You got my vote. If we are able to press a button to show our support for a post, then it only seems fair to be able to press a button to show our dislike for a post. Some might argue that we can reply to the post to offer our disagreement, in lieu of a dislike button, but then we could do the same to show our support in lieu of a like button. This could be taken even further with a user-configurable setting to "show only posts with x number of dislikes". That itself could go a long way toward solving the problem.
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Macrumors has become a cesspool of haters
- Thread starter philosopherdog
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I think that could be very easily abused in places like PRSI. You'd have people ganging up on each other politically no matter if they have a logical or reasonable argument to present. So if say all supporters of X candidate against Y candidate are online at the same time, you'd be disliked into oblivion. Then supporters of Y candidate against X candidate might not get to see your posts or things will appear one sided.
I think in the PRSI section, they should do away with likes all together. Just my opinion anyways.
You have a good point about abuse. However, the point was to have a user-configurable setting so each user could toggle it on or off to suit them without interfering with the display of content for everyone else. Additionally, I keep the PRSI forum on ignore.. I believe that section is the heart of the cesspool.
That's what I mean though. The people who might get disliked into oblivion might be giving decent answers/good debate but if you hide dislikes, you might miss out.
On anywhere else but PRSI, I think it's a great idea to have the dislike option. PRSI is definitely is where the most animosity and arguments occur. Politics carry a lot of emotion. Probably even more than the feelings of those complaining about some "Gate" or another.
I also like your idea of removing the like button in PRSI, that alone may take the wind out of a few people's sails.
If it were up to me, I'd remove the PRSI section altogether, I see it as nothing more than a waste of resources.
Well the section section is a part of the Community Discussion outside Apple related stuff so even removing the section would just move the discussions somewhere else. Plus I believe members have to have a certain amount of posts or title in order to actually contribute in that section.
But I agree, remove the like button in that section would be beneficial as well as adding a dislike button everywhere else
It keeps people here. Like soap operas and drama shows keep people hooked. However, when a large percentage of the new posts and unread posts are filled with PRSI clickbait and inciting aggressive emotions, it can make this place look horribly hostile to say.. A newcomer.
I think it needs to have some civil moderation if they're going to keep it. No one wants to express an opinion and be lambasted with insults. Especially if it's just an opinion and not an attack on another forum member personally.
I think that would be a good compromise, I don't mind having PRSI on ignore.. out of sight, out of mind.
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I prefer quality over quantity. I realize we may lose members if PRSI were ever removed, but I like to believe that the members who would leave because of that reduction in content would be the same ones who are contributing to the degradation of the site to begin with. Would they not be of the same attitude as those who are "breaking up with Apple" because Apple isn't doing what those users want? To them, I say good riddance.
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Amen. I'd suspect some of the general hostility on MacRumors is from people getting hot and bothered in the PRSI forum letting their anger spill over into ordinary conversations that have nothing to do with the flame wars they were just participating in. I've certainly noticed that on an occasion or two on other forums I've been on, I've found myself "continuing" a heated conversation with some innocent bloke that had nothing to do with the earlier argument. I carried the baggage from another conversation over to the new guy.
Strange to tell, but there used to be a "dislike" button and it was horribly abused, and - believe it or not - it actually generated even more gratuitous nastiness than is currently visible on the fora.
While I do not mind the existence of the PRSI section, I must say that the tone - and content - of many of the posts are not remotely memorable - this is insult instead of argument.
Worse, was the fact that some extraordinary insults were permitted - on this forum - during a deeply unpleasant electoral cycle, which added to the vicious and vitriolic tone in which political debate has been carried out, serving to normalise and render acceptable toxic exchanges.
The forum atmosphere is its members.
I daresay that a large fraction of users are from the US here, and that is a country with a bizarrely conformist and adversarial culture. As Apple grew out of its techy 'different' niche, the broader community came flooding into these fora, brining with them their own cultural mores. This penchant for hostility seems to have been exacerbated in the last year, unsurprisingly a result of an extremely contentious and sectarian political atmosphere.
It seems natural then that the tone and mood of these fora would shift in response.
I daresay that a large fraction of users are from the US here, and that is a country with a bizarrely conformist and adversarial culture. As Apple grew out of its techy 'different' niche, the broader community came flooding into these fora, brining with them their own cultural mores. This penchant for hostility seems to have been exacerbated in the last year, unsurprisingly a result of an extremely contentious and sectarian political atmosphere.
