Guys, face it. Leopard's not coming until June. With a list of known issues this long (and serious), there's still a fair amount of work to be done.
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Leopard Build 9a410 Seeded
- Thread starter AppleMan101
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well... i have some serious spam... err... posting to do!
Well let me know when or where you're gonna spam .. err... post.. Cause I NEED an avatar!
Ang
there does appear to still be a hell of a lot of work to do on 10.5 given we are expecting it at the latest by WWDC07
Interesting. I do agree that something is fishy with the known problems list. I don't really think Apple would cripple the software on purpose, however...
The known problems list seems to be made up of a lot of bugs which may be either simple to fix, or specific to upgrading to Leopard from an earlier Leopard build. A few, however, do seem serious.
And more things must have been changed than is on that list of changes... unless, of course, the developers have all taken a six-week vacation.
The known problems list seems to be made up of a lot of bugs which may be either simple to fix, or specific to upgrading to Leopard from an earlier Leopard build. A few, however, do seem serious.
And more things must have been changed than is on that list of changes... unless, of course, the developers have all taken a six-week vacation.
oh please. yes, that's a brilliant idea. let's seed buggy software to developers. do you even know how software development works? i am so tired of this utter nonsense of looking for conspiracy theories where there are none. leopard is progressing, it's not close to release. when it is we'll catch wind of it through increased seeds.
jesus, i feel like chris rock "there is no sex in the champagne room". there are no secret builds of leopard. it's not coming out "any day now". there won't be a last minute build that "removes debug code" and "optimizes" the OS so it feels "snappier". it's just not happening
That is so plausable. It is easy to leak and distribute software in this day and age. Why would Apple allow someone the chance to leak/distribute a copy of the most anticipated OS in years? They probably have features broken up into several departments to keep one person from leaking a full copy. The rabbit hole goes deep on this topic.
This is completely the reason the apples seeds are sew bad
D ) After finding out their dev seeds get posted to torrents, I don't blame them for doing this, it would be just like free linux if they didn't make it so damn buggy.
If you look at the list of bugs, they are OS X application feature bugs, not framework and library bugs. iChat doesn't have to be bug free in order for you to test your app against Leopard's core frameworks, libraries and OS system calls. And yes, I know how software is developed. I've been in the computer business in one technical role or another for nearly 34 years. How about you?
My view:
Leopard has "secret" features in internal builds, these are somehow disabled in the builds they seed to developers, so of course there will be a lot of bugs.
Well, that is what seems logical to me as a non-developer, so please arrest me if this is impossible. Sounds reasonable to me though.
Leopard has "secret" features in internal builds, these are somehow disabled in the builds they seed to developers, so of course there will be a lot of bugs.
Well, that is what seems logical to me as a non-developer, so please arrest me if this is impossible. Sounds reasonable to me though.
That is so plausable. It is easy to leak and distribute software in this day and age. Why would Apple allow someone the chance to leak/distribute a copy of the most anticipated OS in years? They probably have features broken up into several departments to keep one person from leaking a full copy. The rabbit hole goes deep on this topic.
You nailed it there! This is exactly the way Steve Jobs operates Apple, each develop their own section, but non disclosure agreements everywhere, so no one is allowed to talk about what he-she is doing. This avoids the big picture to leak out. It has worked that way since the original Macintosh, most recently with the iPhone, and also software get's the same treatment.
For the same reason, dev versions are still buggy. I firmly believe that Leopard is closer to release, than everyone thinks. They may have a last few issues to work out, hence the seeds, but i bet that the known issues already have solutions. Still think it will be ADC before it's released, but it will be a great release, less buggy than Tiger was at it's birth.
I know how software development works and I'm quite familiar with the architecture of OS X and therefore, I have no idea what you're going on about. It's not only entirely possible that Apple is plucking out secret features prior to seeding but also quite likely. That would be even more plausible should that particular feature be a stand-alone app like Automator or (less transparently) Dashboard.
A developer wouldn't need something like Automator or Dashboard present to test their apps. But, the not-so-careful removal of something like that would probably cause a list of weird bugs that appear to never get fixed.
