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From what I see Apple is looking toward the future as far as ports are concerned. If you think the MBP's are hot try going back to the MBP's before the Titanium model. Those were real skin burners. Nevertheless it is my choice to stick with what I have, and it has fire wire and all the ports I need. No one is forced to always grab the newest thing that comes out. I also have a Sony Z11 which I take everywhere and leave the MBP 17" at home.
 
maybe another usb port or two. an hdmi port instead of the stupid mini dvi that loses the sound. thats basically what i meant by "more ports" and i believe apple should have those ports like every other laptop on the market these days.

I kind of agree with you on a number of things, but hdmi is not so great. It's really designed for consumer electronics. Displayport and dvi were both superior for the use of a quality external display.
 
You know what pisses me off? All of these people calling themselves or equating themselves with Professionals/Pros. This is a term very loosely thrown around in an inordinate amount of professions, trades, careers and does not simple mean "I make money doing this/using this". Be more humble and recognize what a true Pro is. A computer is either a tool or a toy. It needs to do what you need it / want it to do. It doesn't matter what it's called or if something is better or worse.

In short, no one cares. So, don't bother embarrassing yourself or wasting time or ranting up the wrong tree.
 
honestly i hope apple has a big awakening and has to reevaluate their objectives. personally i like those companies that spend a lot of money with research and design and not so much marketing. i just think apple is losing their touch and they need to get their heads out of their asses.

That's why growth in Mac sales tripled PCs, right? Contrary to your claim that Apple needs to "reevaluate their objectives," Apple is selling more Macs, and growing Mac sales, far faster than others. Perhaps Apple is selling all those Macs because they do what their buyers want and need them to?

You appear to be using tunnel vision - since Apple isn't making what YOU want them to, they need to extract their heads. You might try looking in the mirror.
 
Not a pro but still pissed

I wouldn't call myself a pro although I do use my mac for work as well as pleasure but yes I agree I'm pretty pissed with them.

I'm hopeful that under new leadership apple might begin to turn around and be a little less obsessed with iOS. (meaning no disrespect for jobs of course but this is just how I feel)

But yes at this point, while I still love my computer to pieces I'm basically frozen on upgrading hardware until such time as I can get a little clarification on Apple's future directions.

Examples:
-Lion - hope they add more options/clean up the next version...
-Mac App store - I was really concerned by an article I read recently suggesting that apps may be sandboxed in a restrictive manner similar to iOS which would disqualify a lot of useful system utilities apps from being allowed in the app store.
-upgradable computers - I love the MBA design but if apple wants to turn all their computers into ipads/iphones - aka disposable electronics with no upgradability, I'll have to pass...
 
Examples:
-Lion - hope they add more options/clean up the next version...
-Mac App store - I was really concerned by an article I read recently suggesting that apps may be sandboxed in a restrictive manner similar to iOS which would disqualify a lot of useful system utilities apps from being allowed in the app store.
-upgradable computers - I love the MBA design but if apple wants to turn all their computers into ipads/iphones - aka disposable electronics with no upgradability, I'll have to pass...

- Lion: a little hard on the memory, but otherwise fine. What kind of options are you looking for?
- You can still install that software in the usual way. Sandbox is good, protects against malware
- laptops have always been restricted in their upgrade potential. So far, there is no indication that the MBP will go away, except for some rumors. Might as well wait for the next set of products to appear before getting pissed...
 
My Gripe

In the business world you often have an application (say database) that has cost a lot of money to develop and propagate to everyone. Then comes Apple and produces a whole load of machines that only support the latest OS X. Would it be so difficult to provide drivers for the mini, air and updated MBPs so that they could run 10.6 on newly purchased computers? I suspect not, but Apple force the issue, making many bespoke and business orientated applications either unusable or in need of expensive upgrades.

In the windows world you can usually choice the older operating system at times of transition somewhat alleviating such issues. We are a Mac organisation and I sometimes wonder whether this is the correct choice.
 
You sir, are a disgrace to the professional world, whom you surely fail to represent.

There is not one professional in the world who can wholly determine the future of these products. The professional world is huge and how each and every person defines it will differ.

If you detest the products, you're not forced or even encouraged to buy into one. If you're much happier building a PC, by all means go for it.

