Is Google that bad?

[ElPaso]

Others have done a pretty good job of that already.

When signing up for Google, we all agree to their terms of service - which is as clear as crystal in the documentation, and which we agree to in order to sign on. I agree to and like their collection of my data, because it targets advertising to my desires and interests, which is as convenient as heck. Their "how" is valid because 1. It's useful; and 2. We agree to it in the sign-up process.

However, if you don't want that to happen, then don't sign up for Google.

 

[throAU]

Couldn't agree more.
Every big tech company are exactly the same regarding privacy.

Except they're not.

All of them collect data either directly or inadvertently through the provision of their online services.

Some of them resell various data to others. Not all.

 

[Steve Adams]

Except they're not.

All of them collect data either directly or inadvertently through the provision of their online services.

Some of them resell various data to others. Not all.

No, exactly. Some are transparent when it comes to your data, others hide what they are doing with it.

 

[dmr727]

I don't think there's some huge conspiracy. It would be a huge deal if Apple were caught lying about not selling data to third parties. It also strikes me as next to impossible for a company of that size to keep such a thing under wraps.

 

[Steve Adams]

I don't think there's some huge conspiracy. It would be a huge deal if Apple were caught lying about not selling data to third parties. It also strikes me as next to impossible for a company of that size to keep such a thing under wraps.

It's actually not since users don't have access to core systems inside the OS. As I mentioned before I don't know if they are or are not, but if they can make money doing it, they are. I don't care either way, I use what I want because at the end of the day, ALL tech companies are the same. I am getting ready to plug my "janky" (according to techfulencers) 10th gen iPad in to charge it up for some work I am doing later. Best tablet I have owned to date. They need clicks to survive I know, but damn, the hate for the 10th gen is crazy. For the price, it's awesome.

 

[Steve Adams]

When signing up for Google, we all agree to their terms of service - which is as clear as crystal in the documentation, and which we agree to in order to sign on. I agree to and like their collection of my data, because it targets advertising to my desires and interests, which is as convenient as heck. Their "how" is valid because 1. It's useful; and 2. We agree to it in the sign-up process.

However, if you don't want that to happen, then don't sign up for Google.

Exactly, Linux and GrapheneOS is your friend at that point. I have a linux laptop and every time I pick it up it's like, yup, I could use this and be happy, then I turn on my trusty dell laptop and YUP this is Home. This is what I like and that's it.

I have tried Macs 3 times and lost my shirt each time selling at a deep discount a few months later. I just don't like how MacOS operates. Wish I did, flashy hardware is NICE. But it's hampered by a backasswards OS. Personal opinion, Others love it and that's cool. It's not for me.

 

[dmr727]

It's actually not since users don't have access to core systems inside the OS. As I mentioned before I don't know if they are or are not, but if they can make money doing it, they are. I don't care either way, I use what I want because at the end of the day, ALL tech companies are the same. I am getting ready to plug my "janky" (according to techfulencers) 10th gen iPad in to charge it up for some work I am doing later. Best tablet I have owned to date. They need clicks to survive I know, but damn, the hate for the 10th gen is crazy. For the price, it's awesome.

Anything is possible, and certainly I might be naive about this. Regardless though I agree - if the tech is better or provides a superior experience, it's not a hill I'm willing to die on.

 

[Steve Adams]

Anything is possible, and certainly I might be naive about this. Regardless though I agree - if the tech is better or provides a superior experience, it's not a hill I'm willing to die on.

Nope. All the Google hate is quite funny. All the apple hate is quite funny. You would not know if someone was attacking their direct family with the way people get on. Apple does not care about you (I use you in general terms, not you peronally DMR), Google does not care about you. NO tech company cares about you. They care about increasing their stock market value by double digits every quarter. Whatever they have to do to do that, they will do. They will tell you the moon is made of havarti and that you will have ever lasting euphoria if you keep buying their product.

I don't believe ANY marketing team of a publicly traded megacorp. I work for one, I know first hand the baffling amount of BS spun from their marketing team daily. I think during managers retreats they just sit in a room clockwork orange style and ingest said BS.

 

[Parowdy]

No it's not bold...and plain right. Even with apple YOU are the product, just in different ways.

So do you finally admit that your claim has NO basis whatsoever and that you only argue based on feeling and not evidence.
That’s great.
Otherwise it would be very rude of you to wait to share your proof that Apple mishandles data like Meta does. Please, tell us.
Or (indirectly) admit that you’re wrong and that you have no interest in evidence based discussion.
We’re waiting.

 

[Parowdy]

Nope. All the Google hate is quite funny. All the apple hate is quite funny. You would not know if someone was attacking their direct family with the way people get on. Apple does not care about you (I use you in general terms, not you peronally DMR), Google does not care about you. NO tech company cares about you. They care about increasing their stock market value by double digits every quarter. Whatever they have to do to do that, they will do. They will tell you the moon is made of havarti and that you will have ever lasting euphoria if you keep buying their product.

