maflynn
macrumors Broadwell
I used/worked on all those except for Mach and multics.
Brings back such memories. Of all of the operating systems listed there, only OS/2 was set up to fail for many reasons.
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Is windows 11 really bloated?
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Brings back such memories. Of all of the operating systems listed there, only OS/2 was set up to fail for many reasons.
I used them all except for Mach and OS/2. One of the benefits of growing up in the Boston area.
eltoslightfoot
macrumors 68040
Steve Adams
macrumors 68000
I just did the latest update to my laptop. The system is much more responsive. Noticeably "snappier". Took a few min for it to sort out while doing the update. But it made a good improvement.
I have some of those books though the computer science textbooks are separate I think. This is a well-known classic too. I think that there are a few others but I'd have to check the computer science section of our home library. This is known as the dragon book.
Steve Adams
macrumors 68000
I couldn't find the book.
The prerequisites for Compilers is usually data structures, discrete math and theory of computation. I think that a lot of casual learners would balk at the first two and the third would be quite confusing.
Steve Adams
macrumors 68000
Co-pilot made that book for me. It was a joke. ha ha. I was making fun of the fact that they are firing all the educated, skilled people for Ai, and now wanting to hire back people.
boswald
macrumors 68030
You're right, it is a one-time-thing. But the problem is, I don't want to do it the first time! I switched my old computer to Linux and it runs better than it ever has. I primarily use my Mac these days, but when I do decide to go back to my Linux computer (for games), it's a joy to use. Not the point of your post, I'm sure, but I just thought I'd share how repulsive the installation process is to veterans, let alone newcomers. I think the MacBook Neo is going to shift how people think about Windows (at least a little bit).
Steve Adams
macrumors 68000
I don't think it will move the needle, nor will linux. If linux was going to, it would have this past year or two. Windows is what windows is, and people use it because of familiarity. Most users DGAF about things as long as they can do what they need. All of the windows sensationalism is only power users and tech sites.
maflynn
macrumors Broadwell
Here's an interesting snapshot, we see windows 10 actually increasing in marketshare where as windows 11 decreasing. Given all of the telemetry windows sends back to the mothership, Microsoft is fully aware that windows 11 has lost all momentum and its widely derided
Introducing Apple Business — a new all‑in‑one platform for businesses of all sizes
Here's one example where Apple is making a move back into the enterprise, couple that with the Neo, it could make things a lot more interesting for Dell/HP and of course MS.
On the consumer side, we have the Neo and Mac Mini both quality computers for well under a 1,000 The Neo is catching everyone's attention, and I can see most consumers seeing that and opting for the Neo over going to best buy and buying a pile of plastic ewaste.
I'm typing this on CachyOS, and I'm happy but my usage case, is far outside that of a typical consumer..
I'm not so sure anymore
Introducing Apple Business — a new all‑in‑one platform for businesses of all sizes
Here's one example where Apple is making a move back into the enterprise, couple that with the Neo, it could make things a lot more interesting for Dell/HP and of course MS.
On the consumer side, we have the Neo and Mac Mini both quality computers for well under a 1,000 The Neo is catching everyone's attention, and I can see most consumers seeing that and opting for the Neo over going to best buy and buying a pile of plastic ewaste.
Linux will never be a major player in the desktop/laptop market, for one reason and one reason alone. The OS that comes with the computer is good enough for people. They may not like Windows but not enough to reinstall something else. For Macs, there's no reason to opt for Linux, so you'll not really see anyone outside of a tech enthusiast wanting to play with Linux on a mac.
I'm typing this on CachyOS, and I'm happy but my usage case, is far outside that of a typical consumer..
Steve Adams
macrumors 68000
The reason Microsoft is doing a 180 is the fact they lost 1/2 a TRILLION dollars in market cap. The telemetry has nothing to do with it. They saw that the Co-Pilot everywhere Ai everywhere idea is not working. Nobody is paying for ai so they are taking it out again. Yes alot of users have been complaining, but the factor is MONEY, nothing else.
I am all for it too. I tried linux and while free, open and not tied to "the man". It's just not there. I tried MacOS a few times as well. Again, Not for me. Not into finger gymnastics for everything command, option control plus 4 letter keys for this, or that. Just didn't jive with me. I am born and bred on a mouse with a right button for most things. Way faster than keyboard commands.
