Jony Ive Pushing for 'Flat Design' in iOS 7 Amid Greater Hardware-Software Design Collaboration

[stockscalper]

Rather then matching Microsoft's and Google's flattening of UI why not come out with something innovative.

Yes I agree glassy establishments are outdated, but hell Apple caused the trend to glassify everything.

I think Apple has lost its cool if it going to start following design trends initiated by Microsoft of all companies.

If all iOS7 is going to offer is flat icons with rounded corners, its game over for Apple.

It's been game over for a long time. Fanboys and Apple just haven't gotten the memo yet. Must be using Apple Mail.

 

[RenoG]

I sure hope not. Every time I am sitting beside one of my co-workers when they have their Android phones out, I notice two things immediately. The over-saturated cartoon like colors and the just plain "ugliness" of the whole thing. Nearly every screen is just horrid. Yea I know this image is of a Windows Phone fooled around with an iPhone look but the same applies. Fugly!

Yup this is exactly what kept me from trying out android, it looked like my old Samsung solstice UI just clearer with fancy movements....

I just hope that apple, while using the flat design at the very least give it to us in 2D (layered in sorts) - shadows.. It doesn't have to be all generic...

 

[Bytor65]

Ive is pushing a more "flat design"...

I despise flat interface design. It is boring, and makes things harder to pick out. Is Linux going to be my only refuge from this lame trend?

 

[adder7712]

Yup this is exactly what kept me from trying out android, it looked like my old Samsung solstice UI just clearer with fancy movements....

I just hope that apple, while using the flat design at the very least give it to us in 2D (layered in sorts) - shadows.. It doesn't have to be all generic...

Then both of you have never used any Android phone, just observations from a distance.

It also depends on the phone, Samsungs AMOLED screens are known to oversaturate colours. HTC's screens have more realistic colour reproduction.

 

[Neodym]

Maybe leave the design to Apple. They seem to be doing alright so far.

They're not - and they know it! They know it so well they even feel compelled to ride cheap attacks against the competition.

Next you'll be expecting a eye-sensor on there, just like in the new Android phone, which is just gimmicky rubbish.

*Yawn* - this is getting so old! If it's not from Apple, it's "just gimmicky rubbish"...

I think because Apple product are used by designers and creatives, everyone seems to have an opinion on where these products should be going.

If only they would go anywhere instead of standing still! As i wrote i'm no educated designer myself and my post was only an answer to Rogifan's request to demonstrate that i'm not simply bitching, but can also point out the problem(s) from my POV.

Reliability mixed with solid design and technology wins in the end.

You forgot to include continuing innovation and a good price/performance ratio. Starting to rest on one's laurels has never been a good idea. A company always has to justify charging premium prices for its products - and this does not work without (a sufficient amount of) innovation.

 

[-hh]

Just exactly WHERE did Ivy do a good job????

Mighty Mouse = Total Disaster Scroll Wheel
Magic Mouse = Diaster to work with
Retina Mac Book Pro = Cant use Bluetooth along with WIFI
iPhone = Antenna Problems

This guy is a disaster waiting to happen. And IS going to contribute to Apple's decline in quality... Most Pros are LEAVING Apple and OS X --

Ivy is obsessed with beauty in Hardware.... And his beauty in Hardware IMO is second, third, fourth to NONE..... But functionality HAS to be a part of the equation. Ivy's design is ONLY beautiful... Functionality is a catastrophe.

I see where you're going, and while others have disagreed, I will agree.

Yes, it is really nice to have a 'beautiful' design, but it doesn't really matter how pretty it is if you can't be productive with it...and preferably, more productive.

Similarly, just how much is the 'Beauty Tax' going to cost us? And is it merely just the retail price tag, or does it whack usability/productivity too? (shades of the iMac's thinness mantra and CPU overheating).

Sure, we consumers will generally be willing to pay more for something that's also pretty, but all consumers will have a limit (YMMV) for just how much more they're willing to pay for such asthetic embellishments.


For example, consider on the eye-tracking system in Android that was mentioned:

Provided it does what it's supposed to do and does it well, how is it gimmicky rubbish?

Historically, eye-tracking systems have had a mixed record. Canon tried some on their higher-end SLR cameras awhile back ... and a simple pair of dark sunglasses (didn't even have to be perscription ... or mirrors) was enough to cause a capability failure.

Thus, for this technology, there's going to be some consumer use cases which will have (close to) 100% failure rates of this feature...hopefully, the rest of the design will be failure tolerant by having an easy/obvious means of recovering from the embellishment failing to work as originally intended.

