Marco Arment Argues the 2012—2015 MacBook Pro is 'Best Laptop That Has Ever Existed'

[SteveW928]

It's so frustrating. I was tentatively looking forward to the revivsion of the Retina MBPs, expecting (hoping) for a more flexible solution than the 2013-15 series. Hah. This is after waiting for an update to the 17" in 2012 when I grabbed one new off ebay after I missed out on the refurbs. After upgrades, that was/is a fabulous machine, apart from the non retina display, that I've been happily using since, while debating the merits of a 1TB 15" with discrete graphics.
After missing out several refurb opportunities, they finally reappeared on the Aus refurb store and I jumped, even though with our dollar crash it's 50% more than my fully specced 17" was in 2012, but with 50% more BenchMark (and USB3/TB2).
The screen is great, no idiotic TouchBar, ESC key, largely bulletproof and repairable keyboard, MagSafe, big battery, sensible touchpad and upgradeable drive. Too bad they didn't stick a couple of TB3 ports on it - and the battery actually runs for hours on regular apps, unlike the 17" that maybe gets an hour even though it's 90% + capacity.
Maybe the mid 2015 with discrete graphics is still the best choice till they actually make a pro laptop again, especially since it can run multiple resolutions (including a non scaled 2880x1800) and a 5K screen @60Hz).
They must still be building some of these to test response since there's no way new ones could still be available in the real world.

That's interesting. But, yea, I'd consider a 2015 MBP (or 2013 Mac Pro) if it weren't for it being TB2 and my concern over Apple removing TB2 support for eGPUs. I hope Apple has something to show in June. New MBPs that fix some of the issues and/or a reasonable Mac Mini upgrade.

 

[Anarchy99]

That's interesting. But, yea, I'd consider a 2015 MBP (or 2013 Mac Pro) if it weren't for it being TB2 and my concern over Apple removing TB2 support for eGPUs. I hope Apple has something to show in June. New MBPs that fix some of the issues and/or a reasonable Mac Mini upgrade.

I wouldn't worry about Apple support for eGPUs it's rubbish anyway.

I've been using eGPUs prior to Apples support and will long after
I even use eGPUs on thunderbolt 1 devices fine like my 2012 rMBP with a gtx1070
Egpu.io forums are one of the best places for eGPU support

 

[Anarchy99]

FTR, the PowerBook Duo 230 is the best laptop that has ever existed.

Never since, have I been as pleased with one of Apple's amazing advances in laptop thinness and judicious pruning of onboard ports. The Powerbook Duo 230 was easily the sexiest Mac of the early 90's, especially when it was enhanced into a full desktop with its accompanying Duo Doc (if you could afford it). It remains a surprisingly early harbinger of all that was to come two decades later in the age of ultrabooks.

At the time of its release in October 1992 -- the Duo 230 was a revelation!

Forgot about that
ZOMG guys
Apple invented the two in one
Eat your heart out surface book

 

[SteveW928]

I wouldn't worry about Apple support for eGPUs it's rubbish anyway.

I've been using eGPUs prior to Apples support and will long after
I even use eGPUs on thunderbolt 1 devices fine like my 2012 rMBP with a gtx1070
Egpu.io forums are one of the best places for eGPU support

Yea, I really dislike that they seem to have limited it to TB3 (w/o modifying the OS). But, yes, that site is the place to be, I've heard. I'd just like native support so I don't have to mess with all that.

I spent years building servers and systems, and had a MythTV box for quite sometime. The problem is that you end up putting in a good number of hours creating it and keeping it going, which is worth a good amount of $. I've been really tempted lately, though.

 

[bosozoku]

Can’t agree more. The best laptops ever (despite staingate issue, but it was kinda fixed in 2015 models).
Nice screen, nice keyboard, nice case and weight - the last Apple laptop represents Steve approach to making things!

 

[KPOM]

Can’t agree more. The best laptops ever (despite staingate issue, but it was kinda fixed in 2015 models).
Nice screen, nice keyboard, nice case and weight - the last Apple laptop represents Steve approach to making things!

I think the 12” MacBook reflects Steve Jobs’s vision of a consumer notebook. He wanted it to be as simple as possible with no user-accessible parts. That was his philosophy with the original Mac.

 

[JDW]

...staingate issue... it was kinda fixed in 2015 models

Actually, it wasn't. I own a mid-2015 15" MBP and made the following video which clearly shows the 2015 models too have the problem:

 

[bosozoku]

I think the 12” MacBook reflects Steve Jobs’s vision of a consumer notebook. He wanted it to be as simple as possible with no user-accessible parts. That was his philosophy with the original Mac.

Oh, and don’t forget: if your SSD is dead, you’re In BIG trouble (this means loss of you ALL data), if your keyboard is screwed up and out of warranty, you are in trouble. And gimmicky touchbar which is never used by pro users (coders, etc.) is a neet, but not needed. But, I can consider macbook 2015- model, as a simple typewriter for blondes.

IMO, the best macbook pro would be 2012 classic-like model with retina display, new cpu/gpu, slightly thinner body without dvd drive, but with fully upgradable SSD/RAM. Also do not forget glowing apple logo! But Apple won’t make this kind of model, which is really PRO, not this hipster garbage mbps they are making now!
[doublepost=1550622505][/doublepost]

Actually, it wasn't. I own a mid-2015 15" MBP and made the following video which clearly shows the 2015 models too have the problem:

I saw many 2012, 2013 models which were not affected by the staingate issue. I think, it depends on screen supplier or factory... also saw completely destroyed 2014 pro model twice. 2015 is not so terrible, saw a couple with only slight marks from keys, nothing terrible.
[doublepost=1550622574][/doublepost]And, ofc, anti glare coating could be removed completely, anytime...

