Mac Pro Announced

[Evangelion]

Nice!!! Most likely you made a wise decision to purchase your addional RAM and HD from a third party. Apple requires arms and legs for their optional upgrades.

FB-DIMM RAM is hard to find, and I bet it costs arm and a leg no matter where you buy it from

 

[Multimedia]

Hey Lighten Up. NVIDIA GeForce 7300 GT 256MB Is Plenty For 95% Of Us

What is it with these excuses? It's OK so ship sub-par vid-card as standard with their hi-end workstation because not EVERYBODY needs fast vid-card? Hell by that token, maybe they should use Celerons as standard on these machines, since not _everybody_ needs fast CPU's?

They could offer a faster vid-card, and make the crappier vid-card a BTO for those who don't need fast graphics. GF7300 is a low-end GPU. And this is a hi-end machine.

Hey calm down. 95% of users don't need anything faster than that base card. Remember they are going to ship the base config to all sorts of dealers who will not be doing BTO. It still supports one 30" as well as a 23/34" Monitor. Lighten up man. Offering the lower end card as regular config is the right thing for Apple to do. I would rather drive 4 screens for an extra $150 than a whole bunch of extra money for cards most don't need and never will need.

 

[Multimedia]

Only $344 For A Pair Of Crucial 1GB Sticks

FB-DIMM RAM is hard to find, and I bet it costs arm and a leg no matter where you buy it from

Not bad. A Pair of 1GB sticks from Crucial for that motherboard is only $344.

All Intel S5000XVN Memory Upgrades (RAM) - This is the Intel Motherboard Apple uses in the Mac Pro.

Crucial Part Number: CT2KIT12872AF667
Module Size: 2GB kit (1GBx2)
Package: 240-pin DIMM
Feature: DDR2 PC2-5300
Specs: DDR2 PC2-5300 • CL=5 • FULLY BUFFERED • ECC • DDR2-667 • 1.8V • 128Meg x 72

Looking forward to what OmniTech can offer them for in a month or so. I would say that $172 per GB is not an arm and a leg. Maybe a pinky finger... But not too dear - especially in light of what a bargain the Mac Pro is in the first place. It's $1200 cheaper than the same DELL. That's more than enough savings to fill it with 6GB more.

 

[Evangelion]

There are many of you I want to beat with a spiky stick right now. Let's consolidate you into one bullet-point list of whiners:

Ah, more excuses

1. You are going to spend thousands on a Mac PRO and you are going to pitch a fit over adding wireless for less than 80 bucks? Guess what, these are PROFESSIONAL WORKSTATIONS, not consumer internet computers. The target demographic of these computers is a wired-network setting. Obviously home users and others may have use for wireless in a Mac Pro, so that's why Apple OFFERS IT.

Lets re-phrase that: "Apple is going to ask over two grand for this machine, and for that money I can't get the features that come standard in the bottom of the barrel model?!?! Features that cost about 20 bucks for Apple to implement!?"

2. What applications do you need that a Mac Mini Core Duo can't handle? Oh, games? Why in the sweet baby Jesus' name are you on MACrumors if you're a gamer?

You are saying that I can't (or shouldn't) install Windows on one of these machines for occasional game or two? I could use OS X for just about everything, and then dual-boot to Windows for occasional game or two. Apple is basically telling me that "yes please, give our competitors your money. We are not interested in having it". They are making it very easy for consumer to buy a cheaper Mac and a Windows-PC, instead of just getting a bit more expensive Mac, and dropping the PC entirely.

Which of those scenarion would benefit Apple more?

Leave the grownups alone.

Ah yes, the good 'ol "games are for kids!"-argument....

 

[Evangelion]

Hey calm down. 95% of users don't need anything faster than that base card.

And the default-card could be something faster, while the penny-pinchers could have a cheaper BTO-model. Fact is that there are PC's out there that cost maybe half of MacPro, that offer way better vid-cards.

Offering the lower end card as regular config is the right thing for Apple to do. I would rather drive 4 screens for an extra $150 than a whole bunch of extra money for cards most dont' need and never will need.

