Mac OS X Lion Roundup: Recovery Partitions, TRIM, Core 2 Duo Minimum, Security Focus

[machewcoy]

I'm sorry, but this sounds like an exaggerated lieeeeeeeeeeeee. I'm so serious. And I had that 2007 macbook, with it's plastic that chips, and the swollen battery. Paid a premium for that.

I also had an even earlier (late) 2006 black MacBook with the cheap plastic that broke if you put your wrists on it and showed fingerprints like no other - and yes, my plastics DID break - a LOT. But, it was never a SERIOUS problem for me other than the down-time I had sending it to Apple and them fixing it (for free, I might add, even well after AppleCare had gone out). So, paying the "Apple-premium" for free and good customer service well after the allotted warranty has gone out? I'll gladly pay that.

 

[Macmel]

Yeah, it's a shame that upo release of Lion all previous MacOSX versions are gonna be automatically deleted from the hard drives of non supported machines...
WAIT! That's not gonna happen!! You have a perfect working computer that WILL be a perfect working computer after Lion is released...
So why the hell are you complaining exactly?

 

[RalfTheDog]

Anyone know if Lion will support whole disk encryption?

My question is, will it support whole disk encryption and TRIM at the same time?

Proof you can't please everyone lol. Oh no, 4gb of my 256gb or 500gb drive is gone. The humanity.

My problem with restore partitions is, they are a great place for malware to hang out. With any luck, Apple will use public/private key encryption and a high bit key to let anyone read the partition, but only Apple can write to it.

Yes - but only for SSDs from Apple. Insert an Intex X25 SSD, and you will see that suddenly there is no TRIM support after all. Oh well, I'm sure there'll be a way to circumvent it...

This is an early beta of the software that only supports a small fraction of the final hardware. It is far too soon to know what will and will not be supported.

I'm just going to pretend those frowns are upside-down smiles.

(Although, that's as good a theory as any for my pyromaniac impulses.)

I think we should turn them into happy fluffy bunny smilies.

Yes, it is there. From Apple: "the all new FileVault, that provides high performance full disk encryption for local and external drives, and the ability to wipe data from your Mac instantaneously."

I would love to dump PGP.

I plan to use both. I will use FileVault for the HD and PGP for sending encrypted messages and files. I love PGP's online public key system.

IN any case, some people might not agree with your thinking. My MBP is Core2Duo and I still think it's rotten of Apple to arbitrarily dump support of computers that still potentially have plenty of life left in them...

By supporting the old stuff, they would need to support 32 bit systems. This would degrade overall performance by forcing Apple to spend programming time on old hardware that few people use.

What is a "major" revision? 10.6 and 10.7 are both pretty darn light on features. Apple seems to be into doing a 'major' release version now to drop hardware more than to add features (like they used to do with Tiger inside minor revisions). Now when you count Windows versions, you seem to skip all the actual large updates (free updates at that). XP had SP1, SP2 and SP3. Vista had SP1 and SP2. Windows7 is really Vista SP3. So this "release" schedule is little more than a labeling game of what is "major" and what is not. You might as well compare Classic Mac OS to Win95/98/ME and OSX to XP/SP1/2/3. By that way of counting, the Mac is behind the times. It's really just how you count. If you start at OSX's introduction compared to XP you have 6 revisions of OSX released since then and Windows has had 8 (XP/SP1/SP2/SP3), (Vista/SP1/SP2), Windows7.

That is why they are the best revisions. Software developers need to get away from piling on new features and put more effort into making their new software leaner, faster and more reliable as well as less exploitable. The first step in doing this is to cut everything you can out.

 

[AidenShaw]

"Methinks thou dost protest too much."

Big difference between a special effect when doing fast user switching (are there any other examples?) and the huge variations in every aspect of the interface that occurred with vista.

For heaven's sake - "huge variations in every aspect of the interface". Hyperbole much?

If your system or connection (Remote Desktop Connection or virtual machine console) doesn't support Aero, you get a few changes - not "huge variations in every aspect of the interface".

