Is windows 11 really bloated?

[Steve Adams]

Resolve seems to be almost the only major product usable on Linux. There is nothing as comprehensive as Adobe Creative Suite or music notation programmes like Sibelius or Dorico.
I do hope things will change but although Linux itself has improved the simple lack of world-class software means it’s a non-starter.

I ran from Adobe years ago, Speaking of bloated software. Adobe is the worst. Once you free yourself of them, things are much faster.

You could try your music notation software via bottles/wine, or winboat. For video work Kdenlive is a great program. Photo editing, try rapidraw and darktable to replace lightroom and GIMP to replace photoshop. I have a small low powered dell running Zorin and I have used all of these programs without issue. I have 4 gb of ram on that system.

 

[Imperial926]

I ran from Adobe years ago, Speaking of bloated software. Adobe is the worst. Once you free yourself of them, things are much faster.

You could try your music notation software via bottles/wine, or winboat. For video work Kdenlive is a great program. Photo editing, try rapidraw and darktable to replace lightroom and GIMP to replace photoshop. I have a small low powered dell running Zorin and I have used all of these programs without issue. I have 4 gb of ram on that system.

Thanks for these suggestions - I will take a look. Although I quoted Adobe I also ran from it 2 years ago so now it's Affinity and Pixelmator Pro which I bought before the subscription model. Who knows if Pixelmator will ever see any more updates for those who purchased it out right.
In Europe we have to extract ourselves from reliance on previous solutions as much as possible so further exploration of Linux is on my to do list!

 

[Steve Adams]

Thanks for these suggestions - I will take a look. Although I quoted Adobe I also ran from it 2 years ago so now it's Affinity and Pixelmator Pro which I bought before the subscription model. Who knows if Pixelmator will ever see any more updates for those who purchased it out right.
In Europe we have to extract ourselves from reliance on previous solutions as much as possible so further exploration of Linux is on my to do list!

We are in the same boat here in Canada as well. That being said, Microsoft has invested billions of dollars into the Canadian infrastructure to lessen reliance on US based cloud services, and committed to our data sovereignty. I think Microsoft have made so many bad moves in the past couple of years they need to do this to keep what they have.

 

[pshufd]

We are in the same boat here in Canada as well. That being said, Microsoft has invested billions of dollars into the Canadian infrastructure to lessen reliance on US based cloud services, and committed to our data sovereignty. I think Microsoft have made so many bad moves in the past couple of years they need to do this to keep what they have.

Canada is an energy powerhouse and the US is lacking energy infrastructure for AI growth. We're in New England and we have to import natural gas, gasoline, diesel and electricity from Canada because of a dumb law where we can't ship it within the country, people not wanting pipelines running through their town and not wanting generation in their own state.

There's a strong anti-data-center sentiment in the United States right now.

 

[Imperial926]

We are in the same boat here in Canada as well. That being said, Microsoft has invested billions of dollars into the Canadian infrastructure to lessen reliance on US based cloud services, and committed to our data sovereignty. I think Microsoft have made so many bad moves in the past couple of years they need to do this to keep what they have.

Yes, 'interesting' times! I received an email from Pavan Davuluri who heads up the Windows Insider team saying they were listening to users' pleas and detailing, very specifically, the changes they will be making, including giving CoPilot more of a back seat. I have to say that as my Windows machine is a home build and I didn't subscribe to the new, more expensive version of Office + deleting CoPilot in Windows I see very little change, no advertising and it runs very smoothly. I can't be the only one!
I am trialling an Ionos Cloud storage offer to see if I can use it to replace OneDrive but Microsoft hold all the cards with 1Tb being bundled with Office - hard to resist.
Here in Europe, products need to be rolled out that work seamlessly with existing setups but what I would really love to see is a European computer OS and solutions that don't depend on advertising. I would be happy with a system run something like Public Broadcasting but I suspect many would be suspicious of it. Just imagine though! A world with no endless adverts, popups and more - a throwback to the early years of the Internet.
Good luck in Canada. We're thinking of you!

