Lexus SUV Being Used for Apple's Self-Driving Software Test Spotted on the Road

[doelcm82]

I invite you to UK country back roads, just wide enough for one car, guarantee you better bring your brain as a tourist the poster is right , this software is going to struggle for a very long time and have limited usage at the beginning , probably highway driving as some form of cruise control

I've traveled those roads during my time working in Hereford. Well, not working, because I would have needed a work visa for that. I just "attended meetings" continuously for a couple of years.

I don't know why you think a computer couldn't handle situations like these.

 

[tardegrade]

Nope. Ignore the driving , look at the conditions a computer would have to deal with . I'm trying to demonstrate that driving it about instinct and common sense, how do you program those....even experienced drivers struggle on those roads...

It will be interesting to see the software negotiation between two autonomous cars coming nose to nose like this on a Devon road. For example legally a car travelling uphill has the right of way on a single track road, so the car coming down should reverse back to the nearest passing place. But what if that car has a queue of cars behind it and the car going uphill has nobody behind it and has a passing place 20 yards to the rear? In that instance most drivers going uphill will reverse, it's far quicker and more sensible. The software is going to have to negotiate with the oncoming car (assuming it's also autonomous, certainly won't be initially) remember the passing paces accurately etc. and know when it's acceptable to drive half the car into the hedge to squeeze past.

I imagine that when these are introduced, for quite a good while there will be many roads that they will not drive on autonomously and will switch to manual override and have to warn you of this in advance before you get to that situation. And if you are drunk and getting your car to pick you up from the pub you'll just have to take the long way around.

 

[doctor-don]

Since Apple is a U.S.A. company, one would think a vehicle made in the U.S.A. would be used.

 

[9081094]

Because Apple is a company which looks to the future, not one that is stubbornly stuck in the past.

Uh, i don't really understand your comment because all I see Apple come out with lately are products from the past. iPad, MacBooks, Mac Pro, iMac and even iPhones. Same with the software. There doesn't seem to be much of evolution there. Comparing it to the competition it's all stuck in old technology and even the OS aren't as advanced as they used to be. I really hope they've been working behind the screens at something incredible but somehow I doubt that when reading their plans with the iMac and Mac Pro.

 

[JeffyTheQuik]

Note to self: if I ever get something terribly ugly installed on the roof of my car, tell people I'm just part of Apple's self-driving car initiative to save face.

View attachment 697718

If I'm ever at a stoplight next to a car that has something terribly ugly installed on the roof of my car, I'll tell people that I have a phone in my lap, instead of looking terribly disappointed of what I'm seeing there...

Well done on your picture, btw!

 

[doctor-don]

Self driving cars, once they are in the majority, will change everything.

Journey times will be reduced, traffic will be a thing of the past and accidents will drop off the scale.

It is the future and to be honest it sounds a lot more comfortable than travelling in tubes.

Nope! Unless congested traffic can be reduced significantly by synchronizing traffic lights, the highways leading to and from cities will remain nightmares, and the only drivers who get on those highways will be those who HAVE to use those pathways to their jobs. Governor Deal in Georgia promised he would do something about all the Atlanta traffic with 24 hour 'rush hour' creep. He has NOT. The DOT thinks adding more lanes will solve the problem; it won't. All that will do is increase the run-off when it rains, creating flooding as we had in 2009.
[doublepost=1493382098][/doublepost]

Uh, i don't really understand your comment because all I see Apple come out with lately are products from the past. iPad, MacBooks, Mac Pro, iMac and even iPhones. Same with the software. There doesn't seem to be much of evolution there. Comparing it to the competition it's all stuck in old technology and even the OS aren't as advanced as they used to be. I really hope they've been working behind the screens at something incredible but somehow I doubt that when reading their plans with the iMac and Mac Pro.

You want teleportation?

 

[satchmo]

Since Apple is a U.S.A. company, one would think a vehicle made in the U.S.A. would be used.

Don't forget China. If it works in California and Beijing, Tim will green light it.

 

[avanpelt]

They're pulling a Steve Jobs and driving around with no plates. Nice!

 

[compete12]

Self driving cars, once they are in the majority, will change everything.

Journey times will be reduced, traffic will be a thing of the past and accidents will drop off the scale.

It is the future and to be honest it sounds a lot more comfortable than travelling in tubes.

