Liquid Glass - A must read critique

[fisherking]

Yet the moment a forum member dislikes Liquid Glass with objective reasoning, you quickly discredit their comments?

So I’ll ask you once again, since you love this UX: how is Liquid Glass an improvement over what we currently have?

see post above 🙄

'objective reasoning'... i see a lot of opinion, detailed explanations of why someone is 'right' and something is 'fact'. but i live in the real world, and UX/UI is an invention; a logical one, and amendable, not static.

liquid glass is simply the moment we're in. i am not saying it's an improvement, i'm saying it's not a step backward. it just is, and ppl will adapt, or whine until they tire themselves out.

 

[Apple Knowledge Navigator]

'objective reasoning'... i see a lot of opinion, detailed explanations of why someone is 'right' and something is 'fact'. but i live in the real world, and UX/UI is an invention; a logical one, and amendable, not static.

liquid glass is simply the moment we're in. i am not saying it's an improvement, i'm saying it's not a step backward. it just is, and ppl will adapt, or whine until they tire themselves out.

😂 Stop it you’re cracking me up

Well, enjoy your diffused white text-on-grey background with reflections; the forward-thinking movement we’re all struggling to grasp…

 

[fisherking]

😂 Stop it you’re cracking me up

Well, enjoy your diffused white text-on-grey background with reflections; the forward-thinking movement we’re all struggling to grasp…

'we're all..." as if a handful of people on an internet forum matters more than the millions of macusers in the world who just use their macs and don't sweat the minutiae.

we're in beta, and (hopefully) there will be refinements and improvements. but it will still be liquid glass (like it or not).

while you struggle, i'll continue to work

 

[M4th]

from all indications, it's an acquired taste...

 

[fisherking]

View attachment 2528680

from all indications, it's an acquired taste...

ha. if that's a female ass, i'm all-in. ☺️

i'd humble suggest that every new mac os look is an acquired taste for someone 🤔

 

[shijan]

The problem is that Apple just don't care about Mac anymore. It became smartphones company long time ago. Also Apple will not listen other people. They have corporate plan to make some new UI every few years and advertise it. Some (talented and less talented) designers came to some "bright" visual concept and convinced the head of department/corporation to approve it for all devices. Next a lot of money thrown into development advertisement and presentations with "smart" faces. So once it all done, they can't just change it globally.
What can we do:
- Don't update and keep using Mojave/Catalina (like i do). This somehow a dead end because macOS is not a Windows, new apps versions and new hardware not supported on old systems.
- Obey to any ideas that Apple generates (like fisherking) and spend few $K for new hardware every 3-5 years.
- Research more about possible UI hacking and customization of Sequoia. I already saw some new customization projects in development that don't require to disable SIP.
- Migrate to Windows or Linux systems.
- Don't use computer anymore.

 

[fisherking]

The problem is that Apple just don't care about Mac anymore. It became smartphones company long time ago. Also Apple will not listen other people. They have corporate plan to make some new UI every few years and advertise it. Some (talented and less talented) designers came to some "bright" visual concept and convinced the head of department/corporation to approve it for all devices. Next a lot of money thrown into development advertisement and presentations with "smart" faces. So once it all done, they can't just change it globally.
What can we do:
- Don't update and keep using Mojave/Catalina (like i do). This somehow a dead end because macOS is not a Windows, new apps versions and new hardware not supported on old systems.
- Obey to any ideas that Apple generates (like fisherking) and spend few $K for new hardware every 3-5 years.
- Research more about possible UI hacking and customization of Sequoia. I already saw some new customization projects in development that don't require to disable SIP.
- Migrate to Windows or Linux systems.
- Don't use computer anymore.

the macs are better-designed than ever. hmmm... perhaps apple does care about the macs? and you're on mojave/catalina? hmmm again.

we buy cars made by companies that don't ask us how to design them. we can buy a PC, or run linux. or get a chromebook. this is the real world, and you can live in it... or in some imaginary place in your head (maybe not a bad idea, considering the state of the world).

for now, i'm sticking with 'real world'

 

[Apple Knowledge Navigator]

the macs are better-designed than ever. hmmm... perhaps apple does care about the macs? and you're on mojave/catalina? hmmm again.

we buy cars made by companies that don't ask us how to design them. we can buy a PC, or run linux. or get a chromebook. this is the real world, and you can live in it... or in some imaginary place in your head (maybe not a bad idea, considering the state of the world).

for now, i'm sticking with 'real world'

Ah yes, the old “if you disagree with me then you’re not living in the real world”.