You know what else sounds like gimmicky rubbish when you first hear about it? Bouncy screens. You know, scrolling to the bottom of a page on a touchscreen device, and having it scroll up and snap back instead of stopping dead when you get to the end. That sounds dumb as hell, but it works great.

Ultimately, we're going to have to wait and see just what the end product is of this entire discussion. It might be great/clever/etc, or it very well might not. Hopefully, Apple will be able to recognize if it is a failure and resist the temptation of pushing an inferior product out the door - - time will tell.



-hh

 

[RenoG]

Then both of you have never used any Android phone, just observations from a distance.

It also depends on the phone, Samsungs AMOLED screens are known to oversaturate colours. HTC's screens have more realistic colour reproduction.

No I seriously considered an android phone and spent some time on them. (Mostly the galaxy S III) and I just didn't care for the UI the use of all that dark background just seemed dated to me hence it took me back to a 2008-10 Samsung phone. However I really like the windows 8 Nokia phone, it just didn't fit my needs.

 

[Manderby]

Vectors have been around for so long, I find it strange why they were never introduced into today's OS's.

They are. Quartz is PDF which is PS which is Vectors.

Vectors are also small in filesize.

Depends on the content. They can be rather big.

Because of the small filesize, vectors can render faster too.

No. Wrong. Any Vectorfile of any size (even with zero Bytes) takes longer than a bitmap. Because the computer needs to render the vectors to a bitmap in order to display it.

Most app icons, logos etc. these days are created with vectors (and exported to bitmap)

I see about 60% Renderings, 30% bitmaps and only maybe 10% vectors.

It also makes sense to make everything vector because they won't need to worry about upscaling UI elements for whatever size or ratio screen the OS has to deal with. Vectors will scale to any size or shape.

Unfortunaltey, vectors will also scale to non-integer pixel coordinates. Which results in anything being blurred.

Using vectors will also make designers/developers 'smarter'. If Apple forces them to, developers and designers will need to pick up Adobe Illustrator or some other vector editing app for graphics. It's shocking to me how many designers out there have not discovered vectors.

Designers know vectors. Both the advantages and the disadvantages. The reason why you are shocked is that there are a lot of disadvantages which is why a lot of designers will not use them for the final icons.

 

[wankey]

Yeah, you're right, iMacs, iPods, iPhone, iP3G,4S, iPhone 5... Such disasters...
How about ipads, form ove function, right? Oh wait..

Macbook air.... Oh so big disaster, that every other company tries to copy.

I saw only 2 issues: mice and iphone 4 antennagate, but other then that is great.

And I will fix one more thing for you. General public doesnt give a ***** about Pros leaving Apple. Deal with it.
Meanwhile you can switch to WP8, where you experience things like random reboots or surfing over cellular data while connected on your Wifi.

iPhone 4 antenna gate isn't even an issue until someone brought it up. I still use my iPhone 4 and it's perfectly fine for every day use.

 

[aristotle]

If I wanted a flat UI, I would be using a windows phone and windows 8. Just google/bing for usability issues with metro and you will see that flat UIs are a usability nightmare. I hate flat.

If Ive ruins the UI, I will go to the nearest hardware store, buy and axe and chop my expensive Retina MBP, iPad 3 and iPhone 4S to pieces while someone films it with another camera. At the end of the video, I will use a bunch of expletives directed at Ive and then I will send a link of the video to his email address as well as other execs at Apple.

With a flat UI like metro, you cannot tell what is a button and what is the background.

 

[misterquin]

"Overall, they expect any changes to be pretty conservative."

Firstly, I don't know who they are, but this would upset me greatly. Jony Ives is a brilliant man. When OS X Tiger was first unveiled to replace 10.3 it was significant in it's changes. There wasn't anything flashy and there was nothing that could confuse users added, but the idea behind OS X evolved visually and functionally.

Ive is capable of BRILLIANT things and I hope that the changes he implements into iOS 7 are significant ones. I don't want an update like the ones we've seen thus far, all of which have been incremental and minimal and almost insignificant sometimes.

Of course, it will remain intuitive as it always has, but knowing that Jonathan Ive is responsible for it's design, I expect an overhaul. I expect features that should have been there to finally be integrated. But most importantly, it needs to look better. And I can't think of anyone in the world more capable of designing things that are simultaneously gorgeous, functional, and intuitive, than Sir Jony Ive.

Now I expect a bunch of backlash for saying all this- for some reason people always respond with an "if it ain't broke don't fix it" sorta mentality when it comes to iOS. But that's been Apple's approach for too long. It is broke. And Mr. Ive will prove that when he "fixes" it.