It seems natural then that the tone and mood of these fora would shift in response.
Agreed, that the forum atmosphere is its members, but it is also what its members make of the forum.
If they choose to thrash it with the language they use and the attitudes they express, then, the experience of visiting becomes a lot less agreeable as a tone of enabling belittling insult is allowed to predominate at the expense of reasoned debate and discussion.
A forum where members argue for the right to uninhibited expression - under the umbrella of 'it's free speech', or 'not a white tie dinner' - makes for a deliberate decision on the part of those members to enable and facilitate the cultivation of an environment where discourtesy and the use of offensive and insulting forms of speech become considered acceptable, and allowed.
Just because people can indeed use insulting terms to others - or, about others - on the forum, doesn't mean that they should, or ought to want to.
English is a rich and expressive language. It ought to be possible to articulate disagreement and dissent without recourse to coarse and offensive language and crude epithets and insults when expressing yourself.
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This may be true to some extent, but this is not usenet. This is a moderated, profit-making enterprise. While it certainly behooves us to not throw gasoline on a fire, the standards are set by the rules of the forum and by extension its moderators.
Given that presumably smart and helpful members are leaving, the management may wish to set the bar a bit higher. I would suggest that individuals who post solely to mock or disparage others (in this thread, for example) should be told to take themselves elsewhere. Otherwise, good people seeking help will do so.
A.
(while I am gratified to note that the more offensive individuals on my ignore list are now suspended, I must balance that with the fact that it took years for it to happen. Life is too short.)
Is it possible to use a like/dislike system similar to Slashdot? So you can filter posts based on their votes and all votes are anonymous (at least to the normal users).
I agree. Debate is one thing and usually spirals down to name calling for those who cannot respond thoughtfully. However, it is the PRSI forum, so thick skin is required.
I agree. Debate is one thing and usually spirals down to name calling for those who cannot respond thoughtfully. However, it is the PRSI forum, so thick skin is required.
Personally, I don't have anyone on my 'ignore' list, although that does not mean that, in practice, the are not members whose posts I willingly ignore.
Granted, this is a profit-making - and yes, moderated (relatively well moderated, much of the time) - enterprise.
However, my concern, - and this is what I believe that @mobilehaathi may have been alluding to - is that the recent election in the US has allowed - and indeed, enabled, encouraged and facilitated - a new low in the tone of permissible public - and political - discourse - and in online communities, such as this one.
This tone - thuggish, insulting, deliberately offensive and bulletin - was set - enabled, encouraged - by recent events in American public life, and it is an absolute scandal that it has not been challenged more, both here - on this forum - and elsewhere - in public life in the United States.
And, make no mistake, the tone taken during this recent election does little credit to the United States.
Elsewhere, I queried elements of this - such as calling people - being allowed to call people and defending the right to call people - (well, a certain person) in public life "a criminal bitch" on these very threads.
There are no circumstances - anywhere, in any setting, public or private - where it is considered acceptable to call a woman a "criminal bitch" - and to defend the right to do so, serves not only to coarsen tone of debate in the public space, and to confuse free speech with the right to offer offensive insults in lieu of debate.
During the election, comments were made online - and elsewhere - enabled by the tone set by one campaign in an attempt to make abusive language a new political and public norm.
By not disavowing it, the site encouraged and enabled and facilitated it - and - by definition, condoned it.
Now, elsewhere I have mentioned that I have spent much of my adult life teaching and studying politics, and - as it happens - the use of language in situations of politics and power; more recently, I have worked as a political analyst, and elections specialist, - working on monitoring, observing, running, reporting on, and analysing elections in some of the most contentious places on the planet over the past 20 years - and I do understand that tempers can be frayed and emotions heightened during an electoral cycle.
However, that does not excuse allowing the use of crude, coarse, belittling and insulting language to insult peel on the basis of their race, ethnicity, gender - especially when language the language we use to communicate in - the English language - is rich and expressive with a vast and nuanced vocabulary.
It should be possible to express strong and robust differences of opinion and vigorous disagreement without hurling vicious and deliberate offensive abuse at those whose views differ from yours.
