We shall see how it is going in 6 months. It will be interesting to see how far Epic willing to take this.
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Judge in Apple v. Epic Case Sides With Apple on Fortnite and Epic on Unreal Engine [Updated]
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Good on ya judge.
You can't agree to a contract and then get into it and breach it and say "you're not fair you big meany"
You (Epic) demonstrated that you were in agreement and operated under the agreement.
Not gonna win this....victory for the little developers.
I think Fortnite has reached its APEX
You can't agree to a contract and then get into it and breach it and say "you're not fair you big meany"
You (Epic) demonstrated that you were in agreement and operated under the agreement.
Not gonna win this....victory for the little developers.
I think Fortnite has reached its APEX
IF Epic Games uses one developer account for Fortnight AND Epic International uses a different account for Unreal, then I have a concern with Apple shutting down both.
I've actually complained that Epic didn't do two separate companies to protect its users and was therefore irresponsible in protecting its devs (and no one disagreed with me about this point [they disagreed with me in general, but not about this point]).
If they each pay their own $99 a year to use Apple's tools, then to me it's a separate issue, especially if they're not even making games with the one but only making the Unreal engine. Apple's terms may be written and support closing both, I think they prevent someone who's kicked out from getting a new account, but IF these were already established for their different "divisions" then it's not as clearcut to me...
But Judge, think about the children! Out there alone, and isolated, with our war game their only means of communication!
I think it would be pretty surprising - nearly shocking - if the court issued a TRO under these circumstances. Even if the court thinks Epic Games is likely to win on the merits in the long run, the standards for a TRO probably aren't met here.
EDIT: To be clear, when I suggest it would be nearly shocking for the court to issue a TRO, I say that regarding Fortnite.
EDIT: To be clear, when I suggest it would be nearly shocking for the court to issue a TRO, I say that regarding Fortnite.
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Many of us have been saying this, that 30% on a platform is an industry norm.
Sony's PS, MS XBox, Google Play. "Right now, Epic is paying Apple nothing. Epic itself charges third parties"
Coming from a judge it adds a lot more weight.
Even though not a trial and an outcome you get the impression the judge is telling Epic to go away and re-think this.
From twitter
Steve Troughton-Smith
It was fascinating to watch just how impatient the judge was with Apple's arguments in the Epic v Apple TRO hearing. Apple really played the part of arrogant monopolist mob boss, and it didn't seem like anybody was convinced
Steve Troughton-Smith
It was fascinating to watch just how impatient the judge was with Apple's arguments in the Epic v Apple TRO hearing. Apple really played the part of arrogant monopolist mob boss, and it didn't seem like anybody was convinced
it’s not going to be a great experience. my ps4 remote play barely plays fine
No, most purchases actually have a 0% cut.
30%: applies to purchases that are actually consumed on the apple device -> everything you purchase on the app store, subscriptions for applications that are consumed on an apple device (Spotify/Google play music/etc...) and then inside of apps things like app feature unlocks, in-game currency, skins for your game character,...
15%: Video streaming services like HBO/Amazon Prime Video/Netflix/Hulu/etc... and other subscriptions in 2nd year.
0%: basically everything that's not consumed on an apple device (Food ordering, regular shopping, ...)
No, the fee does not apply to physical goods.
Steve has the worst takes.
He’s he person that believes Apple should implement virtual machines on an iPad. He has no clue what would make an experience great.
He’s more in line Wozniak and we all know if Wozniak designed the iPhone, no one would buy it.
it only applies to digital or IAP. Not to physical items or services.
Since there wasn’t a ruling today, and the Judge said a TRO isn’t a solution; it’s reasonable to believe that Apple can delete the dev acct IF Epic doesn’t revert Fornite back to the pre Aug 3rd update. Since Epic is now on record not wanting to get back into a “antitrust” situation with reverting the app, I’d say it’s within Apple’s contract they can delete the dev acct and leave the Unreal engine acct alone. Epic has painted themselves into a corner, and they don’t have many options at this point. I foresee hundreds of millions of dollars will be going to lawyers instead of the developers in the near future.
I don’t think that’s the same..maybe compare it to purchasing Amazon Prime thru the app?
If it is owned by another entity, how can this judge grant a TRO that is being sought by a company other than that entity?