No thanks. I like getting in my car and going wherever I please without having to get an OK from anyone and without getting billed by the mile. Just imagine your own automobile (if you can actually buy one, you'll probably end up "leasing" one perpetually) becoming an Uber, and Apple (or whoever else) getting a percentage of whatever your iDrive (taxi-meter) reports......billed directly to your iTunes account.

Remember, it's always about profits for these people. Don't give up your freedom.

 

[Born Again]

"Apple lacks innovation because they aren't catering to a small niche of nerds that hardly makes any revenue"

While many tech-minded individuals question Apple's competitiveness and long-term sustainability, I personally feel that the Apple brand has never been stronger in the eyes of consumers buying the products. We can go even further to say that the Apple brand is so strong these days, consumers are not shocked or surprised to hear rumors about Apple entering new industries like cars.

Meanwhile, it is the the tech press who still can't wrap their heads around the idea of Apple designing its own car.

How ironic.

everyone is doing their own driverless car. apple in this market isn't a surprise.

at issue is that apple hasnt done enough to improve their own products.

 

[MH01]

I've traveled those roads during my time working in Hereford. Well, not working, because I would have needed a work visa for that. I just "attended meetings" continuously for a couple of years.

I don't know why you think a computer couldn't handle situations like these.

In my experience there are so many blind corners . I find that automated parking struggles at best of times. It's a personal opinion.

 

[Gasu E.]

Everyone is coping everyone. How about coming out with something just as innovating but totally different?

I know, right? Apple's so-called "Apple Car" looks exactly like a Lexus SUV. Talk about copycats! Apple's greedy, Tim sucks, Jonny's lost it, Steve would never have allowed this, and why aren't these engineers working on my Mac Pro?

 

[Abazigal]

Uh, i don't really understand your comment because all I see Apple come out with lately are products from the past. iPad, MacBooks, Mac Pro, iMac and even iPhones. Same with the software. There doesn't seem to be much of evolution there. Comparing it to the competition it's all stuck in old technology and even the OS aren't as advanced as they used to be. I really hope they've been working behind the screens at something incredible but somehow I doubt that when reading their plans with the iMac and Mac Pro.

The iPad and iPhone are both fairly new, relative to the Mac at any rate (it's what? 30 years old now?). I personally feel that any talk of moving past the iPhone is still premature at this stage. It probably still has at least another 5 years going for it? Before the discussion can pivot to what I believe will be Apple's next major platform - wearables.

As to your point about old tech, I would revisit an earlier point made in another thread about the technology being the means, but the user experience being the end. Apple isn't a company who crams the latest tech into a product just so they can boast about specs. Rather, their design led culture means they will use whatever tech is needed to achieve a desired user experience, nothing more, nothing less.

This is why we got a tablet running a mobile OS, an ARM processor with 256mb of ram and still sporting smoother performance than a windows tablet. We got the iPad precisely because Apple had enough common sense not to fall into the trap of letting the technology dictate the end product. Something which many a company still falls prey to even till this day.

This is why ios devices enjoy better performance despite having lesser ram and fewer cores.

That's why I am happy using my Apple devices. Because the user experience is literally better than the sum of their parts combined, so I don't lose sleep over the fact that my iPhone has a lower screen resolution than the S8, or a hundred other things Apple products routinely get criticised for lacking.
[doublepost=1493387084][/doublepost]

By your own words, Apple's self driving car is destined to fail because they don't control both the hardwade and software. Apple doesn't make cars.

Carplay is failure due to Apple not controlling both hardware and software. Apple doesn't make car stereos or head units. Look in the forums and you'll see tons of complaints about Bluetooth syncing with iPhones and cars.

Not yet, at any rate, but I believe that it's only a matter of time before we hear of Apple designing their own car. The temptation is simply too great not to, given their obsession with design and their desire to control the whole user experience from end to end.

 

[neliason]

It's just not possible to create a self driving car that can handle all possible scenario. Why?? Because we have been trying and not been successful in creating a computer that can mimic human brain. Until then, we all can keep dreaming!!

I'd say you can't build an artificial mind. Man possesses a mind which is not the same as a brain. They can program computers with advanced algorithms but it will never have a mind. I think in the real world this means lots of bad things can happen when a car computer is in control. That isn't to say autopilot isn't a great thing. For modern airplanes it works great. But ironically that is a much simpler environment than our roads.

