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loby

macrumors 68000
Jul 1, 2010
1,846
1,459
If Apple has to do this marketing stuff, then they are concern about it being a "flop".

Apple watch is not going to happen until they make it an independent product instead of an accessory to the iphone.

Until the watch can work without needing an iphone, then this expensive toy is dead in the water before taking off.

Sure the 20% percent will buy it when it comes out just to buy since it is Apple, but the rest will probably pass on this one...

Has potencial, but in its current technological state...a "dud".
 

iWe

macrumors regular
Jul 18, 2012
152
0
It goes without saying that most of us all miss Steve, your are all stating the obvious, but when you get down to it, is it the products we get excited about, the presenter, or the presentation. And I think we can ALL agree that NOBODY puts on a presentation quite like Apple does, including the press / fashion experts / CREATING A WHOLE NEW BUILDING to perfectly display it's latest masterpiece. For all the new things I've seen Tim do, like present honesty and complete transparency, apologizing when needed (maps), explaining circumstances when people are in doubt (iCloud Nude-Gate), it's just people tend to not want to listen and think they know better. Egos tend to get in the way.
The folks at Apple still know how to put on a presentation alright but without Jobs' reality distorting charisma they're not quite the same anymore.
 

Pilgrim1099

Suspended
Apr 30, 2008
1,109
602
From the Midwest to the Northeast
The folks at Apple still know how to put on a presentation alright but without Jobs' reality distorting charisma they're not quite the same anymore.


That's very true. No matter how smooth they tried to be on the keynote presentations, one can notice a bit of stumbling or pause here and there.

There is only one man who's got that gift of presentation and that's Craig Federighi. Cook's presentation disturbs me and how he quoted about journalist stating that Android is a "hell stew of viruses" and then all of a sudden, iOS 8 had issues during the upgrade phase. There's some double standard going in here and using scare tactics to frighten people into buying iPhones based on Android phones' instability is not right, especially if the NSA can easily break into any phone including Apple's, no matter how secure they claim to be.

If Apple thinks their phones are the most secure, they need to think twice. The government sector will always have a way around it.

----------

Oh and by the way, this post was a bit off topic however but it had to be said.
 

bigpics

macrumors 6502
Jul 26, 2002
287
48
Rockland County, New York
They're really trying to force this on the fashion crowd.

"Force"? I think not. It looks like they're trying to just make it look acceptable.

There-I-fixed-it-for-you Dep't: "Foist" is the word that fits... ...and there's no end of egocentric, insecure narcissist types out there ready (almost begging) to be plucked....

The fact that they are pushing this as a fashion piece is a turn-off. It also lets you know what their take on the demographics of Apple gear users are. No longer is the focus on "Think Different". People are trying to fit in.

Lots of users I know choose Apple gear at least mostly because it's... ...Apple gear... ...trendy and safe for their demographic (and some who don't because they're in PC/Android bastions where they face derision for showing up with a precious Ives design).

Fashion's a funny thing. Trends. Tribes. Flags. Gang signs.
 

wigby

macrumors 68030
Jun 7, 2007
2,782
2,767
Everything that comes out of this guy's mouth is fancified gobbledegook. He totally trashed the iOS UI, and now he thinks he's done something special with watches. He's the equivalent of a pop star or teen actress who became a superstar and is completely out of touch with reality. He's a zillionaire with a crowd of fans following him around, fostering his delusion that nothing he does is imperfect in any way.

What are you talking about? He's been with Apple for nearly 20 years and is responsible for iMac, iPhone, iPad among other hits. You might not like his sense of hardware and software design but Jobs loved it and so does Cook. I guess when you finally get your turn as Apple CEO we can expect big changes :rolleyes:

----------

Let's hope so...and there'll be an option to switch off that feature alltogether!

If you're receiving unwanted heartbeats from people in your close friends and family list, you've got more problems than an Apple Watch in your life.
 

baryon

macrumors 68040
Oct 3, 2009
3,885
2,945
I do see the benefit of having information displayed on your wrist. Why did watched end up on our wrist instead of in our pockets? Reaching into your pocket to check the time on your phone is too much of a hassle for something as small as checking the time or whether you got a Facebook like.

If you're nervous and waiting for your date, you may end up checking the time or your emails every 10 seconds, it looks silly to reach into your pocket every time. It's handy to be able to just glance at your wrist.