 

[Anarchy99]

IMO, the best macbook pro would be 2012 classic-like model with retina display, new cpu/gpu, slightly thinner body without dvd drive, but with fully upgradable SSD/RAM. Also do not forget glowing apple logo! But Apple won’t make this kind of model, which is really PRO, not this hipster garbage mbps they are making now!

why make it thinner at all, its not like a non retina 2012 is absurdly thick, IMO your close to right except they should keep the form factor and use all the free space after everything you mentioned on battery.

I would also be OK with a revival of a 17" MBP with the same requests as above

 

[SteveW928]

why make it thinner at all, its not like a non retina 2012 is absurdly thick, IMO your close to right except they should keep the form factor and use all the free space after everything you mentioned on battery.

Yeah, it's a MacBook Pro. They have other models to be slim and trim, and I'll bet the MacBook Air is plenty for what most of the 'pros' that are really attracted to these newer designs are doing, except maybe video encoding... which isn't great on a laptop anyway due to noise/heat.

If they had kept the bigger case design, it opens the possibility of more advanced parts and a better (maybe quieter?) cooling system, I would think.

 

[Techwatcher]

He’s an idiot...I’ve listened to their ATP podcast and it’s just non-stop complaining.

Sure, some people don’t like the new MacBook Pro models for various reasons and that’s fine. My advise would be, move on. Either buy a $1700-2000 computer or not. Feel lucky you have the ability to do so. We’re living in the greatest era in humankind and he’s complaining about a keyboard, ports and minutiae.

This... Is a great point.

 

[dhazeghi]

Original Retina MBP dropped support for upgradeable memory. It made upgrading storage a royal PITA (proprietary connector, firmware prevents deep sleep with most 3rd party SSDs. Also the end to the matte screen option.

Yeah, the 2016+ models are considerably worse, but the rMBP was their first major step in the wrong direction.

 

[bosozoku]

Original Retina MBP dropped support for upgradeable memory. It made upgrading storage a royal PITA (proprietary connector, firmware prevents deep sleep with most 3rd party SSDs. Also the end to the matte screen option.

Yeah, the 2016+ models are considerably worse, but the rMBP was their first major step in the wrong direction.

I would say, 2012-2015 retina models have their design flaws, but 2016-2018 models are total disaster! Especially keyboards!

 

[MattG]

I miss my TiBook

 

[goslowjoe]

I have two 15" MacBook Pro units, one a 2014 and the other a 2015 model. Yesterday I went to the local Apple supplier, and started typing gibberish on a 2018 15" unit, just to get a "feel" for the keyboard everyone complains about. It definitely sounded and felt to me that those who complain about the noisy keyboard and bad tactile feedback are absolutely correct. Since you are going to spend a lot of time interacting with the unit with your fingers and eyes, for me they keyboard and screen are paramount. While my eyes could not argue that the display is super, my fingers did not agree about the keyboard. After that, the rest is pointless.

I concur with the OP.

 

[BigBoy2018]

He’s an idiot...I’ve listened to their ATP podcast and it’s just non-stop complaining.

Sure, some people don’t like the new MacBook Pro models for various reasons and that’s fine. My advise would be, move on. Either buy a $1700-2000 computer or not. Feel lucky you have the ability to do so. We’re living in the greatest era in humankind and he’s complaining about a keyboard, ports and minutiae.

Ok, you're making a statement that we're (and specifically Marco in this case) is being too much of a 'first-world baby'. I get your point, and do think there's way too much bitching about silly stuff these days ...

However, what is the threshold for anyone to complain about anything by your standards?
If I have clean water, food to eat, a roof over my head and good health ...

am I not allowed to complain about terrible service at a restaurant?

Am I not allowed to complain about being mis-charged for a purchase from an online vendor that won't refund the difference?

Am I not allowed to complain about Apple removing all sorts of niceties and features they once happily offered in their laptops, all in the pursuit of thinness, while making them more expensive and more unreliable?

Realize I'm not necessarily saying you're wrong, but I am wondering what, by your standards, would be ok for me to complain about. Only things that affect life and limb?

 

[bosozoku]

Actually, it wasn't. I own a mid-2015 15" MBP and made the following video which clearly shows the 2015 models too have the problem:

Listerine + microfiber cloth. Hope you now the rest)
Or hurry up to apple store and get your screen replaced!

 

[drumcat]

I bought the 2015 in 2017 for exactly those reasons. Peak MBP, and it's going to last me another 6 years.
[doublepost=1551135533][/doublepost]

Yeah. I have Ethernet dongles out the butt myself. USB A, thunderbolt and USBC/TB3.

I never understood why many was euphemised as "out the butt".

 

[bosozoku]

These dongles are real pain in the ass! My friend always carrying usb-c to usb for charging his iPhone, a big one with HDMI for presentations... I have all this stuff in my rMBP. So, why to torture yourself? Not even mentioning kb failure...
Retinas are revatively light, compact, have nice screens, still supported! I’ll be with mine till the next redesign.