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Is M1 base really that superior to Intel i9 or i7?
- Thread starter TheOutlier
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I'd guess that would depend on the alder Lake of course. alder Lake (high end) was designed to compete with M1 Max and M1 Pro, M1 is a more basic SOC, but probably competes handily with lower end alder Lake
I'd guess that would depend on the alder Lake of course. alder Lake (high end) was designed to compete with M1 Max and M1 Pro, M1 is a more basic SOC, but probably competes handily with lower end alder Lake. Oh and lets not forget the thermals on alder Lake
Rumors are that there will be a 12-performance core option in the iMac Pro, currently expected in September. I guess that they want higher Geekbench numbers than Alder Lake.
Intel doesn't care about thermals. They will take any win that they can. AMD's results yesterday shows impressive penetration into the server market where PPW is very important. Intel has to next defend their marketshare there.
A lot of consumers don't really care about thermals on desktop - as long as there's a good cooling solution. Nobody likes fan noise.
The past decade has shown huge growth in the cloud which means that old systems can be used for far longer because compute is done somewhere else. That's true for storage too.
From left to right: Windows i7-10700 Desktop, M1 mini, 2014 iMac, 2010 iMac. One of the most annoying thing about Windows is how Virtual Desktops works with multiple monitors. Apple gives you the option to have virtual desktops be for one screen or all screens. On Windows, it's all screens. I usually like to keep one screen fixed while being able to change another.
Fair comment, I was a bit grumpy yesterday.Come on, tell us how you *really* feel!
Still, that M1 MBA is just sitting on a shelf gathering dust for me. It has a fan! My dislike of the Air was centered around 3 points, one was a lack of a fan (hot, throttling), and the other is that I need x86 VM capability to run Windows. And until Microsoft allows us to actually purchase a Windows on Arm License, I can't use it for work, and that is a requirement for me. I can see how that doesn't matter to a lot of people, but it does to me. Windows on Arm isn't exactly a speed demon on the M1 either, and it definitely causes a lot of my heat problem, not to mention it doesn't run everything x86.
My Air only has 16G of RAM, and that's really not enough for me either. I tend to run a lot of different things all the time. That's why my Intel Mac Mini with a lot more RAM actually is a better fit for what I want to do.
I had a decently specc'd 14" MBP Max on order for awhile to replace my MBA, but I decided to wait until the WoA situation gets resolved.
It's great that it fits what you want and need though, congrats!
Maybe Microsoft will stop exercising anti-competitive behavior and release widows on ARM, or your vendor would release an apple silicon version. It is not surprising that a demanding windows program, not an optimized Apple silicon program, would have trouble running on emulation, goes without saying. The remarkable thing is that it does run. You should have known about the monitors. But what amazed me is that I can use my laptop monitor, an external 4k monitor and an airplay 4k monitor at the same time. Not 3 external 4Ks, but enough for me
On the mini - I did know but I wanted an immediate solution. The rumors were that an upgrade to the mini would come in the fall so I wanted something to play with to see if my stuff would work on Apple Silicon and then upgrade to something better in the fall. The mini Pro didn't arrive and I don't know when it will other than to say that it will arrive this year. There are rumors that it will arrive this spring but, really, I don't think that anyone knows. Not even Apple.
So the M1 mini was an experiment. I don't strictly need it as I could just hook up the second monitor to my Windows desktop. I would just lose Spaces which I like a lot. The Windows Desktop supports up to 4 4k displays.
I bought the 2021 MacBook Pro in that crazy 15 minute timeframe on launch and just wanted to hit my requirements - 32 GB RAM and 16 inches. I assumed that it would support three external monitors and was pretty disappointed that it didn't. The thing is my 2014 and 2015 said that they only support 2 4k monitors but they actually support 2x4k + a third monitor but it can't be 4k. I found this out with experimentation. That is in addition to the internal display. So Apple, in the past, did support more external displays than in the specs. Just not with these models.
I was using the 2021 MacBook Pro with two external displays but there are memory leak problems which were really annoying. I took it off the desktop cluster because I had to reboot it regularly and it's just used in the house and when I travel. It appears that external displays really exacerbate the memory leak problems. It's much less of a problem used standalone. So I am waiting for bugfixes on Monterey in general. I'm running Big Sur and Mojave on my other Macs (that can go to Monterey) because I still consider Monterey to be unstable.
I really didn't want to return it and then wait for an M1 Max. It appears that you get 1 external with 13, 2 with Pro and 4 with Max. I'm hoping that they do 2 with the M2 Air, 3 with M2 Pro. Some people do like to run their desktop off a MacBook. At the moment, though, I'm enjoying them being separate as I can use the laptop as a laptop and the desktop is stable.
