Leaked EU Document Could Spell Major Changes for App Store, Messages, FaceTime, Browsers, and Siri

[Quu]

Or, you could... you know... buy an Android device.
I support you in this endeavor.

That's like saying I should use Windows instead of macOS when we all know full well we love that we can install third party software on our Macs because we prefer that operating system.

I prefer iOS from a UI and usability perspective and I prefer the iPhone from a hardware perspective. To me the locked down walled-garden that Apple has created is just one side of what the iPhone is and it's the only side I'm losing interest in having.

Because you don’t know what you’re talking about and have no experience calculating negative outcomes of bad decisions and bad ideas.

I'm a successful business owner that deals exclusively in the creation and sale of software so actually in this regard I do know what I'm talking about, I probably know more about the underpinnings of iOS than most who will comment in this thread having worked on some of the apps you probably have used over the past 15 years.

I would like platform neutrality to the degree that macOS affords users. You are free to disagree and you are also free to stay within Apples walled garden and never install a third party app store or sideload an app, your phone your choice.

 

[siddavis]

Apple does a lot of annoying things, but at least they aren’t imposed with the force of law.

And this is the key difference! There is only one entity that can compel by fine or imprisonment. They have a monopoly on it actually.

 

[GMShadow]

I’m all for allowing side loading and forcing Apple to make good on its promise me make FaceTime open source.

It wasn't open sourced because of legal issues, not because Apple doesn't want to.

 

[siddavis]

I prefer iOS from a UI and usability perspective and I prefer the iPhone from a hardware perspective. To me the locked down walled-garden that Apple has created is just one side of what the iPhone is and it's the only side I'm losing interest in having.

So do I. Please stop imposing your wants on it through regulation. Don't like the walled-garden approach? Leave.

 

[Deguello]

Just because two parties consent to a transaction doesn't make it legal. Particularly when there is a massive power disparity between the two parties.

“Legal” is just a question of what the government chooses to enforce. That doesn’t make it efficient, let alone conducive to competition or morally acceptable. Slavery was “legal.” Whether something is “legal” has little do to with whether it is helpful.

No one has to buy Apple. On Android. Or Ford or Chevy or whatever.

 

[Michael Scrip]

Question... what if Apple is forced to allow sideloading... but hardly any developers do it?

Android has just as many developers as iOS... and Android has always allowed sideloading. Yet almost all Android developers go through Google's Play Store which takes the same 15% or 30% cut as Apple.

Weird, huh?

Maybe it's just easier to let the big platform store handle the entire process instead of developers setting up their own servers, payment gateways, and whatnot. And dealing with taxes in 150 countries!

I dunno. It'll be interesting to see how this all shakes out.

It's just weird that there's this drumbeat growing to demand Apple open up its platform.

And yet Android has always been wide open... but Android developers are choosing to go through Google's store and pay Google their cut.

Maybe sideloading isn't the magic bullet after all...

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Quu]

So do I. Please stop imposing your wants on it through regulation. Don't like the walled-garden approach? Leave.

No, I don't think I will. And I think my side will prevail so perhaps you should move to Windows Phone

 

[JM]

I’m looking forward to installing virus software on my iPhone and Apple Watch.

 

[jarman92]

"Margrethe Vestager said last month that she expects the DMA to come into force 'sometime in October.'"

Maybe sometime in October 2032 after the inevitable legal challenges.

 

[bcortens]

So do I. Please stop imposing your wants on it through regulation. Don't like the walled-garden approach? Leave.

This comes to a fundamental difference in perspective, some people live in a world where corporate regulation is a net negative while others realize that sometimes companies don't act in the best interest of the world and the world could be a better place if they were prevented from just doing whatever they want.

I think they overreach by far on this law by requiring far more than simply opening up to third party app stores and side loading but by essentially forcing apple to build APIs for inter-app communication and interoperability in messaging standards (that don't make technical sense).

 

[siddavis]

Just because two parties consent to a transaction doesn't make it legal. Particularly when there is a massive power disparity between the two parties.

How about when one of the parties doesn't consent, and the other is the only one that has the power to compel at gunpoint? How's that for power disparity?

 

[kanki1985]

Why not do this to everything else, like I should be able to add waymo self driving package on a Tesla, or make my sony playstation work with xbox games, or have Nikon lenses fit into canon cameras. Oh why not scrap all companies and have the government make all products we need?

