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Kuo: Apple 'Well Prepared' for Headset Announcement Next Month
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It honestly depends on how these physically look and if/how they can extend my Mac desktop. I might be a day one buyer.
HobeSoundDarryl
macrumors G5
"SEEM"??? Personally I am shocked that THE "think different" crowd is so lacking in imagination with a device that is rumored to be able show our eyes anything such that it looks like reality. ANYTHING. ANY reality. Bonus: the device will also offer hands-free AR, to offer countless assisted benefits that are beyond what can be accomplished with iPhone or iPad.
All goggle threads feel like the weekly Apple vs. <other> threads, where Apple is completely right and <other> is entirely wrong. Apparently this brand new product coming from Apple, having been in the Apple labs for 6 or 7+ years is being mis-cast as Samsung or Microsoft or Google or someone with a patent against Apple or is someone forcing a change on Apple, etc. Just to be clear for the quick skimmers: this is Goggle, NOT Google.
Announcement: This is an Apple creation, long-term in the Apple incubator, about to be rolled out by Apple with an Apple logo on it.
The closest I've seen to an Apple vs. Apple thread is when Woz occasionally says something against Apple. Clearly Woz is wrong every time he offers anything other than gushing praise. Or when one group of Apple employees are flexing some union power against Apple Inc. Clearly that segment of Apple is confused, rebels that need to be crushed by the empire. "Lord Vader: go deal with those evil rebels."
This time it is Apple Corporate- the core of Apple- rolling out a new Apple product made and believed in by the Apple Corporate core that is always right in all things no matter what. It will be demoed by the current supreme Emperor and perhaps other corporate core faces of Apple who are always right in all things. And now it's apparently being rolled out in only a few weeks, so it's not like it is an entirely new, off the wall rumor like that first one that said a notch would come to MB or than iPhones would be bigger than the perfection, "one handed use" of 4 inches.
All these years here and I've never seen anything like it. Either a bunch of Luke Skywalker's have arisen and THINK they have Jedi powers... or the slaughter of this rebellion (thought) is incoming fast.
In Princess Leia's recorded voice, I can only hear: "shut up and take my money" blasting out of R2HPs (home pods) everywhere.
Personally, I'm FARRRRRRRRR from any fan boy around here... but if this arrives as rumored, it will be amazing.
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I find posts like this to be weird on a website called Macrumors. This is a place where RUMORS are posted and discussed. Rumors are NOT fact. They are a mixture of speculation and hearsay.
I don't get why this attitude is so common here. I really don't. If you don't like rumors, perhaps this isn't the spot on the internet for you?
I will keep an open mind about this device. I still remember when I said an iPad was just a large iPod Touch and I would never get one... well, guess what? I have had three iPad Pros and I love the darn thing, it is probably the Apple product I like the most.
The article will brag how Fall Detection saved someone who fell because they had the glasses on in public.
There is a long way to go for the tech to truly be feasible at the mass market level, but people really do underestimate what it means for a device to be able to deliver anything (whether physically possible or not) to our eyes and ears."SEEM"??? Personally I am shocked that THE "think different" crowd is so lacking in imagination with a device that is rumored to be able show our eyes anything such that it looks like reality. ANYTHING. ANY reality. Bonus: the device will also offer hands-free AR, to offer countless assisted benefits that are beyond what can be accomplished with iPhone or iPad.
All goggle threads feel like the weekly Apple vs. <other> threads, where Apple is completely right and <other> is entirely wrong. Apparently this brand new product coming from Apple, having been in the Apple labs for 6 or 7+ years is being mis-cast as Samsung or Microsoft or Google or someone with a patent against Apple or is someone forcing a change on Apple, etc.
Announcement: This is an Apple creation, long-term in the Apple incubator, about to be rolled out by Apple with an Apple logo on it.
The closest I've seen to an Apple vs. Apple thread is when Woz occasionally says something against Apple. Clearly Woz is wrong every time he offers anything other than gushing praise. Or when one group of Apple employees are flexing some union power against Apple Inc. Clearly that segment of Apple is confused, rebels that need to be crushed by the empire. "Lord Vader: go deal with those evil rebels."