 

[wordup60]

Tesla has yet to turn a profit

Technically, they did turn a profit, in Q1/2013:

 

[doelcm82]

In my experience there are so many blind corners . I find that automated parking struggles at best of times. It's a personal opinion.

Human drivers struggle (and sometimes fail) with blind corners. Computers are always alert, can look in several directions at the same time, and have faster reaction times.

I suspect that the automated parking that you (or I) have used up to now is not up to the task of fully automated driving, but we're not talking about that level of automation.

I also think the technology will be ready for fully automated driving before the regulations are changed to allow it. You won't see cars without steering wheels for a long time, but by the time you do, you'll be accustomed to "driving" without your hands on the wheel most of the time.
[doublepost=1493389657][/doublepost]

It's just not possible to create a self driving car that can handle all possible scenario. Why?? Because we have been trying and not been successful in creating a computer that can mimic human brain. Until then, we all can keep dreaming!!

Our human brains can't handle all possible scenarios. Computers can already do better than a brain in some situations. They react faster, don't get distracted or sleepy, don't get drunk.

We don't need (or want) the car's automated system to mimic a human brain. It needs to be tailored to the task of driving. It doesn't need to get angry, or fall in love, or do other things that human brains do that don't help driving at all.

 

[MH01]

Human drivers struggle (and sometimes fail) with blind corners. Computers are always alert, can look in several directions at the same time, and have faster reaction times.

I suspect that the automated parking that you (or I) have used up to now is not up to the task of fully automated driving, but we're not talking about that level of automation.

I also think the technology will be ready for fully automated driving before the regulations are changed to allow it. You won't see cars without steering wheels for a long time, but by the time you do, you'll be accustomed to "driving" without your hands on the wheel most of the time.

How does a computer see around a corner ? I'd argue that it's fear of the unknown that makes us alert and cautions . We also learn from experience.

fear is a major factor in safety when it comes to situations like these. The other factor the computer will struggle with is road rules, and that on roads like these humans use common sense and not road rules . It's gonna get its knickers in a twist

 

[doelcm82]

How does a computer see around a corner ? I'd argue that it's fear of the unknown that makes us alert and cautions . We also learn from experience.

fear is a major factor in safety when it comes to situations like these. The other factor the computer will struggle with is road rules, and that on roads like these humans use common sense and not road rules . It's gonna get its knickers in a twist

Humans can't see around corners. Sometimes they are less fearful and less cautious than they should be. Computers don't need fear to be cautious.

The common sense can be programmed into the system. When you meet an oncoming vehicle on a single track road:

1. Slow or hesitate.
2. Try to establish communication with the other vehicle (If it is automated as well, you can choose the most efficient resolution). Watch for obvious signals from the driver.
3. Remember the location of the last passing place you (the computer) saw. If it is within some parameter, then almost immediately reverse.
4. If the other vehicle reverses first, follow its lead.
5. If the other vehicle should be the one to reverse, but doesn't, then reverse to the last passing place.
6. Follow the local norms to determine if you, or the other vehicle should be the one to pull into the turnout, but gracefully handle the situation if the other vehicle doesn't follow those norms (it could be a less-knowledgable human driver).
7. Don't wear knickers if you are a computer. That is not appropriate.

Not that big a deal. Scarier for a human who hasn't done it before than for a computer that received the algorithm in a software update after other automated cars encountered the situation.

 

[pdaholic]

You missed the point.

You and the other guy missed the point of my original post...a joke referring to the number of "brainless" drivers on the road. Apparently all drivers in Britain are expert drivers with brains more powerful than any supercomputer ever built--but incapable of comprehending a joke. And I'll add a smiley face indicating that the last bit of this post was a little more of the old "tongue-in-cheek."

 

[jedifaka]

You drive a Crown Vic by choice? And want people to believe your opinions about cars?

Fair 'nuff.

Those Lexus SUVs suck. You pay a lot of money for it, and it has the Lexus brand name, but it drives like a Toyota.
[doublepost=1493355723][/doublepost]
Whether or not you're talking about buying American(tm), I'm convinced that Japanese cars are inferior nowadays. American cars handle better and seem to have caught up in terms of fuel economy. I used to drive a 2010 Honda Accord, and it handled like garbage compared to my uncle's Chevy Malibu and the 2005 Ford Crown Victoria I now drive. But I think the German companies still make the best cars.

