Wasn't trying to call him dumb... probably came across that way. Meant to say that OpenCL is the standard for making it work across all cards so that is probably the way development should be leaning. Also, there is a lot of device optimization that is useful in CUDA or OpenCL that I prefer not to mess with on a laptop graphics card like the 330M when Im going to be running all the code on at least a GTX295 or a Fermi card(where I get true out of order execution). It's far far more practical in my opinion to write code on my laptop for the running machine using SSH or transfering it via SCP than it is to write code natively on my laptop and then have to completely rewrite sections for device optimization later. If he isn't trying to do all of that sure, it works fine to write CUDA for a small test set on the laptop and then just run it on a larger more performance oriented device. Also, SSH is fast enough that I've never seen it as a major hit. So I never feel the need to complain if my mobile computer doesn't have something vendor specific that I need that I can get from just remote connecting to a server. Its a straightforward workaround that doesn't effect my workflow or productivity so I just get frustrated with the whole attitude of "No I need this to have a vendor specific device" in what is essentially a mobile device that you don't have a lot of control over.
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MacBook Pros with Thunderbolt, ATI/AMD Graphics?
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Wasn't trying to call him dumb... probably came across that way. Meant to say that OpenCL is the standard for making it work across all cards so that is probably the way development should be leaning. Also, there is a lot of device optimization that is useful in CUDA or OpenCL that I prefer not to mess with on a laptop graphics card like the 330M when Im going to be running all the code on at least a GTX295 or a Fermi card(where I get true out of order execution). It's far far more practical in my opinion to write code on my laptop for the running machine using SSH or transfering it via SCP than it is to write code natively on my laptop and then have to completely rewrite sections for device optimization later. If he isn't trying to do all of that sure, it works fine to write CUDA for a small test set on the laptop and then just run it on a larger more performance oriented device. Also, SSH is fast enough that I've never seen it as a major hit. So I never feel the need to complain if my mobile computer doesn't have something vendor specific that I need that I can get from just remote connecting to a server. Its a straightforward workaround that doesn't effect my workflow or productivity so I just get frustrated with the whole attitude of "No I need this to have a vendor specific device" in what is essentially a mobile device that you don't have a lot of control over.
This was true in 2005 but Apple has outgrown the designer/pro market. The designer/Adobe pro user market represents a truly small percentage of the revenue stream these days. The Mac's phenomenal growth for the past 20 quarters has been fueled by general purpose users who also play games.
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You should be supporting OpenCL if you are coding yourself. Even as a user you should be pressuring vendors to support OpenCL as the default GPGPU platform.
CUDA will die with NVidia.
wolfenkraft said:Nooooooo!!!!! I need CUDA cores!
Absolutely. Not supporting CUDA will make me a sad panda.
You should be supporting OpenCL if you are coding yourself. Even as a user you should be pressuring vendors to support OpenCL as the default GPGPU platform.
CUDA will die with NVidia.
Why do they 'sux'? I own many devices with NVIDIA GPU's. They perform great, the drivers have always been stable and they are updated periodically with tweaks & refinements.
I don't understand the hate. I think a lot of people moan about anything. My experience of ATI/AMD GPU's is nothing to write home about. They cost less than their NVIDIA counterparts, but that's about the only major plus point.
NVIDIA dominate the top positions (I have a GeForce GTX 570 on order with my delayed SB PC):
http://www.videocardbenchmark.net/high_end_gpus.html
I know that recently, when getting cards sorted for my desktop PC i found that power consumption was far greater on nvidia cards as was heat in a like for like card comparison. AMD cards also provided much better value for money, in the low/mid range similar cards are cheaper and even in the higher ranges too.
Thats mostly just my opinion from testing out a few different options.
Yes, that's the situation right NOW. That does not mean that it won't be changed with the introduction of the Sandy Bridge integrated GPU, which is a lot better than the previous Intel integrated GPUs are. Just wait until the computers are actually announced to make judgements like this
There are 'different' sets people making the comments, dude.
Some would rather have the faster cpu, others would settle for a little less cpu in exchange for a better gpu.
Just because different people prefer different things doesn't mean that 'people' are hard to please ... it just means there's different opinions out there.
Geeez!
Not as easy as "TB."
TB port, TB cable, etc. Hey we're all ADD on the net, and TXT and tweet character limits demand all these elisions. We have tons of Mac specific acronyms on these forums. Who wants to make 11 keystrokes over and over when "two will do"?
TTYL from my new MBP with SSD, TB, SB CPU & AMD GPU homies....
Is Sony VAIO Z still the Best 13 incher in the business?
