Jony Ive's Design Team Nixed Apple Watch Band With Sensors

[0098386]

I'm starting to wonder if Apple's supposed "user experience is king" motto is just marketing for us. Because how can they say "good enough is not good enough" and yet bring us slow Smartwatches, phone batteries that last a day if you don't use them, iOS 10's music app, a mouse that isn't ergonomic, a laptop with one port. Those things aren't good enough and yet are easily fixed (as proved by other manufacturers, or even Apple themselves).

 

[44267547]

Your sarcasm meter needs a recharge

Disregard my first post. You replied to Rogifan. For whatever reason, it was not showing the second portion of the post. My mistake. Sorry.

 

[mcdspncr]

So - form over function. Got it.

It sounds to me like rather than compromise on form or function, they pushed the engineers to improve the quality of top-of-the-wrist sensors to bring them in line with older reliable bottom-of-the-wrist sensors. Maybe that's why they put a pulse-ox into the watch rather than just traditional IR? I find the current HR sensor very accurate for my purposes, even when worn semi-loose. Rather than just accepting the pretense that accurate measurement required the sensors in the bottom, the refusal to compromise on the user experience forced creative solutions. We need more of this mentality. Or you could just bash them for not taking the easy way out right?

 

[RiddlaBronc]

Why dont they design a band with sensors built in them? No one is going to force anyone to buy it except those people who are really interested in all that health related stuff. That will allow people to swap it out when the ocassion arises.

Heck the band does not have to look pretty as long as its functional. It may even have a seperate battery if needed

 

[Ronlap]

Because I am so clumsy I usually wear my watches on the inside of my wrist so that I don't clobber the crystal. The Apple Watch manual says that the heart rate monitoring wouldn't be as accurate if worn on the inside, but based on the designer's comments it sounds like it should be more accurate. Hmmm....

 

[AppleFan91]

While the popular thing will be to chastise Apple for worrying about the "fashionable" watchbands, having sensors in the bands would quickly spike the prices of them and they are already rather high. As fun as it is to criticize Apple, I actually agree with their decision on this. They wanted to make a watch first and add features from there, not shrink an iPhone and try to fit it around a wrist. Samsung tried that route and no one wanted it on their wrists because it was not a watch, but a phone.

 

[S.B.G]

Just imagine how much more expensive the watch bands would be if they did have sensors in them.

 

[brendu]

I'm starting to wonder if Apple's supposed "user experience is king" motto is just marketing for us. Because how can they say "good enough is not good enough" and yet bring us slow Smartwatches, phone batteries that last a day if you don't use them, iOS 10's music app, a mouse that isn't ergonomic, a laptop with one port. Those things aren't good enough and yet are easily fixed (as proved by other manufacturers, or even Apple themselves).

Agree with you on all of it except iOS 10 music. I think it's great. Much better than the previous Apple Music. I use music almost exclusively in my car and I use it in my car a lot. Having the bigger fonts has been quite the welcome change.

 

[AppleFan91]

Because I am so clumsy I usually wear my watches on the inside of my wrist so that I don't clobber the crystal. The Apple Watch manual says that the heart rate monitoring wouldn't be as accurate if worn on the inside, but based on the designer's comments it sounds like it should be more accurate. Hmmm....

It *should* always be more accurate to detect heart rate on the bottom of the wrist, however in this case, perhaps Apple changed their sensor somehow so that it would be accurate on the top of the wrist which consequently causes it to be less accurate on the bottom of it. I obviously don't know, but that's where my guess would start.

 

[IJ Reilly]

WRONG!!!

Engineering is what you put in, and 'design' is how you make us give our right kidney to own it.

You say I am wrong, then essentially make my point. The engineering approach to design is to shoehorn in every feature that they can make work in the time before the product ships. Design means only including the features that work well. Apple has always been highly selective about the features they include and those they don't, and the latter is what the geeks are always complaining about, especially when that feature shows up in a later version of the product.

 

[jscooper22]

Jobs once said "Design is not just what it looks like and feels like. Design is how it works." If they sacrifice functionality for design ... and only for design ... it's a mistake. Anybody can make something that looks good (well, I can't, but a lot of people can), but Apple's strength had been technology that looked good, but worked amazingly.

 

[citysnaps]

So we want to get into health and fitness but lets go for fashion over function. Okay makes sense to me. You're wearing it wrong people. Apple says one thing publicly then they contradict themselves.
I understand the cost factor with bands but don't say you're concerned about health and fitness tracking then half ass it because of fashion.

I don't think it makes sense to you at all. Fashion over function? You're wearing it wrong people?

Some people want a watch that speaks to fashion. Some people want a watch for fitness. Why can't you have both? Not going the distance with respect to excellent engineering results in an either/or inferior product.

I use my watch daily for fitness. The heart rate sensor is extremely accurate and not fussy on how its positioned. I also have two watch bands I like to switch between. And will buy another one or two.

