MacBook Pro A1706 : stay away from it and all soldered on Logic board SSD

[Trimapa]

As an long-standing Apple fan as far back from my first Apple Cube to queuing up in the rain to get my hands on a first gen iPhone on release day at Apple store in Bordeaux , France . Over these all these years I have owned nearly every model IPhone , had several IMacs , MacBooks ( the white one always was my favourite ) Pro’s , IPads , IPods , AirPort/ Extreme and so on . This week my MacBook Pro A1706 bought in early 2018 goes from working well in the morning to when returning home staring up with the flashing carpet : Took it to the nearest authorised official Apple repair centre and get presented a 760 euro repair bill as they claim it is SSD fault and the Logic board needs replacing. Now ,as I always treat my tech products as members of the family , I have never had one single problem with any of my Apple products; I mean Genius Bar is something I know that it exists but never had to use it . Perhaps the very reason I never took out extended warranties : I somehow trust the Apple products and was convinced of its superieur quality and reliability and for that I didn’t mind paying premium prices for these products .
However, I can not accept my 2 and a half year old very mildly used A1706 for no apparent reason ( no 3rd party software, all peripherals are genuine Apple , no moisture, not a scratch on the screen nor case let alone shock damage ) dies and I get served a 760 euro repair bill . I simply refuse to pay that and collected my MacBook from the service center ( who charged me 60,50 Euro just for the estimate) as I can’t believe that my beloved Apple product has let me down in such a way . I spoke lengthy with tech and after sales staff of Apple Spain but they stick to the 2 year warranty and for the rest I can basically sod off . I insisted in obtaining an appointment or a possibility to drop off my MacBook at the nearest Genius Bar which is Marbella : New Covid19 related restrictions only allow me to travel to Marbella on Thursday as I happen to have a dentist appointment in the same area . I appreciate that the Apple store also has to comply with Covid19 related restrictions and no slot is available. I requested just 30 second what it takes to drop off the MacBook to get a second opinion at some later stage . No avail . However , on Thursday I could walk in the store without appointment and spend thousands of euros and walk out with a brand new MacBook . That is exactly what I will NOT do . This technical disaster and disappointing Apple service will keep me from buying another Apple product as from now .
I will need a new laptop within the next few days , I know that it would be so easy with my time capsule and ICloud to configure a new MacBook but much more time consuming with a different operating system. Guess that is the price to pay when one no longer has enough trust in the Apple reliability , the competition has cheaper units which will compensate the time spent.
Actually, I was lucky secure a slot from a cancelled appointment at 14:40 on Thursday . All what Genius Bar did was confirm the estimate from the other place but offered to do the repair for 35 euros less . Looks like I got a euro off for each year I have been a Apple client.

I just thought to let you know this
R.I.P Mr. Jobs , what a visionary! Now it is run by financial experts only !

 

[GumaRodak]

The soldering itself is not so hard if you have proper equipment and spare part. Its just easier for them to replace all. The quote is so high, since they want you to buy new machine and not continue old if you choose first option or second, they will make profit... capitalism

 

[Trimapa]

Very much aware of this , I have nothing against capitalism quite the contrary. Apple must have a way to retrieve the list of all the units that have been registered from new with my Apple ID except for the “ pre Apple ID “ units . They apply premium prices as they claim to offer premium products and services : It’s there where I have a problem with at the moment . When I asked them what had gone wrong or does this happen often : their answer was “ no this does not happen often at all and we have no idea as exactly how or why it happened “ “ You are unlucky “ I don’t expect them to cover their products and components when I would have dropped it from the the 3rd floor or decided to make some vision calls with the MacBook whist being in my swimming pool . This is an inert non mechanical component that has not been subjected to any wrongdoing from my part . I had every intention to replace this laptop within the next couple of months ( that is the average time I keep my computers ) for a new model with the M1 chip ( wait a couple of months to get some feedback from real users ) . My iPhone 11pro was to go next month as I always change iPhone’s before they reach 18 months. Non of this is now likely to happen.