I don't believe ANY marketing team of a publicly traded megacorp. I work for one, I know first hand the baffling amount of BS spun from their marketing team daily. I think during managers retreats they just sit in a room clockwork orange style and ingest said BS.

Share your evidence with us that Apple mishandles data.
You’re claiming quite a lot but don’t back anything up. „I work for an unmade mega corp so I know how every mega corp is operating.“ Sure.
How come people that claim Apple is misappropriating user data can’t produce a single piece of legitimate evidence or cite legitimate sources? Oh, I know…

 

[Parowdy]

It's actually not since users don't have access to core systems inside the OS. As I mentioned before I don't know if they are or are not, but if they can make money doing it, they are. I don't care either way, I use what I want because at the end of the day, ALL tech companies are the same. I am getting ready to plug my "janky" (according to techfulencers) 10th gen iPad in to charge it up for some work I am doing later. Best tablet I have owned to date. They need clicks to survive I know, but damn, the hate for the 10th gen is crazy. For the price, it's awesome.

All tech companies are the same IS bold. And plain wrong. Even if you feel it’s not.
Evidence bro, evidence.
For example, you really suggest that Framework or Fairphone are the SAME as Google or Apple? The same… not alike, no no. And their privacy policies are also the same? You’re quite something with this.

 

[Steve Adams]

Share your evidence with us that Apple mishandles data.
You’re claiming quite a lot but don’t back anything up. „I work for an unmade mega corp so I know how every mega corp is operating.“ Sure.
How come people that claim Apple is misappropriating user data can’t produce a single piece of legitimate evidence or cite legitimate sources? Oh, I know…

Share with me that they don't. You can't. I can't. I am sorry you feel like I am personally attacking a family member of yours. I am not. I am typing this on my apple iPad 10th gen right now while eating my breakfast. I am a realist. The real facts are if there is any way for a tech company to make renvue from you, no matter what way, they are doing it.

I do see that their marketing team is working on you which is fine. You do you.

 

[Steve Adams]

All tech companies are the same IS bold. And plain wrong. Even if you feel it’s not.
Evidence bro, evidence.
For example, you really suggest that Framework or Fairphone are the SAME as Google or Apple? The same… not alike, no no. And their privacy policies are also the same? You’re quite something with this.

No framework and fairphone are not, becuase they don't make money off of services, or have any. Whoooosh. The point, missed. They sell hardware. That being said, There sure is truth stretching in their marketing as well. Plus, framework an fairphone are a little tiny speck of dust in size compared to the companies I am talking about, Google, apple, MS, T mobile, at&t, Bell, Telus, etc etc etc. Hell most of the major PC players like Asus, Dell, Lenovo and others all sell your personal data. Apple is no different and totally not som holy'r than thou corp. that's for sure. They are just as cold and calculated as the rest, You just drink their marketing teams juice.

 

[Steve Adams]

A quick google search provides lots of information about apple. They "settle" alot of lawsuits about data collection. Instead of letting the information become public they will throw money at the lawsuit to make it go away. Funny that.

If I were a major player in the tech industry that makes bold claims like we never collect and sell your data, No amount of settlement would amount to me paying it to make the lawsuit go away. I would want it proven without a doubt in court that I never sold my users data. That sounds like integrity to me. Instead, apple tosses whatever amount the plaintiff asks for and makes it go away before presenting it's proof and data records in court. Again, Funny that.

Please, stop treating apple like a friend or family member that has your best intrested at heart. They are anything but. They are out to milk every dollar out of you that they can, whether by selling hardware and subs to you, to taking your data and generating income from that as well. I am singling out apple since, for some reason, people defend apple more than any other tech company out there, I mean all major tech companies, service providers, etc etc etc. Don't use facebook, instagram, whatsapp, snapchat etc etc etc. They are all tracking and collecting. All for $$$$$$.

 

[Cobalt Blizzard]

No framework and fairphone are not, becuase they don't make money off of services, or have any. Whoooosh. The point, missed. They sell hardware. That being said, There sure is truth stretching in their marketing as well. Plus, framework an fairphone are a little tiny speck of dust in size compared to the companies I am talking about, Google, apple, MS, T mobile, at&t, Bell, Telus, etc etc etc. Hell most of the major PC players like Asus, Dell, Lenovo and others all sell your personal data. Apple is no different and totally not som holy'r than thou corp. that's for sure. They are just as cold and calculated as the rest, You just drink their marketing teams juice.

Individual device manufacturers often do their own shady stuff.