 

[eltoslightfoot]

They are reversing all the junk they did to windows to make people to start jumping ship. Windows is actually not that "bloated" it's more of being forced to do things you don't want to do. If you turn off all that nagging its fast and quick. I don't see "bloat" I see ads, and forced Ai opt ins. I turn off the ads, and turn off the forced ai nagging and it's fine.

ALOT of the Linux talk is from YouTubers wanting to get clicks, calling windows bloated etc. Sensationalism. I had an issue with my M365 account, and got upset because I have alot of data on my OneDrive. I was getting my server/NAS setup but the motherboard died on the system so I have to wait until I get a new system for that before I can migrate things off OneDrive.

I already did this. I use an Unraid Linux server as my NAS and Nextcloud setup. It works great and no Onedrive.

 

[Bubble99]

I haven't personally used it but my die hard Windows friends who work as Windows sysadmins and network administrators all switched to Linux or Mac at home.

I'm assuming yes it's really bad.

Why is Windows more bloated than Linux?

 

[pshufd]

Why is Windows more bloated than Linux?

Commercial operating systems will tend to be more bloated because the reward system in software development companies (stock options, bonuses, promotions) is geared to new features.

 

[JMalone]

There is actually a great utility that does this - Stardock Groupy.

I used WindowBlinds way back in the day. I just never enjoyed hacking a system. Fun for a while but never stick with it.

 

[eltoslightfoot]

I used WindowBlinds way back in the day. I just never enjoyed hacking a system. Fun for a while but never stick with it.

I feel the same. Inevitably I end up back with the system defaults LOL. At least the option is there for those that want it I guess.

 

[Steve Adams]

I already did this. I use an Unraid Linux server as my NAS and Nextcloud setup. It works great and no Onedrive.

I was on the way to doing this but apparently my servers motherboard pooped the bed

 

[Steve Adams]

Yes, 'interesting' times! I received an email from Pavan Davuluri who heads up the Windows Insider team saying they were listening to users' pleas and detailing, very specifically, the changes they will be making, including giving CoPilot more of a back seat. I have to say that as my Windows machine is a home build and I didn't subscribe to the new, more expensive version of Office + deleting CoPilot in Windows I see very little change, no advertising and it runs very smoothly. I can't be the only one!
I am trialling an Ionos Cloud storage offer to see if I can use it to replace OneDrive but Microsoft hold all the cards with 1Tb being bundled with Office - hard to resist.
Here in Europe, products need to be rolled out that work seamlessly with existing setups but what I would really love to see is a European computer OS and solutions that don't depend on advertising. I would be happy with a system run something like Public Broadcasting but I suspect many would be suspicious of it. Just imagine though! A world with no endless adverts, popups and more - a throwback to the early years of the Internet.
Good luck in Canada. We're thinking of you!

I have that now using edge with ad blockers and Brave for the rest.

 

[jakey rolling]

I used WindowBlinds way back in the day. I just never enjoyed hacking a system. Fun for a while but never stick with it.

I have Object Desktop because I use a few of the utilities included (Fences, Groupy, Start11, and Multiplicity). Decent little productivity apps that I find really useful for organizing stuff on my work machines.

WindowBlinds is kind of like the old Kaleidoscope for classic Mac OS. I agree, not really my thing, but I do see there are some people really into modding their machines. There are a few eye-candy-ish apps included in OD that I'm sure I would have loved in my late teens and early 20's. Deskscapes is another included utility that I tried for a while and actually liked insofar as what it did (animated backgrounds and could be set as a screen saver), except that its UI is a bit of a cluster-fk and it has a nasty memory-leak issue.

 

[chrono1081]

Why is Windows more bloated than Linux?

Some of it is more on the hardware manufacturer than Windows. A lot of computer manufacturers will subsidize the cost of their PCs by preinstalling lots of different software from companies who pay them to do so (for example trial versions of anti-virus software or gaming software or something).

That kind of stuff could generally be removed but apparently (again, I don't much experience with 11) Microsoft started doing that kind of thing directly in the operating system as well and it's just part of the OS.

Couple that with co-pilot everywhere and people are starting to get annoyed.

 

[Ctrlos]

Why is Windows more bloated than Linux?