I don't think the iWatch is as important as the smartphone: if you don't have one, you won't be missing out on too many things. If you don't have a smartphone, you're missing out on a LOT of things. But maybe some people have extra money and people already liked to spend lots of cash on expensive watches that basically are just pretty things that display the current time - needlessly expensive but people loved them. This may work well for those people.
 

wigby

macrumors 68030
Jun 7, 2007
2,782
2,767
The major fault with the apple-watch is that it is a part device, it needs to be tethered to the iphone, so for many this is a problem, you might not have an iphone, so the apple watch is pretty much a paperweight!!

This to me is a massive blunder, to render a device inert or non functional without the related phone is a mistake, yet there seems to be no word or discussion in this regard.

It should work without having any need for the iphone, yes I know it can, only a very few apps on the apple watch will work, defeating the point to a 6 hour watch, which after 90 days of heavy use, this is what the battery will be like... I have owned many devices that start out with long life batteries, and within a very short time they wear out as I use the device a lot, with the apple watch, this will be the same.

What Apple should do is with the Apple Watch, in the same box, a free iphone and a boatload of battery boosters, that gives at least 60 hours battery life!!

You're complaining about the battery life of the Apple Watch while also complaining that it should be a standalone device? Do you realize that if you wanted a smart watch to do anything besides tell the time and still get a full day of battery life you need a phone to work with it? How do you expect to get texts, emails, notifications, connected apps, phone calls, GPS, anything from iCloud without a phone???

Sure Apple is forsaking at least half of the smart watch buying market but let's face it, the Android users were never going to shell out $350-$500 for a smart watch anyway. They made that clear by buying into Android. So Apple is just targeting 500 million iPhone users worldwide. I think they'll be OK.

----------

I am a huge apple fan and always the first to stick up for them and their products.

But this time, i just don't see it. I was one of the first to own a pebble which i wore for about a week and then never wore again because getting notifications on your wrist is just not something i really NEED or care about very much and it took for me to actually buy one to realise that.

What i DO care about is my health. I expected the Applewatch to wow us with an amazing array of sensors to track all sorts of bodily functions and give a true indication of our overall health. Instead, it has a heart rate sensor (Oh WOW) and an activity monitor. REALLY? That's it? With all the billions of dollars in R&D that is the best they could come up with? All the other features just seem gimmicky to me. They seem to have taken a page out of samsung's book. I can't speak for other people but I will NEVER be typing emails or responding to texts from my wrist. That is just ridiculous and you WILL look ridiculous doing it. I really do think this product is going to flop. I hope they prove me wrong but it does absolutely nothing special. Design and craftsmanship will only get you so far.

They don't have a lot of sensors now but will you buy an Apple Watch next year when they add a lot more sensors? The first iPhone had no apps, GPS or ability to shoot video and look at it now. Apple made a bold step in a different direction from any smart watch maker. It might not play off as big as iPhone but then again, it might eclipse the iPhone altogether.
 

wigby

macrumors 68030
Jun 7, 2007
2,782
2,767
ugly, bulky, expensive, and does nothing. To all that say people buy expensive watches, yup, they do, and 30 years later they are still working.

1 year later this watch will have half the battery life. 2 years later it's model will be outdated. 3 years later its ios won't be supported. I'm eager to say it'll flop but there are a bunch of idiots out there that'll buy. I think it'll do decent but far less then what Apple hoped.

Why are you comparing this to an expensive watch that does one thing? Why not compare it to a cellphone that does many things, is priced similarly, becomes obsolete in a few years and is then replaced by a new one. Sounds like Apple has another iPhone on their hands if you ask me.
 

kdarling

macrumors P6
Sure Apple is forsaking at least half of the smart watch buying market but let's face it, the Android users were never going to shell out $350-$500 for a smart watch anyway. They made that clear by buying into Android.

That's like saying, "iPhone users were never going to shell out $350-$500 for an iPad anyway. They made that clear by mostly only buying the iPhone under subsidy for an upfront cost of free to $200."

Since subsidized sales are not a good indicator, perhaps we could compare watch sales more to tablet sales. Except that tablets have a pretty long lifetime compared to smartphones (as we've seen from slowing tablet sales).

