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I think Zuck’s comments were not unreasonable, the market that Apple is addressing with the Vision Pro is far different from the main consumer market that Meta’s Quest headsets go for. But it is a shot across the bow. VisionOS looks like it will be well integrated with the rest of the Apple ecosystem, and we will have to see what happens when the “Vision SE” hits the market.
 
That would suggest that, 70 million people can afford it, which will make Apple really happy I suspect, when it launches world wide, not just US & Canada, at least 10 million will be sold

Out of those 70 million people, it’s debatable how many of that segment are even interested in buying it. Look at iPhones, tens of millions of people can afford top of the line iPhone 14 Pro Max’s, but they don’t buy them.

The price of this headset is putting itself in a narrow market, but maybe 10 million people will buy it, who knows? That 10 million is absorbed into insignificance at a public level but might be enough for Apple to claim it a success.
 
If Mark is against it, it makes me want to get one.
I don't care for it and I have like 2 euros, but now I wish I could get one.
 
VR gaming is just a new market. The growth rate shows it's not niche.
Yes it is a niche market.

I have been gaming since the year of or Lord 2000 and have been following gaming (PC gaming especially) development very closely. And ever since Oculus turned up it was a gimmicky niche that promised the heaven and the earth... and before that it was Nvidia's 3d-glasses (basically active LCD shutter glasses) that didn't pan out. Just like 3d cinema that remains to this day (theatres or home) a gimmick like those home beverage carbonation deviced that keep getting forgotten and remembered.
And, to add some salt on the wound - this new device from Apple is NOT pushed to the gaming scene as if it's any surprise.
 
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If Mark is against it, it makes me want to get one.
I don't care for it and I have like 2 euros, but now I wish I could get one.
Mark Zuckerberg is 39 years old. Tim Cook is 62. Elon Musk 51.

What Mark Z has accomplished at his age is nothing short of amazing. I don't agree with his tactics, but I applaud his foresight and grit.

Haters gonna hate.
 
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I think I nailed the million without even knowing the amount they built.
Still Zuck to me comes off as "ok" with what Apple is doing because Apple will take the high end, while not building enough of these units (right away) to alter his plans. BUT, the big but. Is that Apple has historically been successful with high end to the point that they end up making "lower" end products based off it because the high end isn't for everyone.

The iPod, for instance wasn't cheap until the nano or Mini. It wasn't $3,500 either but for what it was, it wasn't cheap. And you had plenty of less expensive options out there that ended up going away. Not to mention, it only worked (at first) with a Mac, over firewire, using iTunes. So the limitations, and premium price did not stop it from dominating the market. Apple eventually sold it with Windows compatibility and a Windows version of iTunes.

I'm of the feeling that this product (Vision Pro) is similar in that it's not "new", but it is done right. And it may have that addictive factor to it. Where you want to use it, and you look for it just like the old iPod or of course your iPhone. Maybe even more so than your desktop computer. They have to get that battery life up of course. Maybe the M3 3nm version will last a bit longer. And or maybe we get better battery tech, or both.
 
Uhm you got it all wrong. You don't need 80"+ OLED because it's gonna die on you within three years (if you are lucky). If you want state of the art TV that you might want to take a loo at 8K miniLED Z9K (it will last you a lifetime). But for the money of OLED you quoted you can get a real good 4K Sony Projector and stereoscopic 3D. Instead of MBA which you don't need you can get a proper projector screen such as Elite. And when it comes to sound nothing beats true surround setups and none of that softwate upmix bs that apple and sony do on their phone apps.
alright well, a few things

1) by all accounts, based on every screen/projector you mentioned, they are the same price if not more expensive than what I listed

2) yeah, you don’t need an MBA to use AVP, but one of its biggest selling points is being able to mirror macOS (which imo will be far superior in an AR space than what Apple has cooked up in visionOS thus far—though I don’t doubt it will get better with time, we can all acknowledge that it is essentially an iPadOS port at this point in time)

3) when you get into a true surround sound system, that again just further raises the price that I’d previously tallied

4) Apple seems to be taking Spatial Audio pretty seriously this time around (I’ve been a naysayer on that technology since its inception)—never before have they mentioned any kind of “audio raytracing,” and that will either end up being another marketing buzzword or a game-changer for the technology itself—interested to see how the (ostensible) use of bone conduction on those speakers pans out as well, given I’ve heard it provides a generally more immersive audial experience (‼️anectodal evidence alert‼️). at the end of the day, if immersion by way of ANC matters to the end-user, they can hook it up to a pair of APP

5) [bonus] Joanna Stern came back from her demo with AVP and said it was the first time 3D movies “are finally making sense” to her; I’m hard-pressed to think of a better way to watch 3D content than with a headset like this—Apple really drove that point home with the addition of the 3D cameras that can be used to capture photo/video (and I can’t recall who on the forum said this, but in response to the idea of wearing a headset at a kids’ birthday party being creepy, they simply recalled the all-too-familiar memory of their dad with his camcorder in front of him at events like that. still wish I knew where my father’s camcorder went.)
 