Apple isn't the sole provider to computers and the fact that their products, marketing strategy or other strategies don't suit you doesn't make them ****, every firm is faced with the same problem of making a varied range of products to suit as wide a customer base as possible and I'm afraid you simply aren't in that bracket.

----------

+1 pissed
When the wheels fall off my mac I be going over to windows

You don't sound like you ever got past your training wheels anyway. Go; this is a Mac users' community and while you're welcome here, if you hate the products you spent thousands on, you might as well leave.
 
I agree. You should get the PC if your perceived value is that it's better.

When I pay for the Mac, I buy it for OS X. If I wanted Windows, I have many choices for that, be it building my own machine or buying a comparable laptop computer, but when it comes down to it, when I need OS X there is only one manufacturer. I think someone should get a Mac only when they can put aside specs and put more value on the "user experience."

Take my parents for example; they had some trouble with a PC (they couldn't figure anything out), that when I got them Macs, they were happy with them. My father has a rather old and slow MacBook Air, so I asked him recently if he wanted a faster machine—his response was a simple, "No thanks, this one easy to figure out and if I have to wait a long time, I'll go walk outside or read a book." I think many new Mac users fall into that category.
 
most of the people who are bitching at me are probably just apple fan boys.

i myself do love macs and will be buying a new top of the line 15" MBP. but that does not discern the fact that im ****ing pissed at where apple is going. and i will in fact build a killer desktop PC in which i can create into a hackintosh most likely. then i will have the best of both worlds, a MBP and a desktop PC that runs windows and OSX.

this thread was really pointless and just to see what other people feel as i do.
 
most of the people who are bitching at me are probably just apple fan boys.

i myself do love macs and will be buying a new top of the line 15" MBP. but that does not discern the fact that im ****ing pissed at where apple is going. and i will in fact build a killer desktop PC in which i can create into a hackintosh most likely. then i will have the best of both worlds, a MBP and a desktop PC that runs windows and OSX.

this thread was really pointless and just to see what other people feel as i do.

I understand your frustration but wtf is wrong with you?

If Apple products no longer appeal to you then don't buy them. Personally, the only Apple computer I have owned is the Macbook Pro. I would never own any of their desktop offerings because they don't appeal to me. Simple.

You have the choice of a several computer manufacturers, so why are you throwing a tantrum online because Apple's design decisions no longer align with your priorities? Just buy a different computer that better suits your needs.

How is this not common sense?
 
I understand your frustration but wtf is wrong with you?

If Apple products no longer appeal to you then don't buy them. Personally, the only Apple computer I have owned is the Macbook Pro. I would never own any of their desktop offerings because they don't appeal to me. Simple.

You have the choice of a several computer manufacturers, so why are you throwing a tantrum online because Apple's design decisions no longer align with your priorities? Just buy a different computer that better suits your needs.

How is this not common sense?

i am doing that...although the mbp still meets my needs more than any other laptop so im buying a new high end mbp but then im going to build a killer desktop pc so ill have the best of both worlds.

i was just simply seeing who else is with me on apples direction..
 
i am doing that...although the mbp still meets my needs more than any other laptop so im buying a new high end mbp but then im going to build a killer desktop pc so ill have the best of both worlds.

i was just simply seeing who else is with me on apples direction..

I think Apple's design decisions of late have been rather bold and foolish, but I guess it doesn't matter since there are several idiots out there who know nothing about computers and would rather abdicate any control over their machine to the manufacturer.

Apple is simply changing their market, they're appealing to the masses now, and so they're designing their products with the masses in mind. We're all somewhat technical minded on this forum and so some of the decisions don't make sense to us.

But at the end of the day Apple has to make shareholders happy, that's their priority. We just have to live with it or look elsewhere for our computing needs.
 
I am not much different than most of the die hards who wring their hands concerning the future of Apple, but I have had a change of heart recently...

