Lexus SUV Being Used for Apple's Self-Driving Software Test Spotted on the Road

[doelcm82]

You give programmers too much credit having worked in software development for 20 years.... from experience, this is not going to be easy......in theory sure, in practice . No.

From experience , I have little faith of
An automated system working in such conditions . Software tends to get its knickers into a twist when it meet a scenario that is not coded.... this does not end well in a passenger plane to car ....etc .

Nothing beats a human pilot or driver .

Come to think of it , new cars are a mess, as soon an something simple goes wrong, the dumb computer goes into preservation mode and shuts down the whole vehicle... it's really silly. Anyway that Is a different discussion where too much tech is not always better

I also have 20 year professional experience in software development. The scenario you describe is not a kobayashi maru. It's a common driving situation in the UK, and it's not unheard of in the United States. When two cars meet on a single track road (or a long driveway), one of them needs to back up until they reach a place wide enough to pass each other. If automobile makers want their cars to work in areas where this is common, they'll code for it.

The ones who will freak out in these situations are the human tourists who reserved an automatic transmission ICE rental car only to find out that none were available and not only do they have to shift gears, but they have to do it with their left hand. And the only road that leads to their AirB&B near Arthur's Stone is not even a "B" road. Their nerves are already frazzled from the 15 roundabouts (and the car stalled in two of them). It's too much for their monkey brains to handle.

 

[Keirasplace]

Have you ever driven or owned a Tesla? They certainly don't have it "down pat." Far from it. They still leave MUCH to be desired in terms of fit/finish of their interiors. Little details break all the time. And I wouldn't call the user experience inside of a Tesla exactly Apple-like. They're trying, but their user experience is far from intuitive or dare I say "magical." They may have stolen several Apple UI designers, but they haven't given it the Apple touch. Yet.

Tesla is ahead in terms of technology and performance. And battery manufacturing. And charging stations. But they are certainly not ahead in terms of user experience and overall polish. They have a LONG ways to go.

Elon Musk wouldn't make disparaging remarks about Apple entering the space if he wasn't nervous. Apple wouldn't even be on his radar if Apple wasn't a serious threat to his business.

Oh, and way to be original with your watch bands sarcasm. Like we haven't heard that a million times on this forum already. Yea, that engineer sitting behind the wheel had to break his watch review meeting to get in that car. Because Apple doesn't have different teams working on different projects

People seem to forget people don't own a car to use batteries, stations or whatever they're goal is go A-B, Look Good, Go A-B with various level of comfort (for some), performance, reliability, low TCO; tech
is a means to an end, nothing else.
That's like people talking up Mhz or cores or ram in their computer of phone like its something that actually mattered.
IF the user experience is crap, doesn't matter what's under the hood.
If Apple can provide a great user experience, no matter what tech is used to do it, well people will buy it.

 

[MH01]

I also have 20 year professional experience in software development. The scenario you describe is not a kobayashi maru. It's a common driving situation in the UK, and it's not unheard of in the United States. When two cars meet on a single track road (or a long driveway), one of them needs to back up until they reach a place wide enough to pass each other. If automobile makers want their cars to work in areas where this is common, they'll code for it.

The ones who will freak out in these situations are the human tourists who reserved an automatic transmission ICE rental car only to find out that none were available and not only do they have to shift gears, but they have to do it with their left hand. And the only road that leads to their AirB&B near Arthur's Stone is not even a "B" road. Their nerves are already frazzled from the 15 roundabouts (and the car stalled in two of them). It's too much for their monkey brains to handle.

Let's agree to disagree. In my opinion we are a long way from automated cars being able to drive on roads with other humans or systems. Unless you can get everyone to sign up to the same system, it's going to be a kobayashi Maru

Apple maps cannot get the right locations in the UK, and we are discussing a car arriving at the right locations, where at time there is no internet connection? For this to work , you will need these cars to know each other's locations

 

[tongxinshe]

A few years behind what? They've been working on this since at least 2010.

No one has released a completely automated self-driving product. Everyone is still in the testing phase.