Most transparency effects disappear. BFD. Taskbar popups appear as lists instead of thumbnails - again BFD since even with Aero the popups will be in list view if there are too many instances to show images. (Have 6 tabs open in IE in Aero - you see thumbnails. Have 60 tabs open, you see list view.)

And, since you seem to like legal trivia, look for the class action lawsuit that Apple lost for claiming (pre-OSX release) that the Imac would be great for OSX - yet when OSX released the Imac graphics was only supported in a degraded mode.

(for the title: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_lady_doth_protest_too_much,_methinks)

 

[lifeinhd]

Yeah, it's a shame that upo release of Lion all previous MacOSX versions are gonna be automatically deleted from the hard drives of non supported machines...
WAIT! That's not gonna happen!! You have a perfect working computer that WILL be a perfect working computer after Lion is released...
So why the hell are you complaining exactly?

I don't think you understand. Once a new OS comes out, developers tend to stop supporting older OSes. Unlike in the Windows world, the time between a new OS being released and a developer dropping support for an older OS is usually very short. While I agree, I could use a CD MB for quite some time under Leopard for the exact same things I'm doing today, the problem comes when I want to do something outside my usual routine. In 2012, I might need to convert an FLV to MPEG, and I'll need a converter to do it. Too bad no one still makes converters that work on 10.6. Looks like I'll need a new Mac for this simple little task. And that's why people are complaining-- at that point, they'll need to either find a workaround (borrow a Mac from a friend, do it at an Apple store, etc, all very inconvenient) or drop $2k on a new Mac. Apple knows which they're going to choose. And they can even sweeten the deal by making something like the Mac App Store exclusive to the latest OS, when there's no real reason it couldn't be released for the last generation OS as well.

 

[cmaier]

And, since you seem to like legal trivia, look for the class action lawsuit that Apple lost for claiming (pre-OSX release) that the Imac would be great for OSX - yet when OSX released the Imac graphics was only supported in a degraded mode.

(for the title: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_lady_doth_protest_too_much,_methinks)

huh?

 

[KnightWRX]

I don't think you understand. Once a new OS comes out, developers tend to stop supporting older OSes. Unlike in the Windows world, the time between a new OS being released and a developer dropping support for an older OS is usually very short. While I agree, I could use a CD MB for quite some time under Leopard for the exact same things I'm doing today, the problem comes when I want to do something outside my usual routine. In 2012, I might need to convert an FLV to MPEG, and I'll need a converter to do it. Too bad no one still makes converters that work on 10.6. Looks like I'll need a new Mac for this simple little task.

Why would people drop support for 10.6 6 months after the release of 10.7 when we're now something like 2 years after 10.6 came out and stuff still works fine on 10.5 ?

Not to mention, why would every trace of every app available today on the Internet disappear suddenly ? Does some kind of janitor go all over and delete every old version off the Internet when new ones come out ?

You're being quite hyperbolic here. PPC machines still work with Leopard today. Core Duos will live on much longer on Snow Leopard. And when OS X does stop being an option, you can always install Linux or one of the BSD's on your older machine and keep on converting those FLVs to MPEGs without having to buy a whole new computer.

 

[petsounds]

I didn't read through all 11 pages of comments, so I apologize if this has been discussed.

But the addition of Recovery Partitions, a seemingly innocuous feature, caused a giant LED bulb to blare through my brain. The Mac App Store, the move to "apps" aka locked-down software, removing boxed software from the Apple retail stores. Yes...so what's the next step?

In late 2011 or 2012 we will see a completely-redesigned Macbook Pro. It will not have a DVD drive. This will push all software sales towards the Mac App Store and its 30% revenue grab, and iTunes for music and video. If you're a software developer, you'll have to offer your software through some digital distribution means. A war of attrition is being waged on them.

Jobs will herald it as breaking the chains of physical media. "We send files through the network. Who needs sneaker net? In Lion you can do repairs from your hard drive. No more digging around for the recovery CD. So we got rid of the Superdrive. And just look how thin the Macbook Pro is now. Incredible, stunning stuff. We've always lead the industry in hardware advances. We were the first to remove the floppy. And now it's time to say goodbye to the DVD."

