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This is really lame ....

I keep seeing people posting this nonsense. "If you find a lost phone, give it to the bartender! Call the police and report it! Etc. etc."

I don't know what alternate reality you people live in? But in most cases I can think of? #1. I wouldn't trust most bartenders not to just promise you they'll "try to find out whose phone it was" and just take the thing home that night themselves.

#2. If I actually called the police about a lost cellphone? They'd probably tell me just to keep the thing! It'd be like pulling teeth to get an officer to actually come out there and DO anything about it. They don't want to be bothered with something that trivial. (And who can blame them? Wouldn't you feel like an idiot if you made a cop drive out and waste an hour of his time after that filling out paperwork over a cellphone. When meanwhile, a REAL crime happened like an armed robbery or car theft - because the cops were all tied up and too busy to do a patrol around that area at the time?)

And earlier, someone actually posted some sort of "How would YOU feel if your phone was the one lost, and someone picked it up and resold it?" line. Well, guess what? I've actually had that happen before, with a Palm Treo smartphone. As soon as I realized I left it someplace? I was upset with MYSELF for doing it, but wrote it off as a loss and proceeded to look into my options for buying a replacement. You call it in and get them to shut it off so someone can't run up your cellular bill - and beyond that? It's just something normal people chalk up as a loss.

I mean, look - it's *great* if someone is honest and wants to "do the right thing" and return your lost phone (or anything else) to you. But the law comes down on the rigid and unrealistic side of things on all of this stuff. So yes, the "letter of the law" tells you any lost property that someone discovers and resells is "stolen". But how enforceable is it, really? The world generally believes in "finders, keepers" despite the law offering an alternate view. This stuff is a lot like speeding.... The posted sign may say "55MPH speed limit" but look around you while driving on that highway. Do you see everyone following it to the letter, or do you see practically everyone exceeding that posted limit, by at least 4 or 5MPH? People *expect* not to even get a ticket for "going only 5MPH over the limit" if you ask most of them.


Please Apple!! Sink the whole Gawker Network!! :mad:

Because they were dead wrong! The guy should have never removed the phone from the bar! Like the article said, you give it to the bartender... duh!! :rolleyes:

In my eyes, it's like buying stolen goods.
 
Oh please. Only in America.

Some muppet / balloon / halfwit Apple Engineer takes his "trade secret" iPhone to a bar, gets lashed up, loses it and the unlucky good samaritan that finds it gets threatened.

I can't believe the twit that lost the phone still has a job. He's got his phone back so there is no case. In fact the whole of any case which may arise (and I doubt there will be) is based on the testimony of the ned that lost the phone. I can hear the defence attorney's opening question to the Apple employee, "Had you been drinking ? No further questions".

The finder and Gizmodo should be asking for a "handling fee". Just how much effort and expense must an individual go to to return lost propoerty ? Hand it to the bar owner ? Sure, they're well known for their honesty.

hahaha...very good and true! Yes hand it over to the BT and he would have called Giz to sell it for 10K$
 
I hope that getting the scoop was worth whatever repercussions are coming from Apple. I would imagine that their access to Apple events will be revoked for a very long time.
 
I'd have taken a picture of it and sent it to Steve Jobs. He's been responding to email a lot lately. Just say "Hey, I'd like to get this back to you guys. Let's meet for lunch." Hell, Steve might even buy.
 
Apple will remain silent until Steve shows us exactly what the next gen phone will be... and then he'll stand there holding the shiny source of so much desire and then he'll say, "oh, and one more thing... Gizmodo, my lawyers would like to speak to you outside in the hallway" :p

LOL that would be AMAZING. :D

Who the hell is rating this story negative btw? Gizmodo is a site full of douchebags and this is NOT at all the first time they've "done the wrong thing" which is why I avoid that site like the plague. F them. I hope they get what they deserve.
 
You turn it over to police you dumbass. If you are in my house, pick up my friends phone, leave with and don't contact them. That's stealing.

I'd explain the difference between a personal dwelling and place of business, but I'm taking notes.
 
I have no sympathy for any of these guys. Gizmodo could have contacted Apple themselves to see if it had been lost before exposing it online. Apple needs to do something. yeh, it was fun and exciting to see the phone, but really it was wrong.
 