 

[JamesTheMac]

In the UK we have the Sale of Goods Act, that says a product is supposed to perform as described for a reasonable amount time. I think there is something similar in the EU too, which is why Apple got pulled up by the EU for selling customers extended warrantees (AppleCare) that were not needed, as customers already had consumer protection. (Apple only sell AppleCare+ in the EU now, under the guise of 'accidental damage', which of course consumers dont get as standard under EU law)

One of the tests is determining how long is 'reasonable' for a product to work. This is largely based on cost. But Apple have made it easy for their laptops. For with the butterfly keyboard debacle, they now will replace those for four years from the date of original purchase. Apple have in effect admitted their product should function for at least 4 years.

So if I were you, I'd look up the Consumer Law rules in Spain, and tackle them with those, and the 4-year keyboard replacement.

Good luck.

 

[brianmowrey]

If Apple made a car they'd weld the wheels, seal the engine, and label it Pro.

 

[Trimapa]

This is indeed something worth looking into : Where of course the butterfly keyboard issue was very widespread ( Not sure if my A1706 in question is not equipped with these first gen butterfly keyboard, if so , at least these have never given me any problem ) and hence multiplied pressure on Apple . To be honest , were it not for the Covid19 restrictions I couldn’t even spare the time to write all this on the forum . Have been a regular visitor of the site but never took the time to join and post . Guess I somewhere expected Apple to make some kind of Comercial gesture towards this “ very unusual “ failure as they claim it is instead of the insulting 35 euro off from the estimate issued by the authorised service center . Perhaps a comercial gesture towards a new MacBook ? As said , I have been a long standing loyal to Apple , then again certainly not the type of customer that will make a difference in their annual report . Still , not happy and perhaps the time to give another new innovative company a chance like many of us did when everything was IBM & Windows . Alan Sugar’s products are no longer there either.

 

[sazali]

I'm always avoided to buy the “latest” product especially when they keep on soldering everthing to motherboard, i will wait or abandon the whole Apple product if they keep on do that.

 

[GumaRodak]

well, soldering has some advantages...less cold joints, connectors may have as well defects which result in another cold joints or failure modes, heat transfer is for sure better with soldering, less space needed, easier assembly, everything is automated instead of manual labor... connectors cost money .. etc...

 

[Trimapa]

Absolutely, couldn’t agree more with you . We expect and demand from Apple to innovate , find more cost effective ways to manufacture etc . However they then should also make provisions in the way they repair eventual breakdowns of certain components such as SSD’s . Resort to exchange units like in automotive industry : engines , turbo’s etc . When I read the estimate from Apple carefully, it clearly states that by accepting the repair we allow Apple to use reconditioned to adequate standards components and that they do not return the old replaced part . This allows me to suspect that Apple will most probably swap out my logic board / integrated SSD with one that probably has once been in a similar state than mine . What is the single cost of a SSD ? Retail they seem to vary from 150 -300 Euro depending make and capacity. Add to that the 60 euro labour cost they charge me , it’s still a far cry from the quoted 635 euros. To me it looks like that the cost effective production process of Apple is at our cost .

 

[GumaRodak]

Sure it is.. apple will milk you from new machine and from repair too. And i am pretty sure that your defective ssd will be replaced and the logic board will be installed in other mac sold as refurbished or so so they will milk another customer

 

[bliggs]

35 years of Apple products without a single problem and when one finally pops up, that's it... Done with Apple forever? I agree that the product should be built to last and Apple's repair prices are incredible, to say the least, but come on man... Best of luck to you with your windows machine.

 

[darkmatter343]

I have a much different outlook on this simply because my entire career has been repairing electronics and working in the IT industry.

Laptops fail. Period. Whether it's Dell, Lenovo, Apple, doesn't matter, some may last a decade, others may fail after a few months. The problem though is that in today's world of newer laptops, everything is soldered. Apple isn't the only one doing it, Lenovo, HP, many of manufacturers are following the same trend and soldering the RAM and SDD to the motherboard. It allows them to make the devices thinner, while saving penny's on the cost of the connectors had the components been non soldered. Obviously this isn't ideal, because when one component fails, your SOL. Also, it allows them to charge you up front for RAM and Storage upgrades since you can't do it yourself after the fact.