Apple came through with a superior product because they spent time sweating the details.

 

[Zirel]

I'm confident Apple decided to go with an emphasis on fashion to grab the "trend setters" to normalize wearables as the first rollout phase for what the Watch is going to become. Without fashion, it's incredibly hard to get normal consumers on board with the idea. Now that it's getting out there, the tech aspect can really kick in.

Smart watches had the stigma of calculator watches a few years ago (and given some of the horrible designs I can see why).

I don't care a lot about fashion, but it's important that a smart watch can do everything.

The Apple Watch can be used in the gym, as well as it can be done in a office, or a day off or a night off.

Changing bands transforms the watch, specially in the stainless version that I bought. From rubber to leather, to nylon to steel.

This wouldn't be possible with the electronics in the bands.

 

[32828870]

This ticks me off. As a type 1 diabetic since 12 (now 39) I test ~20x/day and monitor my health very tightly. Non-invasive BG meters have existed with more accurate results than BG meters using strips yet never made their way to market having had their patents bought and sat on by pharmaceutical companies and their subsidiaries as that would mean billions lost on test strip sales. Why do you think BG meters are free or ~$19USD? Test strips in NA cost $100+ a month, $200-300 for OneTouch Ultra which I use. Not too dissimilar with the oil and gas industry buying alternate energy patents and sitting on them, or manipulating markets to push less mass transit and more auto and bus transport. Google the streetcar and GM scandal that lead to GM destroying one of the best US mass transit systems, ironically Los Angeles, and forcing diesel buses which resulted in a slap on the wrist and fine from the US government and don't believe the few articles debunking this fact as most are propaganda pieces. As one man states:

"Explain West German cities that did not have US/UK/FR military influence and their ability to keep their streetcars. I personally was stationed in a German city that tore up its streetcar lines and used buses. In some older sections not devastated by the bombing of the war there was still some rail in the streets. A nearby city of about the same population that didn't have any US/UK/FR occupation still had streetcars. Both cities were within an hour of each other and would have had the same oil supply system."

There's a precedence that is widely known and accepted and very prevalent in many industries. Money and profit will always come before true progress. Nixon privatizing the healthcare industry in order to "improve progress" certainly wasn't the case, and neither is privatizing US prisons that are overcrowded as prisons in other first world nations are so empty they're being transformed into recreational centers or public area's. I realize FDA approval would be necessary, but adding blood glucose monitoring would be amazing. 24/7 readings, a dream come true. Well, unless you're a pharmaceutical corporation with lobbyists using 2010's Supreme Court "Citizens United vs the FEC" interpretation.

Side note: In 2012, two scientists won the Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine in adult stem cell research. Cells generated by induced pluripotent cells, or iPS cells, could be made to mature into any type of adult cell in the body. Since 2006, they have begun human trials in Europe, injecting patients with iPS cells, first regrowing damaged heart tissue and curing heart damage, now regrowing and healing CNS damage resulting in patients regaining use of limbs. Now they're beginning Type 1 Diabetes research, "healing" or growing parts of the pancreas now known to be the cause of Type 1 Diabetes (previously believed to be the immune system attacking beta cells, which was proven false by research in Toronto and Sweden). As a Brit/American living in Berlin, so much is either ignored or intentionally misreported Stateside. It's amazing the differences.

Cloning and Stem Cell Work Earns Nobel

 

[Zirel]

Charging a watch every night isn't how most people use watches either, Jonny.

A magnetic wireless charger isn't either.

People who don't charge the watch every night, every 2 years:

1. get in the car
2. go to a jeweler
3. find a parking spot
4. ask for a battery replacement
5. wait 20 minutes for the jeweler to open the thing and replace the battery
6. pay the jeweler

 

[jweinraub]

I'm confident Apple decided to go with an emphasis on fashion to grab the "trend setters" to normalize wearables as the first rollout phase for what the Watch is going to become. Without fashion, it's incredibly hard to get normal consumers on board with the idea. Now that it's getting out there, the tech aspect can really kick in.

Smart watches had the stigma of calculator watches a few years ago (and given some of the horrible designs I can see why).

Interesting point. A colleague of mine is very keen on his Apple Watch and despite me being a technogeek I still prefer my analogue watches. I think they look great. Don't need to have batteries replaced since it is mechanical and the fact a watch nut thinks that the Apple Watch is a good thing got me thinking. But at the end of the day while the Watch may have neat features, I can still live without it. An analogue wristwatch I like mainly because i've always worn one, I do in fact use it for time and don't always need to have the overpriced features the watch offers. Granted an Omega is far more expensive than the Apple watch, it will be something I give to my future son one day. The apple watch, unlike the phone, I see it is pointless to having to charge it daily and the fact the next best thing comes next year. A watch is not like a phone. And being used as jewellery i dont plan on replacing it every two or three years. So instead of focussing on watches, and TVs, and cars, maybe it is time to start investing time and money on Macs once again! And OS X that isn't Siri related.