I can really see both sides of the argument. My background is in software engineering and I got back into the Macs once OS X rolled out. I was amazed at what Apple was able to release sitting on top of BSD Unix. Still to this day, there is nothing that even comes close on Linux or Unix. Back in the day my friends had Apple IIs (I had Vic-20s and C-64s), and eventually I crossed in and out of the Apple world beginning with the Mac SE/30. Once my career in software and system engineering started I strayed from Apple (I was never a big fan of the Apple OS pre-OS X, and always viewed it as somewhat of a toy). I crossed over to the dark side and became a predominantly Windows user since that is what the tools that I used were on for most of my career. Just when I started getting heavily into Solaris, OS X came onto the scene and I truly fell in love with what it was and what I thought its potential may be.

I figured that Apple now had a rock solid Unix underneath and would begin making major inroads into Enterprise IT. I played with OS X server, began developing with Web Objects was really excited by the XServe, XServer RAID, XSan, the announcement for their implementing ZFS. I really truly believed that Apple was going to break out big time in the Enterprise. They truly had the technology, they just did not have the traction and customer base in the Enterprise. Being such a smart guy, I was absolutely convinced that they would buy Sun Microsystems and basically meld the technologies together. One of the exciting things about OS X in the early days was that it was going to be such a spectacular system for running Java on. Even the Web Objects framework went Java. I have to admit, I was really geeking out on the possibilities.

But then the retreat from the Enterprise market began. It seemed like it was ripe for the taking, but Apple just did not seem to be interested. Web Objects went from being a big dollar application server, to a packaged app sold in the Apple store for around $100, to becoming free. They began backtracking incrementally from the enterprise, and then even decided to remove Computer from their name.

Perhaps it would have never worked anyway, because future product secrecy and longterm corporate IT planning do not mesh. I just always imagined what might have been, for someone who was tired of the status quo in the enterprise - it felt like a potential rennaisance was suppressed (OK, maybe I am laying it on thick - but I was really sick of working on the same old stuff and was really interested in what Apple might have been able to bring to the table).

Ever since then, until very recently I have always been looking at the glass as being half empty instead of half full. With every product announcement, I saw the cool iStuff, but less and less of what made me such a fan of Apple. I finally ditched windows for good, after so many years, and I felt like at some point I might be heading for an iOS brick wall.

Why the long winded story? Well I think a lot of people who feel like the OP, probably come from a tech/power user background like myself, and are very worried that the Apple we love might eventually disappear. I mean when Steve Jobs got up and announced that Apple 'is now a mobile device company', I almost passed out.

The Xserve has been discontinued, there are now rumors of the Mac Pros demise, and who could seriously believe that Apple can continue to put any resources into OS X Server when it is being sold for $49.99 through the Mac App store (with unlimited licenses). I really believe that this release of OS X Server will be the last (at least in its present form) because it seems like Web Objects all over again.

Ok, that is the doom and gloom. But I have to say over the last several weeks I have finally had it with the doom and gloom. From my technical background, I absolutely love the killer work horse machines like the Mac Pros. But realistically, with the pace of technology these smaller machines like the iMacs, Mac Minis and MBPs are just absolutely amazing spec wise. If you look at the benchmarks it would have been unfathomable to me that any of those machines would even be able to come close to the power contained in the Mac Pros.

I think what we are beginning to see is more power coming in smaller more compact packages. The Mac Mini, with its footprint, is really an amazing machine if you take it for what it is. Heck, I am even amazed by my hockey puck sized Apple TV. If Apple had never switched from the Power PC, think of how far behind we might have been at this point. Our Mac Pro beasts would probably have less power than a Mac Mini, and we would have still loved them, because we wouldn't have known any better (at least not any better than we had known pre-Intel).

I was 100% against the iOSifficaton of the Mac product line. Until I realized how ridiculous that stance was, since iOS is OS X.

I'm beginning to change my opinion, and starting to believe that Apple is not abandoning the Pro user - its just that the specs available on machines now a days puts almost everything in the pro category (barring things like GPUs which I am confident will be rectified in short order). Connectivity like TB and beyond, will allow pieces of the system to become more modular. Just like some don't like the iMac because it is an all in one, in a way, so is the Mac Pro. High speed connections like Thunderbolt (and whatever comes next) will allow high demand users to modularly build out their systems, instead of just having it all in one box. Sure it might not sound pretty, but if all those pieces became rackable, and had rows of nice power lights lined up in the dark - I would bet that many of us would think that it was really cool, almost like the old days (and in many ways better). Perhaps at some point in the future, we may even see the introduction of an Apple Server device with a powerful CPU in the form factor of an Apple TV, just waiting for all of the modular goodness to be bestowed upon it.