If you are all about the right to repair, buying Apple, or any laptop with soldered components, you've bought the wrong laptop.

I completely understand your frustration with Apple, and anger, but... their bill of cost isn't unreasonable. *Wait, let me get my sheild before you reply haha* In all seriousness, people seem to think that being charged hundreds to repair a laptop is evil and the company should be cast into the fire. Truth is, for that 760 euro's, Apple is providing you with a brand new motherboard that not only is replacing the SSD, but also has everything else... new ram, new cpu, etc... You are not paying 760 euro just for a new SSD for them to solder on, they replace the mainboard. Additionally, there is a cost of labour, and while that is peanuts, it still takes away a small portion of the repair cost. I would wager, Apple isn't making that much of a profit from the repair. From my experience with HP, Dell, and Lenovo, those guys can charge upwards of a $1000 to replace a mainboard, and that's without the SSD and RAM since sometimes those are not soldered. I don't agree with the high cost of the replacement parts, and I do think that's something that need's to change with new laws.

There are some things I would never buy warranty on, TV being amongst those items, but any laptop over $2000, hands down. And I repair the stuff. Heck, I would buy the warranty even if it only covered the LCD, because that in itself would cost more than the warranty cost.

But I do get it. I started my career working in sales at Best Buy 2 decades ago, and one of the most hardest things was trying to convince someone who just dropped over $1000 on a laptop, that they should spend another $200-300 on warranty. Why?!?... if this product is so great, why would I need the warranty?!?! It's typical, I get it. But unless you're buying the best buy $999 special laptop, where you can order the parts off ebay and self repair, buy the warranty. I repeat buy the Apple Care. Last year, I bought a Lenovo X1 Carbon, and I still bought the warranty. If I remember correctly the SSD was not soldered but the ram was. Maybe that laptop would be trouble free for 5 years, but it's also possible after 1 year something on the board may die... and then I would be looking at a $800-1200 repair cost, even if I could replace the part myself.

I know... it's quick of people to say, well... they charge you soooo much because they just want you to buy another new one. If that were the case, Apple would have charged you $1500 euros. I'm not saying there isn't any truth to that myth, but a vast majority of the time, you are paying for replacement parts, period. They are expensive. On the PC side, some of the manufactures like Dell, HP, they really mark up their parts, and it's not becuase they want you to buy a new one, but sure, it's just business. You need the part, they have the part, pay up.

Anyways... now that I've written a novel, the $760 euro repair bill they quoted you does sound reasonable. I've been in this industry for 2 decades. Apple didn't quote you that because they would prefer you bought a new laptop, although I no doubt am sure they wouldn't mind if you did. You're paying such a large amount, because they don't just have to replace the SDD, but EVERYTHING on that mainboard is being replaced, including the cost of the Intel CPU, RAM... all the IC chips etc etc... is that stupid, yes, is it unfair to the end consumer, yes.

Still though, I get why most people are upset when companies like Apple ask for large amounts to repair items not in warranty. If you are buying anything Apple where you know all the components are soldered on, buy the Applecare. It's peanuts in comparison to what any part on that laptop will cost you to replace out of pocket.

 

[brianmowrey]

Apple didn't quote you that because they would prefer you bought a new laptop, although I no doubt am sure they wouldn't mind if you did.

The price for the replacement is indeed fair, but that doesn't speak to the totality of Apple's motives for making replacement necessary for discrete component failure, and whether driving consumers to buy new is part of it, in the first place. We can only speculate. Which puts us in the same dismal boat as everyone working at Apple.

Back to OP, if you were in the US and made enough stink with Apple Support, you would eventually be given a replacement MBP based on the decades-plus loyalty, though you might have to chip in for upgrades compared to your current spec. But, I don't know how Apple Europe rolls.

 

[jerryk]

If Apple made a car they'd weld the wheels, seal the engine, and label it Pro.

Sounds like the Tesla model or any farm tractor made in the last decade or so. I love my Teslas, but it is a walled garden

 

[neinjohn]

Circuits fail.

If you don't care anymore it certainly has value for parts for repair stores, on eBay or local. May be different if you didn't have FileVault enabled.