 

[Stefan johansson]

Soo,anyone really thought that Apple would in fact build the car themselves? Most likely,Apple will provide the self driving equipment,that will be installed in other companies cars,like Tesla,Volvo,Lexus,BMW or Mercedes Benz. Many of those already offer alternatives with CarPlay.

 

[groovyd]

This is such old school thinking. It's like the patent commissioner (Charles Duell) saying "everything that can be invented has been invented." back in 1899.

"We" may have been trying for years, but that's just how difficult the problem is. The fact that over a dozen of the top electronic and car companies have been working on it is pretty amazing and shows how unified 'we' are to create a valid solution.
[doublepost=1493353660][/doublepost]

This is like creating a high def version of a CD-rom to appease those who aren't willing to make the jump to streaming and downloading content. The billions of dollars it would take to change our nation's infrastructure are better spent finding a fully autonomous solution.

baby steps... it will take a long time for people to feel comfortable with that even if the technology was bullet-proof which it isn't and won't be for a long time. i also think the finacial outlay to 'upgrade' a autonomous only lane with something simple like an embedded wire would be a relative bargain for those cities in dire need for solutions to traffic problems. guessing it would be a lot cheaper then digging tunnels

 

[TallManNY]

Tesla has yet to turn a profit, and their success is contingent on the government continuing to give it expensive grants and tax breaks.

The future, as they say, is a riddle only time can answer.

Their current sales are slightly dependent on government grants and tax breaks. I suspect that their business model does not suggest that they need those at all in the future. If they can sell a high performing, stylish, all electric car for $40,000, they will sell as many of those as they can make. The future is a riddle. But what Tesla is doing now is impressive enough to bet on them being successful in the future.

 

[Millah]

Tesla has it all down pat. it's over, done, finished with. This is some scheme that sounded great in the Apple "lets re-imagine we are innovators" meeting and is just running out its course. Apple is already real busy with new watch bands.

Have you ever driven or owned a Tesla? They certainly don't have it "down pat." Far from it. They still leave MUCH to be desired in terms of fit/finish of their interiors. Little details break all the time. And I wouldn't call the user experience inside of a Tesla exactly Apple-like. They're trying, but their user experience is far from intuitive or dare I say "magical." They may have stolen several Apple UI designers, but they haven't given it the Apple touch. Yet.

Tesla is ahead in terms of technology and performance. And battery manufacturing. And charging stations. But they are certainly not ahead in terms of user experience and overall polish. They have a LONG ways to go.

Elon Musk wouldn't make disparaging remarks about Apple entering the space if he wasn't nervous. Apple wouldn't even be on his radar if Apple wasn't a serious threat to his business.

Oh, and way to be original with your watch bands sarcasm. Like we haven't heard that a million times on this forum already. Yea, that engineer sitting behind the wheel had to break his watch review meeting to get in that car. Because Apple doesn't have different teams working on different projects

 

[MH01]

Humans can't see around corners. Sometimes they are less fearful and less cautious than they should be. Computers don't need fear to be cautious.

The common sense can be programmed into the system. When you meet an oncoming vehicle on a single track road:

1. Slow or hesitate.
2. Try to establish communication with the other vehicle (If it is automated as well, you can choose the most efficient resolution). Watch for obvious signals from the driver.
3. Remember the location of the last passing place you (the computer) saw. If it is within some parameter, then almost immediately reverse.
4. If the other vehicle reverses first, follow its lead.
5. If the other vehicle should be the one to reverse, but doesn't, then reverse to the last passing place.
6. Follow the local norms to determine if you, or the other vehicle should be the one to pull into the turnout, but gracefully handle the situation if the other vehicle doesn't follow those norms (it could be a less-knowledgable human driver).
7. Don't wear knickers if you are a computer. That is not appropriate.

Not that big a deal. Scarier for a human who hasn't done it before than for a computer that received the algorithm in a software update after other automated cars encountered the situation.

You give programmers too much credit having worked in software development for 20 years.... from experience, this is not going to be easy......in theory sure, in practice . No.

From experience , I have little faith of
An automated system working in such conditions . Software tends to get its knickers into a twist when it meet a scenario that is not coded.... this does not end well in a passenger plane to car ....etc .

Nothing beats a human pilot or driver .

Come to think of it , new cars are a mess, as soon an something simple goes wrong, the dumb computer goes into preservation mode and shuts down the whole vehicle... it's really silly. Anyway that Is a different discussion where too much tech is not always better