There are loads of background processes sending who knows what telemetry and ad data back to Microsoft that eat RAM and storage. On my Surface Laptop Go W11 takes up 30gb of space, even after running a decrapify script to turn off and uninstall all the bloatware. I wiped it with Linux and it took 5gb of space.

 

[Bubble99]

I notice windows like to hover around 40% RAM use.

Looking at 8 GB of RAM 40% RAM in use and 16 GB of RAM 40% RAM in use.

I’m wondering if Microsoft scale RAM up and likes it to hover around 40% RAM use.

There was PC with 4 GB of RAM and 40% RAM use.

Have others here notice RAM scale up likes to hover around 40% RAM use no matter what scale is 4, 8, 16 or 32 GB of RAM.

May be Microsoft thinks windows should hover around 40% RAM use.

Note this nothing running on fresh reboot.

 

[pshufd]

I notice windows like to hover around 40% RAM use.

Looking at 8 GB of RAM 40% RAM in use and 16 GB of RAM 40% RAM in use.

I’m wondering if Microsoft scale RAM up and likes it to hover around 40% RAM use.

There was PC with 4 GB of RAM and 40% RAM use.

Have others here notice RAM scale up likes to hover around 40% RAM use no matter what scale is 4, 8, 16 or 32 GB of RAM.

May be Microsoft thinks windows should hover around 40% RAM use.

Note this nothing running on fresh reboot.

macOS and Windows memory management feel similar to me. My iMac Pro is using 19 GB, 12 GB for cache and has a tiny amount of swap. This system is mainly used for office stuff and video editing though the video editing stuff isn't loaded at the moment.

My Windows desktop has 9.8 GB in use, 3.2 GB cached and 118 GB available. So Windows 11 doesn't try to fill up the RAM. Both of these systems have been up for at least a few days though more likely several weeks.

I just noticed a new explanation in the Memory composition bar in that you can mouseover a section and it explains the composition in English.

 

[Steve Adams]

My memory usage on my laptop I am using now is 8.1gb used with 51gb free. I should be good.

 

[maflynn]

macOS and Windows memory management feel similar to me.

But its not.

For macOS, free memory is wasted memory. It tries to grab everythign and manages it rather aggressively, where as windows only uses what it needs. That's why when in windows when you see free memory go down, things tend to go wrong

 

[Bubble99]

macOS and Windows memory management feel similar to me. My iMac Pro is using 19 GB, 12 GB for cache and has a tiny amount of swap. This system is mainly used for office stuff and video editing though the video editing stuff isn't loaded at the moment.

My Windows desktop has 9.8 GB in use, 3.2 GB cached and 118 GB available. So Windows 11 doesn't try to fill up the RAM. Both of these systems have been up for at least a few days though more likely several weeks.

I just noticed a new explanation in the Memory composition bar in that you can mouseover a section and it explains the composition in English.

That is really interesting I wonder If Microsoft and Apple where working together that the way OS uses RAM is similar?

Where Windows and MacOS is loading frequently used apps into RAM.

 

[jakey rolling]

That is really interesting I wonder If Microsoft and Apple where working together that the way OS uses RAM is similar?

Where Windows and MacOS is loading frequently used apps into RAM.

"Working together", not likely as far as OS development goes. "Copying Learning from one another", absolutely.

Apple and MS work together to make sure the apps that one develops work acceptably well on the others' OS.

 

[pshufd]

"Working together", not likely as far as OS development goes. "Copying Learning from one another", absolutely.

Apple and MS work together to make sure the apps that one develops work acceptably well on the others' OS.

It's also standard stuff in CS textbooks. I have a few of the dinosaur textbooks on my CS shelves.

 

[Bubble99]

It's also standard stuff in CS textbooks. I have a few of the dinosaur textbooks on my CS shelves.

I don’t have any engineering textbook so I don’t know what is in engineering CS textbook.

 

[pshufd]

I don’t have any engineering textbook so I don’t know what is in engineering CS textbook.

Sorry. First link was to the sixth edition. Here's a pic from Amazon on the current edition.

 

[pshufd]

This is an older version of the dinosaur book and you can better see why it is so named. The book has a history and I think a taxonomy of operating systems so you can see that there's a lot more than just Linux, Windows and macOS out there.