But between the lines of his gilded words you will find the phrase, "I own you now".

 

[KnightWRX]

the move to "apps" aka locked-down software

Apps is the short form of Application. It has nothing to do with locked-down or unlocked software.

 

[petsounds]

Apps is the short form of Application. It has nothing to do with locked-down or unlocked software.

By "app" I was referring to the software purchased from the Mac App Store.

 

[KnightWRX]

By "app" I was referring to the software purchased from the Mac App Store.

Well, next time say "Apps as purchased through the Mac App Store". Otherwise are how we to understand what you're talking about. And how is that locked down ? You can install it as much as you want on up to 5 authorized computers. You can de-authorize computers and authorize new ones.

Plus no one is forced to use the Mac App Store and while Apple may be doing away with optical drives, you can still purchase external USB drives.

I have personally never even clicked on the Mac App Store icon, nor do I plan on using it.

 

[petsounds]

Well, next time say "Apps as purchased through the Mac App Store". Otherwise are how we to understand what you're talking about. And how is that locked down ? You can install it as much as you want on up to 5 authorized computers. You can de-authorize computers and authorize new ones.

Plus no one is forced to use the Mac App Store and while Apple may be doing away with optical drives, you can still purchase external USB drives.

I have personally never even clicked on the Mac App Store icon, nor do I plan on using it.

Way to totally miss the crux of my post and focus on a minor point. Fact is though, software you get through the App Store is locked down, and probably will evolve to be more DRM'd in the future. But like I said, you're missing the point.

 

[KnightWRX]

Way to totally miss the crux of my post and focus on a minor point. Fact is though, software you get through the App Store is locked down, and probably will evolve to be more DRM'd in the future. But like I said, you're missing the point.

Yes, I am missing the point because your point is simply paranoia at this time. Mac App Store software is not locked down at all as I've stated and you're not forced to use it.

As far as saying it will be DRM'd in the future, that is all pure speculation on your part.

 

[AidenShaw]

huh?

It is an example of a class action lawsuit that Apple lost because the OSX UI would only run in a degraded mode on the original Imacs - which was counter to your claim that "Apple would never do anything that stupid".

Apple has done that.

 

[petsounds]

Yes, I am missing the point because your point is simply paranoia at this time. Mac App Store software is not locked down at all as I've stated and you're not forced to use it.

As far as saying it will be DRM'd in the future, that is all pure speculation on your part.

No, the point you're missing is that Apple is doing everything it can to "encourage" software developers to use the App Store. I'm sure we haven't seen the end of the carrots and sticks. But basically, boxed software will be dead on the Mac once they get rid of their DVD drives. Once Apple eliminates that delivery platform, they will put other pressures on software developers to put their stuff in the App Store. How they will accomplish this with the 30% margin is unclear, but every move Apple has made so far points to this being their endgame.

If they kill the DVD drive, it's also a pretty bad situation for music and video content. Buy a CD and rip it? Sorry. You'll need to do that on another computer. Want to watch a DVD on the plane on your Macbook? Sorry. But hey, we've got tons of great content on iTunes!

Apple rarely does things for no reason. And if they're investing engineering resources into Recovery Partitions, there's a strategic reason for that. And strategic decisions regarding major Apple software features are usually to expand or reinforce their walled garden.

 

[KnightWRX]

No, the point you're missing is that Apple is doing everything it can to "encourage" software developers to use the App Store. I'm sure we haven't seen the end of the carrots and sticks. But basically, boxed software will be dead on the Mac once they get rid of their DVD drives. Once Apple eliminates that delivery platform, they will put other pressures on software developers to put their stuff in the App Store. How they will accomplish this with the 30% margin is unclear, but every move Apple has made so far points to this being their endgame.

Encourage them ? Self-contained .app bundles only. Respects Interface guidelines only. No installers, no multi-file archives, no modifying the filesystem...