Plus a lot of iPads were sold to people without iPhones.

Hmm. So there might not be a direct comparison available yet. Thoughts?

So Apple is just targeting 500 million iPhone users worldwide. I think they'll be OK.

500 million is how many have been sold since 2007.

Currently there are about 1.5 billion smartphone subscribers, of which 12% use iPhones.

So they would be targeting the current 180 million iPhone users worldwide.

Still a lot, of course, but how many of those can afford (and/or will pay for) a $350+ watch that could be out of date in a couple of years?

I wonder if Apple will set up subsidized phone+watch combinations at carriers?
 

Tech198

Cancelled
Mar 21, 2011
15,915
2,151
Johny, its a watch.... weather dumb, or smart-watches... its just does more things..

We get it, the design it great..... now get back to work. I wanna see that new Mac Mini, front, and center.
 

Col4bin

macrumors 68000
Oct 2, 2011
1,908
1,602
El Segundo
Don't forget, the iPhone started at $600 (WITH contract) and you needed $499 to get the cheapest iPad. Now, they're 40-60% cheaper ($199 and $299 respectively), and 20x more powerful.

Yes, but the busniess model for a fashion wearable piece is MUCH different than Apple's typical tech products. They are not the same, no matter what Apple claims. I don't think Apple can blur the lines between the two, but we'll see...
 

wigby

macrumors 68030
Jun 7, 2007
2,782
2,767
That's like saying, "iPhone users were never going to shell out $350-$500 for an iPad anyway. They made that clear by mostly only buying the iPhone under subsidy for an upfront cost of free to $200."

Since subsidized sales are not a good indicator, perhaps we could compare watch sales more to tablet sales. Except that tablets have a pretty long lifetime compared to smartphones (as we've seen from slowing tablet sales).

Plus a lot of iPads were sold to people without iPhones.

Hmm. So there might not be a direct comparison available yet. Thoughts?



500 million is how many have been sold since 2007.

Currently there are about 1.5 billion smartphone subscribers, of which 12% use iPhones.

So they would be targeting the current 180 million iPhone users worldwide.

Still a lot, of course, but how many of those can afford (and/or will pay for) a $350+ watch that could be out of date in a couple of years?

I wonder if Apple will set up subsidized phone+watch combinations at carriers?

Not sure what you mean about iPad. I was speaking more to Android customers and their low spending habits. Sure they'll consider a $200 smart watch but Apple Watch was always going to price them out of the market anyway so that's not a sale Apple is losing because they are only focusing on iOS users.

As far as 500 million, you're right, I guess I'm exaggerating best case scenario a bit. But just think of the expected 50 iPhone purchases in the U.S. alone by year's end. Then throw in the 20-30 million expected from China. That's a lot of excited consumers looking to pair the Apple Watch with their new iPhone in early 2015. Conservative estimates put Apple Watch at 10 million sales in 2015. That overshadows all Android smart watches combined by a factor of several times.

I was just thinking that an iPhone+Apple Watch bundle would be a great promotion in stores. If they even just shaved off $50 for that purchase, many people would jump on it. It's not Apple's style to bundle items for discounts but this is a new Apple now that probably wouldn't have done an Apple Watch like this just a few years ago. Anything can happen.
 

amirite

macrumors 6502a
Aug 17, 2009
880
691
If Apple has to do this marketing stuff, then they are concern about it being a "flop"..

Yeah! If it were good enough it would sell well on word of mouth alone, like their other products!

...what?
 

hipnetic

macrumors 65816
Oct 5, 2010
1,267
562
What are you talking about? He's been with Apple for nearly 20 years and is responsible for iMac, iPhone, iPad among other hits. You might not like his sense of hardware and software design but Jobs loved it and so does Cook. I guess when you finally get your turn as Apple CEO we can expect big changes :roll eyes:
I love my MacBook. I appreciate his sense of style for hardware design, though interestingly enough, I don't find the Apple Watch to be particularly attractive. My main complaint with Ive is with what he's done now that he's been put in charge of the user interfaces of IOS and OSX. Jobs didn't put him in charge of those areas. Jobs put Scott Forstall in charge of those areas.

