Now try that with multiple application with multiple windows have some active and some minimised. It's a no go.
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Is Expose No More...?
- Thread starter atacinus
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I'm almost tempted to just acquire a DP4 copy of Lion and see it for myself. But I know things can change until the final release.
It's already been established earlier in this thread that it currently doesn't include minimized windows in mission control view. It could well be a bug or it could be by design
Lets hope it's a bug and the the shipping version of LIon has this functionality back.
Their keynote gives a prime example of why Mission Control sucks compared to the old all windows. He starts off by talking about how usually his desktop has tons of windows open and then says mission control address this. This is the image we get:
How is that a better solution to this problem?? With Snow Leopard (and back all the way to 10.3) you press one button and *all* windows are visible. The third preview window in mission control has a tiny corner visible... This demo does not demonstrate that mission control more successfully solves this problem than previous iterations. On the contrary, it demonstrates that it is not as good as solution as previous iterations.
To add insult to injury, their "app preview" which requires two steps, *still* doesn't replicate the same functionality for even the previewed app.
The third window is *still* largely obscured. Massive fail Apple.
I know bitching can be annoying, but I feel a big stink about this has to be made if there is to ever be hope that Apple leaves the old expose in as at least an option.
How is that a better solution to this problem?? With Snow Leopard (and back all the way to 10.3) you press one button and *all* windows are visible. The third preview window in mission control has a tiny corner visible... This demo does not demonstrate that mission control more successfully solves this problem than previous iterations. On the contrary, it demonstrates that it is not as good as solution as previous iterations.
To add insult to injury, their "app preview" which requires two steps, *still* doesn't replicate the same functionality for even the previewed app.
The third window is *still* largely obscured. Massive fail Apple.
I know bitching can be annoying, but I feel a big stink about this has to be made if there is to ever be hope that Apple leaves the old expose in as at least an option.
A better solution for displaying those 3 windows would be to show them in a 10.5 expose manner when you spread them, i.e. you see all of the 3 windows fully at their relative size.
Sort of like this:
This has got way too complicated, lets set this straight:
- Mission Control has replaced Snow Leopard's 'All Windows' expose
- You can still do 'Application Windows' expose by right clicking an app Dock icon and choosing "Show All Windows" or set a keyboard shortcut in Mission Control preferences (or F9, which is an old shortcut). This will also show minimised windows.
- There is no more hold the Dock icon or scroll up for Application Windows expose
- Few tips for Mission Control: press space bar over a window to zoom it and scroll up on a group of windows to 'peek' at them
- Mission Control has replaced Snow Leopard's 'All Windows' expose
- You can still do 'Application Windows' expose by right clicking an app Dock icon and choosing "Show All Windows" or set a keyboard shortcut in Mission Control preferences (or F9, which is an old shortcut). This will also show minimised windows.
- There is no more hold the Dock icon or scroll up for Application Windows expose
- Few tips for Mission Control: press space bar over a window to zoom it and scroll up on a group of windows to 'peek' at them
This is all I want. 10.5 Expose was perfect. None of this "mission control" crap.
I have to side with BlackMango on this one. I too am a creature of the minimize habit. Spaces have always bugged me a bit because even though I will set certain apps to them, they sometimes don't behave quite like I want them to. However, I do use all windows Expose to see all my open app windows, which I am fairly certain shows all windows from all spaces. Whereas the Lion Mission Control way seems to show all windows expose/stacked style of that space, but you have to change to a new space and reinvoke to see the windows of that particular space.
And it sounds like a real bummer if you don't get minimized windows in that view. But it may just require that I change my approach. Most likely I will try to eliminate minimizing if I can, use the F10 method for some apps like safari where I truly have multiple windows open, and try to relegate almost all windows to my main desktop, saving the spaces for full-screen apps.
There are too many great features in Lion not to upgrade. The new mail with conversations, LaunchPad which I personally like, full-screen apps, enhanced gestures, Safari Reading List, new iCal, Resume, full-screen screen sharing. I like the swipe gestures, though in Safari I would prefer that it go from tab to tab rather than forward and back. Some people are knocking LaunchPad but I like the idea of better stack-like organization for apps than the current way. With LP I can decide not to use folders and set each page of apps for certain apps and swipe across pages. I would like the folders more if they were visually represented by a stack or a customizable OS X folder rather than an icon filled iOS folder with a name. That just bothers me.
I was planning on getting my new iMac after Lion's release so it would come preloaded, however, BlackMango made me think I might want it now so I can revert to SL if I don't like it. Who am I kidding, too many things in 10.7 that I find useful, so while I am bummed that Mission Control doesn't show minimized apps or all app expose across every space like SL, I will probably find a better workflow that fits with the way it is designed, and get used to that pretty quickly.