 

[StevieD100]

As time goes on my desire for sideloading and installing apps that Apple would never allow grows stronger so I have to say I support the EU lawmakers in this endeavour.

OR
As time goes on my desire for sideloading and installing apps that Apple would never allow grows WEAKER so I have to say I DO NOT support the EU lawmakers in this endeavor.

Two sides to any coin.

 

[Neepman]

Socialism. Does. Not. Work.

 

[Quu]

Question... what if Apple is forced to allow sideloading... but hardly any developers do it?

Android has just as many developers as iOS... and Android has always allowed sideloading. Yet almost all Android developers go through Google's Play Store which takes the same 15% or 30% cut as Apple.

Weird, huh?

You'll still find 99% of the applications will be released on the official stores as that is where the vast majority of users go to find new apps. Nothing about that will change.

But you will find part of this proposed document from the EU is about money. Developers ability to charge for apps directly using their own payment systems. So in this situation I as a developer could release an app for free on the iOS App Store and then once you launch the app I ask to charge you money to use the app and Apple wouldn't get a cut of those proceeds.

This may alter the dynamic of the App Store with Apple charging developers a subscription to list apps or charge based on download counts for apps that are commercial but list as "free" on Apples store etc

 

[w5jck]

As time goes on my desire for sideloading and installing apps that Apple would never allow grows stronger so I have to say I support the EU lawmakers in this endeavour.

As time goes on, my desire to keep garbage you install on your devices from screwing up my devices grows ever stronger. So I say, "@#$% the EU." Let the EU build their own devices. Oh wait, they tried that and got walloped by American companies. So I guess they have a snowball's chance in hell of capturing the EU market, much less a foothold in the planetary market. Maybe they can buy iPhoneskys from the Russians.

 

[Neepman]

The only thing governments are good at doing is killing people and taking their money. They have the opposite of the Midas touch ?

You are only half right. Governments aren't very good at killing people either.

 

[IamTimCook]

The encrypted messaging services needing to talk to each other is downright hilarious and scary at the same time.

EU: Hey Apple, we're gonna need you to handover your encryption keys to Facebook and Google, Mmmka.
______________
Big Tech: Who's gonna hold all of our keys for safe keeping?

EU: We will!

 

[Deguello]

Just because two parties consent to a transaction doesn't make it legal. Particularly when there is a massive power disparity between the two parties.

Your post was about “competition,” though. That the EU can make it legal doesn’t imply that doing so protects competition. If you have a point on how dictating how companies must interoperate fosters competition, feel free to make it.

 

[krspkbl]

can't see anything wrong with any of that. apple has enjoyed control for far too long. they need to be brough back down to earth. good on the EU.

 

[Quu]

As time goes on, my desire to keep garbage you install on your devices from screwing up my devices grows ever stronger. So I say, "@#$% the EU." Let the EU build their own devices. Oh wait, they tried that and got walloped by American companies. So I guess they have a snowball's chance in hell of capturing the EU market, much less a foothold in the planetary market. Maybe they can buy iPhoneskys from the Russians.

I'm confused by your signature, you're an old mac user who owned an Apple II+ and have been using them ever since. The Mac would not even exist today if Apple was vetting all the software for that platform. And you clearly know that Macs are not a diseased entity in computing, they are thriving and people are using them for all manner of tasks today, despite their ability to sideload and install third party stores.

Look at the huge success of Steam and what it has done for PC and to a lesser extent Mac gaming. That sort of store would be wonderful to have on iOS.

 

[turbineseaplane]

Fantastic!

I am thrilled to see the EU going big here.

It’s long past time on some of this stuff.

 

[bcortens]

The encrypted messaging services needing to talk to each other is downright hilarious and scary at the same time.

EU: Hey Apple, we're gonna need you to handover your encryption keys to Facebook and Google, Mmmka.

Yeah, that and a few other provisions - like requiring Apple to include APIs to replace OS level features - seem like a massive problem.

 

[TheYayAreaLiving 🎗️]

Apple's legal team is going to be busy in the coming days. I don't understand why the government is always after Apple. I wonder if Apple will pull out from all this mess.

 

[Deguello]

You are only half right. Governments aren't very good at killing people either.

They seem pretty good at it to me.