i dont know if Apple users miss it (and you couldnt possibly know that either), however most "main Apple" users wont even be aware of it, and if they were to use windows they would still use the bottom right area for resizing (as i do). a suitable reason for this would be that apple wants to keep the entire window mainly focused on the top left of the screen (where the
symbol is, the File Menu and all those), making it more usable. is it controlling?? yes it is. but it keeps a standard layout for the applications and GUI.
You can have the file menu on a right hand screen so that blows that theory out of water and being able to resize from all sides is simply easier. The reason Apple won't do it the Windows way is that MS beat them to it, just like with multiple button mice and they would rather do things in a less productive way, just to be different and not admit MS do lots of things quite well. Which is actually very stupid.
i use multiple monitors rougly 80% of the time i am on my computer, i dont feel crippled by their implementation of it - just like with Windows.
On a Mac you can fit one window or the other, on a PC you can do the same or fit to desktop - very useful and also without the stupid gap at top due to the fixed File Menu. I have to constantly drag windows to fit as opposed to click a button. If using multiple Monitors your file menu is on a different screen to the software,
so lots more mousing particlualry when you have biiiig desktops. Plus it's quite confusing as to what programe is live on occasions as Macs are a bit too subtle at times and with the File menu being separate from the programme it's doubly confusing. Sometimes the only feedback I get is 80 pixels of text on a 3840 pixel wide monitor.
I use both systems with multiple monitors and Macs are very inferior compared to Windows when using the nVidia multiple monitor software. The ATI software is no where near as good but the menu being attached to programme as in Windows is much better for multiple monitors as there is less confusion and
much less mousing.Imagine using the setup below with the file menu only on one screen as opposed to being next to the actual programme
if you know the systems very well, why do you have so much clicking and travelling of the mouse? the keyboard shortcuts on a Mac are more 'complex' sometimes, but certainly not impossible to use.
Because you need to use the mouse more than on a PC and the shortcuts are at time clumsy particularly with the laptop/wireless keyboard, plus the mouse movement isn't as good, you need a bigger physical desktop to move a mouse across a MAc desktop. My trackpad on my MBP is painful to use as the cursor moves so little distance across my 17" desktop. And I have tweaked the various settings to speed things up.
With Wndows you can also work through menus and dialogue box options without the mouse. Though I've hacked the mac for the latter, though it doesn't always work.
launching programs (for exampl) is much much easier on a mac then compared to XP
I've always laid my programme shortcuts along bottom of screen, long before the Dock existed and so it works very similarly.
suffering from RSI and curing it does not automatically make your opinion correct
I did not use RSI to prove I was right, just to illustrate that I was more sensitive to poor UI design as a result.
i am most familiar with both platforms, the shortcuts and the methods to which objectives can be completed. however we seem to have alternative outlooks.
I bet you do not know windows as well as you think! It can take a long time to learn all the ins and out of OSs and when I watch long term users of either platform, they are rarely using it optimally, far from it usually. I'm lazy, so always find the easiest way to do things and will chuck old habits if I find better ones and have no loyalty to any manufacturer if something better comes along. Most people use the method/technique they first learned and and are usually
very reluctant to change even if the alternative is much easier. Something you really notice when you have done a lot of teaching of both physical and computer skills.
nice find and great point!! there is really no implementation of windows equivalent of 'merging' folders, and it would be nice to see any attention given to upgrading/re-vamping the Finder. it has been a while.
No. Same old crappy Finder in Snow Leopard - Apple even boasted of this.
traps you into their software yea i can see that, by making you use iTunes, iPhoto etc, but their hardware?? i am not following.
You need a Mac to use iPhoto, so once you start with it, it's very hard to get out of it and they block non-iPods from using iTunes. So it's quite simple really! Apple are very very monoplistic and controlling at heart. Thank god Gates beat them,particularly as he is using the moeny for good causes - he may turn out to be be the greatest philanthropist ever.
as can i, for movie management all i use is the Finder. i have everything stored on an external HD (or two
) and i use whatever program that will play the video format, there is no software to organise it or sort it. i do the same in window, managing filers and folders simply by using Explorer, and to be honest i find it much easier using the Finder to manage my data.
I find it cripplingly awful in so many ways. If I had to use Finder for File management, I would simply get rid of the Mac without doubt. As I mentioned before you are probably so used to it's oddities, they seem normal to you and you do not notice the workarounds you constantly do to accomodate it.
It's the sort of thing I could demostrate to you in 5mins in front of the computer, but would take forever via talking about it.
that was a very interesting read, especially from somebody who is an Apple FanBoi™.
Someone who helped create the Mac paradigm is not exactly a FanBoi!
i do have a few problems with some of his comparisons however. take for example..
he is completely exaggerating that a user can become productive [in PS] in 10 minutes
I'd agree, more like a couple of hours!
i have been using the program for over 2 years and can barely cut out an image or change a particular colour!! the shortcuts are hard to remember, not to mention un-orthodox (is that the price you pay for having so many shortcuts?). the menu's are overwhelming because of the onslaught of choices.
PS is actually a very simple programme to use, the complexity comes from the myriad ways you can combine the tools.