Something refreshing here: The judge seems to be clued. This isn't going to go like some East Texas copyright case. She's aware of what's going on from all sides and the quotes in the article make her seem as she's going to look at this from all angles. Apple punishing Epic International does seem like overreach if they're not the ones that broke the contract, but that entity might just be a shell to separate Epic Games for just this type of situation. It might even be the same developers that work under both entities.
It's WAY too early to call winners and losers. This one's going to be a slog. Epic seems to know this. In the game on iOS they've already advertised yesterday's event as the last time iOS users can play with others.
It might be time for me to find another game to play.
It's WAY too early to call winners and losers. This one's going to be a slog. Epic seems to know this. In the game on iOS they've already advertised yesterday's event as the last time iOS users can play with others.
It might be time for me to find another game to play.
I haven't actually paid much attention to the suspension of the Unreal Engine account, but I tend to agree with you on this. Unless the Unreal account also violated terms of their account.
I'm thinking through how I'd feel if Epic had separate accounts for all of their various games and interactions as a way of fire walling each entity from the bad behaviors of the others. I think I'm ok with that-- deal with each problem narrowly.
If this became a shell game where Epic kept spinning up accounts, violating terms, and spinning up more accounts, does that change anything? I'm not sure. Obviously, it doesn't matter which account Fortnite shows up under-- if it's still in violation of the rules, it'll still be recognized and get blocked.
What about smaller devs that break the rules... If there's someone out there who keeps trying to run scams of some sort or another, and just keeps opening new accounts as each one gets closed? Maybe you eventually need to ban the individual, but I dunno. Part of what you're paying for is the App review process, so if some Nigerian prince keeps submitting their app under different accounts, then I feel like Apple can just keep reviewing the app and rejecting it and closing accounts without needing to prevent the prince from opening new accounts in the future. It'll just cost them $99 a try-- which is chump change for a prince.
Something to think about...
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*blinks at Zoom, Skype, FaceTime, Teams, et. al* A game is not the only means for people to communicate.
If Epic has enough entities with developer accounts, can they form their own class? 😄
And? Remove the code and they would be back up on the APP Store. Of course, anyone who downloaded it still has access and IOS is only 12% of their sales.
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If true, they didn’t file the TRO with the correct “company”.
Yup
It's not like EPIC haven't done stuff like, for example blocking 2k/gearbox from releasing borderlands 3 on steam for 6 months. Pretty glass house they're sitting in there, talking about being "anti-consumer"... whilst they're trying to force the Epic store on people who don't want it.
Maybe so, but a heck of a lot more interesting to young people than your first suggestions.
A little off topic, but relevant. I just submitted this feedback on apple’s website:
“I am writing to ask that Apple work with Microsoft, Google, and Nvidia to allow access to respective game streaming app technologies xCloud, Stadia, GeForce now, respectively. I do not agree with Apple’s reasoning for blocking these apps, and consider Apple’s blocking of the apps to be anticompetitive. I will stop using and refrain from purchasing all Apple products until Apple chooses to be more competitive with what is available on the platform. I have purchased several Apple hardware over the past decade. Most recently I have purchased a $1,000 iPad Pro and a $1,200 iPhone. I find it incredulous that I have such restrictions on what I can install on these devices, having spent so much money on them.
I implore you to think twice about your strategy regarding these models.”
“I am writing to ask that Apple work with Microsoft, Google, and Nvidia to allow access to respective game streaming app technologies xCloud, Stadia, GeForce now, respectively. I do not agree with Apple’s reasoning for blocking these apps, and consider Apple’s blocking of the apps to be anticompetitive. I will stop using and refrain from purchasing all Apple products until Apple chooses to be more competitive with what is available on the platform. I have purchased several Apple hardware over the past decade. Most recently I have purchased a $1,000 iPad Pro and a $1,200 iPhone. I find it incredulous that I have such restrictions on what I can install on these devices, having spent so much money on them.
I implore you to think twice about your strategy regarding these models.”
OK, another silly thought: If Epic Games and Epic International are separate entities (Fortnite and Unreal Engine, respectively), why didn't Epic International file for the TRO? I looked it up, it's Epic Games Inc. (https://cdn2.unrealengine.com/epic-v-apple-8-17-20-768927327.pdf)
Is this kind of thing common? Wearing two hats and arguing both sides when you're effectively the same organization?
Is this kind of thing common? Wearing two hats and arguing both sides when you're effectively the same organization?