To my way of thinking, the closer we get to June with these kinds of bugs still not addressed, the more likely it seems that's the case.
I suspect that when Apple is ready to go, they'll likely to a public presentation of the secret features of OS X and then seed a candidate build to developers so they can stomp any last-minute issues those things might cause... or not--remember, we're talking a x.0 release. It's sort of a given that there will be issues.
Nice burn...
Awesome rebuttal... why would a developer care if ichat works? and I don't think it is fair to slam someone's speculation with your own rant of speculation. I agree with daveL. I think we should be hearing more of Leopard soon.
Awesome rebuttal... why would a developer care if ichat works? and I don't think it is fair to slam someone's speculation with your own rant of speculation. I agree with daveL. I think we should be hearing more of Leopard soon.
<Dons Bonehead Project Manager Hat>
Let's see. One month == seven resolved issues.
Thirty-five issues remaining to be resolved.
Five months to resolve currently known issues.
Yup, should see a stable Leopard (perhaps as opposed to a "released" Leopard) around September!
<Throws Bonehead Project Manager Hat Down in Disgust>
Let's see. One month == seven resolved issues.
Thirty-five issues remaining to be resolved.
Five months to resolve currently known issues.
Yup, should see a stable Leopard (perhaps as opposed to a "released" Leopard) around September!
<Throws Bonehead Project Manager Hat Down in Disgust>
I still don't get the rationale for paying $500-$4500 per Developer license to then violate the NDA on BitTorrent.
I know that some dismiss it as a conspiracy theory, but compared to the info and access that we ADC members received during the Jaguar/Panther/Tiger development runs, we've been practically shut-out for Leopard and the seeds that have been provided have been buggy and surprisingly unstable for 'day-to-day' use.
If Leopard is going to hit shelves by June 21, either they're going to be burning the midnight oil in Cupertino, or Apple's holding out on us.
That is so plausable. It is easy to leak and distribute software in this day and age. Why would Apple allow someone the chance to leak/distribute a copy of the most anticipated OS in years? They probably have features broken up into several departments to keep one person from leaking a full copy. The rabbit hole goes deep on this topic.
Apple was very, very upset with the unknown ADC members who posted Tiger developmental builds on various P2P networks -- it had happened with prior OS's (Hotline was big in the OS9 era), but it had never been so widespread, nor was is so immediate -- many times, the ADC seeds were uploaded before the vast majority of ADC members had even received the Seed email from Apple.
It is frustrating, especially when you spend that amount of money and feel that you're not getting the access you paid for... all because some morons had to boost their online geek cred.
It's part of the reason that I'm not renewing my personal ADC Premiere membership and my employer has decided not to renew theirs accounts at this time.
I'm also curious if Adrian Fogge has considered that the seed notes are covered by the NDA, which means he violated the agreement by posting to InsanelyMac?
There has to be or Steve will lose at lot of the media's trust which would be a very bad thing and Steve knows this. It would be marketing suicide if there were no secret features.
Yeah, people need to get over this "OMG SECRET FEATURES" and "OMG NEW UI" thing. Look, just assume Steve Jobs lied (and/or just wanted to have a little fun at Microsoft's expense by talking about "copying") and get angry NOW. The last thing I want to see when Leopard launches is page upon page of "OMG I CAN'T BELIEVE THERE'S NO SOOPAR SEKRIT FEETURES LIEK NEW SHINY UI!"
Is a very dangerous way to poke fun at Microsoft, Steve is clever enough to know how to phrase statements. If he was poking fun then there is absolutely no way he would have phrased it that way.
Well this kind of blows my long standing theory of seeing Leopard's "secret features" at NAB..No way Apple is going to seed this build then 3 days later show off it's secret features..
So in June we will get 10.5, iLife, iWork, new iMacs, and the iPhone? Not to mention pretty much the rest of the product line including displays in the near future. Seems kinda strange to me.
That would be the logical conclusion. However it would mean that in 6 weeks of work, all Apple has done is change some wording in Terminal, which doesn't seem very plausible.
These seeds are essentially XCode + API seeds.