This time it is Apple Corporate- the core of Apple- rolling out a new Apple product made and believed in by the Apple Corporate core that is always right in all things no matter what. It will be demoed by the current supreme Emperor and perhaps other corporate core faces of Apple who are the always right in all things. And now it's apparently being rolled out in only a few weeks, so it's not like it is an entirely new, off the wall rumor.
All these years here and I've never seen anything like it. Either a bunch of Luke Skywalker's have arisen and THINK they have Jedi powers... or the slaughter of this rebellion (thought) is incoming fast.
In Princess Leia's recorded voice, I can only hear: "shut up and take my money" blasting out of R2HPs (home pods) everywhere.
Personally, I'm FARRRRRRRRR from any fan boy around here... but if this arrives as rumored, it will be amazing.
What a mature VR headset means is that you can take a person to any real world place (Eiffel Tower, Baseball stadium, your Aunt's house), any fictional place (Middle Earth, Hogwarts, Star Wars universe), allow them to feel like they are face to face with any person which is a pretty fundamental human need, allow them to be in any body they desire and have a sense of virtual body ownership, and allow them to have countless virtual experiences feeling like they are real lived experiences.
You could at that point, run much of society inside VR. Quite literally, you could go to school in VR and have a (mostly) better experience than the real thing. I could have a virtual movie theater that beats any IMAX theater. I could go to a virtual comedy club and laugh my ass off more than any real world comedy club because jokes are funnier when a person is a pink dinosaur or a person at the gallows waiting for their head to be chopped off.
HobeSoundDarryl
macrumors G5
How can most of our "think different" buddies here not SEE some of that? Perhaps they need goggles?
Even at this late date, I'm still seeing "solution in search of a problem" and "could someone tell me what these could do" posts.
Historically, this is when the extreme pessimists are moderating their passionate negative opinions with classics like "I have to wait and see" and "I'll need to try them in stores" etc. Here we are a few weeks from when it appears pretty likely that an entirely new kind of product from Apple will be revealed and the fan-iest fanboys are still in extreme pessimism mode.
This is worse than iPod launch, when fans thought price and use was insane and Apple had lost their mind to even try some kind of music product at a crazy high price. Refer back to that infamous thread and just change the name of the product. You could also copy & paste some comments to threads about goggles.
Even at this late date, I'm still seeing "solution in search of a problem" and "could someone tell me what these could do" posts.
Historically, this is when the extreme pessimists are moderating their passionate negative opinions with classics like "I have to wait and see" and "I'll need to try them in stores" etc. Here we are a few weeks from when it appears pretty likely that an entirely new kind of product from Apple will be revealed and the fan-iest fanboys are still in extreme pessimism mode.
This is worse than iPod launch, when fans thought price and use was insane and Apple had lost their mind to even try some kind of music product at a crazy high price. Refer back to that infamous thread and just change the name of the product. You could also copy & paste some comments to threads about goggles.
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"SEEM"??? Personally I am shocked that THE "think different" crowd is so lacking in imagination with a device that is rumored to be able show our eyes anything such that it looks like reality. ANYTHING. ANY reality. Bonus: the device will also offer hands-free AR, to offer countless assisted benefits that are beyond what can be accomplished with iPhone or iPad.
All goggle threads feel like the weekly Apple vs. <other> threads, where Apple is completely right and <other> is entirely wrong. Apparently this brand new product coming from Apple, having been in the Apple labs for 6 or 7+ years is being mis-cast as Samsung or Microsoft or Google or someone with a patent against Apple or is someone forcing a change on Apple, etc. Just to be clear for the quick skimmers: this is Goggle, NOT Google.
Announcement: This is an Apple creation, long-term in the Apple incubator, about to be rolled out by Apple with an Apple logo on it.
The closest I've seen to an Apple vs. Apple thread is when Woz occasionally says something against Apple. Clearly Woz is wrong every time he offers anything other than gushing praise. Or when one group of Apple employees are flexing some union power against Apple Inc. Clearly that segment of Apple is confused, rebels that need to be crushed by the empire. "Lord Vader: go deal with those evil rebels."