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So? None of that is relevant to the thread topic. And speaking of changing the topic, every post in here is all about your incredibly specialized needs. That M1 won't run x86 is both well known and NOT RELEVANT TO THE TOPIC.
Honestly? Look at one of the other half dozen 'what should I buy' threads from the last few weeks.
But a short answer? Get the Air unless you KNOW you need more than 16gig RAM. We can't tell you if you do or not. Obviously, another solution would be to tough it out and see if any of the current Pro models show up on Apple's refurbished store page in a few months or save. up and buy a MBP.
Also, if you do this seriously/professionally, budget for a new machine every 3-4 years. Not every 8.
GET. A. WINDOWS. BOX.Fair comment, I was a bit grumpy yesterday.
It has a fan! My dislike of the Air was centered around 3 points, one was a lack of a fan (hot, throttling), and the other is that I need x86 VM capability to run Windows. And until Microsoft allows us to actually purchase a Windows on Arm License, I can't use it for work, and that is a requirement for me. I can see how that doesn't matter to a lot of people, but it does to me. Windows on Arm isn't exactly a speed demon on the M1 either, and it definitely causes a lot of my heat problem, not to mention it doesn't run everything x86.
My Air only has 16G of RAM, and that's really not enough for me either. I tend to run a lot of different things all the time. That's why my Intel Mac Mini with a lot more RAM actually is a better fit for what I want to do.
I had a decently specc'd 14" MBP Max on order for awhile to replace my MBA, but I decided to wait until the WoA situation gets resolved.
It's great that it fits what you want and need though, congrats!
Even if MS licenses Windows Arm, that doesnt mean the x86 apps you need will run on it or run well. Seriously, people, if you need Windows going forward, you want to buy a Windows machine for that need. Unless something drastic changes, the days of Windows being a first class citizen on Apple hardware are over.
Ok those cases are there of course. I'm not running any old code, all my daily apps are native M1 already.
I HAVE MULTIPLE WINDOWS BOXES. I WANT TO RUN A MAC.
Actually I've already tested it, and most runs, and the stuff that doesn't run has alternates that do the same thing. The licensing is a hard block issue though, I can't get around that.
And just forget about what I want to run? That's a totally useless suggestion and comment.
If I ever give up on Mac's, it'll be because of all the people that have told me to get a Windows box around here, not because of the M1+ processors. I'm a computer geek, I run all kinds of boxes and OS's, it's what I do as a hobby -- but I do have a job to do too. (IT Manager, you know the one that approves all the computer purchases and such...)
I wasn't' trying to disprove just suggesting it maybe interesting to try and post about it
Based on your needs you are probably at the high end of what the M1 is optimized for but the next jump up to the MBP M1 Pro may be a more expensive jump. Since Apples products are in flux right now, if you need to buy now, I would go with the M1 13” MBP or even the M1 Air depending on you budget. Consider this a short term decision for the next couple of years. By then all of the products will transitioned and moving onto their next revision of the M-series chips. Software will be fully adapted to AS. You will have more experience with the new platform and can make a more informed choice. Getting the M1 will give you a good tool at a reasonable price. In a couple of years, you can trade it in on something that meets your future needs, too.
Definitely don’t waste your money and patience on the Intel laptops, at this point. Unless you like slow, hot, and noisy. ?
There's a thermal cap so you don't toast your MacBook, but even when you hit it, even for extended time, M1 will most likely keep up with you unless you are legitimately someone who really does need more RAM/CPU/etc. I haven't had it chug on one thing I've thrown at it so far, even the games I've tried on it, and even translating them with Crossover or running through Rosetta 2.
That's not what he said at all.
The M1 is fully capable of peak performance including in a device that doesn't even a have fan! (MacBook Air).
Every other M1 device that is not intending to be the lightest most portable thing available has a fan, and can maintain peak performance indefinitely.
Wise words and 100% agree. There is no “future proofing” - just capacity planning for hardware that will superseded in 2-3 years by the latest models. It won’t stop working of course, and the goal is to plan the capacity based on realistic expected requirements for the planned life of the machine. You don’t need the latest and greatest to be effective, but should need to get “enough machine” for the job.
yeah and I want a Maserati. But we don't all get what we want.
If you need to run Windows apps routinely, your best, most reliable method of doing that will be on a Windows machine. If you can run your apps in an Arm version of Windows, it might work out, but if they're x86 apps and never ported to Arm you'll always be running some risk of incompatibility.
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So make the money and buy one. (If you were serious.) I see no reason to compromise if one is serious.
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One word: Rosetta. The issue here is whether certain software runs well enough and, in some circumstances, whether it actually runs better on an Intel based Mac than an Arm based Mac. With this perspective, an Intel i9/i7 may serve you better than an M1. For example, ATP from Fidelity runs better on the Intel based machines. There may be other examples.
No company is going to gamble on emulation for production. Only casual users will tolerate it.