They could have a better vid-card in there, while keeping the price the way it is. Yes, Apple would have slightly less margins, but not that much. And there would still be an option for cheaper vid-card. 7300 is a low-end card. It really is.

In short: I'm saying that they should offer better vid-card as standard for that amount of money they are asking. You (and others) are basically saying that they shouldn't do that?

I might sound like I hate the new machine. I don't. It's a clear step forward, and I would REALLY like to have one . But I dislike when we have such a great machine that have few flaws in it. The vid-card flaw would cost a bit for Apple to fix, but it shouldn't be anything major. The wireless-issue is just lame. It can be found in their bottom of the barrel machine (like Mini), yet their uber-machine doesn't have it?

 

[CHROMEDOME]

There should be a 7600 in there, that would be a better solution than the 7300 for sure.

 

[Evangelion]

Did anyone see the QT stream and find out what did steve actually say. The MRLIVE quotes it as "10:24 am lots more announcements during the next week"

Which one is true? The former seems to hint software announcements during WWDC while the latter makes me think more hardware announcements in the upcoming weeks

Since SJ said that when talking about third-party apps being made universal, I bet he meant that there will be more announcements regarding third-party software during the conference. In short: "There are over 3000 univerals applications, with lots more being announced during the conference".

 

[Multimedia]

Nothing Apple Does Is Ever 100% Right For Any Of Us

And the default-card could be something faster, while the penny-pinchers could have a cheaper BTO-model. Fact is that there are PC's out there that cost maybe half of MacPro, that offer way better vid-cards.

They could have a better vid-card in there, while keeping the price the way it is. Yes, Apple would have slightly less margins, but not that much. And there would still be an option for cheaper vid-card. 7300 is a low-end card. It really is.

In short: I'm saying that they should offer better vid-card as standard for that amount of money they are asking. You (and others) are basically saying that they shouldn't do that?

I might sound like I hate the new machine. I don't. It's a clear step forward, and I would REALLY like to have one . But I dislike when we have such a great machine that have few flaws in it. The vid-card flaw would cost a bit for Apple to fix, but it shouldn't be anything major. The wireless-issue is just lame. It can be found in their bottom of the barrel machine (like Mini), yet their uber-machine doesn't have it?

I don't know video cards. Are you saying the "NVIDIA GeForce 7300 GT 256MB" is a like a $75 list card they are selling multiples of for $150? I only have a "NVIDIA GeForce 6600 256MB" in the Quad G5 and I think it's great. So the 7300 GT has got to be a lot better 'cause it's got a higher number plus a GT on the end of the number doesn't it?

A lot of people don't need Wi-Fi or Bluetooth in their workstation. I don't have it in my Quad G5 and have never missed it. Direct hard wire to internet through a router is faster as well as on the local GB network. I am surprised to learn today that Wi-Fi in the Mac Pro will eat a PCI Express slot. That blows. In the G5's it's got a dedicated Airport slot - or did before PCI Express. I would have to look into if it still has a dedicated slot in the Dual Core and Quad G5's.

I hear you. But I doubt Apple will change their plan.

 

[shompa]

Does anyone know if this systems absolutely *REQUIRES* ECC RAM?

ECC is very expensive!

It is FULLY BUFFERED ECC in the MacPro. It is even more expensive.

But it is faster than normal ram, since it have a buffer.

It "feels" like EDO ram, back in time. A memory chip on the memory chip to speed up things.

Found som Crusial Fully buffered ECC. Really really expensive. 300% more than ordinary PC 5400 memory.

 

[Multimedia]

Mac Pro RAM Doesn't Seem Too Expensive To Me

It is FULLY BUFFERED ECC in the MacPro. It is even more expensive.

But it is faster than normal ram, since it have a buffer.

It "feels" like EDO ram, back in time. A memory chip on the memory chip to speed up things.

Found som Crusial Fully buffered ECC. Really really expensive. 300% more than ordinary PC 5400 memory.