 

[Bako-MacAddict]

Will see what happens. I hope they change the UI

 

[iHelper]

Jony has been legendary with his vision and work. There's no doubt in my mind he will promote anything but a simple and beautiful UI.

 

[johnhw]

History is repeating itself all over again. I expect iOS 7 to be a vast improvement over iOS 6. Just like how System 7 was an improvement over System 6.

 

[Manderby]

I personally get confused when there are too many icons. I am faster with reading. So I did a quick photoshop. If the icons would be less 3D, I could see something like this (maybe with a different color):

 

[Rogifan]

Firstly, I don't know who they are, but this would upset me greatly. Jony Ives is a brilliant man. When OS X Tiger was first unveiled to replace 10.3 it was significant in it's changes. There wasn't anything flashy and there was nothing that could confuse users added, but the idea behind OS X evolved visually and functionally.

Ive is capable of BRILLIANT things and I hope that the changes he implements into iOS 7 are significant ones. I don't want an update like the ones we've seen thus far, all of which have been incremental and minimal and almost insignificant sometimes.

Of course, it will remain intuitive as it always has, but knowing that Jonathan Ive is responsible for it's design, I expect an overhaul. I expect features that should have been there to finally be integrated. But most importantly, it needs to look better. And I can't think of anyone in the world more capable of designing things that are simultaneously gorgeous, functional, and intuitive, than Sir Jony Ive.

Now I expect a bunch of backlash for saying all this- for some reason people always respond with an "if it ain't broke don't fix it" sorta mentality when it comes to iOS. But that's been Apple's approach for too long. It is broke. And Mr. Ive will prove that when he "fixes" it.

My guess is Apple doesn't want a Windows 8 situation on their hands so they'll go slow rather than a major overhaul all at once. Plus how do we know that Forstall's lieutenants are on the same page as Ive? I'm assuming these guys weren't just taking orders from Forstall/Jobs. Ive might need more time to convince them the kitsch needs to go.

 

[Mystic386]

UI design is very different. If you look on sites like deviantart there are many great looking concepts, themes and all kinds of tweaks, but when you actaully try to use them they are not so good.

That's the difference with UI design. If it looks good doesn't mean it works good.

For example in my opinion Google Maps iOS app is a failure design wise. I hope Apple is not working in this direction.

UI Design and graphical images are interlinked and both are important. Often this means two different people.

This would be akin to saying a good cartoon needs a good artist and someone else arguing the artist is not important you need a good story teller. Actually you need both.

If you listen to SJI (Sir Jonathon Ive) when he talks in either quoted text or video you get the idea this guy understands design at a core level.

You can have an engineer build a computer and it will work. Get a designer involved and you end up with a product people can love.

We may just have to agree that we see things differently.

 

[kristoffer4]

Jony Ive Pushing for 'Flat Design' in iOS 7 Amid Greater Hardware-Software De...

I can't wait to see this! But I doubt we will see anything big before ios 8.

Ios needs it to seperate itself and for going forward.
More simple and less skeumorphic would be nice.
When I hear "flat" I think something like "Letterpress" for ios.

 

[naeS1Sean]

Agreed

Of course he is incredible. He's British.

----------

Your right. Sad...

Because 90% of the people complaining hate Apple and are here just to pick on iFans.

----------

I...like it...

Flat Design.

 

[thekeyring]

Fortunately for us the majority of the human race doesn't see it that way. Otherwise we would be using sticks to cook pieces of meat over an open fire. It worked, why invent the spit, or cooking pot, or oven? Why domesticate horses or oxen since our legs work quite well. Or why invent the plow since one can till the ground by hand?

Innovation and progress is a human trait. Sometimes it doesn't work out but most times life gets a bit easier and better. Who knows what Apple will come up with. Some will undoubtedly hate it, some will love it. Most will simply accept it.

So you need to ask yourself, exactly where in the world of innovation and progress would you like to stop? Find that point for yourself then simply opt out
of further changes. Leave the rest to enjoy the progress. Win-win

Yes, but the steering wheel, once invented, has never been replaced. Some things don't need to change, especially just for the sake of change. If apple make some genuinely better - great, but I'm in no rush to see things change unless someone comes up with a good idea.

 

[donnaw]

Yes, but the steering wheel, once invented, has never been replaced. Some things don't need to change, especially just for the sake of change. If apple make some genuinely better - great, but I'm in no rush to see things change unless someone comes up with a good idea.

Please note that my post was in response to the statement of 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it'. If society lived by that premise no progress would ever be made.

