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Even if the geekbench results are correct, I don't think it makes any sense to compare Apple Silicon with previous chipsets.

I have an iMac 5K 2017 with 4 Core i7 at 4.2 Ghz and Radeon Pro 580.

On paper and Geekbench it's faster than my iPad Pro 2020.

But run the exact same app on the iPad and iMac, the iPad runs circles around the iMac for the exact same tasks. But you will not see this on Geekbench. And this is the iPad with A12Z, not M1 even.
Agree. The only benchmark that matters is the application you are running. Apple Silicon has all sorts of optimizations that can make things run better than the Geekbench numbers might suggest.
 
Apple has Metal (as we see the score in this bench), but there aren't enough gamers on Mac, so companies aren't that interested.

OpenGL was ancient and not many games use it, and for Vulkan there is already MoltenVK.

The lack of games are mostly because companies don't earn that much by porting games to Macs, maybe this will change now that the Macbooks are so powerful, even the M1 can handle games very nicely!

But fear not, there are already some really good native games,

Baldur's Gate 3 is native ARM64 definitely AAA,
Disco Elysium is also native ARM64 now on App Store,
There is also World of Warcraft.
Timberborn is not AAA but a really nice native game in development.

I really hope we will see more AAA games soon now that the whole world is excited about M1 Pro and M1 Max.
MacBook Air is relatively affordable with enough power, so Apple might capture some of the PC market using that instead of $6000 MacBook Pro. With enough people choosing the Apple Silicon Mac, some other applications can eventually follow. Fanless is an amazing attraction for many people.

With that being said, those games you mention aren't that popular. With fortnite being kicked out of Mac alongside all games developed using unreal engine, I dunno how this will pan out. Tech industry has gone through a rough period of each matching being incompatible with each other, down to a handful nowadays and architecture-independent to a degree. Last year Apple quietly ported Metal to PC somewhat so developers can compile their PC game projects to Mac with Apple Silicon. But to me, Apple should make Metal somewhat multi-platform (Mac, Windows, Linux) so game developers can accept the offer of porting games to Mac, and maintain Metal the same fashion Microsoft maintains their DirectX technology.

Ultimately, though, Apple Silicon should aim at the power level to emulate x86 and other processor architectures with high performance. This would solve gaming problem on Mac once and for all, plus that would be an amazing tagline: a computer that you can run anything you want on, without sacrifice.
 
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I’m sure Apple has sent out test products of various configurations for review. I’m sure this is a 24-core version. Hopefully we start seeing hands on reviews this Friday…fingers crossed that’s when the embargo is lifted.
Master blaster lift embargo. Lol.

Hopefully we’ll see real apps get pushed heavily through their paces not don copy past bs we typically see from content creators/YouTubers.
 
So what are we looking at here?

I've read online something in the ballpark of....

16 core = RTX 3060 mobile
24 core = RTX 3070 mobile
32 core = RTX 3080 mobile

Obviously there are significant variances not least the variable power supply ratings available to each tier of NVidia.
 
I hope this is not the 32-core gpu otherwise this would be a bit disappointing :(

Edit: I already pre-ordered my full spec MacBook with M1 Max anyways :p
3x is 300% you know... any increments around 20% is awesome in tech land. 300% is quite INCREDIBLE.
 
[Edit: ignore this - I didn't see the Radeon 5600M line at the bottom - and it's clearly indicating the M1 Max has about 4x the performance (however, they are measuring it). It probably isn't with Geekbench 5 though, because there is a huge gap between 68,000 and about 160,000]

The slide states 4x MBP16 - which could have the lowest GPU config (Radeon Pro 5300M), which has a Metal score of about 23,000 IIRC.

So the 32-core GPU *could* be about 90,000...

Personally, I'm not convinced that what we're seeing is the 24-core GPU, and we might be disappointed. Alternatively, Geekbench may be under-reporting. Let's see real-world comparisons in actual applications.
I don’t know from where the image was taken but the only chart on Apple’s website that says something like that when comparing with the Radeon 5600M is the one measuring Cinema4D redshift, other software have different improvements. The GPUs charts during the presentation had the M1 as reference.
As for the number of cores, I almost certainly convinced it is the 24 core GPU, because the M1 Pro (16 core) score is twice of the M1. It would be almost impossible to veer so much from the linear relation when the M1 Pro respects the linear relation.
 
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5700XT in the iMac has 59629 metal score. It's lower than this. And I doubt we are seeing the actual performance of this SoC on these benchmarks yet. Apple said it's 4X faster than 5600M. These numbers are not 4x more than 5600M.
the current radeon pro 5700XT has a metal score of 74768...and not 59629 Screen Shot 2021-10-21 at 13.54.57.png
 
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Asus RX 580 OC 8GB desktop version.
So I got about 41000 from that card on Intel i9 machine, while the Macbook (notebook) got 68000 score.

68000 corresponds to more modern AMD Radeon Pro Vega 56 8GB desktop version.

Apple GPU is equal to quite powerful desktop graphic cards. If it is 24 core, it plays like most of current discrete cards. The best out there RX6800 etc, so may be 32 GPU may be closer to RX6600-6800. RX6800 alone retails for 1.5K dollars, so Apple GPU is as good as 1.5K modern GPU.