$172 per GB Stick is Too Expensive? That's only a shade more than twice what I paid for PC2-4200 Quad G5 RAM. Seems reasonable to me. Why do you think it's too expensive?

 

[Multimedia]

We Don't Know Video Card Model Numbers Gamers

There should be a 7600 in there, that would be a better solution than the 7300 for sure.

You video card know-it-alls should be providing links to card web-sites so we can read more about it. You toss model numbers around like everybody knows what the hell you are writing about when almost none of us do.

 

[Evangelion]

I still don't understand the people that complain about not having WiFi and Bluetooth standard. This is a Tower. You are not going to be moving it around too much so WiFi is pointless.

With WiFi you can eliminate one more cable. I want as few cables as possible

Also Bluetooth can be had with a $20 USB Adapter if you are going to use it all the time.

USB-dongles hanging from the back? No thanks.

I dare somebody to find any other computer that even has WiFi and or Bluetooth standard.

Mac Mini? the iMac?

 

[Evangelion]

I was thinking this myself until I saw it was 4 x 512mb sticks. That just sucks. If it was 2 x 1gb sticks I would say not bad but its not good.

Since the bus is 256bits wide, the RAM needs to be installed four at a time. OK, you COULD install it in pairs, but you would only get 128bit bus then.

 

[Evangelion]

$172 per GB Stick is Too Expensive? That's only a shade more than twice what I paid for PC2-4200 Quad G5 RAM. Seems reasonable to me. Why do you think it's too expensive?

You basically need four of those sticks.

 

[artpease]

Not bad. A Pair of 1GB sticks from Crucial for that motherboard is only $344.

Crucial Part Number: CT2KIT12872AF667
Module Size: 2GB kit (1GBx2)
Package: 240-pin DIMM
Feature: DDR2 PC2-5300
Specs: DDR2 PC2-5300 • CL=5 • FULLY BUFFERED • ECC • DDR2-667 • 1.8V • 128Meg x 72

The above is NOT the official Crucial Mac Pro memory, although it appears to have the same specs.

This is the link to the correct memory.

http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.asp?model=Mac+Pro

You can't find it by searching, I had to call Crucial to get the link.
The part number for the 2x1gb kit is: CT576475 at the same $343.99 price.
You also can't find that part number by searching.

The picture at the top of the page doesn't show a heat sink, so I won't know if they include it until I get it.

 

[Multimedia]

So Your Problem Is That Apple Didn't Do 100% Of What You Expect?!?! That's Life.

Maybe. But last time I checked, Mac Mini and iMac both have wireless built right in, and those are desktops. And there ARE professionals who value clutter-free desktop. There ARE professionals who would like to use the PowerMac with WLAN. You are basically saying that "this is not an issue, since in many cases pro's don't need these features". You might be right, but you would be also wrong since many pro's do want these features!

NOT Many at all. A Handfull is a more accurate characterization.

You are basically making excuses for a lack of features.

Note: I do love the new MacPro's . _almost_ everything I could wish for, for lower prices than I expected. And I must say that these fit my predictions almost perfectly. I said that MAcPro's would be all Quads. And I was right. I predicted three models with 2x 2Ghz Woodcrest for $1999, 2x 2.33GHz Woodcrest for $2499 and 2x 3Ghz Woodcrest for $3499. I was almost right. I wished for 4x drive-bays and I got it.

I made the same prediction in January. So what. Many of us thought it would be an all Quad line-up. Big deal.

The point is that mini and iMac are TRANSPORTABLE computers that also belong in places where wires don't work. Mac Pros are in fixed work situations that not only do not need wi-fi, in MOST cases they do not WANT Wi-Fi.

You are what is referred to in the business as an atypical consumer. I am also atypical. My immediate need is for 8 cores. I will have to wait. In your case you simply need to BTO your Wi-Fi Bluetooth parts.

 

[macenforcer]

The above is NOT the official Crucial Mac Pro memory, although it appears to have the same specs.