But it's the fact that he's butchered the UI yet talks as though everything he does is perfection that I find particularly annoying.
 

wigby

macrumors 68030
Jun 7, 2007
2,782
2,767
I love my MacBook. I appreciate his sense of style for hardware design, though interestingly enough, I don't find the Apple Watch to be particularly attractive. My main complaint with Ive is with what he's done now that he's been put in charge of the user interfaces of IOS and OSX. Jobs didn't put him in charge of those areas. Jobs put Scott Forstall in charge of those areas.

But it's the fact that he's butchered the UI yet talks as though everything he does is perfection that I find particularly annoying.

Fair enough but I think your complaints say more about general change than any particular change. Every few product cycles there must be change for change's sake. This happened under Jobs and will continue to happen under anyone who runs Apple. It take a few minutes for some users to adjust while some other users never adjust. It's rarely ever because the changes themselves were that bad. Remember, Apple is a few years ahead of all of us in terms of UI and hardware so when they add a swipe from left to right gesture to go back, for instance, it seems weird at first and suddenly makes sense now that the screen sizes have caught up to that design language.
 

jamesryanbell

macrumors 68020
Mar 17, 2009
2,171
93
Good to know nobody knows anyome with health issues that others might be interested in keeping track of....

The idea that such a feature serves no utility is born out of pure ignorance.

Sending your heartbeat to someone else across the room is a gimmick. I'm not talking about a medical reason, and neither were they when they presented it. It's not ignorant at all.
 

inscrewtable

macrumors 68000
Oct 9, 2010
1,656
402
'creepy'?

Almost as soon as the watch was announced a lot of people on various forums singled out the heartbeat wrist tap thing to try and name it as 'creepy', as if it Apple would make it so that anyone could get unsolicited taps from strangers.

It must be obvious to blind freddy that in order for this to work there would have to be a handshake of some kind to set it up. In which case if one has already given permission to be tapped by someone then it cannot be called 'creepy' and all that that word implies.

It's like people are busting their balls to denigrate this object with any sort of outlandish vitriol.
 

kerosene

macrumors regular
Oct 13, 2008
108
4
I also didn't like this feature but Apple helped explain. Imagine you gave her this watch and she sent you her heartbeat...would be cute and intimate. Your work colleague agreeing on having a sushi lunch with you, not so much :D

instagramliuwen.jpg
 

Mildredop

macrumors 68020
Oct 14, 2013
2,478
1,510
a bit too nerdy

This sums up why I don't think the Apple watch will be a success. It'll just be a target for ridicule.

I traditional watch with the ability to vibrate and display a couple of symbols telling me I have missed a call/text/email is the only sort of smart watch I personally would consider.
 

Chupa Chupa

macrumors G5
Jul 16, 2002
14,835
7,396
You dictate what another poster meant, do you? Interesting technique, you must win a lot of arguments that way.


Dictate? Ha. No. It's call inferring meaning and its used by everyone with a functioning brain. The OP was using the word pejoratively, not as an observational descriptions. If my inference is incorrect then please diagram the statement for me to show me where I am wrong. You presenting a dictionary definition of the word, but didn't show any context to how OP used the word in the manner you state he was doing so.
 

mazz0

macrumors 68040
Mar 23, 2011
3,171
3,630
Leeds, UK
Dictate? Ha. No. It's call inferring meaning and its used by everyone with a functioning brain. The OP was using the word pejoratively, not as an observational descriptions. If my inference is incorrect then please diagram the statement for me to show me where I am wrong. You presenting a dictionary definition of the word, but didn't show any context to how OP used the word in the manner you state he was doing so.

Your inference of what the OP meant may well be correct (indeed, I believe I share your interpretation), but it's not what he said. There's no definition of the word novelty by which the described item has to be useless.

My interpretation is that he meant it's a gimmick, which again doesn't mean it has no value - it merely reflects the intent behind it: it's added to attract attention, often to distract from a lack of real features, but if it happens to add real value as well then that's fine: it doesn't stop it being a gimmick (or a novelty).
 

iososx

macrumors 6502a
Aug 23, 2014
859
6
USA
No wonder the refresh of the iPhone was rather dull and featureless in style. J. Ive is too busy with his celebrity appearances, interviews and such. Thereby preventing him from doing any significant design work.

Yet that's the good news and proves he hasn't lost his touch, he simply hadn't had time to engage with members of the design team.
 
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