In other words, we got a desktop-class graphic cards in new Macbooks.
so if this is indeed a 32 gpu core with this score (68.000) is around Vega 56 desktop ? i think we had vega 56 on the 16" mbp also
 
But everyone on the board wants to compare newest GPUs to nVidia latest despite nVidia not supporting Metal and M1 GPU not supporting CUDA. How is that comparable then?
when blender is released with Cycles full metal support..it will be interesting to compare rendering performance. I have a 14in mbp m1pro otw and I have a zephyrus g15 (5900hs/3070) ..will be a good apples to apples comparison since both will be running natively.
 
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I think Apple's plan on gaming is as follows:

Transition the Mac to Apple Silicon. That way basically any iOS game runs on Mac, but more importantly any iOS developer can also easily develop games for the Mac or port their iOS games to Mac.

This grows the developer base for Mac gaming to a whole new level never seen before since there are tons of iOS developers who do not develop for the Mac, yet.

Together with this growth I think we'll see many more AAA titles for the Mac in the upcoming years.
yes, a friend of mine is in Activision and their strategy since the M1 ipad pro..is to make AAA games that dont work on older ipads , and them to scale from iOS ipads pro to the mac also
This is the way, since the mobile gaming profits are now nr 1
And not only Activision is doing this 3 years plan...but i heard others will join the same boat since they have the hardware now for proper AAA. But again, the draw back is compatibility since M1 ipad pro is the only one who will support these, while others arcade games can support even iphones and ipads from 3 years ago
 
yes, a friend of mine is in Activision and their strategy since the M1 ipad pro..is to make AAA games that dont work on older ipads , and them to scale from iOS ipads pro to the mac also
This is the way, since the mobile gaming profits are now nr 1
And not only Activision is doing this 3 years plan...but i heard others will join the same boat since they have the hardware now for proper AAA. But again, the draw back is compatibility since M1 ipad pro is the only one who will support these, while others arcade games can support even iphones and ipads from 3 years ago
I mean, the A12X/A12Z are beats too.

Easily a lot of games will be able to run on those iPads as well as long as they turn down some settings. If you make a game run at 60FPS on an M1 it will easily run at 30 on an A12X...
 
Can someone tell me the pros/cons of MoltenVK and what differences that may make? (in an idiot-friendly way)

I presume it makes it somewhat easier to cross-platform games? But I presume that's only any good if written in Vulkan in the first place? And Vulkan is only used on a few games currently? And I presume is incompatible with the likes of Unreal engine (or whatever engine lots of AA games use)?

So unless people start using Vulkan instead, then MoltenVK is going to make little difference to more games coming? And how likely is it people might start using Vulkan?

Also with new devices like Steamdeck which Valve are behind, and them pushing for linux support and only recently getting anti-cheat to work on such things, is that likely to drive more people to develop cross-platform? And will that help the Mac somewhat, or just Linux games?

Correct? Or is that a load of nonsense. School me... :)
 
So what are we looking at here?

I've read online something in the ballpark of....

16 core = RTX 3060 mobile
24 core = RTX 3070 mobile
32 core = RTX 3080 mobile

Obviously there are significant variances not least the variable power supply ratings available to each tier of NVidia.

The RTX 3080M reaches 18TFlops, the M1 Max with 32 Cores 10.4 TFlops
The 3080M has incredible performance similar to the desktop counterpart, but has a huge 95W TDP.

To compete with the 3080 series and the Radeon 7800 series which is upcoming Apple needs a 64 and 128 cores edition for the higher end desktops (iMacs and Mac Pro).
 
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I mean, the A12X/A12Z are beats too.

Easily a lot of games will be able to run on those iPads as well as long as they turn down some settings. If you make a game run at 60FPS on an M1 it will easily run at 30 on an A12X...
in general those settings are applied for android platform
im just telling you how some developers plans and doing it
They are building AAA games that can run just on M1 and up...for native resolution at 60hz or 120hz depending on the game
I think next ones will be an fps and rpg(aka diablo for the ipad and the mac with M1 at least, that can run up to 120fps (on the m1 max native), the target for release they are saying late 2022..but they never get the release target.
So by 2023 a lot more devices will support it
 
I think Apple's plan on gaming is as follows:

Transition the Mac to Apple Silicon. That way basically any iOS game runs on Mac, but more importantly any iOS developer can also easily develop games for the Mac or port their iOS games to Mac.

This grows the developer base for Mac gaming to a whole new level never seen before since there are tons of iOS developers who do not develop for the Mac, yet.

Together with this growth I think we'll see many more AAA titles for the Mac in the upcoming years.

Maybe, but the point here is that people want to play now on the current AAA titles, not wait years before future AAA titles have MacOS release as well with native support for Metal and Apple Silicon optimization. Apple didnt dedicate even a second of the keynote to talk about actual non-iOS games running on the new chips. CoD or Battlefield demo would have been good indication of "We are here, these chips are also suitable for gaming!". An even more clear indication would have been if they have released a gaming MacBook Pro variant.
 
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