Shifty Pig is right. There is no theft here.

The law requires that you make reasonable efforts to return the property. The finder asked around the bar and then called Apple and spoke to a rep. The state doesn't get to put him in jail for a year because Apple didn't transfer him to the right person. There's no requirement that you turn the phone over to the police, or to the bartender, for that matter.

This case won't be prosecuted because the People know that you won't be able to convince anyone on a jury to convict on these facts. And if you look at published cases concerning the theft of lost property, there are no facts even close to this.

And of course if the property isn't the subject of theft, Giz didn't receive stolen property.

The "trade secrets" issue is less clear - the fact that the phone wasn't stolen doesn't mean that it wasn't "misappropriated" under the UTSA (nor does it mean that it was misappropriated.) And the details of the phone do seem to meet the very broad definition of trade secret contained in the statute. However, there are some pretty serious 1st amendment issues with the breadth of the UTSA, so it's not clear whether the statute really means what it says or not. Nor is it clear what the measure of damages is - has Apple really lost money due to the form and a couple of details being disclosed on a website? I think that would be extremely hard to prove.

And a suit like this would probably only end up harming and embarrassing Apple, both monetarily and with customers.

More to the point, it's pretty clear that Giz took some pains to protect Apple - they deliberately chose not to report on the processor in the iPhone, the memory in the iPhone, the actual power of the battery...or other technical details that competitors would be interested in. For this reason, I don't think that Apple will go after Giz, or even prohibit them from attending Apple events.

Although I would be surprised if Apple gave Giz its $5,000 back.
 
This guy lost his phone on a night of drinking at a German bar, he now has his phone back. Again where is the case apple has against gizmodo?
 
This is another example of how the "news media" behave worse than the people they report about.
This was so blatant that to try and defend it just makes Gizmondo look even worse.
I hope Apple nail these thieves.
You expect the truth from the news. How could anyone believe a thing these low lives ever write about again?
Gotta get that story :mad:
 
This guy lost his phone on a night of drinking at a German bar, he now has his phone back. Again where is the case apple has against gizmodo?

Uh oh... you're about to open up the "trade secrets" can of worms that the mongs have been spouting on here for three days.
 
Oh, please. The people who feel that Gizmodo or the "founder" of the phone are in the right are absolutely insane. No two ways about it.

Apple could go after 'em so easily. I'm not even a lawyer, and I can already write up an air tight argument.

Not that it matters, but Apple employees who test products actually do use them in real world scenarios. This guy just happened to be stupid and lose it, but the person who "found" it has a responsibility to get it back to him. Under rule of law. And Gizmodo's too entrenched in the tech community and in tech related issues to pretend they didn't know what they were doing.

Now, even if I were Apple, and I could go after these bozos, I wouldn't bother at least until after the phone's released. Even then, it's one of those things you probably just leave alone.

But, if Apple did go after them? They're pretty screwed.
 
Would anyone get arrested if it was a $10 Razr that got lost at a bar? Or if you buy something used on Craigslist but don't have absolute proof that it wasn't stolen?

I do think this whole 'fiasco' has been in somewhat of a gray area. But Gizmodo did return the phone to Apple. I think Apple is better letting the whole matter drop, and not try to press on the cops to pursue criminal charges.

Besides, what if charges were filed and that Denton guy subsequently commits suicide? ;)
 
It's disheartening that the finder of lost property would spend a couple of minutes asking around a bar (and make a few phone calls), but then turnaround and sell it for $5000. What a despicable person.

It is not that easy. In this case, there are two different values: The proper value of the phone, and the value of the insight into Apple's products. The value of the phone is IMO less than the value of an ordinary new iPhone. It is a prototype, it is not guaranteed to work as well as a normal iPhone, you won't get it repaired if something goes wrong etc. And then there is, completely separate, the value of the knowledge someone could get about Apple's next product.

The property value of the phone itself is saved by laws even if it is lost. You have a right to your property even if you lost it, and so does Apple. However, there is the trade secret part of it. Trade secret requires that you keep it secret. When an Apple employee leaves a product lying around, anyone has the right to look at it. Say the employee left the phone on a table while going to the toilet. Anyone has the right to take a look and take photos of it. Trade secret gone. Even worse when he messes up and loses the phone.