Most people will still buy the "plastic e-waste" because it runs windows. What the neo WILL do is force the PC makers to up their quality game.
boswald
macrumors 68030
Linux, no, but the Neo might put a dent into the student/education sector. At least make a ripple in the ocean.
maflynn
macrumors Broadwell
I definitely think the Neo will turn out to be a game changer.
boswald
macrumors 68030
I haven't seen any in the wild yet but I'm on the lookout. I'll have to check Starbucks before school gets back into session.
eltoslightfoot
macrumors 68040
Oh it will definitely be a game changer, but the main thing it will do is force PC Makers to put out better versions of their low end stuff. Apple could sell 10 million of these things a quarter and the PC world would barely notice.
I think both things are true.
maflynn
macrumors Broadwell
That's the wild card, how will they respond. The last time a low cost laptop turned the industry on its ear, was the netbooks, and the change was horrible, it was a race to the bottom. This time around we have premium build quality with decent features. How will Lenovo, Dell, Asus, etc respond. I don't mean just cutting the price of their existing products - some have already started to do that, but offer something similar.
eltoslightfoot
macrumors 68040
I still think the problem with the enterprise world is everything is windows based. So many IT shops won't even want to bother with something different. Now the education world is very different, and I think that is where it will make huge inroads.
maflynn
macrumors Broadwell
Yes, for larger organizations it boils down to getting the best deal possible. Where I work, we have a business relationship with Dell, so all of our servers are Dell based, and using EMC storage. Don't you think within that contract there's verbiage that basically benefits both Dell and my company to have Dell supply laptops to us?
If my company decided that they want to use Mac Neos for everyone, then that will only happen when the contract comes up for renewal, and its negotiated. Odds are Dell will make it very tempting to keep supplying the laptops.
Also, the majority of people in IS are certifed and have experience with Windows, embracing a different platform has huge implications with support, application compatibility, and the ability to manage each machine
With what Microsoft offers, managing security, and pushing updates is done in a way that people have experience with.
Its an uphill battle for Apple to try to eat into the enterprise market.
It may but there are a lot of headwinds.
Reading proficiency in United States schools are 31%. Math proficiency is 22% in twelfth-grade. The pandemic was part of the problem but digital education itself may be a large part of the problem too. The idea of Chromebooks was to reduce costs as textbooks are expensive, need replacement every few years, get damaged and lost and there are storage and distribution costs.
When you have a textbook, the lesson is available to you to do homework. You can look at previous lessons if you are uncertain about earlier material and you can jump ahead in case you learn better with more than one take at a topic. Screens are a big topic of discussion in schools these days.
I am not sold on the quality of instruction delivered to students on Chromebooks. I read about a lot of issues from teachers, students and parents about the learning approach.
Steve Adams
macrumors 68000
Not if school districts buy the computers like they do here. They bought Lenovo Chromebook for all our kids and they are actually decently stout. I think they paid 150 each for them. No way they are going to spend 600 each for a neo.
eltoslightfoot
macrumors 68040
Interesting, our kids are on M1 Macbook Airs in these crazy tank cases. But yes, I think schools will go back to textbooks. It's already happened in some of the Nordic countries.
But in our School District, Neos would save them money.
boswald
macrumors 68030
There's a lot of young people going back to the "old school" technology. I asked a Gen Z why and she said she's sick of everything tracking her.
Steve Adams
macrumors 68000
Yes, if your district doled out airs'. Ours doled out lenovo chromebooks for 150 a piece. My son has one and it it's like a tank. No it's not Al-u-minium, but it will look much better after a drop down a flight of stairs than said Al-u-minium laptop.
Plus Apple is not a thing really in my province. They have one "reseller" in Jump+. Chromebooks and lower cost windows systems are everywhere.
Even if someone does want to go through the pain of installing Linux, or even buying a laptop that comes with Linux preinstalled, most of the apps are just not there -- no MS Office, no tax software, no Proton Drive, no Dropbox, etc. You're either reduced to working through a browser, explore altenative apps, or look at kludgy solutions like VMs.