It is disappointing that after all Apple did to elevate the power & speed of MacBook Air, I would think they would elevate 13" MacBook Pro to its true status as a Pro machine: full SSD, superb (not just good enuff) discrete graphics (facilitated with removal of Optical Drive). I don't know if the product development at Apple know that a higher end MBP 13 with substantial discreet graphics can be a big winner among gaming crowds who want to play graphic intensive FPS like Modern Warfare, SOCOM 4 or Crysis 2 on the Mac platform, Boot Camp or native, but do not want a bulky 15 or 17. I think "thin" should not be the design principle for the MBP line. We already have "thin" in the fantastic MBA line. We don't mind slight thickness, or the price. We do mind the size of that screen. We want to carry this thing around town in our sling bag. I guess Sony Vaio Z is still the best full feature 13" laptop (quad SSD RAID 0, BluRay writer, 1GB GPU, Core i7) in the business. Too bad it runs Windows.
It is disappointing that after all Apple did to elevate the power & speed of MacBook Air, I would think they would elevate 13" MacBook Pro to its true status as a Pro machine: full SSD, superb (not just good enuff) discrete graphics (facilitated with removal of Optical Drive). I don't know if the product development at Apple know that a higher end MBP 13 with substantial discreet graphics can be a big winner among gaming crowds who want to play graphic intensive FPS like Modern Warfare, SOCOM 4 or Crysis 2 on the Mac platform, Boot Camp or native, but do not want a bulky 15 or 17. I think "thin" should not be the design principle for the MBP line. We already have "thin" in the fantastic MBA line. We don't mind slight thickness, or the price. We do mind the size of that screen. We want to carry this thing around town in our sling bag. I guess Sony Vaio Z is still the best full feature 13" laptop (quad SSD RAID 0, BluRay writer, 1GB GPU, Core i7) in the business. Too bad it runs Windows.
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You have no idea what you are talking about.
In the desktop market. Nvidia is destroying amd at the moment. In price and performance. The gtx 580 leaps ahead of the 6970.
Also the new gtx 560 is the best bang for the buck you can get. It even outpeforms the 6950 and the 6970 in many games. And it's an easy 1 ghz overclock.
And was great with the 5 series.
But thet lost alot of momentum now.
SlickShoes said:
You have no idea what you are talking about.
In the desktop market. Nvidia is destroying amd at the moment. In price and performance. The gtx 580 leaps ahead of the 6970.
Also the new gtx 560 is the best bang for the buck you can get. It even outpeforms the 6950 and the 6970 in many games. And it's an easy 1 ghz overclock.
And was great with the 5 series.
But thet lost alot of momentum now.
Possibly some misunderstanding about ThunderBolt?
I read in the aticle about ThunderBolt on the main MR page, that the name is an Intel trademark.
Searching about it further, I saw this article about Intel's ThunderBolt:
http://savolainen.wordpress.com/2008/04/27/intel’s-mobile-strategy/
"Thunderbolt will be available soon in either 2 GB or 4 GB densities and may be combined with additional Intel BGA NAND packages to extend the density to 16 GB." (that was way back in 2008!)
But it's all about NAND...
Could it possibly be that the ThunderBolt is referring to a seperate SSD for OS?
I read in the aticle about ThunderBolt on the main MR page, that the name is an Intel trademark.
Searching about it further, I saw this article about Intel's ThunderBolt:
http://savolainen.wordpress.com/2008/04/27/intel’s-mobile-strategy/
"Thunderbolt will be available soon in either 2 GB or 4 GB densities and may be combined with additional Intel BGA NAND packages to extend the density to 16 GB." (that was way back in 2008!)
But it's all about NAND...
Could it possibly be that the ThunderBolt is referring to a seperate SSD for OS?
Probably not a good idea to market a device as a disease abrieviation.
Hope a VirtualDisk port never gets announced.
I own a VAIO Z, nothing else comes close. I enjoy my MBA, but the Z blows it out the water in every area, bar the touchpad.
The specs indeed sound ridiculous.
Sadly, ironically, he probably got the 256MB VRAM right on the lower end videocard. That's right, I bet Apple is still gonna offer a lousy 256MB VRAM on the base 15'' model so that you have to upgrade to the more costly higher end 15'' or 17'' in order to get 512MB VRAM or more.
Just got back from my local Apple store...
The apple sales guy is trying to help a student choose a new computer. She repeatedly asked if there's a 13" macbook pro and he kept saying he's out of stock. I should have told her that a new one is coming out tomorrow with a THUNDERBOLT port!
I think she may have gone with the white macbook though... Apple sales guys are so tricky...
The apple sales guy is trying to help a student choose a new computer. She repeatedly asked if there's a 13" macbook pro and he kept saying he's out of stock. I should have told her that a new one is coming out tomorrow with a THUNDERBOLT port!
I think she may have gone with the white macbook though... Apple sales guys are so tricky...