This time it is Apple Corporate- the core of Apple- rolling out a new Apple product made and believed in by the Apple Corporate core that is always right in all things no matter what. It will be demoed by the current supreme Emperor and perhaps other corporate core faces of Apple who are always right in all things. And now it's apparently being rolled out in only a few weeks, so it's not like it is an entirely new, off the wall rumor like that first one that said a notch would come to MB or than iPhones would be bigger than the perfection, "one handed use" of 4 inches.
All these years here and I've never seen anything like it. Either a bunch of Luke Skywalker's have arisen and THINK they have Jedi powers... or the slaughter of this rebellion (thought) is incoming fast.
In Princess Leia's recorded voice, I can only hear: "shut up and take my money" blasting out of R2HPs (home pods) everywhere.
Personally, I'm FARRRRRRRRR from any fan boy around here... but if this arrives as rumored, it will be amazing.
The Apple "think different" crowd is long gone, replaced by those who love the "beige box" products Apple puts out every year (cue the 1984 hammer commercial with Apple now the brainless audience). Don't get me wrong, their products are very reliable and very practical, but not exactly bursting the creativity seams anymore. That's why I'm cautiously optimistic about these goggles, this is Apple's chance to display their world renown creativity and I think Cook knows this, that's why he's pushing it so hard. At $3k no thanks, but in 4-5 years and $1k it may be something that flies off the shelves.
HobeSoundDarryl
macrumors G5
I guess! I'm no fanboy. I can be plenty critical of Apple Inc. I'm a consumer FIRST, corporation second guy.
And I'm genuinely excited about this product potential... much more so than anything before except maybe iPod... which is the "crazy expensive", "Apple has lost their mind", "why would anyone want an iPod" product that actually brought me into Apple all those years ago.
Yes, iPhone seems much bigger than iPod but I never really bothered with iPhone at all. My iPad Mini doubles as my phone & texting device (buds and VOIP app) and has since iPad Mini 1. Before that my Macs covered phone and texting needs. I recall making phone calls with Skype on Mac back in the early 2000s.
iPod had the same wall of doubt and same perception of insanely high pricing and it basically transformed Apple... making iPhone and iPad possible many years later. To my perhaps foolish imagination, I'm seeing Googles like iPod way back then.
The power to show our eyes ANYTHING in a realistic way is a creative canvas beyond anything we've ever had before. Pair that with buds that can similarly fool our ears into thinking we are "there" too, and 2 of the big 5 senses (perhaps the most important 2) can be stimulated in ways like nothing has ever done before.
And I'm genuinely excited about this product potential... much more so than anything before except maybe iPod... which is the "crazy expensive", "Apple has lost their mind", "why would anyone want an iPod" product that actually brought me into Apple all those years ago.
Yes, iPhone seems much bigger than iPod but I never really bothered with iPhone at all. My iPad Mini doubles as my phone & texting device (buds and VOIP app) and has since iPad Mini 1. Before that my Macs covered phone and texting needs. I recall making phone calls with Skype on Mac back in the early 2000s.
iPod had the same wall of doubt and same perception of insanely high pricing and it basically transformed Apple... making iPhone and iPad possible many years later. To my perhaps foolish imagination, I'm seeing Googles like iPod way back then.
The power to show our eyes ANYTHING in a realistic way is a creative canvas beyond anything we've ever had before. Pair that with buds that can similarly fool our ears into thinking we are "there" too, and 2 of the big 5 senses (perhaps the most important 2) can be stimulated in ways like nothing has ever done before.
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Wow, everything you said here seems really creepy, no offense. It sounds to me like you are running from reality. That is sad. Donning a VR headset is never going to replace experiencing the actual reality of face to face human interactions or going to see the Eiffel Tower or taking in a baseball game in person. At least in the United States, people (especially our youth) need to experience more reality and face to face interactions, not less. Many of the younger folks in this country are already anti-social, narcissistic, zombies as is. Not to mention suicide rates amongst teens have doubled over the past ten years. Less reality is not working out well at all.
Sony sold 5 million PSVR headsets - that one was a medium success. Although now they are struggling to sell it's successor - probably due to a higher price (around 1/5 to 1/6 of the rumored price for the apple headset)
I mean if you really want to get into this discussion, reality is wherever our senses are directed at. We don't even experience a true reality, but our brain's reconstruction of reality - where it makes sense of whatever is actually out there.