Really, there's more restrictions on the Mac App Store than anything. It's only a small subset of very simple applications that can even be submitted right now.

Again, you're quite making all this up. But even if you aren't, there's a huge step between Apple encouraging developers to use the App Store and forcing it as the only delivery mechanism for software. I don't even see how you can associate one and the other.

If they kill the DVD drive, it's also a pretty bad situation for music and video content. Buy a CD and rip it? Sorry. You'll need to do that on another computer. Want to watch a DVD on the plane on your Macbook? Sorry. But hey, we've got tons of great content on iTunes!

And how do you propose Apple kill the DVD drive ? That would require them to remove all USB ports... I don't think you've quite thought about this...

Apple rarely does things for no reason. And if they're investing engineering resources into Recovery Partitions, there's a strategic reason for that. And strategic decisions regarding major Apple software features are usually to expand or reinforce their walled garden.

What walled garden ? I think you're quite mixed up here. This thread is about OS X Lion, not iOS 5.

 

[lifeinhd]

I didn't read through all 11 pages of comments, so I apologize if this has been discussed.

But the addition of Recovery Partitions, a seemingly innocuous feature, caused a giant LED bulb to blare through my brain. The Mac App Store, the move to "apps" aka locked-down software, removing boxed software from the Apple retail stores. Yes...so what's the next step?

In late 2011 or 2012 we will see a completely-redesigned Macbook Pro. It will not have a DVD drive. This will push all software sales towards the Mac App Store and its 30% revenue grab, and iTunes for music and video. If you're a software developer, you'll have to offer your software through some digital distribution means. A war of attrition is being waged on them.

Jobs will herald it as breaking the chains of physical media. "We send files through the network. Who needs sneaker net? In Lion you can do repairs from your hard drive. No more digging around for the recovery CD. So we got rid of the Superdrive. And just look how thin the Macbook Pro is now. Incredible, stunning stuff. We've always lead the industry in hardware advances. We were the first to remove the floppy. And now it's time to say goodbye to the DVD."

But between the lines of his gilded words you will find the phrase, "I own you now".

Naw. Developers will simply put their stuff on write-protected USB drives and increase the price of their wares $10.

 

[macgeek18]

Oh god not a recovery partition. That's one of the things I love that a Mac DOESN'T have.....

 

[ozred]

recovery partition and TRIM - really? guess we covering the "about time" part of lion first

While trim support in the wild has been out for some time, what's truly amazing is in less than ten years Apple finally adopts a recovery partition. Just how amazing is that? It seems as though Apples rate of adoption is prehistoric.

Every PC, laptops especially, has offered a recovery partition for many years.

However I do know that one of Apples weaknesses is fear of change, or worse, to use a proven tecnology they did not invent.

Poor Apple, their arrogance, big mouth, and wild claims of innovation has them backed into a corner. Cowering must be miserable.

 

[John.B]

Every PC, laptops especially, has offered a recovery partition for many years.

However I do know that one of Apples weaknesses is fear of change, or worse, to use a proven tecnology they did not invent.

OK, one more time:

Windows PCs historically have been unable to boot from an external drive. So any recovery software either has to be supplied on optical disk or on a hidden partition on the boot drive. This is a workaround to the technical limitations of Windows.

Then the OEMs caught wind of this and started delivering their shovelware (and even the OEM version of Windows!) on recovery partitions; typically this is a reimage (ghost) solution. Often this doesn't let the user reinstall Windows on top of an existing installation. And forget about letting the user generate their own installation media from the recovery partition.

Ugh!

Macs have been able to boot from external drives (even the drives of other connected Macs) for years. Now they can even install from the optical drive of a networked Mac. A recovery partition isn't necessary to a Mac user, as there are better solutions.

If Apple deserves criticism on this front, it should be for not following through with the delivery of the OS, applications, and recovery software on a USB stick like they did with the MBA.

As far as "a proven tecnology they did not invent", at least they included a spell checker in the OS.

 

[notabadname]

Surprised we waited this long. Excellent.

