijack, click-wheel, hold switch, dock connector, and back cover/top and bottom covers (on the mini). Just one more gap wouldn't totally ruin its appearence.

As for the battery cover... Hmmmm, as much as I'd like to easily remove my iPod's battery when it eventually dies, I still prefer having to pry it open. It's risky, but I'm preety careful with gadgets, and it's one less seam to have in its already scratched surface

 

[izzle22]

Lets just hope Apple comes out with the 60 gig iPod on Tuesday!

 

[Mainyehc]

Yes, I realize Apple's overall revenue increased 37% and that's great but do you realize 43% of hardware revenue was from the iPod? It was an easy 43% too and that's what worries me. Producing an iPod is much cheaper and easier than a PowerBook or a PowerMac. They have already separated the hardware divisions into Macintosh vs iPod. They may feel they can take the easy route with the iPod while letting the Macintosh division languish. Why put the time, money and effort into PowerBooks, PowerMacs and iBooks when they can just crank out iPods? Personally I think we are starting to see signs of this. Where does this leave Mac users? This would most certainly not be a good thing.

Oh, do shut up with all this nonsense... I think it's time people stop with this Mac vs. iPod whining. As long as Mac sales don't go down, the Mac line keeps getting consistent updates, and QC doesn't decrease below acceptable levels (YES, I have a defective buzzing PSU and I'm not happy with it, still, I know Apple is replacing them), everything will be fine. Do you think it was EASY to design the new iMac G5? However, it's here and has been extremely well received by the press. My only concern right now is that Apple's marketing on their hardware offerings, both present and future (G5 eMac? G5 PowerBook? or will they use Freescale's Dual Core G4?...) may become so much more efficient than it used to be that IBM can't meet up the G5 chip demand. Apple has learned a lot from their iPod marketing campaigns, so I think we should have reasons to be concerned with the good ol' "demand outstripping supply" issue.

It seems you're suggesting that an "anti-halo" effect, when everyone else is expecting an iPod halo-effect. That, of course, doesn't make any sense! And if the iPod is easier to engineer than a Mac, therefore, it shouldn't eat much into Mac R&D, that's the way I see it. There's more, the original 1G and 2G iPods have contributed with its great looks and design concept for this new gorgeous machine I'm using now... (it's not just pure marketing, that clear plastic border makes it REALLY look like a giant iPod).

And for that Mac-division-languishing thing... It's true that Apple didn't meet SJ's 3GHz G5 promise... Or was it IBM's fault, because they didn't meet THEIR promise in the first place?... Hmmm... It would be nice if there was more than one company producing 64-bit PowerPC chips, you know, just in case I may be a recent switcher, but I sort of understand what happened to Apple in the mid-90's, with Motorola. We don't want that happening again, do we?

Anyway, if history repeats itself, it won't be the iPod's fault. Is the iPod eating R&D resources like, say, the Newton? Even if it is, the profits are HUGE. Hooray for the iPod, it's a great cash cow! Do people think that the same thing that happened to the Mac will happen to the iPod? I surely hope not, and don't honestly believe that the humongous marketshare that Apple has will suddendly go "puff!" because of M$ jumping to the market. People are fed up with M$ products, and in this particular case a lot of them do know there's another option.

Besides, M$-compatible players are still somewhat "uncool", and even if they become cool one day (I must confess, that Zen micro thingy looks good enough for me), Apple, being still in the lead as far as coolness is concerned, has a great advantage. And you know, competition stimulates the leaders to strive for having the best products in the market, and I hope Apple reacts accordingly to its competition... Let's just hope...