And it sounds like a real bummer if you don't get minimized windows in that view. But it may just require that I change my approach. Most likely I will try to eliminate minimizing if I can, use the F10 method for some apps like safari where I truly have multiple windows open, and try to relegate almost all windows to my main desktop, saving the spaces for full-screen apps.
There are too many great features in Lion not to upgrade. The new mail with conversations, LaunchPad which I personally like, full-screen apps, enhanced gestures, Safari Reading List, new iCal, Resume, full-screen screen sharing. I like the swipe gestures, though in Safari I would prefer that it go from tab to tab rather than forward and back. Some people are knocking LaunchPad but I like the idea of better stack-like organization for apps than the current way. With LP I can decide not to use folders and set each page of apps for certain apps and swipe across pages. I would like the folders more if they were visually represented by a stack or a customizable OS X folder rather than an icon filled iOS folder with a name. That just bothers me.
I was planning on getting my new iMac after Lion's release so it would come preloaded, however, BlackMango made me think I might want it now so I can revert to SL if I don't like it. Who am I kidding, too many things in 10.7 that I find useful, so while I am bummed that Mission Control doesn't show minimized apps or all app expose across every space like SL, I will probably find a better workflow that fits with the way it is designed, and get used to that pretty quickly.
This has got way too complicated, lets set this straight:
- There is no more hold the Dock icon or scroll up for Application Windows expose
In DP4 they changed the scroll up to double-tap with two fingers
An scroll down with 3-4 fingers is back but disabled by default
Give me Lion, but without Mission Control please! I often work on documents, and edit photo and clips, and I need to see and compare my work side-by-side. Mission Control doesn't allow that and I'm seriously considering downgrade back to SL.
There is no problem staying at Snow Leopard. I am confident Snow Leopard will be supported for at least 2-3 years (leaning toward 3). There is no REAL reason it shouldn't compared to Lion as the only differences are bad gestures, useless features, and removal of the great all app expose while replacing it with Mission Control (Apple's attempt to foce spaces down our throats).
Tiger can still be used alright. However, many applications are not supported like Chrome, Firefox ect. Leopard is holding strong and is turning 4 years old. Because Snow Leopard is turning 2 years old, I know it has life in it. Since Snow Leopard made Leopard better, I believe it could last longer. Since Lion brings no internal features, there is no reason Apple couldn't support it at long as Lion is supported.
I understand Lion can still change. But we have a month until it is released and they are only fixing bugs now. What we see now is what we will probably get. Therefore, I am sticking with Snow Leopard as long as I can or until Lion lets me do everything Snow Leopard is able to let me do. Besides... the UI in Lion is really ugly.
Yeah, at a bare minimum the "app preview" of mission control should do that. It boggles my mind that the preview button *still* won't show all the windows like in your above image. Ideally of course, they should keep the all windows mode intact as another option. There is absolutely nothing wrong with options. If some people prefer Mission Control, I wouldn't care that they added it in. Just let me do things the way I prefer and the way I've been doing them since 10.3!
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2 finger double tapping a dock icon does not activate application expose on older trackpads (whereas 2 finger swipe up worked fine in dp2). There is also no proper preference to change is back. The Trackpad preference pane is different for older models.
Also, the worrying thing is that apple will not listen to any complaints regarding mission control. They ignored complaints made about expose in Snow Leopard.
Fortunately there was an early 10.6 developer build that contained a Dock.app with old expose. I use that Dock.app still to this day.
2 finger double tapping a dock icon does not activate application expose on older trackpads (whereas 2 finger swipe up worked fine in dp2). There is also no proper preference to change is back. The Trackpad preference pane is different for older models.
Also, the worrying thing is that apple will not listen to any complaints regarding mission control. They ignored complaints made about expose in Snow Leopard.
Fortunately there was an early 10.6 developer build that contained a Dock.app with old expose. I use that Dock.app still to this day.
This thread makes me sad... Leopard Exposé + hot corners was perfect, and one of my favourite features on the mac since Panther. Snow Leopard made it slightly less good, but certainly still great. Mission Control looks like a real kludgy mess by comparison, though I guess I should reserve judgement until I use it. *sigh*
Exposé has been changed to App Exposé. As far as I can tell when you do perform it it only exposes the windows for that particular app...
Yeah, but it was all Windows that was the really useful one to me. Hopefully they'll add it back later.
Stacks 2011 edition.