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Civility on a forum isn't achieved or promoted by criticizing others even when the criticism is barely cloaked in flowery prose. Maybe some are fooled by the poster's motivations; maybe even those who are in political agreement with the poster, and the poster themself, can't see through the words to see their own share in inflaming the atmosphere, as exampled even in this thread. But it's highly likely they know exactly what they're doing. Crap on the forum, the members and the member-moderators while giving the appearance of sainthood. The pot calling the kettle black. "Must get my own way."
For those who do it*, stop pretending to want forum harmony while simultaneously fanning the flames of hostility. This is a forum with people from all walks of life with multiple points of view. You won't always get your philosophical way, no matter the cleverness of your postings.
I'm new here so, I don't know if the atmosphere has gotten worse through the passage of time. It could simply be a result of the increase in membership. There have been numerous threads on this topic. There's also been comprehensive, open explanations from management about how they approach moderation. Seek them out for information, and, for suggestions on how a member can help in the effort to eliminate some of the nonsense. I'm out of time or I'd link some here. Of recent, there was one (probably more) by @annk, and there's always the forum rules to read.
*I'm not criticizing the OP or others for posting their frustrations, and for their efforts to deal with them in a constructive way. Maybe the day will come that I'll stop visiting, as well. Maybe this post will hasten my departure. Regardless, I am thankful to this forum, its members and member-moderators for the knowledge I've gained here. There's real value easily found here. Take some of it and leave some in return.
For those who do it*, stop pretending to want forum harmony while simultaneously fanning the flames of hostility. This is a forum with people from all walks of life with multiple points of view. You won't always get your philosophical way, no matter the cleverness of your postings.
I'm new here so, I don't know if the atmosphere has gotten worse through the passage of time. It could simply be a result of the increase in membership. There have been numerous threads on this topic. There's also been comprehensive, open explanations from management about how they approach moderation. Seek them out for information, and, for suggestions on how a member can help in the effort to eliminate some of the nonsense. I'm out of time or I'd link some here. Of recent, there was one (probably more) by @annk, and there's always the forum rules to read.
*I'm not criticizing the OP or others for posting their frustrations, and for their efforts to deal with them in a constructive way. Maybe the day will come that I'll stop visiting, as well. Maybe this post will hasten my departure. Regardless, I am thankful to this forum, its members and member-moderators for the knowledge I've gained here. There's real value easily found here. Take some of it and leave some in return.
Is it necessary to use expressions such as "crap on the moderators" - while making your point? This is an excellent example of what is - to my mind - unnecessarily coarse language.
Perhaps it is the norm in the US, but, in truth, expressing disagreement in 'flowery' language - or, at the very least polite language - is, I would argue, a lot more 'civilised' and constructive than seeking refuge in crude - if forceful - terms.
English allows for a very varied and rich vocabulary; it is - or it ought to be - perfectly possible to criticise someone - and their posts - without seeking recourse to coarse and crude forms of expression to do so.
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Macrumors has become a cesspool of haters
Has it? Or maybe the frustrating wannabe cool hipster cluster**** of forced terrible ideas and constant dumbing down that Apple has become is giving us a new reason to criticise it every day?
Has it? Or maybe the frustrating wannabe cool hipster cluster**** of forced terrible ideas and constant dumbing down that Apple has become is giving us a new reason to criticise it every day?
MOD NOTE
Please note that we have removed a number of PRSI related posts from this thread. Whilst we normally refrain from removing posts made in this particular subforum, especially in those threads directly related to criticism of this forum, it was felt that these overly PRSI posts adversely affected the ongoing discussions taking place.
Carry on.
Please note that we have removed a number of PRSI related posts from this thread. Whilst we normally refrain from removing posts made in this particular subforum, especially in those threads directly related to criticism of this forum, it was felt that these overly PRSI posts adversely affected the ongoing discussions taking place.
Carry on.
I'm new but I don't really see a lot of hating to tell you the truth, maybe I'm just used to the general negativity we see online these days. I always expect the ratio of positives to negatives to be skewed because people who are indifferent are probably unlikely to take time out to post.
I agree completely. I am frustrated with what is available (Or rather not available). I continue to buy Apple products, but the excitement has been somehow trumped by frustration. Having hardware and software issues with a new product right out of the box does not help things.
Macrumors used to be more positive because there was always, "one more thing" to get excited about.
Nowadays "one more thing" is hyped up "S" models.
"Oh great a new phone! Oh it's an S model? It looks the same... It's faster? The last one was fast... it looks the same. What? It's 1mm thinner? Great... what else you got?"