That said, VR doesn't need to replace the real world, and I'm not advocating for it replacing the real world. I think that some experiences will be better in VR, some will be as good as the real thing, and some will be worse. However, when it is worse, it can very much act as a stand-in for when we can't do things in real life, since travel is expensive, time is short, and the hassle is large.
So of course people are going to meet in the real world still, but when they are unable to (when was the last time you saw a friend/family member >100 miles away?) then VR/AR is going to be the next best thing. If people are able to experience face to face interactions more through VR/AR then that sounds like a positive to me, compared to experiencing things through a 2D screen like we do today on our phones and computers.
A lot of the pitfalls of social media will not exist in VR. There will be downsides and addiction that will come as a result of VR/AR usage, and those are fair points, but the positives are also very high and shouldn't be underestimated.
Oh I agree, if AR/VR was used properly, it would have many upsides and few downsides honestly. Unfortunately, as we've seen with the internet and most certainly social media, the downsides will most likely overtake the upsides due to addiction/misuse by humans. When kids can strap on a headset and be in a different world, they will leave reality further and further behind because so many haven't been raised to deal with the real world. I'll save the philosophic side of the discussion for another day, although that is one of my favorite subjects. 😊
Honestly, I've visited the Eiffel Tower recently. Next time I'd go for the VR-Version where you don't have to stand in a line forever and that's not stuffed to the brim with tourists. I get your point, but Paris really isn't a good example for a "real", authentic experience - it's probably the most artificial mass-tourism city in Europe, even more than Venice. Having traveled to Paris a few weeks ago and also owning a VR-headset I can say without a doubt that the latter had a stronger impact on me.
Everything you said is totally right, but at the same time there can be applications for VR that rival real world experiences. Don't have the thousands of dollars for a European vacation to see the Eiffel Tower? Don't have the thousands of dollars to buy a front row ticket to the World Series? Want to watch a pride of lions hunt in Africa close up? Want to experience a true Star Wars experience complete with spacecraft fighting all around you as you take out your light saber and duel with Vader? etc. etc. VR can be a ticket to many things that many can't feasibly experience in real life. Especially when other things begin to catch up like smells, tactile experiences, mobility, etc. AR is another story, having overlayed information at your fingertips sounds really good on one hand, but on the other hand is just another information overload that we keep accepting without thinking about our mental health.
I get it about social media, I have 2 kids and my life revolves around keeping them away from social media and ensuring they have tons and tons of real world, face to face interactions. But I gotta tell you, it's a losing battle as kids nowadays put a lot of value into social interaction over the internet and it's only going to get worse as technology improves. The world changes, and just as parents were afraid of smartphones changing their kids social patterns, and before that they were afraid of the internet changing their kids social patterns, and before even that they worried about television and radio changing their kids social patterns, here we are now doing the same thing with VR. How antiquated does it look when we think about parents railing against having a television or radio in the house, but it's how our kids will think of us in 20 years for better or worse.
I have a stereoscopic video camera I took with me when we visited Hawaii. My wife and I scoped out an incredible spot and enjoyed the sun and waves for half the day. I mounted that camera and recorded some footage. Every now and then I can put on the Quest and play that video... and look around. Of course, it doesn't compare to actually being there but it's an incredible and powerful way to relive that moment. The tech is only going to get better.
There are experiences that people will never be able to do. Either by financial or physical limitations. Just like a photograph or a video, having an experience that approaches a realistic experience is an incredible tool to have. If you have the ability to do something in reality go do it, life is short. But if not, what's wrong with a virtual experience, or a virtual memory of a real experience?
HobeSoundDarryl
macrumors G5
Very much agree with this. Here's another example, let's go to the big game and get some great, courtside seats (available now)...
That's actually real. Those are available for ONE, 48-minute game right now. Who wants to sit courtside and have best possible view of this big game?
Lots? But you don't have $43,350 for a seat? Com'on! Only $43,350 for one whole game. Check the couch cushions.
What would be next best thing? What if you could virtually sit in that kind of seat for say- $200? Interested? What if you could sit there throughout the playoffs for $200? Interested?