Motorola phones have started hijacking the Amazon app to insert affiliate codes [Video]

A truly bizarre situation on Motorola phones has led to the software hijacking the Amazon app to inject an affiliate...

9to5google.com

 

[Steve Adams]

Individual device manufacturers often do their own shady stuff.

Motorola phones have started hijacking the Amazon app to insert affiliate codes [Video]

A truly bizarre situation on Motorola phones has led to the software hijacking the Amazon app to inject an affiliate...

9to5google.com

Re read what I said. I said the same thing. I don't think framework or fair phone are at the point where they can get away with it yet.

 

[robvalentine]

Individual device manufacturers often do their own shady stuff.

Motorola phones have started hijacking the Amazon app to insert affiliate codes [Video]

A truly bizarre situation on Motorola phones has led to the software hijacking the Amazon app to inject an affiliate...

9to5google.com

To be fair Steve hasn't claimed that Google don't, he's pointing out that apple also spy. Hijacking referal codes etc like honey, and now Motorola is a scummy practice.

 

[Parowdy]

Share with me that they don't. You can't. I can't. I am sorry you feel like I am personally attacking a family member of yours. I am not. I am typing this on my apple iPad 10th gen right now while eating my breakfast. I am a realist. The real facts are if there is any way for a tech company to make renvue from you, no matter what way, they are doing it.

I do see that their marketing team is working on you which is fine. You do you.

Oh my oh my, what a response 🤣
I don’t have to provide evidence because I didn’t start to claim anything, you did.
I could share a bunch of documentation from Apple and third parties concerning their use of private data, and you would just simply deny their legitimacy because you feel like it, as that’s already what you’re doing, because that data already exists…

You’re essentially like a flat earther arguing they don’t see a curvature so there is none, and everyone that tells them the earth isn’t flat has to provide evidence for it 🙈
No, it doesn’t work like that. YOU make a claim, YOU back it up.
If YOU feel like going against the consensus, YOU have to explain why and how. Simple as that. You’ve obviously never had to do with real research, science or anything like that or you’d know.
You feel like Apple HAS to gather not-anonymized data to sell it, because you think they need to. Not because you know.
Because if you knew, you’d have at least something to share with us except your thoughts and feelings.

You could, apparently single handedly, expose THE company when it comes to user privacy, but chose not to, why? Why limit yourself to forum posts when you could do the world a favor and expose the lying cheating frauds that objectively get paid too much anyway living their stolen fabulous life’s in California, but you don’t.
And it’s obvious why. Not because people wouldn’t believe you, I promise there are millions of people that would eat up your every word (remember the recent malware TikTok). It’s because it’s all hot air with exactly 0 evidence to just back up even a slither of it.
Apple couldn’t possibly make enough money with software and hardware, no no. They need to secretly betray their entire user base for some more while manufacturing their earnings calls and just hope brave souls like you don’t speak up with their evidence thoughts and feelings. Why do they even bother with ads in Maps (and the backlash) if they can already make big bucks like Google or Meta do with user data?
You are a lot of things, a realists isn’t one of them 😂. Be real, provide ANYTHING except your believes. You can’t.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Let that seep into you’re brain for the future, it will help you going forward.

Also, I don’t feel like you’re attacking a family member of mine. I feel like you’re attacking the integrity of the forum as a whole.
If anyone who spews baseless claims on here would be allowed to do so without any backlash or RIGHTFUL requests for data this forum would die a horrible death like so many others (especially not tech related) in the last 10 years. You’re part of the anti-intellectual wave that judges based solely on feelings and not on any hard data.

 

[Parowdy]

No framework and fairphone are not, becuase they don't make money off of services, or have any. Whoooosh. The point, missed. They sell hardware. That being said, There sure is truth stretching in their marketing as well. Plus, framework an fairphone are a little tiny speck of dust in size compared to the companies I am talking about, Google, apple, MS, T mobile, at&t, Bell, Telus, etc etc etc. Hell most of the major PC players like Asus, Dell, Lenovo and others all sell your personal data. Apple is no different and totally not som holy'r than thou corp. that's for sure. They are just as cold and calculated as the rest, You just drink their marketing teams juice.

Point missed? Your point was that all tech companies are the same. Your words…
Also, Framework doesn’t provide software or services? At least bother to look them up before you claim they don’t exist. And yes, even free software counts as software, and pointing out where to get it and offering support does count as a service.
But ok, all tech companies are the same isn’t true anymore all of a sudden once I bring actual examples to the table.
Your turn now for your claims…

We don’t have to talk about marketing, I don’t care about that. We do need to talk about cold hard evidence though.
You use the word fact so freely but apparently can’t be bothered to know what it means.
I don’t argue that most companies are soulless money printing machines, we totally agree on that.
I argue that Apple for the most part is an exception when it comes to profiting off user data, something generally regarded as „true“.
You say it’s not true. So, back up your claim. You can put however many companies and names in whatever lists you want.
I’m asking you for data, evidence, proof, whatever you want to call it. Not just your general feeling that it must be the way you think simply because you think it.
I’m not asking for much here, am I?
Just provide ANY THING that proves ANY THING.

