Let Apple know WE DONT WANT "HD Graphics 3000" in 13' model

[leman]

I think the future (in a few years) could look like this: the MBPs drop any dedicated GPU, moving more to the MBA style and look. If you want gaming: well, you have your new Thunderbolt interface which features insanely hight throughput and extremely low latencies, so you just plug your external GPU in. Would be a great usage model, actually

 

[torbjoern]

HD Graphics 3000 is TOTALLY a deal-breaker for 13'
it is a Downgrade!!!

Right now I just want 320m back, i am not asking much.

Why dont we summit the feedbacks all together?? To let Apple know "HD Graphics 3000" is a deal-breaker??? To make them do the right thing!! to tell them they NEED TO CARE ABOUT OUR THOUGHTS!!!



here is the feedback link:
http://www.apple.com/feedback/macbookpro.html

I just dont know what to buy now (2010 MBP or 2011 MBP )

Vote with your wallet.

 

[Davichi]

HD Graphics 3000 is TOTALLY a deal-breaker for 13'
it is a Downgrade!!!

Right now I just want 320m back, i am not asking much.

Why dont we summit the feedbacks all together?? To let Apple know "HD Graphics 3000" is a deal-breaker??? To make them do the right thing!! to tell them they NEED TO CARE ABOUT OUR THOUGHTS!!!



here is the feedback link:
http://www.apple.com/feedback/macbookpro.html

I just dont know what to buy now (2010 MBP or 2011 MBP )

I am not sure you know what you are talking about.

It's not that apple wanted to throw in intel GPU in there. They did not have a choice with the sandy bridge processor. Apple could only do either sandy bridge or nvidia GPU.

They chose sandy bridge because too many people cried over core 2 Duo last year.

They cannot fit in dedicated GPU in 13 MBP unless they take out optical drive. Then they would have even more angry people.

Intel HD 3000 was their only choice for sandy bridge.

 

[OllyW]

Early benchmarks show the new 13" is no slouch. I'd wait until it's been properly tested before writing it off completely.

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1102765/

 

[wannamacpro]

What problems? Curious...

Intel has an abysmal record of supporting their GPUs under any platform but Windows. Those benchmarks that are supposedly close to the 320m (but they're not, if you look closely) are under Windows. Ask any *nix user stuck with a GMA how good Intel's driver support is - even YouTube brings a GMA-equipped system to its knees. nVidia - essentially benchmarks the same under Windows, Linux, even OpenSolaris. I'll be waiting to see how the HD3000 does under OSX, but I suspect it'll be a Bootcamp-only affair for those who want to play anything 3D. Oh, and 3D support under Fusion / Parallels? LOL.

 

[lesyork]

Intel has an abysmal record of supporting their GPUs under any platform but Windows. Those benchmarks that are supposedly close to the 320m (but they're not, if you look closely) are under Windows. Ask any *nix user stuck with a GMA how good Intel's driver support is - even YouTube brings a GMA-equipped system to its knees. nVidia - essentially benchmarks the same under Windows, Linux, even OpenSolaris. I'll be waiting to see how the HD3000 does under OSX, but I suspect it'll be a Bootcamp-only affair for those who want to play anything 3D. Oh, and 3D support under Fusion / Parallels? LOL.

What happened in the past is irrelevant. What matters is that they're actually making an effort to work with Apple now they're spewing so many machines out with only their IGP to rely on.

 

[wannamacpro]

No one will care. They've DICTATED what you WILL use if you buy the 13". Otherwise, pony up the cash for a high-end 15" or 17". Those are the ones that really matter anyway.

13" is for casual use. Apple has dictated that. You want power? Go big. That's the way it is.

Next thread.

Nice attitude. Nobody here or anywhere else needs to do or buy anything just because YOU say so. What has been suggested is that upset prospective 13-inch purchasers either choose not to buy anything at all at this time, or choose to buy from a competitor. This is a perfectly valid strategy and one that has influenced economic decisions since well before you were born.

Apple is in the business to make money. If 13-inch sales drop without a corresponding increase in MBA / 15-inch purchases, Apple will respond with a model that better suits the market. If not, Apple will be vindicated and continue to produce MBPs as-is.

 

[mashsensor]

It's not that apple wanted to throw in intel GPU in there. They did not have a choice with the sandy bridge processor. Apple could only do either sandy bridge or nvidia GPU.

