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Macbook Air 2012 - LG vs Samsung LCD
- Thread starter laff2
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Is it crazy to suspect that Apple is aware of the quality differences between the two display panels, and weeds out sub-par LG ones when choosing display models?
Given that about 50% of panels are LG ones, getting a luck of draw where all panels are Samsung is unlikely, assuming there are of order 10 laptops in the store display.
Anyone who has ever sourced parts for anything knows all suppliers receive the same requirements for the part and before Apple signs the contract, the vendor has to prove to Apple they can produce the part according to specifications and in quantities Apple requires.
Are you saying that the LG and Samsung panels are indistinguishable? Or just that Apple grants big margins of errors in their requirements to the part vendors?
They seem to be using 128GB ssd's from Toshiba with a controller from Sandforce (which doesn't seem to be the dreaded one in the Sandforce drives that causes lots of problems like with standby/hibernate/sleep) but the 256GB and 512GB drives are from Samsung (which is basically the OEM version of the fast and reliable Samsung 830 series). The 768GB one is probably also from Samsung. Seems like Apple thinks the Toshiba is the best option for 128GB while Samsung is the better one for 256GB and up.
Anyway, I ordered a 13" Air with the 256GB ssd as did the guy in your vid. Mine has the LG panel which I calibrated with my Spyder3 Pro (and it looks awesome now) as well as the SM256E ssd. Of course I tested it with the Black Magic app and I'm seeing high speeds above the 400's:
The 128GB drives have a lower performance because of the way these disks are constructed. The 512GB drive will probably be even faster than the 256GB one.
I think people should get their feet back on the ground. Lots of people are looking at the craziest things to explain things. It's completely useless because the factories order things in batches. They order parts at a couple of suppliers and thus you'll get a Samsung, AUO or LG at random. The position of the moon, the distribution centre around the corner, your wife's period, etc. have no influence on this whatsoever and certainly do not explain why some have LG, some have Samsung and some have AUO. The brand also says little about the panel itself because it is still impossible to construct tft panels with a consistent quality. That means that the quality of a panel will vary greatly, even within the same batch. Some LG panels therefore may look as good, even better or worse as the Samsung and vice versa. If you want the Samsung because you think that one is good then you need to have some luck. It is simply like a lottery.
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LTH133BT01A03 here with a 13" BTO i5/8gb ram/128ssd so i guess Samsung?
Yes, that is a Samsung display.
Your second question reveals your bias and while I imagine it's a rhetorical question and sarcastic, I will answer it. No, for a company a focused on quality as Apple is, they don't have big margins of error for their vendors of the same part.
There have been several posts in this thread which indicate at least some people cannot see a difference between the LG and the Samsung.
So, we have people who swear there's a huge difference and others who claim they can't see any difference.
There are thousands and thousands of 2012 MBAs in the hands of consumers. As fast as it took for the iPhone 'antenna-gate' controversy to hit the press, do you really think a difference as substantial as some of the people in this thread claim there is, that this wouldn't be major technical news by now?
Mind you, these screens use the same profile while each panel is different and thus needs to be calibrated individually. Some panels will look better, some panels will look worse with this profile. Other panels simply are physically better or worse. I'd worry more when calibration doesn't help because in that case there would be something different physically.
Most simply do not have a clue that anything is wrong. I will agree that there can be variances in displays even between two LG displays. With that said, I only had mine to compare. When I did a comparison against all 4 Samsung displays at the Apple store, the difference was immediately obvious, not only to me but to 2 other Apple employees, including a manager. Returned on the stop with an apology and complete understanding of my concerns.
It seems that there are quite a few other LG MBA owners here who have made their own comparisons and generally, they seem to agree that the LG display is not as good. As a customer, I expect the quality of the display to be on par with the quality of the displays that I used to decide to make the purchase. Whether Apple does this on purpose or not is debatable, I suppose, but the fact remains that the real life quality of the displays on the MBA are wide and variable and that's a shame because we all expect consistent performance from Apple products.
It's the same reason that I go to Starbucks to get my Americano instead of some other shop...consistency of quality.
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From my experience, calibration can drastically enhance certain images that have similar characteristics, and then drastically distort other images that have a different set of characteristics. I've found that it's best to use the default calibration and use Aperture for example to enhance the images.
BTW, none of the calibrations that I attempted on my LG MBA improved the text quality at all.
Cool, what's the deal with the SSD's? What's best, Toshiba or Samsung?
From what I just leaned, I have the "APPLE SSD TS128E", Toshiba.
There should not be a big difference between Toshiba and Samsung SSD anymore. In the past, the Samsung was faster.
How do you calibrate? By eye with some website or with something like a colorimeter?
Just fired up a 2012 13" with all the goodies (8GB RAM, i7, 512GB SSD) and it has the LG display. Compared to my 2011 13" Mac Book Pro, things look a little washed out. Bummed.
The SSD is Samsung.
The SSD is Samsung.
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I have the Toshiba SSD. No complaints here. Plenty fast.
I have the Samsung screen though, that I am happy about and possibly would've made a fuss if I ended up with the LG.