No, that's not correct. Google's Waymo is already out for customer use. It'll soon be everywhere as long as the regarding law passes.

 

[neutralguy]

Have you spent any amount of time on the road? It's clear that you don't need a brain to dive a car!

I live in SF Bay Area. That should tell you how much time I spent in traffic

That aside, let me give a simple scenario and tell me how the self driving cars will handle such scenario.

A narrow road that's only wide enough for one car to go but allows two way traffic. The only way a car can pass another is if one of the car moves a little off road and stops or if there is a turn about to stop.

So if two self driving cars are coming in opposite direction, how they will cross each other?
[doublepost=1493419723][/doublepost]

Let's agree to disagree. In my opinion we are a long way from automated cars being able to drive on roads with other humans or systems. Unless you can get everyone to sign up to the same system, it's going to be a kobayashi Maru

Apple maps cannot get the right locations in the UK, and we are discussing a car arriving at the right locations, where at time there is no internet connection? For this to work , you will need these cars to know each other's locations

I agree. How long does it take google map to update if there is a change on the street direction or a street has been replaced with different street? Until then what will the self driving car do?

 

[pdaholic]

I live in SF Bay Area. That should tell you how much time I spent in traffic

That aside, let me give a simple scenario and tell me how the self driving cars will handle such scenario.

A narrow road that's only wide enough for one car to go but allows two way traffic. The only way a car can pass another is if one of the car moves a little off road and stops or if there is a turn about to stop.

So if two self driving cars are coming in opposite direction, how they will cross each other?

Oh my. Yet another individual on this site who doesn't understand a joke. Brainless drivers. Too many of them on the road. People can't drive because they don't use their brains. Does that make sense now?

And I, too, live in the SF Bay area. I'm actually impressed with how relatively well people drive on 101 and 280 compared to other places I've lived. We seem to use our brains around here!

 

[IJ Reilly]

Their current sales are slightly dependent on government grants and tax breaks. I suspect that their business model does not suggest that they need those at all in the future. If they can sell a high performing, stylish, all electric car for $40,000, they will sell as many of those as they can make. The future is a riddle. But what Tesla is doing now is impressive enough to bet on them being successful in the future.

Do you have the actual numbers? I believe a quite significant percentage of their revenue still comes from selling compliance credits. The only way they escape from that need in the future is to perfectly execute the double back flip into a thimble of scaling up to manufacture and sell hundreds of thousands of cars profitably at a third the price of the ones they sell at a loss now, and do it within the next couple of years. Otherwise their goose is truly cooked.

I wish them luck, I really do. Because I think they will need plenty of it.
[doublepost=1493448520][/doublepost]

I also have 20 year professional experience in software development. The scenario you describe is not a kobayashi maru. It's a common driving situation in the UK, and it's not unheard of in the United States. When two cars meet on a single track road (or a long driveway), one of them needs to back up until they reach a place wide enough to pass each other. If automobile makers want their cars to work in areas where this is common, they'll code for it.

The ones who will freak out in these situations are the human tourists who reserved an automatic transmission ICE rental car only to find out that none were available and not only do they have to shift gears, but they have to do it with their left hand. And the only road that leads to their AirB&B near Arthur's Stone is not even a "B" road. Their nerves are already frazzled from the 15 roundabouts (and the car stalled in two of them). It's too much for their monkey brains to handle.

Now that got totally offensive for no reason whatsoever. I've driven many single-track roads in the UK as a tourist, shifting with my left unaccustomed hand and I can tell you it is a considerable adjustment particularly when you are the only one being polite enough to slow down and give way or you get the horn from someone behind you for taking an extra second to make sure you turn left onto the left side of the road. The first few days is the biggest challenge and the difficultly of adjusting has nothing to do with intellectual disability, thank you kindly.

 

[sudo1996]

You drive a Crown Vic by choice? And want people to believe your opinions about cars?

Fair 'nuff.

It's cheap and reliable and drives well. I'm a college student. What more do you want?