As I stated before, whatever changes Apple comes up with will excite some, some will hate it, and most will simply accept it. For some it will be seen as progress and improvement. For some, not so much. But I highly doubt it will be a 'change for the simple purpose of change.' Software development just doesn't work that way. And Apple has no track record of 'change for the sake of change'.

People need to stop getting their panties in a wad over this. Deciding you will hate it before even knowing what they have in mind is just ridiculous. In fact, nobody even understands exactly what is meant by 'flattening'. Most are speaking of icons, etc. I believe it is more of a different menu structure since that is the usual term when designing software and the goal is limiting the number of layers involved in order to actually get to an action.

Apple will do whatever they want.

 

[donnaw]

If I wanted a flat UI, I would be using a windows phone and windows 8. Just google/bing for usability issues with metro and you will see that flat UIs are a usability nightmare. I hate flat.

If Ive ruins the UI, I will go to the nearest hardware store, buy and axe and chop my expensive Retina MBP, iPad 3 and iPhone 4S to pieces while someone films it with another camera. At the end of the video, I will use a bunch of expletives directed at Ive and then I will send a link of the video to his email address as well as other execs at Apple.

With a flat UI like metro, you cannot tell what is a button and what is the background.

Hmm, I happen to have a Nokia 920 running WP8 and I disagree. To be honest the flat look of the tiles has absolutely nothing to do with the functionality of the OS. I also have a couple of PCs running Windows 8. One is a standard laptop without a touch screen and one happens to be a touch screen tablet. While some people have issues with the metro tiles on a non-touch device it's quite easy to revert to a standard UI.

MS could just as easily made the tiles 'look' rounded and 3-D. The functionality could be the same. Don't confuse the 'look' with functionality. If you wish to dislike both, fine. But they are vastly different issues.

Oh, and just where do you get 'With a flat UI like metro, you cannot tell what is a button and what is the background'? It's virtually impossible to NOT see the tile as a separate entity.

 

[Rogifan]

Please note that my post was in response to the statement of 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it'. If society lived by that premise no progress would ever be made.

As I stated before, whatever changes Apple comes up with will excite some, some will hate it, and most will simply accept it. For some it will be seen as progress and improvement. For some, not so much. But I highly doubt it will be a 'change for the simple purpose of change.' Software development just doesn't work that way. And Apple has no track record of 'change for the sake of change'.

People need to stop getting their panties in a wad over this. Deciding you will hate it before even knowing what they have in mind is just ridiculous. In fact, nobody even understands exactly what is meant by 'flattening'. Most are speaking of icons, etc. I believe it is more of a different menu structure since that is the usual term when designing software and the goal is limiting the number of layers involved in order to actually get to an action.

Apple will do whatever they want.

I'm curious...has anyone ever heard Ive use the word "flat" or say he likes "flat" UI design? Removing ugly doesn't = "flat" or copying Windows metro style. There's plenty of Windows that is quite ugly IMO.

Sure you can probably find examples that aren't ugly but it shows that "flat" in and of itself isn't necessarily better. And the iOS podcasts app looks a lot better but I wouldn't call the design "flat". My guess is rounded corners aren't going anywhere in iOS.

 

[lordofthereef]

I'm curious...has anyone ever heard Ive use the word "flat" or say he likes "flat" UI design? Removing ugly doesn't = "flat" or copying Windows metro style. There's plenty of Windows that is quite ugly IMO.

Sure you can probably find examples that aren't ugly but it shows that "flat" in and of itself isn't necessarily better. And the iOS podcasts app looks a lot better but I wouldn't call the design "flat". My guess is rounded corners aren't going anywhere in iOS.

I assume those are examples of what you consider ugly? To each his own I guess. I don't find iOS or wp8 to be ugly, just different looks/means to achieve the same basic end goal. I still find windows tiles to be marginally better than iOS in that they can display information (more than "you have x number of alerts in this app"), but even that can and should be worked on IMO. It's not ubiquitous thought the os and apps, even those that are preloaded.

 

[dazed]

I'm curious...has anyone ever heard Ive use the word "flat" or say he likes "flat" UI design? Removing ugly doesn't = "flat" or copying Windows metro style. There's plenty of Windows that is quite ugly IMO.

Sure you can probably find examples that aren't ugly but it shows that "flat" in and of itself isn't necessarily better. And the iOS podcasts app looks a lot better but I wouldn't call the design "flat". My guess is rounded corners aren't going anywhere in iOS.

I quite like some of those windows 8 phone images. The idea of live tiles is something that has to happen in ios.

I'm not saying it has to copy win 8, but for crying out loud the icon for the weather app doesn't even update.