Just received my MBA 2012 i5 w/ 8GB Ram 128gb SSD... and it has the SAMSUNG DISPLAY Toshiba SSD but Samsung and Toshiba are basically the same speed- changes drive to drive. Looks very sharp and glad I don't have to do an exchange.
Toshiba SSD but Samsung and Toshiba are basically the same speed- changes drive to drive. Looks very sharp and glad I don't have to do an exchange.Well, what kind of equipment did you use exactly? My Spyder isn't all that special either but it does its job (colorimeters aren't that special either you could say; there are much better tools for the job).
Depends on the person: what they say and whether they like it or not. Some people like more darker pictures while others like brighter ones. Same for colour temperature: some like cool, some like hot (cool can be too blueish, hotter looks more white; the other way around: hot looks yellowish, blue looks more white).
It is very good to question because there simply is a whole lot more to it. It is about what you see, it's about what you like, it is about the entire production process up to the quality control and it is about the technology used (aka TN). The problem with LCDs is that they are quite complex to create with a consistent quality. Even today there will be noticeable differences in the same batch. That alone makes it quite hard to say a certain brand is better than the other. It can because brands can create panels within the specs that they designed. If they want the panel to have a higher colour temperature they can do so and you'll see it across the board.
What the colorimeter does at least is take out the subjectiveness of the individual. It doesn't favour a particular colour, or colour temperature. It just sees what it sees.
That is why I'm using a colorimeter with its software for this
That would be a rather difficult survey because of all the possibilities. With the Pro you have various screen sizes as well as glossy vs antiglare and normal resolution vs high resolution. That is more like comparing every car there is and picking the best one out of the lot.
Did u use an app? What's that app called? I wanna try calibrate it on my LG. It doesn't look that bad with the profile found in the osxdaily but the greens are still not popping to my eyes.
I bought a Spyder3 Pro a few years ago which consist of the software and a colorimeter (=sensor). The software will use the colorimeter to read out the display so it can calculate and create a new colour profile for it. I only used the accompanying software although you can use other software. You definitely need the combination of a sensor you put on the display and software to properly calibrate the display.
I didn't use any equipment. I just tried different profiles and self-calibration by eye. If the MBA needs to be calibrated by an expensive calibration tool, such as Spyder, then they should include it in the package.
I don't think calibration would have helped my LG display much. Anyway, it's gone and I have another on the way. If I get another LG display, I'll still give it a shot to look good, but if I can't it'll go back and I'll be done with it.
Than it is not really calibration. The way you are doing it can actually make it even worse. In essence every panel needs to be calibrated manually. You can imagine that this is nearly impossible to do, especially since everybody wants his/her laptop right away They've thought of that and created a profile that will suit most displays and make them look ok. It doesn't bring out the best of the display, they just make them workable. If you calibrate then do it with a colorimeter else it is quite useless and it can be a real PITA. It is easier and quicker when you use a colorimeter. Calibrating is something you do to bring out the best of the display by making sure it displays things as best as it possibly can.
Let's not forget that these are still TN panels which suck in terms of colours. If you want good colours then don't buy an Air but go for the MBP Retina instead. That machine has a proper IPS panel and will display colours and such heaps better.
I hope you'll get an MBA that has a good display though, the Air is a great machine. Good luck with the new one!
PS: that Spyder isn't an expensive one, it is amongst the cheapest you can get. It is quite decent in terms of quality although you can get better (but you'll see that reflected in the heftier price tag (say >300USD)). As an added bonus: you can use it on various computers/displays. It is something you buy and use for several years.
If you don't want to buy one then look around because there are companies that will calibrate for you.
They've thought of that and created a profile that will suit most displays and make them look ok. It doesn't bring out the best of the display, they just make them workable. If you calibrate then do it with a colorimeter else it is quite useless and it can be a real PITA. It is easier and quicker when you use a colorimeter. Calibrating is something you do to bring out the best of the display by making sure it displays things as best as it possibly can.Let's not forget that these are still TN panels which suck in terms of colours. If you want good colours then don't buy an Air but go for the MBP Retina instead. That machine has a proper IPS panel and will display colours and such heaps better.
I hope you'll get an MBA that has a good display though, the Air is a great machine. Good luck with the new one!
PS: that Spyder isn't an expensive one, it is amongst the cheapest you can get. It is quite decent in terms of quality although you can get better (but you'll see that reflected in the heftier price tag (say >300USD)). As an added bonus: you can use it on various computers/displays. It is something you buy and use for several years.
If you don't want to buy one then look around because there are companies that will calibrate for you.
Can someone shed some light on this topic for me? I have been reading a few pages of this thread and I can't seem to figure this out all by myself. In a few months I'm going to buy a MacBook Air via the Apple Online Store as I want to get the 13'' model with 8GB and 256 SDD. Lets say my Mac arrives and I see the display is manufactured by LG, am I able to return it to Apple just by saying that the display isn't as great as the Samsung one? Do they accept that as a "reason" to exchange it? Do I have to do that on the Apple Store or do I have to talk to the guys at the Online store? Thanks in advance.
Thanks in advance.