This is what a conversation with you has been like so far.

AKN: I dislike this new car model, it’s more difficult to drive.

FK: Unlike you, I’m forward thinking, I drive in the real world! That’s just your opinion that the windscreen is hazy!

 

[fisherking]

Ah yes, the old “if you disagree with me then you’re not living in the real world”.

This is what a conversation with you has been like so far.

AKN: I dislike this new car model, it’s more difficult to drive.

FK: Unlike you, I’m forward thinking, I drive in the real world! That’s just your opinion that the windscreen is hazy!

you're not hearing me. you can disagree all you want; apple won't abandon liquid glass because you don't like it. (they will, likely, improve it over the beta cycle).

and you can buy any car you want; it's called choice. (btw if your windshield is hazy, just clean it) 🤷

the rest is just stuff you're making up. i am nothing if not very specific about what i say and mean. i am not always right, but i am always clear. ☺️

 

[shijan]

Lucky there are more than 3 companies in this word that manufacture cars, so we can plenty of options to choose.
Also imagine - you buy a car and after 3 or 5 years it can't road 75% of roads because some company made new cars that use new type of wheels, and all roads changed to those new type of wheels and not compatible with old cars. And after 10 years fuel for your car no more manufactured because it is too old type of fuel.

 

[Apple Knowledge Navigator]

i am nothing if not very specific about what i say and mean. i am not always right, but i am always clear. ☺️

Perfect.

So how does Liquid Glass improve on prior macOS UXs?

 

[flowrider]

It’s not working well for a large number of users and they all have concrete complaints, like legibility issues… so it’s great that it works for you but you don’t care about anyone else?

I'm an 86 Year old guy with AMD and have no problem with legibility🤔

Lou

 

[Bungaree.Chubbins]

The problem is that Apple just don't care about Mac anymore. It became smartphones company long time ago. Also Apple will not listen other people. They have corporate plan to make some new UI every few years and advertise it. Some (talented and less talented) designers came to some "bright" visual concept and convinced the head of department/corporation to approve it for all devices. Next a lot of money thrown into development advertisement and presentations with "smart" faces.

A common and cynical viewpoint shared by many on this forum, but I don’t buy it. Apple Silicon Macs are amazing pieces of hardware that just wouldn’t be made by someone who didn’t care.

So once it all done, they can't just change it globally.
What can we do:
- Don't update and keep using Mojave/Catalina (like i do). This somehow a dead end because macOS is not a Windows, new apps versions and new hardware not supported on old systems.

No ****** way would I go back to Catalina again! I used it until last year, and I am ever so happy to be running Sequoia now, and odds are good I will be happy with Tahoe when I upgrade.

- Obey to any ideas that Apple generates (like fisherking) and spend few $K for new hardware every 3-5 years.

A bit reductive and dismissive.

- Research more about possible UI hacking and customization of Sequoia. I already saw some new customization projects in development that don't require to disable SIP.

You do you. I’ll not be doing that.

- Migrate to Windows or Linux systems.

You couldn’t pay me! I’ve done my time there, never again!

- Don't use computer anymore.

I suppose it follows that since I reject your initial premise, I also disagree with the rest of your post. I don’t reflexively like everything Apple does, but in my eyes their average is really good. In fact the issues that I can see coming that make me doubtful for their future are all externally imposed, and there’s not a lot they can do about it.

If you don’t like using Apple products any more, as you said, use an alternative! Windows and Linux are even better options for some people! No one is being forced to use Apple, if anything, using it is a choice against the default!

I’m not implying criticism is not allowed! Apple has made a few daft decisions over the years, and there are a few of their current decisions I’m not heaps happy with, but this endless pile on, nitpicking every detail in every beta, hating on every thing they do, is getting really exhausting. I’m not directing this at anyone in particular, but sometimes it seems to be the theme of this forum.