 

[Luis Ortega]

Windows PCs historically have been unable to boot from an external drive. So any recovery software either has to be supplied on optical disk or on a hidden partition on the boot drive. This is a workaround to the technical limitations of Windows.

Not at all. I used to simply burn my recovery disk to a cd with programs like Acronis or Ghost since Windows 95 and have them safely stored if the hard disk went bad or the OS became corrupt.
Very cheap and more secure than putting the image on yet another hard drive that could become damaged.

 

[Kristenn]

While trim support in the wild has been out for some time, what's truly amazing is in less than ten years Apple finally adopts a recovery partition. Just how amazing is that? It seems as though Apples rate of adoption is prehistoric.

Every PC, laptops especially, has offered a recovery partition for many years.

However I do know that one of Apples weaknesses is fear of change, or worse, to use a proven tecnology they did not invent.

Poor Apple, their arrogance, big mouth, and wild claims of innovation has them backed into a corner. Cowering must be miserable.

I have a question. Did you sign up this month just to troll and spout of crap that you know nothing about? Seems that way to me but by all means, prove me wrong. Please!

Tecnology. I have a technology built into my OS called a spellchecker that would catch THAT abomination! Than again, I spend more than enough time while posting (especially if I am claiming it factual) to go over it and check for errors.

Before deciding what (Proven technology) is and what Apple should have done and have done wrong, take a look at yourself please, thanks!

As for the recovery partition. I hope they give me the option to remove it. I like to have all my hard drive space there for ME to use not for some recovery of my computer. I cannot remember ever having to reinstall an OS on any Macintosh I have ever used. My install/restore DVDs for my MacBook Pro remain unopened after two years so have 7 or so GBs of my HD for a recovery partition seems like a waste.

 

[elppa]

What is a "major" revision? 10.6 and 10.7 are both pretty darn light on features.

10.6 was, 10.7 isn't. 10.7 adds more notable new features than Windows 7 added to Vista and we are finding about more and more changes every day.

You might as well compare Classic Mac OS to Win95/98/ME and OSX to XP/SP1/2/3. By that way of counting, the Mac is behind the times.

But that would be a stupid thing to do.
Mac OS = DOS
Darwin (OS X) = NT

It's really just how you count. If you start at OSX's introduction compared to XP you have 6 revisions of OSX released since then and Windows has had 8 (XP/SP1/SP2/SP3), (Vista/SP1/SP2), Windows7.

It would be at least 7 (10.0, 10.1, 10.2, 10.3, 10.4, 10.5, 10.6). But the whole argument is silly. Both companies come at it from completely different angles.

Apple have developed OS X quicker than Microsoft have built Windows and a large part of that is due to Microsoft' focus on the enterprise and needing to preserve legacy. That doesn't mean either approach is right or wrong, just different.

 

[diamond.g]

OK, one more time:

Windows PCs historically have been unable to boot from an external drive. So any recovery software either has to be supplied on optical disk or on a hidden partition on the boot drive. This is a workaround to the technical limitations of Windows.

Then the OEMs caught wind of this and started delivering their shovelware (and even the OEM version of Windows!) on recovery partitions; typically this is a reimage (ghost) solution. Often this doesn't let the user reinstall Windows on top of an existing installation. And forget about letting the user generate their own installation media from the recovery partition.

Ugh!

Macs have been able to boot from external drives (even the drives of other connected Macs) for years. Now they can even install from the optical drive of a networked Mac. A recovery partition isn't necessary to a Mac user, as there are better solutions.

If Apple deserves criticism on this front, it should be for not following through with the delivery of the OS, applications, and recovery software on a USB stick like they did with the MBA.

As far as "a proven tecnology they did not invent", at least they included a spell checker in the OS.

Of course not every Mac user is going to have an extra HD around that just so happens to have an extra version of the system on it. But your point does stand. With Apples eventual move to SSD and removal of the ODD it would seem like the recovery partition is a way to not have to include a USB key with every Mac (as that is potentially expensive for little return).