OK, you don't like NBA? Offer the same for ANY favored sport? Interested?
Why would the NBA be interested in selling that seat for $200 instead of $43,350? They wouldn't, but they know that someone will still pay up the $43K to actually sit there. The problem with physical seats is there are only so many of them. They can't add 500 more courtside seats right there. Or can they?
How many would pay $200 to sit there? If they could get at least 217 NBA fans to pay $200 to not actually occupy that seat, they also get $43K for NOT that actual seat. What if they could get 2,000 people to not actually sit there but who would never come up with $43K to be the ONE body to sit there? What if that was 20,000 people? Etc.
Why would Apple want to sell such a package? 15%-30% cut of sales of <sport> front row center VR could be a gigantic amount of regularly-renewing services revenue. I wonder if the rumors of Apple competing for NFL ST was not actually that at all... but Apple pitching a new version of that package called NFL ST VR? NFL could still sell ST for those billions "as is" AND the VERY SAME product could also get this extra (new) revenue from Apple for those willing to NOT actually attend games- or unable to actually attend them- but virtually be there... sitting in seats that aren't actually available because a real body fills those seats now?
So anybody want this seat for $200 or so?
Note: it will take a one-time purchase of $3K to make this work. Anybody want this $43K seat for $3200 and then $200 next year and $200 the year after? How about for NFL games: NFL ST VR? How about MLB VR? Soccer? Golf? Tennis? Hockey? Olympics? Broadway Shows? Concerts? And on and on and on.
Is this impossible now? Not at all. This takes a specialized camera installed in the right place. Here's a poor sampling, very limited and warped by trying to show a 3D experience within a 2D frame:
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Darth Tulhu
macrumors 68020
My imagination can easily outpace reality, so I'm cautiously hopeful this thing will be awesome, if it does what I think it will.
I'd love interactive A/R overlays, virtual screens, etc.
I'd love interactive A/R overlays, virtual screens, etc.
I know people who spend all day and night in VRChat, even sleeping in it. That's not for me personally - I can see how it would benefit some individuals that literally can't function in reality:
^ This is a case where living in VR and forgoing the real world does make sense. If it works out for them, that's good.
At the time time, I've seen how VRChat can destroy lives. People can spend way too much time in there and forget their real world responsibilities, losing their job and income, missing classes, having too many drinks, or not taking care of their health. There's no question that VR will destroy some people's lives. I personally don't think it will ever get close to the amount of good it will provide, so that's why I think the tech should have the greenlight to keep developing and being more ingrained in our society.
I do think that in the very very far future, when/if we have Matrix-level VR, it is probably inevitable that most humans will choose to live most of their lives in VR. If we are enslaved, this is horrible and a net-negative. If we are free or at least mostly free, then I believe that despite this drastic shift for most of humanity, it will be the better outcome because life is ultimately wherever our senses are directed at. If people have happier lives in Matrix-level VR simulations that feels as real as the real world at all times, then overall it is a positive force for humanity.
Some people like to go a step further with sci-fi and talk about stimulating the senses to provide pure streaks of pleasure and happiness 24/7. That... I don't want, because that's not me driving things, that's me being a vegetable having 24/7 pleasure. What VR enables is impossible experiences that I drive second-by-second. I have full control and agency, and that is why happiness in VR is real happiness.
HobeSoundDarryl
macrumors G5
If you take your thinking to its logical conclusion, we need to get rid of always-connected iDevices too. They- not rumored goggles- are the cause of ALL of the negatives you are offering now.
So kill iPhone and iPad (and all similar products) to take a good shot at addressing this problem? About no one will support that argument. We're simply trying to assign blame for all of it on this product which hasn't even been launched yet.
AR/VR could very well provide more escape- or regression- but I don't know that Apple NOT rolling out this cut at it will make any difference in all of what you are sharing against it. Those "lost teens" are already lost in that iPhone (and iPad) which have 0% chance of going away if we all got strongly behind the ideas you are offering.
I fully agree that people need as much reality as possible... as much actual social interaction as possible, etc. You are right about that. But Apple goggles are not hindering any of that at all today. And what is will likely never be able to be put back into the bottle.
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