 

[Zirel]

This ticks me off. As a type 1 diabetic since 12 (now 39) I test ~20x/day and monitor my health very tightly. Non-invasive BG meters have existed with more accurate results than BG meters using strips, but that would mean billions lost on test strip sales. I realize FDA approval would be necessary, but adding blood glucose monitoring would be amazing. 24/7 readings, a dream come true. Well, unless you're a pharmaceutical corporation with lobbyists using 2010's Supreme Court "Citizens United vs the FEC" interpretation.

Okay, why don't those miraculous devices exist in Germany (since you have a German flag)?

Are you blaming the FDA now? Or those things simply don't exist?
[doublepost=1471310307][/doublepost]

While the popular thing will be to chastise Apple for worrying about the "fashionable" watchbands, having sensors in the bands would quickly spike the prices of them and they are already rather high. As fun as it is to criticize Apple, I actually agree with their decision on this. They wanted to make a watch first and add features from there, not shrink an iPhone and try to fit it around a wrist. Samsung tried that route and no one wanted it on their wrists because it was not a watch, but a phone.

View attachment 645091

Worst even was this:

With this thing, if the rubber bracelet broke or was damaged, was goodbye watch, because it has the camera and the microphone in the bracelet.

 

[32828870]

Okay, why don't those miraculous devices exist in Germany (since you have a German flag)?

Are you blaming the FDA now? Or those things simply don't exist?

Oy, please reread my post and study up on US law - I even provided you with a link (before you go there, it's one of my fields, so don't).

 

[Zirel]

Oh, sure. Just add $129 to the price of every current band and see how much people like that news.

Seems like they made the right call.

Worse yet: make people buy the same sensor multiple times over.

Or: don't allow for band replacements.

 

[radiology]

I'm confident Apple decided to go with an emphasis on fashion to grab the "trend setters" to normalize wearables as the first rollout phase for what the Watch is going to become. Without fashion, it's incredibly hard to get normal consumers on board with the idea. Now that it's getting out there, the tech aspect can really kick in.

Smart watches had the stigma of calculator watches a few years ago (and given some of the horrible designs I can see why).

I loved my calculator watch. It had great battery (never had to replace it or charge it), it was water proof (50 meter), it was fast, and it also had a barometer and an altimeter (never used those functions but they were very entertaining). Oh, I could also use different bands (loved the ones with Velcro).
[doublepost=1471310814][/doublepost]

While the popular thing will be to chastise Apple for worrying about the "fashionable" watchbands, having sensors in the bands would quickly spike the prices of them and they are already rather high. As fun as it is to criticize Apple, I actually agree with their decision on this. They wanted to make a watch first and add features from there, not shrink an iPhone and try to fit it around a wrist. Samsung tried that route and no one wanted it on their wrists because it was not a watch, but a phone.

View attachment 645091

That actually doesn't look that bad

 

[lordofthereef]

As long as third parties have access to feeding the watch sensor information in future models, this doesn't even bother me. A dedicated comapny is very likely to do a better job of something like this than Apple anyway.

 

[Zirel]

I can relate to this

I have the Apple Watch and Microsoft band , the Microsoft band captures the HR at the bottom of the wrist and Apple Watch on top. The Apple Watch HR is useless for me , I still need to wear my Microsoft band for accurate sports tracking.

Are you serious?

The Microsoft Band is a piece of inaccurate trash!

http://metro.co.uk/2016/01/27/this-...lthy-heart-rate-considering-its-dead-5647836/
[doublepost=1471311074][/doublepost]

Oy, please reread my post and study up on US law - I even provided you with a link (before you go there, it's one of my fields, so don't).

Im not talking about US law, US law doesn't apply in Germany ICYMI

 

[32828870]

Im not talking about US law, US law doesn't apply in Germany ICYMI

So then why are you commenting about my remarks regarding US law, corporate entities (research "Citizens United vs the FEC (2010) ), and the effects such have on progress? Keeping in mind many of the pharmaceutical companies and their subsidiaries are based in the US. Claiming that "magical devices (sic)" as non-invasive BG monitoring don't exist outside the US negates my point is backwards logic and not addressing the points (which I further expounded on for your benefit).

 

[Zellio]

Whew.

Thank God "fashionable" watchbands made the top of their priority list when designing the Apple Watch.

The Microsoft Band 2 which I have have some sensors at the opposite side of the watch, makes it very easy to check things like UV radiation levels.

Jony Ive only cares about making things smaller..

 

[Zirel]

So then why are you commenting about my remarks regarding US law, corporate entities (research "Citizens United vs the FEC (2010) ), and the effects such have on progress? Keeping in mind many of the pharmaceutical companies and their subsidiaries are based in the US. Claiming that "magical devices (sic)" as non-invasive BG monitoring don't exist outside the US negates my point is backwards logic and not addressing the points (which I further expounded on for your benefit).

I didn't say that, your shifting the goal posts.