While we've heard a lot about Apple's new low end 13-Inch MacBook Pro, there's been hardly any information about the upcoming 15" and 17" models. CNet provides a rundown of what they've heard about today's announcements.
First, as we've heard, Light Peak is officially being branded as "Thunderbolt". We've seen the photos already showing it on the 13" MacBook Pro.Thunderbolt will be found on the new MacBook Pros. Next, as we knew, Intel's latest Sandy Bridge processors will be used in the new MacBook Pros. And, the 13" MacBook Pro will only use Intel's integrated graphics chip.
CNet, however, also reveals that the 15" and 17" MacBook Pros will use AMD (formerly ATI) discrete graphics cards alongside Intel's integrated solution. CNet offers no specifics about which graphics cards Apple will be offering. Current 15" and 17" MacBook Pros have NVIDIA graphics cards built in.
Article Link: MacBook Pros with Thunderbolt, ATI/AMD Graphics?
As long as they don't generate the kind of heat that the Radeon Mobility X1600s did in the first and second rev (2006, Core and first gen Merom Core 2) MacBook Pros, I'm all for it.
So the 13" PRO will have Intel IGP?
Such a deal...
The 13" Pro has always been (at least since the white Unibody MacBook) the biggest rip-off in Apple's entire Mac line. Period.
It's kinda hard to mess up a 15"/17" MacBook Pro release.
Apple works with the GPU manufacturer. As of recent, AMD has been more responsive in terms of putting out up to date drivers for their Apple supplied GPUs than NVIDIA has.
NVIDIA GeForce GT 4xxM or 5xxM where xx is either 25, 30, or 35, or an AMD Radeon HD 6xx0M where xx is either 65, 67, 75, 77, or 83 (skeptical as all hell on that one though).
I've been wondering how many pages will get refreshed in addition to the MacBook Pro page. I was shocked to find that they even edited in their Snow Leopard system requirements for OpenCL to include the 320M this time last refresh.
That exists? Or rather, that, in a form that there'd be room for in a 13" Pro, exists?!
Nooooooooooooooooo!
I need a 13" with decent graphics not a 15"!!!
It's really not that much larger, honestly.
Nope, the 68xx cards are the successors to the 5770 and the 5830 cards, no rebranding. The 67xx series, on the other hand, is a rebranding. Though I think that only applies to desktop cards.
...And you don't have AppleCare?
Worse on graphics, better on CPU. Though I'm still skeptical that the model we saw is going to be the one announced tomorrow.
It makes sense, especially given the negative tech PR associated with another Intel IGP.
It has already been confirmed that the leaked 13" with the Sandy Bridge integrated graphics is called a MacBook Pro. Check this post. Altho the pic is not showing up for me atm, but it has the new MBP box with Thunderbolt and all.
I for one won't be upgrading my 2010 13" MBP to these. I'll most likely go with the 15" one next time I upgrade as I'm disappointed with how "Pro" the 13" is.
Edit: Also, I can't see them dropping the white plastic MacBook, the chix dig it and some other people too. It's a simple computer for simple people kinda. For people who'd use the SuperDrive the Air isn't the best option so I do think it's nice to have a very basic model in the lineup even if I'd personally never buy one.
Edit2: Quote the post and paste the link to a new browser tab if you can't see the pic.
(a) Pix can be deceiving; I'm still not ruling out a photoshopping. (b) The 13" Pro has always been a joke. Though to be fair the 320M is the closest it ever got, relative to every other IGP to come before it, to attaining even semi-Pro stature.
Wow, AMD GPUs? I guess Apple really doesn't want me as a customer again
ATI/AMD still can't write drivers to save their lives. AMD does make good main CPUs though.
I take it you're not a gamer? AMD was the only of the two providing its driver fixes for things like Steam (The Source Engine games) and StarCraft II for the Mac and having those drivers work on the first go. No CUDA cores, yeah, that sucks. AMD has Stream processors and for everything else, there's OpenCL, which ought to be mass-adopted anyway.
Just got back from my local Apple store...
The apple sales guy is trying to help a student choose a new computer. She repeatedly asked if there's a 13" macbook pro and he kept saying he's out of stock. I should have told her that a new one is coming out tomorrow with a THUNDERBOLT port!
I think she may have gone with the white macbook though... Apple sales guys are so tricky...
Theres allways a thin line in difference with tricky/clueless.
Guess which one was it at yout example IMHO.
Tod
I don't understand what you're talking about. The current MBPs already have nvidia graphics card in them.
Tests for the GeForce GT 330M showed that the extra VRAM made no noticable real-world difference unless you were using a 24" Apple external monitor. Otherwise, performance for most things was more or less on par with each other. Somehow, I doubt a changeover to AMD would change this.
The 13" MacBook Pro rumored to be released tomorrow, apparently doesn't.