 

[Parowdy]

Re read what I said. I said the same thing. I don't think framework or fair phone are at the point where they can get away with it yet.

You think that THE mainstream company when it comes to user privacy can get away with marketing that private user data? I mean, apparently, but at least try to make it make sense.
Maybe, I don’t know, with data?

 

[chrono1081]

Couldn't agree more.
Every big tech company are exactly the same regarding privacy.

No they're not and that's not opinion. Don't give advice based on your feelings.

 

[chrono1081]

I’ve never used Android so I don’t know, but a friend of mine is now using these apps on his phone because he “can’t stand Google”?

Fossify

Google apps aren't my particular favorite to use and their search engine has gone to trash long ago especially with media searches. A lot of people hate Google because their motto used to be "do no evil" and they stripped it from everything and are now, doing evil.

Android as an OS is fine unless you're on a phone that wildly customizes it and makes it crappy. It's not my cup of tea but for most people it's just personal preference which one to use.

 

[jamezr]

2 lawsuits and one was a class action

Every time you set up a new iPhone, you are asked whether or not you consent to Apple collecting analytics data. If you decline consent, you’d of course expect no analytics data to be sent to Apple.

However, Mysk found that Apple apps were collecting and sending this data regardless of this setting. Indeed, he could see no difference at all in the data sent whether the user had chosen to grant or decline permission.

Apple accused of ‘systematic violations’ of user privacy

Apple is facing another class action lawsuit over its practice of allegedly collecting and sending analytics data from iPhone users,...

9to5mac.com

All the Data Apple Collects About You—and How to Limit It

Cupertino puts privacy first in a lot of its products. But the company still gathers a bunch of your information.

www.wired.com

Voice assistants typically react when people use “hot words” such as “Hey, Siri”. Two plaintiffs said their mentions of Air Jordan sneakers and Olive Garden restaurants triggered ads for those products. Another said he was served ads for a brand name surgical treatment after discussing it, he thought privately, with his doctor. The plaintiffs alleged Apple did not receive consent before recording their conversations and in fact could not receive consent from one of the plaintiffs because they were a minor without an Apple account at the time of the recording.

Apple to pay $95m to settle claims Siri listened to users’ private conversations

Settlement of proposed class-action lawsuit represent nine hours of profit for Apple, which has denied wrongdoing

www.theguardian.com

 

[Steve Adams]

2 lawsuits and one was a class action

Apple accused of ‘systematic violations’ of user privacy

Apple is facing another class action lawsuit over its practice of allegedly collecting and sending analytics data from iPhone users,...

9to5mac.com

All the Data Apple Collects About You—and How to Limit It

Cupertino puts privacy first in a lot of its products. But the company still gathers a bunch of your information.

www.wired.com

Apple to pay $95m to settle claims Siri listened to users’ private conversations

Settlement of proposed class-action lawsuit represent nine hours of profit for Apple, which has denied wrongdoing

www.theguardian.com

Don't use fact and logic trying to provide fact vs. Peoples emotional attachment defending a company who sells them things. It's like Pig and Elephant DNA just don't mix.

There's been proof showing apple does the same thing, but pays the people off to shut up and go away.

 

[BigMcGuire]

Don't use fact and logic trying to provide fact vs. Peoples emotional attachment defending a company who sells them things. It's like Pig and Elephant DNA just don't mix.

There's been proof showing apple does the same thing, but pays the people off to shut up and go away.

These 3 instances are your proof that Apple and Google are identical in how they deal with privacy and selling user data?

One company data mines everything you do and sells it to the highest bidder as a business model. The other company collects data that .... is needed for operations of apps... Lawsuit still pending... And the Siri thing was the iPhone triggering microphone when it thought people said Hey Siri. And that's how Apple is identical to Google?

Yeah nope. Apple does not do the same thing. Did you actually read the articles? You are not helping your cause.

Even Marques' latest video acknowledges that using a FitBit is to give your data to a company that data mines and sells everything you do. Apple does NOT do this. A lot of other companies do this to an extent but nowhere near the extent that Google does this.

I was willing to hear you out but you have provided no proof or support of your argument. If Apple was doing the same thing Google was, it would be making significantly more money than Google on top of its hardware sales.

Now I give you kudos for not trusting any company. This, again, is why I run an encrypted DNS service at the Profile level of Mac OS / iOS and adblockers at the OS level.