Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Kuo: Apple-Designed 5G Modem May Debut in iPhones as Early as 2023
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
lol in that case, i' not entirely wrong either, i just got the apple arm's articture model name mixed up.
Thanks for the technical breakdown. Hopefully we see some innovation in this space and future tech is able to overcome the above listed roadblocks
Some of us enjoy intelligent responses that contribute to the conversation, and educate those of us uninformed on complex issues as these.
Last edited:
Yes, once all the patents are expired in 20 years time. Qualcomm made the "huge" and continuous investment and R&D on 5G ( as with many other companies ), You might disagree on what they are charging, but surely they deserve something.
But then vast majority of MR thinks they are patent trolls.
It's not difficult but it is ridden with broad patents that blocks you from even getting started.
If boiling water is patented, how do you invent new ways to make tea?
A lot of these patents aren't in the modems, but in the tower systems to deliver it. Nokia and Huawei, as examples, are the biggest providers for the tower hardware, with Ericsson behind them.
The only one that really stands out there is Samsung, who does have their own modems... but they rely on Qualcomm patents so much that their rollout of their own chips is the minority of their deliveries and only in select countries. It's cheaper for them to use the entire Snapdragon SOC for the vast majority of devices.
You're reading too much into this, o2 always have and always will be pants as a network, that's the explanation.
In other news Qualcomm will once again drag Apple into a multi year lawsuit, their claim being that if it is a cellular modem, it violates their patent and that they are the only ones allowed to make a cellular modems.
'Apple-designed modems can be expected to offer faster speeds, improved latency, among other benefits compared to Qualcomm or Intel modems, which powered earlier generation iPhones.'
I agree with mfram. So Apple in a few years of development is going to match Qualcomm without infringing on patents? Seems implausible.
People just don't learn anything from the past. It is like some have just arrived form a different planet. Apple has shown over and over and over that being first on doing something means jacksh*t.
IDK, on the one hand it makes sense for Apple to ensure their technological independence, the iPhone is so incredibly important for the company that nothing (and I mean nothing) can put the iPhone in jeopardy.
On the other hand, this seems to be the one thing Qualcomm has nailed down better than anyone else in the world, and Apple really has to outmatch Qualcomm.
At least has to deliver an equally good modem, but if it is worse than Qualcomm and people notice, ... well, that's not good. Eh, it's only money, right?
On the other hand, this seems to be the one thing Qualcomm has nailed down better than anyone else in the world, and Apple really has to outmatch Qualcomm.
At least has to deliver an equally good modem, but if it is worse than Qualcomm and people notice, ... well, that's not good. Eh, it's only money, right?
This is a great example which illuminates the world of patents!
Let us break down the tea-making process. It is essentially an extraction process, where some substances in the tea leaves need to be transferred to hot water. Physical chemistry tells us there are at least four parameters which have an impact on the extraction process: solvent, temperature, flow at the solid/liquid interface, and time.
As we have a multi-component extraction, getting the same balance as the gold standard (boiling water) may require some experimentation, but I can imagine at least three plausible ways of brewing tea without boiling water:
- Use liquid water in sub-boiling temperatures. There is a relatively large pressure-temperature space which can be used. For example, the water remains liquid at 100+ °C if the pressure is higher than standard pressure. Best guess is to heat the water to just below boiling.
- Use vapour without liquid water. The vapour may condense on the tea leaves and then extract whatever needs to be extracted. Same as above, different temperatures and pressures may be utilized.
- Use another solvent, e.g. supercritical CO2 in the extraction process. Mix the solvent with water and separate the solvent.
(There are several patents with my name in the inventor field. Despite that I think the patent system is fundamentally flawed and should be replaced by something more useful. We need a mechanism to keep the incentive to innovate, but the system is now way too inflexible and emplys far too many lawyers.)
What patents will be infringed upon that aren't covered in their 8 year licensing agreement?
What’s ridiculous are your lack of reading comprehension skills. Let me help you out: of course he was being sarcastic.
This isn't gonna bring the price of a new iPhone down
all it does is make it cheaper for APPLE to manufacture.
all it does is make it cheaper for APPLE to manufacture.
No. It’s pretty simple, as it turns out. Verification is the hardest part. But still much simpler than CPUs. But Intel hasn’t been able to hack it with cpus either for the last decade.
Yeah, that wouldn’t likely be happening for 2 reasons.
1. Even Musk himself had said repeatedly recently that Starlink isn’t meant to serve large portion of population in high density urban area. The satellite itself would run out of available bandwidth and frequency allocation to resolve between different ground transceivers within a small area.
2. Currently there is no Starlink ground antenna small enough to fit inside your pocket or have enough power efficient to be powered by battery. In fact, US military just announce interest and purpose a request for feasibility study into possibility of “Man-Portable Starlink System” last month. If the US military wasn’t even entirely sure miniaturized Starlink antenna is possible. There is zero chance we would see such technology be wildly deployed by 2025.
Last edited:
Better Engineering management and a different company culture goes a long way towards fixing Intel’s silo culture and fiefdoms that may have made working there a daily grind.
Whereas the modem group wasn’t high up on Intel’s priority list, I can guarantee that to Apple it is and has changed things accordingly to make its acquisition a success.
Unlike Intel who was directly competing with Qualcomm, and have to make everything without infringing on Qualcomm’s patent making the task of creating good modem much more difficult. Apple have the option to act more like Samsung who also make their own modem using technologies licensed from Qualcomm.
Apple now have licensing agreement for Qualcomm’s technologies at least until 2025~2027, experienced modem engineering team from Intel, and good hardware R&D management experience from themselves. I don‘t think it is fair to assume Apple would fumble like Intel once did with these much additional advantages. If licensing deal with Qualcomm make sense to Apple, they can just keep extending their agreement.
Also, with Apple creating their own modem instead of buying chips from Qualcomm. We would finally see modem being integrated into SoC which could improve efficiency.
Last edited:
That's one of the reasons why Apple acquired Intel's modem division. With it they got a significant portfolio of related patents (going back to the Infineon days) that they will leverage in licensing negotiations and to defend against litigation.
Not for me. No way I am going to use new Apple RF silicon. They simply don't have the chops for that. Look at how badly they bungled WiFi and cellular over the years. For me, it will be a least 2 years after first shipment to even consider.