If you care, I would recommend to see if 3rd-party store near you offer logicboard repair and has experience with Apple MacBooks. Ask if they charge for a quote and for a diagnostic. Sometimes it is a "simple" fault on the circuit to the SSD. Probably cost from 250-350€. There are also mail-repair services, Madrid and Barcelona must have something.

Apple obviously don't do this kind of service to the customer and it's a shame/waste. Though I ain't aware of any brand which does it (?).

Since you change computers on three-year basis I would recommend to look for the extra year insurance. Or buy some business laptop with 5 year warranty (expensive).

 

[Trimapa]

35 years of Apple products without a single problem and when one finally pops up, that's it... Done with Apple forever? I agree that the product should be built to last and Apple's repair prices are incredible, to say the least, but come on man... Best of luck to you with your windows machine.

More like 25 years actually, but yes it may sound drastic . It is perhaps exactly because I have never had faulty product before . Let alone of this magnitude.

 

[GumaRodak]

@darkmatter343 ok so they replace the complete board and all components are new.
What they do with the old logic board? I don't think they will give it to you. So they are basically stealing the good components from you I believe that they are repairing the board and sell/use again in refurbished...
So this is a scam basically as this board is yours you paid for it and they are selling it again

If they do scrap the part, then thats bullsh..t as is not really environment friendly to generate so much ewaste just bcs of one failed IC or whatever.

If the scrap is true, their statement that missing chargers are bcs of saving mother earth is just excuse to generate profit as the scraping of the parts generate much more ewaste imo

 

[Trimapa]

I have a much different outlook on this simply because my entire career has been repairing electronics and working in the IT industry.

Laptops fail. Period. Whether it's Dell, Lenovo, Apple, doesn't matter, some may last a decade, others may fail after a few months. The problem though is that in today's world of newer laptops, everything is soldered. Apple isn't the only one doing it, Lenovo, HP, many of manufacturers are following the same trend and soldering the RAM and SDD to the motherboard. It allows them to make the devices thinner, while saving penny's on the cost of the connectors had the components been non soldered. Obviously this isn't ideal, because when one component fails, your SOL. Also, it allows them to charge you up front for RAM and Storage upgrades since you can't do it yourself after the fact.

If you are all about the right to repair, buying Apple, or any laptop with soldered components, you've bought the wrong laptop.

I completely understand your frustration with Apple, and anger, but... their bill of cost isn't unreasonable. *Wait, let me get my sheild before you reply haha* In all seriousness, people seem to think that being charged hundreds to repair a laptop is evil and the company should be cast into the fire. Truth is, for that 760 euro's, Apple is providing you with a brand new motherboard that not only is replacing the SSD, but also has everything else... new ram, new cpu, etc... You are not paying 760 euro just for a new SSD for them to solder on, they replace the mainboard. Additionally, there is a cost of labour, and while that is peanuts, it still takes away a small portion of the repair cost. I would wager, Apple isn't making that much of a profit from the repair. From my experience with HP, Dell, and Lenovo, those guys can charge upwards of a $1000 to replace a mainboard, and that's without the SSD and RAM since sometimes those are not soldered.

There are some things I would never buy warranty on, TV being amongst those items, but any laptop over $2000, hands down. And I repair the stuff. Heck, I would buy the warranty even if it only covered the LCD, because that in itself would cost more than the warranty cost.

But I do get it. I started my career working in sales at Best Buy 2 decades ago, and one of the most hardest things was trying to convince someone who just dropped over $1000 on a laptop, that they should spend another $200-300 on warranty. Why?!?... if this product is so great, why would I need the warranty?!?! It's typical, I get it. But unless you're buying the best buy $999 special laptop, where you can order the parts off ebay and self repair, buy the warranty. I repeat buy the Apple Care. Last year, I bought a Lenovo X1 Carbon, and I still bought the warranty. If I remember correctly the SSD was not soldered but the ram was. Maybe that laptop would be trouble free for 5 years, but it's also possible after 1 year something on the board may die... and then I would be looking at a $800-1200 repair cost, even if I could replace the part myself.