With the enormous changes we are likely to see in the near future due to the push towards Cloud computing, any laptop or desktop will be a pro machine, because every one else will have absolutely no use for a form factor like that. OS X and iOS will no doubt have to merge at some point, because the iDevices will have the power to run a full operating system, without limitations. Developers and content creators will be on anything above an iPad or iDevice. Office workers again will be working on basically dumb terminals running off of the cloud or images running in the server room. (I know Steve had told us all that with his cars/trucks analogy - but I just could not truly wrap my close minded attitude around it).

Its funny, but Apple use to be the ones to race ahead, and Microsoft used to make such conservative incremental changes. But it looks like Microsoft knows that the writing is on the wall and they need to do something drastic, and I believe that will be Windows 8. The convergence of iOS and OS X is minuscule and ultra conservative compared to what it seems like Microsoft has up its sleeve.

When the iPad first came out, I was a little disappointed that it wasn't something that would be able to replace a laptop. I had always been a desktop tower guy, and used laptops for mobility only. I think there is a huge percentage of the population waiting for tablets to do everything that a laptop can. And I believe Windows 8 will do that on a tablet.

If Apple does not continue down the road it is going with the advancement of iOS, and the merging of OS X and iOS, there will be a point in time that Apple will be left standing, wondering how everyone happened to pass them once again.

So here I am, a computing dinosaur, grasping onto my tower machines and griping about iOS (much in the same way I swore I would never give up the command line). When in reality, though, we are seeing some amazing things transpire. My 15" MBP has WAY more power than I imagined would have been possible just a few years ago. Will I continue to need a desktop machine running 24/7 - absolutely, but it probably will not look like what this tech dinosaur is used to. And in the end, many years from now, I bet I will still be amazed by how powerful these little machines have become.

Sorry for such a long post, its just something that had been on my mind for such a long time....

-OldMike
 
apple is really beginning to ***** me off, big time. i just dont like where they are heading, and what customers they value. they seem to have forgotten us pro users and are making critical decisions just to support the general public.

the pro line is named pro for a reason and they seem to be forgetting that. i think the MBA is nice for the general public but lets keep the pro as pro as possible. id like to see the same MBP design with better cooling, more features/ports, and better performance. but no they're going to make a thinner pro that runs blazing hot.that and they're pretty much ditching the mac pro line all together.

also how there trying to implement ios stuff into OSX. i dont want that bloated **** on my OS, i want more flexibility, performance, and simplicity.

if any other laptop could compare the the MBP i would get it, but for now im going to buy a new MBP. but i tell you what im building a killer desktop PC soon. so much more bang for buck and then ill have the best of both worlds.


How did this get 19 negative ratings? Are the only people downranking these facts about apple's negligence towards pro users individuals who are clueless on the real world working environments?

I've gone from a Power Mac, to a Mac Pro, to a Macbook Pro and over the years its been *very* clear that Apple doesnt care about professionals. Their money making machines are the iToys, and if the iPadification of OS X isnt proof, god have mercy on your poor soul.

I wish Apple put as much or even HALF as much focus on OS X and their computers as they do with the effing iphone and ipad.
 
apple is really beginning to ***** me off, big time. i just dont like where they are heading, and what customers they value. they seem to have forgotten us pro users and are making critical decisions just to support the general public.

the pro line is named pro for a reason and they seem to be forgetting that. i think the MBA is nice for the general public but lets keep the pro as pro as possible. id like to see the same MBP design with better cooling, more features/ports, and better performance. but no they're going to make a thinner pro that runs blazing hot.that and they're pretty much ditching the mac pro line all together.

also how there trying to implement ios stuff into OSX. i dont want that bloated **** on my OS, i want more flexibility, performance, and simplicity.

if any other laptop could compare the the MBP i would get it, but for now im going to buy a new MBP. but i tell you what im building a killer desktop PC soon. so much more bang for buck and then ill have the best of both worlds.

apple is an abusive polygamous spouse and its cult all covers for it lol, so you won't curry favor around these parts lol... anyways, it seems like you're getting angry over what only amounts to speculation at this point - these are rumors, to my knowledge apple hasn't said a word about their future line up (as per usual).
 