Apple had a choice, ie the new S series is thinner, lighter with the same chip+optical+dedicated amd gpu from Sony.
http://www.engadget.com/2011/02/22/sony-vaio-s-series-get-an-updated-design-core-i5-2410m-cpu-and/

Instead of redesigning the mobo, Apple took the more profitable route, and Apple has every right to choose this option because they are a profit oriented company. And we as consumers has every right to "Vote with our wallets "

end of story.

 

[LoganT]

Apple had a choice, ie the new S series is thinner, lighter with the same chip+optical+dedicated amd gpu from Sony.
http://www.engadget.com/2011/02/22/sony-vaio-s-series-get-an-updated-design-core-i5-2410m-cpu-and/

Instead of redesigning the mobo, Apple took the more profitable route by not redesigning the mobo, and Apple has every right to choose this option because they are a profit oriented company. And we as consumers has every right to "Vote with our wallets "

end of story.

I think Apple didn't want to sacrifice battery life. Apple could have shrunk the battery to fit a GPU, but decided that battery life was more important.

 

[wannamacpro]

What happened in the past is irrelevant. What matters is that they're actually making an effort to work with Apple now they're spewing so many machines out with only their IGP to rely on.

This is a nice thought, but nVidia and ATI / AMD have about an 8-year head start in optimizing drivers for *nix platforms (AMD less so). Oh, and Intel had a chance a few revs back and couldn't do it then. Not a foregone conclusion, but I would be very cautious about trading in an nVidia / AMD-equipped model for this one, until it can be demonstrated that the drivers are good under OSX (and Linux, for those who want to dual-boot an alternative OS).

Actually Lightpeak is the most exciting part of the new machines to me, as it paves the way for EXTERNAL GPUs (probably not in the immediate future, but maybe by the next rev). Imagine being able to hook your power-sipping 13-inch to a 27-inch Apple Display with a built-in 480x. Now that would be nice.

 

[Deliak]

To this day I have owned 5 different macbook pros, and believe me I love these laptops.
It amazes me how many people seem not to understand how underwelming the new 13" may be for someone like me. I believe that a laptop with a smaller form factor should not by default belong to the "low end" category. I love the mac hardware and design, I love a kind of laptop small and light enough to bring it everywhere I go, I would also love it to have a decent graphic compartment and the 3000 is utterly crap. The graphic capabilities of the Macbook Air are now better than those of the 13 pro, and the cpu will not help at all in a lot of applications. Let's not talk about games, and do not tell me "noone would play with a 13" laptop ", I would. For those who need benchmarks, the info to compare the 3000 to the 320M is already out there.

 

[Evil Spoonman]

I believe that a laptop with a smaller form factor should not by default belong to the "low end" category. I love the mac hardware and design, I love a kind of laptop small and light enough to bring it everywhere I go, I would also love it to have a decent graphic compartment and the 3000 is utterly crap. The graphic capabilities of the Macbook Air are now better than those of the 13 pro, and the cpu will not help at all in a lot of applications. Let's not talk about games, and do not tell me "noone would play with a 13" laptop ", I would. For those who need benchmarks, the info to compare the 3000 to the 320M is already out there.

Ever heard of this thing called physics? You can't pack a supercomputer into a 13x1" box. It doesn't work. By definition the smaller the form factor the lower the TDP. The benchmarks for the HD 3000 and 320M are indeed out there, and they show basically the same performance. So let me get this straight: you're complaining because the 13" laptop suddenly became twice as powerful at the same price point?

I think you folks just enjoy whining. Too bad you don't get paid for it.

 

[klaze]

How is the new graphics card if playing on bootcamp?

 

[Deliak]

Ever heard of this thing called physics? You can't pack a supercomputer into a 13x1" box. It doesn't work. By definition the smaller the form factor the lower the TDP. The benchmarks for the HD 3000 and 320M are indeed out there, and they show basically the same performance. So let me get this straight: you're complaining because the 13" laptop suddenly became twice as powerful at the same price point?

I think you folks just enjoy whining. Too bad you don't get paid for it.

Your benchmarks must be very different from those available. Cause as far as I understand it the performance of the 3000 is on par with a 310M...
And do not tell me you cannot fit a decent low end discrete gpu in the 13", have you ever opened it, cause I did and there is space.
And by the way there are plenty of examples of 13" laptops with decent discrete gpus. Lets talk about the VAIO Z, for example, which I would buy if it had the design and quality of Apple.