So if the guy sold not the phone, but the opportunity to have a really good look at it, for $5000, as long as he made it clear to Gizmodo that it was not his property and Gizmodo made clear that they would make sure it gets returned to the rightful owner, then I think they are in the clear. If I was in Gizmodo's place, first thing I would have done is type a letter explaining the situation to Apple (hi guys, we got your phone, it's at our office here, drop in at any time during our office hours and pick it up), print it, put it in an envelope, put a stamp on it, put it into the nearest mailbox. Make sure that Apple gets their property back, but not exactly in a hurry.

If I find a phone, I have no obligation to return it to you, as long as I give you an opportunity to pick it up. Why should I spend money for fuel for my car, when it is your phone?

"I gave it back" is not a legal defense for theft.

If I find something and give it back then it is no theft. If I find something and keep it, that is theft. If I find something and give it to a person that I trust to return it, and that person returns it, then it is no theft.
 
This case would go nowhere, first off the person who found the phone, FOUND IT, did not steal it, he waited to see if the guy would come back, he did not return looking for the phone.

Second, he then tried to give it back to Apple and they played dumb like they knew nothing about it. That is strike two against Apple.

Third, You can't charge someone with stolen property when you lose something. That is strike three against Apple.

When Apple contacted the web site, they returned the phone. I highly doubt Apples wants to get embarrassed in court by the judge for this BS case.

End of story.

This whole phone deal was a plant, Apple did this on purpose for publicly.

Pretty sad if you ask me.

I don't think you have paid close enough attention to California's lost property and theft laws. It is not nearly as open and shut as you would hope. "finding" vs. "stealing" is not nearly as different as you would have it.
 
I have no sympathy for any of these guys. Gizmodo could have contacted Apple themselves to see if it had been lost before exposing it online. Apple needs to do something. yeh, it was fun and exciting to see the phone, but really it was wrong.

Gizmodo had no legal obligation to contact Apple before posting pictures. They're not under an NDA to protect unreleased Apple products. If I found a phone and posted pictures of it online so that the owner would KNOW that I had it (and know who to contact), would I be doing the wrong thing?

Edit: They had likely already contacted Apple telling them they had the phone. However, there's no reason they shouldn't have gone ahead and posted the photos.
 
Granted this is not some conspiracy type deal... I think the person that picked up the phone should have had better judgement. I remember having a phone in my possession which I thought was mine (since it was the same model type etc) but realized it wasn't. Yes this was in a bar. No I didn't stick around the bar trying to find the person... or even wait till someone claimed it, since that is just ridiculous (Like I'm going to hold up a sign saying "Lost iPhone, please claim".) I called the last number that was in the recent call list. A friend of the owner picked up, and that friend directed me to a landline of the owner and we met up and I gave the phone to the owner. Period. I figure there is some sorta sham going on here. I will not visit jizzmodo's site due to their part in the sham
 
If Gizmodo had not bought the phone, it never would have been returned to Apple.

The guy had it a month, and it never got back to Apple. Gizmo paid $5000, and makes arrangements to get it back to them the first business day they had it in their possession.

Apple doesn't stand a chance of winning any litigation against Gozmodo.
 
I think this part seems to be pretty clearcut- he did not seem to make a legitimate effort to find the phone's owner. And then went ahead and sold it for a cool $5K.

Maybe you don't leave the phone with the bartender. But it's pretty common sense that you would call the bar and ask if anyone had reported losing a prototype iPhone...

Whether or not Gizmodo is legally liable is another issue. The guy who actually stole the phone...stole the phone.
 
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 3_1_3 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/528.18 (KHTML, like Gecko) Mobile/7E18)

Controlled leak. Job well done.
 
"I gave it back" is not a legal defense for theft.

How did he steal a "Lost" phone? Who is at fault here? The Drunk engineer who lost a phone at a bar where the phone shouldnt have been, or the guy who found that phone MADE a effort to track down the user and then sold the phone when he "Felt" like he exhausted all of his options?

Is it grand theft? petty theft? What is the value of the phone? Did the lucky guy steal it out of the engineers pocket?
 
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