Just in terms of driving experience (obviously not luxury), it's a lot better than the high-end Accord and Crosstour cars I drove for years... which is sad, considering that it's an old clunker. I'd cite the Hondas' front wheel drive and ridiculous front-heavy weight distribution as the most likely reasons. Really crappy design.

 

[doelcm82]

Now that got totally offensive for no reason whatsoever. I've driven many single-track roads in the UK as a tourist, shifting with my left unaccustomed hand and I can tell you it is a considerable adjustment particularly when you are the only one being polite enough to slow down and give way or you get the horn from someone behind you for taking an extra second to make sure you turn left onto the left side of the road. The first few days is the biggest challenge and the difficultly of adjusting has nothing to do with intellectual disability, thank you kindly.

I should have said "primate brains," not "monkey brains". I wasn't suggesting intellectual disability. The situation I described was similar to my first time driving in the UK. I rented an automatic transmission, but the car rental place didn't have any available. I can drive a stick but had never done it with my left hand. I had a three-hour drive to get to my destination with terrible directions, using M, A, and even B roads (but no single track roads except for a couple of one-lane bridges). I found it very stressful.

I rented cars my next two trips to that destination, but starting with the fourth trip, I took the Heathrow Express to Paddington Station, and then bought a ticket to my destination.

 

[IJ Reilly]

I should have said "primate brains," not "monkey brains". I wasn't suggesting intellectual disability. The situation I described was similar to my first time driving in the UK. I rented an automatic transmission, but the car rental place didn't have any available. I can drive a stick but had never done it with my left hand. I had a three-hour drive to get to my destination with terrible directions, using M, A, and even B roads (but no single track roads except for a couple of one-lane bridges). I found it very stressful.

I rented cars my next two trips to that destination, but starting with the fourth trip, I took the Heathrow Express to Paddington Station, and then bought a ticket to my destination.

Fair enough. If you were arguing that machines might well be better at these tasks than we humans, then I take the point. As a species we tend to believe that we are far better at them than we really are as a whole. The population is divided into those who've had humbling experiences behind the wheel, and those who will.

I'd long ago given up trying to rent automatic transmission cars in the UK. They are virtually unobtainable. I once had the experience of driving a manual shift car, by myself, across central London from where I'd rented it, to our hotel, and from there out of the city. This was fifteen years ago, when all we had for navigation was paper maps. No accidents or incidents, but also no need to try that feat ever again.

All direction in the UK are terrible. Getting around the country by car is kind of national sport. No better way to see the countryside, yet you will very likely see more of it than you'd hoped.

 

[mrhick01]

No, that's not correct. Google's Waymo is already out for customer use. It'll soon be everywhere as long as the regarding law passes.

Public trial in Phoenix, AZ and still tied up in court. Farther along than everybody else, but far from a mature product.

The market is still wide open.

 

[TallManNY]

Do you have the actual numbers? I believe a quite significant percentage of their revenue still comes from selling compliance credits. The only way they escape from that need in the future is to perfectly execute the double back flip into a thimble of scaling up to manufacture and sell hundreds of thousands of cars profitably at a third the price of the ones they sell at a loss now, and do it within the next couple of years. Otherwise their goose is truly cooked.

I wish them luck, I really do. Because I think they will need plenty of it.
[doublepost=1493448520][/doublepost]

I was more thinking about the consumer facing grants and tax breaks. I don't think they expect those to go on forever. Compliance credits I think they do expect to keep getting and then selling. I didn't have their numbers but did look them up in their 10-K.

"We recognize revenue on the sale of these credits at the time legal title to the credits is transferred to the purchasing party. Revenue from the sale of regulatory credits totaled $168.7 million, $216.3 million, and $194.4 million for the years ended December 31, 2015, 2014 and 2013."

So well under 5% of their revenue comes from those credits.

 

[huperniketes]

Interesting. So I wonder if the car in this pic actually was an Apple test vehicle.

4 people with badges entered the car guarded by the man in black fatigues, with another guy talking to one of the passengers in the back. I snapped the pic in SF last year, the week before WWDC. Most likely a coincidence.