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Joanna Stern and John Gruber Discuss Apple M1 Transition and 'Craptastic' 720p FaceTime Cameras

I’ll be honest, I thought the image of Gruber looked more than OK from his camera, but I think its ok in decent lighting conditions isn’t it?

When I’m at my desk I do have a 1080 web cam plugged in via my monitor, but I’ll be honest, a camera bump on my laptop life wouldn’t be the end of the world, especially if it had FaceID in it.
 
So many people have been complaining about the 720p camera (that every other laptop has) it's getting ridiculous.

Personally, I don't care; I take my Zoom meetings with the camera off, even if I have tape over all my computer cameras. People do not need to see me to understand what I'm saying. Mics on the other hand...

However, people in their industry that are going to be broadcasting the Zoom video should be using better cameras.

So it'd be nice if Apple can figure out to put a better camera in, but I'm happy with them improving the rest of the computer how they've done so far.

Now that the M1 is out of the way, they can improve other (in my opinion) less important things.
 
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tharitm said:
yeah but aren't they cramming higher res cameras to "thiner" iPhones already? even that tiny front facing camera on the 12 would do.
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Are you kidding? Phones are WAY thicker than a MacBook lid. Imagine closing your MacBook with a 7-8mm lid lol.
 
Theyayarealivin said:
What's so hard about upgrading to 1080HD Camera??? Are they rare or what?
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I would ask a different question: what’s so important about a high def selfie camera? Are there pimples and stubble that people aren’t appreciating? Is there all sorts of wasted bandwidth headroom for video chats? Are people shooting archival videos with a selfie camera? Who cares if John Gruber’s dedicated desktop selfie cam makes for crisper footage of his mug while he does an interview? (hint: not I).

To me this seems like yet another case of spec-itis, just like Hz, and W, and nits, and pixels, and GB, and in this case, p. More is always better, and less is always worse, right? Unless it’s bezels, in which case unless they’re tiny it’s a travesty. Apple gives us a laptop with an SoC a quantum leap better than anything on the planet, and people bitch about the selfie p. *sigh*
 
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Baggy Spandex said:
Grubers camera looking more than acceptable. This woman, and most people, need to relax.
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I totally agree. The camera is more than good enough for any normal usage. If you want to shoot video podcasts og become a youtuber you'll probably want something better, like an external camera, anyway, but - given enough light - this should be fine for any videoconferencing...

If you reed Gruber's full M1 review you'll see that he acknowledges that the camera isn't good, but it's better than it was (through image processing).
 
Darth Tulhu said:
So many people have been complaining about the 720p camera (that every other laptop has) it's getting ridiculous.

Personally, I don't care; I take my Zoom meetings with the camera off, even if I have tape over all my computer cameras. People do not need to see me to understand what I'm saying. Mics on the other hand...

However, people in their industry that are going to be broadcasting the Zoom video should be using better cameras.

So it'd be nice if Apple can figure out to put a better camera in, but I'm happy with them improving the rest of the computer how they've done so far.

Now that the M1 is out of the way, they can improve other (in my opinion) less important things.
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You don't need to see people to understand them but it does help - you might be surprised how much you can take from body language or facial expressions. You're also completely ignoring things like calls with friends or family, where being able to see the people you're calling is actually half the point of the call.
 
sw1tcher said:
Requires too much courage
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maxfromdenmark said:
Probably they cost like 2 bucks more...
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pers0n said:
It’s that extra $2 Tim Cook is willing to give up per device.

He wants to make sure he has a full wave pool with dolphins, lined by gold bricks and live coral with a helicopter holding a diamond studded diving board and won’t settle for less
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Perhaps you tech experts should have a discussion with the laptop sensor/camera engineer in Post #43.
 
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lostczech said:
At the end of the day it may come down to personal preference, but I prefer the higher facial detail than the washed out warm fuzz that the Air produces

I attached some comparisons (Apologies for the thrilled expression on my face)
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That MBA shot is definitely brighter, but it also looks so blurry. Were you moving when it was taken or is that what it looks like all the time?
 
boss.king said:
That MBA shot is definitely brighter, but it also looks so blurry. Were you moving when it was taken or is that what it looks like all the time?
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I promise you it's like that all the time. I even used a microfiber cloth *just in case* I accidentally smudged the camera with my thumb while opening the lid

Edit: Just compare the rings of my ceiling lights. Even those came out a bit blurry
 
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dragoon2745 said:
The camera looks fine and it's better than the previous model. Did the previous model also get the same camera hate to this extent?
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It's been the same quality for a decade ... and now with the new architecture ... people are wanting their new webcam to look better than it did 10 years ago. The lady in this video did a comparison of the 480p 2010 MacBook Pro camera to the latest Intel 720p webcam and it looked better in almost every situation. So something is off with the webcam in these laptops. I get that the M1 has some tricks to make it look better, but they should really put some R&D into the webcam on these things.
 
boss.king said:
You don't need to see people to understand them but it does help - you might be surprised how much you can take from body language or facial expressions. You're also completely ignoring things like calls with friends or family, where being able to see the people you're calling is actually half the point of the call.
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Agreed, but for family that's what the iPhone or iPad cameras are for, I think.

I would like for Apple to improve laptop cameras, sure, but I don't think the indictment is warranted at this time.

Surely, an improvement is coming.
 
It is easy to complain about Apple’s use of old webcams on their MacBooks, but as others have already noted, the bigger issue is usually horrid back lighting. That and the angle of the camera in relation to your face. The typical upward angled camera with your head tilted down to view the screen is just a bad look. People who stack their laptop on a bunch of books or boxes to get them up so that they’re level with their face always look more natural. But not many people go to that length for work Zoom calls.
 
dragoon2745 said:
The camera looks fine and it's better than the previous model. Did the previous model also get the same camera hate to this extent?
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I think older models got some hate too, but what amplifies it these days is everyone's heavy use of teleconferencing (like Zoom). So it's more obvious than before. For me personally, I was hoping that in the 5 years since my 2015 MacBook Pro, they might have improved the camera, not make it worse..

My personal example:
forums.macrumors.com

Joanna Stern and John Gruber Discuss Apple M1 Transition and 'Craptastic' 720p FaceTime Cameras

At the end of the day it may come down to personal preference, but I prefer the higher facial detail than the washed out warm fuzz that the Air produces I attached some comparisons (Apologies for the thrilled expression on my face)
forums.macrumors.com forums.macrumors.com
 
Ravi_MR said:
Well it certainly seems to have improved and good enough for my calls, going by this review:
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Why is the M1 so ridiculously laggy compared to the Intel MacBook? Is that the "optimization" at work? Because it's awful.
 
Darth Tulhu said:
Agreed, but for family that's what the iPhone or iPad cameras are for, I think.

I would like for Apple to improve laptop cameras, sure, but I don't think the indictment is warranted at this time.

Surely, an improvement is coming.
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I mean, I can, but if my wife and I are trying to catch up with family overseas, it's much easier to use a laptop rather than try to prop up a phone or a tablet. It'd just be nice if it wasn't so much worse looking.
 
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