Nor am I implying that Liquid Glass cannot be criticised, but a lot of the reaction is quite hyperbolic!

Edit: typo repair

 

[fisherking]

Perfect.

So how does Liquid Glass improve on prior macOS UXs?

if you're gonna keep asking me the same questions and not reading my answers... what's the point? it's not an improvement as much as it's a change... and there's no harm in that, just as it's been ok in succeeding OSes since os x first arrived.

apple's job is not to make you personally happy, it's job is to sell devices. and it can move forward in whatever way it wants (and you can go along for the ride or stay on the sidelines and whine).

i see that you've made your choice 😉

EDIT: i don't love everything. am not, for example, crazy about how the buttons in control center become 'glass' when i move a slider. but i'll get used to it, and then, soon, i won't think about it; it will just be what happens when i move a slider.

ppl rant about a new look in the OS before they've even spent time with it; that is what i find curious (and funny) 🤷

 

[maxoakland]

I'm an 86 Year old guy with AMD and have no problem with legibility🤔

Lou

I'm so happy for you! Let's think about the people who do have problems with the Liquid Glass legibility. There are tons of them and they have posted many examples of the issues they have

Even if you're 86 and have no issues, you're not the only person on the planet

 

[maxoakland]

ppl rant about a new look in the OS before they've even spent time with it; that is what i find curious (and funny) 🤷

I started ranting about Liquid Glass after I tried it. At first, I was cautiously excited. But when I used it, I found it looks worse than the images and has tons of issues

 

[fisherking]

I started ranting about Liquid Glass after I tried it. At first, I was cautiously excited. But when I used it, I found it looks worse than the images and has tons of issues

how long after you tried it?

you're personally having 'tons of issues'? hmmm, my macbook works great with tahoe (i do find dark mode works better with liquid glass). but it's still early in the beta cycle...

 

[shijan]

And here we go... Now all other large corporations and manufacturers will blindly follow this "Liquid Glass" trend and redesign their UI. These oversized floating toolbars with hardly visible symbols will be everywhere.

 

[thenewperson]

And here we go... Now all other large corporations and manufacturers will blindly follow this "Liquid Glass" trend and redesign their UI. These oversized floating toolbars with hardly visible symbols will be everywhere.

View attachment 2529031

Eh, that’s just blur.

 

[StellarVixen]

And here we go... Now all other large corporations and manufacturers will blindly follow this "Liquid Glass" trend and redesign their UI. These oversized floating toolbars with hardly visible symbols will be everywhere.

View attachment 2529031

I am almost entirely convinced that the Google started messing with this few months back

 

[shijan]

Yes, Google Drive was redesigned to something similar even before Tahoe preview. But YouTube player was changed only today. Instead of simple bottom toolbar in player, now we have multiple floating groups of buttons and floating scrollbar A lot of visual noise.
By the way, i remember those old good times when YouTube toolbar was under the video. It wasn't overlayed over video during playback and was permanently visible without useless show/hide blinking. Louie Mantia also wrote about this strange and unpractical "fashion" to overlay player controls above video.

 

[redheeler]

You are giving me huge dishonesty vibes. You might like it, and that's ok, but saying that 26.0 has no issues is absolutely untrue.

Look at this for example.

View attachment 2528488
There is a problem with contrast in several places. Look at those checkboxes for example. They are almost invisible.

But to be fair, I will give them a benefit of the doubt. This is still a beta, and things may get tweaked (I certainly hope and expect them to be). At the present state, it has issues.

These UI elements look flatter than the Sequoia versions. The contrast of Apple's strategies is hilarious – let's bring skeuomorphic design and depth to iOS but flatten everything on MacOS. WHY??? 🙄

Really thought the era of half-baked MacOS updates lazily following similar changes in iOS was over but guess not.

 

[tomtattoo]

We have landed in a nightmare.

 

[StellarVixen]

The contrast of Apple's strategies

Welp, I guess there’s at least some contrast, somewhere

 

[shijan]

YouTube changed player UI back to old look. Seems they are still testing it. Anyway i am not optimistic about this, because soon or late it will changed permanently...