This is the link to the correct memory.

http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.asp?model=Mac+Pro

You can't find it by searching, I had to call Crucial to get the link.
The part number for the 2x1gb kit is: CT576475 at the same $343.99 price.
You also can't find that part number by searching.

The picture at the top of the page doesn't show a heat sink, so I won't know if they include it until I get it.

That makes no sense. It is the SAME exact memory.

 

[Evangelion]

You video card know-it-alls should be providing links to card web-sites so we can read more about it. You toss model numbers around like everybody knows what the hell you are writing about when almost none of us do.

Well, since you care anough about computers to hang around in web-forums dedicated to computers, I for one assumed that you have at least basic knowledge regarding current computer-hardware. Anyway, Google is your friend.

 

[daneoni]

So whats the consensus, will we all be buying this MacPro revision at some point?. The Woodcrest chips seem to have a long cycle ahead of them meaning these should be around for a while.

Does anyone still have a link to the intel roadmap?

 

[macenforcer]

Well, since you care anough about computers to hang around in web-forums dedicated to computers, I for one assumed that you have at least basic knowledge regarding current computer-hardware. Anyway, Google is your friend.

For real.

 

[Evangelion]

NOT Many at all. A Handfull is a more accurate characterization.

I'm sorry, I forgot that you had that survey which told exactly what every single PowerMac-user wants from their computer .

Again: You are saying that "Not EVERYBODY needs this feature, therefore not having it is OK

I made the same prediction in January. So what. Many of us thought it would be an all Quad line-up. Big deal.

Well EXCUUUUUSE me!

The point is that mini and iMac are TRANSPORTABLE computers that also belong in places where wires don't work. Mac Pros are in fixed work situations that not only do not need wi-fi,

Let me quote Steve Jobs (from memory):

"And let me point out that we are still the only company that puts handles on their computers. We know that our pro users like to move these machines around, so we built handles on the case"

Said during the introduction of the G5 PowerMac. So what were you saying again? And I don't see Apple advertising Mac Mini or iMac as "transportable" machines. Yes you can move them around (naturally), but that is not a major selling-point for them.

in MOST cases they do not WANT Wi-Fi.

Well, it CAN be switched off, right?

 

[Multimedia]

I Blindly Follow Apple's Base Video Card Offerings Now

Well, since you care anough about computers to hang around in web-forums dedicated to computers, I for one assumed that you have at least basic knowledge regarding current computer-hardware. Anyway, Google is your friend.

I am not a gamer and I don't do 3-D. So I go with the Base Apple tells me to go with and that's the end of it. Back in the day when I was trying to goose my Cube 500 - as in .5 GHz G4, I cared. I don't care any more cause they all seem more powerful than I will ever use.

 

[artpease]

That makes no sense. It is the SAME exact memory.

Crucial sent me the link and the part number page says:
2GB kit (1GBx2), 240-pin DIMM, DDR2 PC2-5300 Upgrade for the Apple Mac Pro Desktop Computer,
which was the clincher for me.

 

[macenforcer]

Crucial sent me the link and the part number page says:
2GB kit (1GBx2), 240-pin DIMM, DDR2 PC2-5300 Upgrade for the Apple Mac Pro Desktop Computer,
which was the clincher for me.

Yeah, I don't doubt its the right memory, I just think its the same memory as the link before. LOL. I just pressed submit order on the other link for the 2 x 1gb dimms then you posted that. I was like OH MAN! I emailed crucial. Will find out if I got the right one.

 

[Multimedia]

Intel Core Microarchitecture Roadmap

So whats the consensus, will we all be buying this MacPro revision at some point?. The Woodcrest chips seem to have a long cycle ahead of them meaning these should be around for a while.

Does anyone still have a link to the intel roadmap?

Yeah when it goes 8 core and Leopard is on-board, I'll snatch a refurb from the SAVE page.

Intel Core Microarchitecture Roadmap. Found it with Google in about 2 seconds. Did you know that Google is your friend? Some here like to say so without providing links. I on the other hand like to say so with the link you want.