I know... it's quick of people to say, well... they charge you soooo much because they just want you to buy another new one. If that were the case, Apple would have charged you $1500 euros. I'm not saying there isn't any truth to that myth, but a vast majority of the time, you are paying for replacement parts, period. They are expensive. On the PC side, some of the manufactures like Dell, HP, they really mark up their parts, and it's not becuase they want you to buy a new one, but sure, it's just business. You need the part, they have the part, pay up.

Anyways... now that I've written a novel, the $760 euro repair bill they quoted you does sound reasonable. I've been in this industry for 2 decades. Apple didn't quote you that because they would prefer you bought a new laptop, although I no doubt am sure they wouldn't mind if you did. You're paying such a large amount, because they don't just have to replace the SDD, but EVERYTHING on that mainboard is being replaced, including the cost of the Intel CPU, RAM... all the IC chips etc etc...

Still though, I get why most people are upset when companies like Apple ask for large amounts to repair items not in warranty. If you are buying anything Apple where you know all the components are soldered on, buy the Applecare. It's peanuts in comparison to what any part on that laptop will cost you to replace out of pocket.

year warranty (expensive).

First , thank you for your extensive input . You are certainly right and the cost to repair could be justified in the way you present it . However , the 760 euro cost is to me excessive and is economically unjustifiable. My A1706 laptop with standard 256gb/8ram configuration with 32 months of use ( even in its prestine condition and very low battery cycle count ) is not worth much more on the second hand market than the repair cost . As mentioned before the idea was to buy a new one in a couple of months and pass this one on to my teenage son : he inherited my previous MacBooks , IMac and IPhones. Apart from broken screens and cracked laptop trackpad because he sat on it ; none of these have stopped working even in his destructive hands . To conclude all this : I have two mayor problems with Apple : one is the total absence of any explanation of what and why this Logic board /SSD failure happened and secondly the elevated cost and total lack of even the slightest consideration that the laptop is only 8 months over warranty and no commercial gesture towards repair or replacement is offered . This is obviously Apple’s commercial policy and they are free to apply whichever they want . Somehow I just can’t swallow it . My reaction is perhaps more emotional then purely economical ; to me it is like the friend you always blindly trusted and you find out he has betrayed you . Trust is gone . Even if I buy a new MacBook tomorrow, I will dread every start up and wonder if that flashing carpet will appear... could be a clever move from Apple to make me buy a new one every 23 months and not 36/40 as I used to . No , Apple I still like to make my own little decisions . Programmed obsolescence will be the next subject?

 

[Trimapa]

The price for the replacement is indeed fair, but that doesn't speak to the totality of Apple's motives for making replacement necessary for discrete component failure, and whether driving consumers to buy new is part of it, in the first place. We can only speculate. Which puts us in the same dismal boat as everyone working at Apple.

View attachment 1665340


Back to OP, if you were in the US and made enough stink with Apple Support, you would eventually be given a replacement MBP based on the decades-plus loyalty, though you might have to chip in for upgrades compared to your current spec. But, I don't know how Apple Europe rolls.

You are indeed right to point out that I would stand a better chance if I were in the US . I lived , studied and worked in California from 84 trough 86 and I remember it was a real culture shock coming from Belgium where I had lived all my life till then . Surprised how normal it was to stand up for your commercial rights and obtain satisfaction when one thought the product was inadequate. In Europe, although it is gradually changing especially in countries like the UK , we still have these inhibitions towards complaining as we consider the staff as our peers . At the same time staff here has such job security that they can afford to tell the customers to bugger off knowingly that it will cost the company much more to fire them then to lose the customer . Each time I return to the US , I’m impressed with the service one gets and this from the cleaning staff in the hotel to the manager in a high end luxury items shop . I sometimes wonder why US citizens want to come to France .. even I think and my wife who is french think staff is rude to customers.

 

[UBS28]

Apple really sucks nowdays. Back in 2010:
- Bought the base 15” MBP
- Put in a 512 GB Samsung SSD (with 5 year warrenty)
- Maxed the RAM (with lifetime warranty).

Total cost: $2000 (with far superior warranty). And this 15” 2010 MBP still works without any issues (unlike the latest models from Apple). And these were not cheap components, I double checked that Apple was using the same components to avoid compatibility problems with OS X.