 

[I'mAMac]

Obviously the only sensible thing for Apple to do is take out the HDD, ODD, and cut half the battery and throw in 6970M Crossfire. Am I right?

 

[Deliak]

Obviously the only sensible thing for Apple to do is take out the HDD, ODD, and cut half the battery and throw in 6970M Crossfire. Am I right?

Well... I would gladly give away the Superdrive for a decent discrete GPU, but I still think that is not necessary and a discrete gpu could fit in a 13" (VAIO Z cough cough...).

 

[Airforce]

Ever heard of this thing called physics? You can't pack a supercomputer into a 13x1" box. It doesn't work.

Sure you can. This isn't the top of the line in the 13 inch category. If folks don't mind working with Windows, rather than OS X, you can have a much better laptop than this.

 

[cube]

Sandy Bridge has old graphics.

They should change all MBPs to Llano as soon as it's available.

 

[Evil Spoonman]

Your benchmarks must be very different from those available. Cause as far as I understand it the performance of the 3000 is on par with a 310M…

Reliable benchmarks using beta drivers show the HD 3000 about 6% behind the 320M. Today, some things are faster, some are slower. It's about on par. What benchmarks are you looking at? Nobody buys the 13" for its graphics performance anyways, so it's kind of a moot point.

And do not tell me you cannot fit a decent low end discrete gpu in the 13", have you ever opened it, cause I did and there is space?

I bow to your superior judgement of TDP. Clearly you know more than Apple's engineers about what their chassis is and is not capable of supporting. I'm going to go out on a limb here and say there's a reason the 13" is using 35W parts and not 45W parts like its larger brethren.

And by the way there are plenty of examples of 13" laptops with decent discrete gpus. Lets talk about the VAIO Z, for example, which I would buy if it had the design and quality of Apple.

Oh yes, because that's a comparison to make. Have you seen the Vaio Z? It's a much meatier piece of kit than the 13" MBP. It also sounds like an aircraft when running at full tilt, and the battery life isn't great no matter what GPU you're using.

 

[zulumonk]

Let's just have the benchmarks from reviews settle this one when the lengthy reviews come in so the bickering will end.

I also have a sneaking suspicion that the battery life is actually equal if not better in this update, but we'll see about that.

Yeah, I don't understand how people are making judgements before the reviews and benchmarks have been released.

 

[Airforce]

Yeah, I don't understand how people are making judgements before the reviews and benchmarks have been released.

It's standard hardware. You can pretty much figure around where it might perform just looking at its innards.

 

[sine-nomine]

I agree with the OP - if they can't fit a good GPU into a 13' laptop, they aren't very good engineers. If you're willing to sacrifice the portability by getting a model that big, you should at lest get some power with it.

 

[ravenvii]

From what I've read, the performance of the 3000 and the 320m is about the same. So it's not a downgrade. Not a upgrade, either.

But I'd be happy with it since we're finally moving on to the i5's with it.

 

[Hallivand]

So. Somewhat faster video encoding and....what else? You ain't going to game due to the crappy graphics, internet isn't going to go any faster, a REDUCTION of battery life. Aside from encoding I highly doubt anything else is really going to speed up.

Before, everyone loved the graphics yet hated the C2D. Honestly, what was wrong with it? Does having a perfectly capable processor impact on your workload? On your life?

Fast forward to now, everyone complains about the Core i5 KNOWING that they would have lost the good GPU.

Lower battery + lower performance GPU, yeah some "upgrade".

For the 2009/2010 13" Macbook Pro, the powerful CPU + GPU was the best combination and had been a very powerful machine. A great all rounder, both for moderate gaming as well as everyday work, encoding, email, etc. Plus it had a great battery, 7 and 10 hours. I bet if they stuck with the Core 2 Duo, the battery life would have been up to 12 hours or beyond. Easily.

I find it rather amusing how my 2009 13" MBP can still match the Intel 3000 integrated graphics, while maintaining the same 7 hour battery as the newest ones.

Oh and no, for those advocating the removing of the Optical drive, it's not going to happen. If you want that, get a Macbook Air for gods sake. They sell that for a reason.

Otherwise the Macbook PRO wouldn't warrant its "pro" status would it now.

 

[Evil Spoonman]

Whine whine bitch moan whine bitch I didn't read any of the pertinent threads and I don't know what I'm talking about.

Dude, your reading comprehension and tech awareness suck.