Mark Zuckerberg is 39 years old. Tim Cook is 62. Elon Musk 51.

What Mark Z has accomplished at his age is nothing short of amazing. I don't agree with his tactics, but I applaud his foresight and grit.

Haters gonna hate.
imo his only foresight was creating (and then acquiring) social networks that people end up getting addicted to and using for insanely toxic purposes—I’ll go ahead and show some self-awareness in that I brought up in another thread the fact (or opinion, I suppose) that how people use a product or service boils down to the person themselves, not the service as a whole—though Facebook has become nothing short of a cesspool for misinformation, and Instagram has become a cesspool for vanity. (speaking from a younger demographic as far as Insta goes, at least, ironically the misinformation seems to oft go awry on Facebook with older demographics who are less social-media/modern-Internet-literate)
 
Magical solution for what? Thoroughly profiling users and milking out every drop of data you can to sell/share to ad companies and government?
 
This is almost exactly how I'll use the device. I'm a writer. But my project is equal parts text and graphic novel, too.

But what I'm always trying to do is to get into a flow state while I write. To this end, the element of "immersion" is what has me sold on buying and trying the device. I'll likely use a bluetooth keyboard for typing. But the ability to put myself into an environment outside my traditional office is the killer app for me. Many writers esconce themselves in some far away place without distractions. I at one point had a remote cabin in the mountains of Guatemala that I used to get me into that state. But with this tool, I"ll be able to custom craft an immersive environment.

Maybe it won't work. But I think it will.
There is a difference in what you do and writing a straight up novel of fiction. A big difference. I could maybe see someone being able to pull it off with a paired keyboard... maybe. But man... talk about an adjustment for adjustment's sake lol.
 
He’s whistling past the graveyard. Apple has dealt a 1-2 punch to Meta. First tracking transparency then this.
 
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Exactly, and I think Apple was very smart on how they are marketing this. This is a device that you can purchase and no one else has to buy. In fact they didn’t show a single interaction with two people having the VisionPro on. It’s expensive, but you don’t need your friends to buy one for you to enjoy it. I sure Apple has some awesome plans for when it’s cheaper and non-pro versions, that do the social thing really well. But for now it’s just buy this thing for yourself, and don’t worry about your friends having one, it works with FaceTime.
Exactly! To me, what Apple is doing isn’t really trying to create a new world/metaverse, but more like looking at new ways to interact in computing.
 
I don't like Zuckerberg, but he understands at the core why I dislike this entire concept. "Each demo they showed was a person ALONE on a couch." or something similar.

The device is inherently solipsistic and is bordering on nihilistic/narcissistic.

Wow, you must REALLY hate paperback books! People sit around reading those for hours...

(Hey, do the other Amish know you're using a computer right now?)

I do not want a future where we're all sitting alone on a couch or at the lake (who the **** drives to a lake to hang out alone in a headset?) moving our hands around like idiots in some quasi-brain in a vat scenario that is the hilarious real world criticism of Renee Descartes "I think, therefore I exist".

Someone's taken a few intro philosophy courses! Good jorb. By the way that's "René", not "Renee".

Also, the device's core functionality is redundant in that all of its core functions are done much easier, much more convenient, and far less expensive.

I hereby hand you an award for "most willful missing of the point" in this entire thread (which is quite an accomplishment given how many pages long it is now).

And for an explanation of the point, I refer you to my earlier comment:

 
Solutions to what, exactly?

Edit: Zuck actually elaborates: “…to any of the constraints on laws and physics that our teams haven’t already explored and thought of.” I guess that’s fair.
“Explored and thought of” is a whole lot easier than actually “solving and implementing”.
 
I don't think either of these are out of the question. I'm not familiar how positional location actually works with the controllers, though.

VR Touch Controllers use IR sensors around themselves which the cameras outside of the HMD see and then track. Notice those rings around controllers like the PSVR 2 or the original Quest controllers? Those are the IR sensors

oculus_quest_2_controller_05.jpg
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