I usually change all my other programmes shortcuts to match PS, as I think they are very good on the whole. Once you know the basics of PS, which I can teach people very quickly, the rest is down to your own ability with image manipulation and creativity. I learnt to use PS with no help and at the time no computer knowledge, but I was experienced in the darkroom and as a photographer, so it simply made sense to me. I knew what the programme was meant to do before I used it. So I only had to learn where things were as opposed how to do Photowork which is another skill entirely.
i didnt see him make an comparisons to the "professional" apps, such as FCE/FCP/DVD Studio etc. like Photoshop upon opening any of these apps the layout looks like daunting, but after using it for a while i was doing everything with ease, it was very very easy to learn, unlike Photoshop which is much more advanced and complicated.
Final Cut is not simple/easy and as challenging as PS is to learn to use well. I asked a very experienced, fast and good FC editor how a simple task - making a slideshow and it stumped him [how to do it effectively]. And Final Cut Studio, was mostly [all?] non-Apple in origin
apple isnt simplistic, they are usable. whether you are a beginner or an advanced user you can still get your tasks completed.
I'm an advanced user and would strongly disagree. Besides not sure if I've mentioned this but Finder is crippled
, so I'm stuffed for File mangement, iCal, Mail etc are simplistic compared to say Outlook. Apple are very much appealing to those with limited demands, most certainly flat design exactly as Tog argues. Their main business is now the iPhone and iTunes and why they dropped 'computers' from company name. The iPhone is very very good in places but the lack of even a back button makes it very annoying to us. Jobs doesn't like buttons apparently, despite the fact they can make life much easier.
if iMovie isnt advanced enough for you to make movies, go to the pro app, the same with DVD creating and sound recording, as for photos - well apple better come up with something for that.
Aperture is certainly crap and Final Cut is anything but easy to use. But that's not quite Tog's point, it was more about how if your needs are not great the simple interface makes it easy for some people, but then how that simplicity is crippling once your demands increase. PC programmes tend to be far more customisable to the user's need which means software can suit what you want. A simple interface that is perfect for a workflow you do not use is actually terrible to use.
I use a Mac but rarely any Apple software by choice as it's too slow, crippled or simply crap.
at this point i must say something: you seem to be somewhat "washed" in respect to your ideas.
Why because I prefer better things than say Apple can provide?
why does apple need to add a second mouse button? is it because you think its the "norm"?
No. It simply makes my life easier and more productive with less keystrokes and mousing needed as a result.
apple has always been a company that goes outside the boundaries, they don't follow the normal trends and dependencies of the market,
actually they do and then proclaim it as their own idea
or ignore that others did it first. Being different for the sake of it is a little childish.
Their original interface came from Xerox, their recent use of gestures comes from Fingerworks and is very limited compared to what Fingerwoks did [though Apple did buy Fingerworks], though Opera [the browser that Firefox nicks all it's ideas from] has used mouse gestures for a very long time, 3 button on a window came from Windows as did Cmd+Tab [Alt+Tab in Win]. I've seen them advertise stuff as new when the same thing has been available on PCs previously. Laser Mice, Aluminium cases....
Apple are very, very good at marketing and are not adverse to telling lies. In the UK their ads getting pulled for being misleading is not unusual
thats what makes them so desirable and competitive (and why they can have such profits on their products
).
More because they have the highest mark up in the PC industry with the least variety of stock which reduces costs dramatically and they makes things that look really pretty even if it makes for poorer ergonomics and prettyness/sexiness always sells. regardless of how good something is.
just because Microsoft has implemented something does not mean that Apple needs to. (with the mouse however, i must agree with you, because its a function thing, not a feature thing).
Features are functionality and both Apple and MS nick from elsewhere and each other. Apple simply pretend not to.
i wonder why that is, to create the illusion that its more customisable? that it has extra features? im not sure...
No simply to hide the fact they finally gave in to a multibutton mouse. Face saving exercise.
well to be honest, i find it quite hard to use my pinkie finger to hit the Ctrl button, as opposed to the
/command/whateveryoucallit that my thumb hits. i thought Fitt's Law only applied to on-screen interaction, otherwise keyboard keys would be running around the outside of the keyboard lol.
Fitt's Law applies to accuracy with finding objects, so things at corners are easier to hit, compared to say one specific key in the middle of several others. So a main modifier key at a corner is more easier to hit and also more ergonomic when used with other modifiers. I also used to wonder why some people complained so much about PS shortcuts being tricky [as you did above], then I used a Mac keyboard and realised why. Cntl+ shftalt+key is much harder on a Mac keyboard. You try doing Save for Web on a Mac keyboard with one hamd!
the same thing can be said for windows, depending on the program you arent guaranteed to close a window when you put the cursor in the top right section of the window, you might need to bring it back that tiny bit.
A fractional diffence in placement of the close button is not the same as different UI behaviour, grasping at straws here methinks.
And will probably only happen with non-MS software such as PS CS4 which disobeys the OS paradigm on both platforms and is better for it on both, particularly the Windows version as it's more space efficient on smaller monitors.
as much as i love garageband and as functional as it is, it sure is ugly!!
is my response to that interface - not very Apple like - which is a constantly moving target anyway.