I looked at the Thinkpad T510 someone mentioned here. It's not even close. Yes, it's $1000 less, but it has:

No discrete GPU, it uses Intel integrated.
It uses a i5, not an i7
250 GB HD
2 GB of ram
1366x768 panel

This was the highest config that I could find for around $1500.

http://reviews.cnet.com/laptops/lenovo-thinkpad-t510-4349/4507-3121_7-33957589.html?tag=mncol

From lenovo.com, Thinkpad T520, self configured:

System components
Intel Core i7-2760QM Processor (2.40GHz, 6MB L3, 1333MHz FSB)
Genuine Windows 7 Professional 64
15.6" FHD (1920 x 1080) LED Backlit Anti-Glare Display, Mobile Broadband Ready
NVIDIA NVS 4200M Graphics with Optimus Technology, 1GB DDR3 Memory
4 GB DDR3 - 1333MHz (1 DIMM)
720p Camera
Intel 160 GB Solid State Drive, Serial ATA
DVD recordable multiburner
Express Card Slot & 4 in 1 Card Reader
6 cell Li-Ion Battery - 55+
Country Pack North America with Line cord & 135W AC adapter
Bluetooth 3.0
ThinkPad b/g/n
Integrated Mobile Broadband - Upgradable

Price: $2,645.00
Web price: $1,824.00
After eCoupon: $1,694.00
You save: $951.00

Total $1,694.00

They do have a base price that is easily on par with the high end 15'' MBP, but the web price is what you usually pay.
This is about as well equipped as a high end upgraded 15'' MBP, but comes at the price of the low end 15'' model. On top of that, the 1920x1080 display is not even an option for MBPs, and 3 year limited warranty is available for $99, a 4 year extended plan is also available. The case is ugly, but you can step on it and pour water on the keyboard without damaging the laptop.

I'm not saying that this is a better laptop, I'm very happy with my MBP. But this should match a MBP in quality and performance (except the GPU maybe), while being somewhat cheaper.
 
apple is really beginning to ***** me off, big time. i just dont like where they are heading, and what customers they value. they seem to have forgotten us pro users and are making critical decisions just to support the general public.

the pro line is named pro for a reason and they seem to be forgetting that. i think the MBA is nice for the general public but lets keep the pro as pro as possible. id like to see the same MBP design with better cooling, more features/ports, and better performance. but no they're going to make a thinner pro that runs blazing hot.that and they're pretty much ditching the mac pro line all together.

also how there trying to implement ios stuff into OSX. i dont want that bloated **** on my OS, i want more flexibility, performance, and simplicity.

if any other laptop could compare the the MBP i would get it, but for now im going to buy a new MBP. but i tell you what im building a killer desktop PC soon. so much more bang for buck and then ill have the best of both worlds.


More than one kind of pro in this world.
 
i agree with you. I wont lie, i have all the money i need and I worked hard for it. On this level I want the most comfort and the best thing money can buy for me and that is the reason I always used apple machines - so the pro line. And with sad eyes I now look at how apple "mainstreams" all its pro line. When the "pro" line disappears what should I buy? A 3500$ Dell or what? it still will be just a buggy Windows pc, no matter how much you pay for it...
 
- Lion: a little hard on the memory, but otherwise fine. What kind of options are you looking for?

The kind that actually let you have an "option".

- Sandbox is good, protects against malware

Yep. Because macs have been plagued with this problem for years.

Seriously... you actually believe Apple's intent with their sandboxing tripe is to protect users from malware?

No offense but LOL! :)
 
And you base this grandiose conclusion on . . . what? Were you privy to the decision making within Apple re naming the Macbook Pro?


What was the Macbook PRO called, before it was the Macbook Pro?
It wasn't called " PRO " anything.
You remember the old days, not all that long ago when the lines were named ...

POWERBOOK G4 changed to Macbook Pro
and
IBOOK G4 changed to Macbook


You need not be privy to understanding that product naming is done with marketing in mind.
 
Umm what's the point of this? Apple must be doing something right being that they are at a 15 year high in computer market share. Also incorporating iOS into os x is fine because of the halo effect. People love ther iOS devices so why not port some of those features into os x?
 
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