If you configured the same MBP in the Apple Store, it would have cost you around $3000 back then (and only 1 year warranty was offered by Apple). So alot of money was saved. And since Apple gets even cheaper prices, the margin that Apple has is mindblowing. You had to be really stupid to buy the upgrades from Apple back then.

Nowadays, Apple wants to sell their overpriced RAM and SSD with very limited warranty. They are making a killing on those upgrades which you could do yourself in the past without much problems. And you are screwed if something breaks, because then you need to buy a new MBP.

 

[Kung gu]

Apple really sucks nowdays. Back in 2010:
- Bought the base 15” MBP
- Put in a 512 GB Samsung SSD (with 5 year warrenty)
- Maxed the RAM (with lifetime warranty).

Total cost: $2000 (with far superior warranty). And this 15” 2010 MBP still works without any issues (unlike the latest models from Apple). And these were not cheap components, I double checked that Apple was using the same components to avoid compatibility problems with OS X.

If you configured the same MBP in the Apple Store, it would have cost you around $3000 back then (and only 1 year warranty was offered by Apple). So alot of money was saved. And since Apple gets even cheaper prices, the margin that Apple has is mindblowing. You had to be really stupid to buy the upgrades from Apple back then.

Nowadays, Apple wants to sell their overpriced RAM and SSD with very limited warranty. They are making a killing on those upgrades which you could do yourself in the past without much problems. And you are screwed if something breaks, because then you need to buy a new MBP.

thats the thing, apple is not the only company doing this now

 

[toniroig]

I've suffered the exact same problem, in the exact same country, with the same bill for repair and with the exact same reaction, not accepting it. I have/had a Macbook Pro mid-2017, the hard drive died four months after the expiration of the extended guarantee period. I'm currently looking for the alternative to keep on using it through a Thunderbolt external drive, but I'm having some issues with firmware partitions. Depending on an external drive is the lesser of two evils for me right now. If you have any suggestions on how to use an external drive for a 2017 Macbook Pro as the main drive while having a dead internal drive, it would be much appreciated, thanks!

 

[Darktitor]

I've suffered the exact same problem, in the exact same country, with the same bill for repair and with the exact same reaction, not accepting it. I have/had a Macbook Pro mid-2017, the hard drive died four months after the expiration of the extended guarantee period. I'm currently looking for the alternative to keep on using it through a Thunderbolt external drive, but I'm having some issues with firmware partitions. Depending on an external drive is the lesser of two evils for me right now. If you have any suggestions on how to use an external drive for a 2017 Macbook Pro as the main drive while having a dead internal drive, it would be much appreciated, thanks!

Will this works on yours

Found this adaptor for 2016/2017 non-touch bar for ssd upgrades

Has anyone heard or tried these out with a 42mm length pci-e ssd? 1587411306 Ive found 512,1tb,2tb nvme ssd that fit this with 2000+mbps read and write too. Makes the cost of making my Mac 1tb roughly 220 dollars.

forums.macrumors.com

 

[Trimapa]

I've suffered the exact same problem, in the exact same country, with the same bill for repair and with the exact same reaction, not accepting it. I have/had a Macbook Pro mid-2017, the hard drive died four months after the expiration of the extended guarantee period. I'm currently looking for the alternative to keep on using it through a Thunderbolt external drive, but I'm having some issues with firmware partitions. Depending on an external drive is the lesser of two evils for me right now. If you have any suggestions on how to use an external drive for a 2017 Macbook Pro as the main drive while having a dead internal drive, it would be much appreciated, thanks!

I know exactly how you feel .

 

[Trimapa]

Will this works on yours

Found this adaptor for 2016/2017 non-touch bar for ssd upgrades

Has anyone heard or tried these out with a 42mm length pci-e ssd? 1587411306 Ive found 512,1tb,2tb nvme ssd that fit this with 2000+mbps read and write too. Makes the cost of making my Mac 1tb roughly 220 dollars.

forums.macrumors.com

From what I understand is that you can replace / upgrade SSD’s on A1708 but not A1706 ( Touch Bar )