Mark Zuckerberg Says Apple's iMessage is Facebook's 'Biggest Competitor by Far'

[ipponrg]

Ok, so it works for basic text message conversations but it isn't using iMessage when Android users are part of the group. This means we would all get charged extra for sending pictures, audio and video so that makes it a none starter for my friends and I.

Understandably this is a specific problem for you, but not common for many U.S. people. Most carriers here provide unlimited text with their phone plans. Data is what you are really paying for here.

The original purpose behind iMessage was to allow people to use Wifi to send messages or to utilize their data plan. At the time, people weren't doing as much on their phone as they are now with data.

 

[OllyW]

Understandably this is a specific problem for you, but not common for many U.S. people. Most carriers here provide unlimited text with their phone plans. Data is what you are really paying for here.

The original purpose behind iMessage was to allow people to use Wifi to send messages or to utilize their data plan. At the time, people weren't doing as much on their phone as they are now with data.

Most of us here have unlimited text messages, it's only MMS messages which cost us extra.

 

[ipponrg]

MMS

I don't understand. Aren't all text messages either SMS or MMS? I would think if you can receive/send unlimited text messages, it'd cover both and not just one or the other.

 

[ImNoSuperMan]

I dont know about the rest of the world but here in India iMessage is absolutely useless. And I'm not even talking about my friends/family not owning about iMessage. But all the spam I keep getting (check attached image) with absolutely no way to block them.

I have turned on the setting to filter unknown senders. Didnt stop even a single such message. Then I tried individually blocking these messages. Still I receive messages from the same "sender". finally called apple support. I was told there is nothing that can be done about it except contacting each of these companies and ask (beg/threaten) them to stop sending spam sms.

If someone knows a solution for this spam please do share. Currently the only solution I have is turn off notifications for all iMessages so atleast I wont be bothered by them all day long. All I want is to hide/filter any message which comes from anyone who isnt in my contact list

 

[OllyW]

I don't understand. Aren't all text messages either SMS or MMS? I would think if you can receive/send unlimited text messages, it'd cover both and not just one or the other.

SMS messages contain only text, MMS include multimedia attachments.

 

[euvnairb]

Can we really call the messages app a "bundled" app? It's a basic and necessary app to have as part of the phone. That's like calling the phone app a bundled app.

 

[ipponrg]

SMS messages contain only text, MMS include multimedia attachments.

Right. The MMS protocol is a superset of SMS. If I send a text message with a picture in it, it counts as a "1 text message" and nothing more. We aren't charged differently for a MMS message vs a SMS message when it comes to texting. It's just "1 text message".

 

[Mr. Heckles]

Too bad Threema, Signal and Telegram are not bigger competitors.

I am beginning to like Telegram and Signal more and more. I try to get people to use at least Telegram and not Facebook Messenger.

I hate using Facebook Messenger. I don’t even have it installed on my phone. If a friend contacts me with that service, I usually don’t even see it until days later. When I do eventually read it, I tell them that they need to iMessage me in the future.
I don't have anything Facebook on my phone either. I wish Apple would put iMessage on Android, and let us have web access on iCloud.com

I used to like WhatsApp for staying in touch with friends and family on Android or overseas but it has really gone downhill since Facebook bought it. I’ve been slowly convincing people to use Telegram instead. It has a much simpler UI and none of the story junk that Facebook tries to force on every app they own. I hope to eventually delete WhatsApp entirely.

I never use WhatApp, but I am trying to get people on Telegram. It's simple to use and seems better on the battery than Messenger ever was.

Why not just use regular text?

For me, I have idiot family members who use Android and use a crap messaging apps that takes data from texting (Facebook messenger for one). I also read that the cell phone carries are going to be using text info for data and ads.

I can think of another flaw, it isn't cross platform compatible.

YES! Like I sad before, they need it on Android and a web version on iCloud.com

 

[OllyW]

Right. The MMS protocol is a superset of SMS. If I send a text message with a picture in it, it counts as a "1 text message" and nothing more. We aren't charged differently for a MMS message vs a SMS message when it comes to texting. It's just "1 text message".

I don't live in America though. Our phone plans are dirt cheap compared to yours but a minor hinderence is we have to pay extra for MMS messages.

It's not a problem for us because we can use iMessage for sending from iOs to iOS or WhatsApp / Messenger for cross platform messaging.

 

[KGB7]

Cry me a river

 

[scuac]

For the rare occasion when I have to respond to a Facebook message on iOS, I have found that the Firefox mobile browser, oddly, allows you to read/respond within Facebook without just getting that infuriating message to "download Messenger".

I do this on Safari stock browser. You just have to do the “Request Desktop site” reload thing and voila, the messages are magically there (even though the whole website still looks like the mobile version)

 

[5105973]

Very interesting.

I wonder if the motivation was purely financial, rather then political, or both? In the same way Google exited China in 2010 instead of playing ball (censorship etc), but will now likely return, as it realised that it sacrificed too much revenue making such an ethical stand.

If I were a pro free speech and vocal Chinese iCloud customer, I would consider myself being hung out to dry and start deleting my emails etc.

Well Tim squeaked by using the true but moth eaten excuse that Apple has to follow the laws of the country it does business in.

I almost wish they would not do business in China. Sometimes I even get angry about it. But looking at it from Apple/Tim Cook’s viewpoint, he’s battled our own government over privacy issues and knows probably better than most of us just how hungry the government is to get its mitts on our data. We already know what was done thanks to the past leaks and it was more like something you’d see the Chinese government do than what a freedom idealizing democracy is supposed to be up to.

He probably doesn’t see a whole lot of difference between what the US has demanded of him vs what the Chinese want. But we have laws he can use to fight our government. He does not in China. I can see why he would not want to leave all that money on the table. He can take it and keep growing Apple and trying to make it more powerful and wield more clout where it can be wielded.

I don’t like that it’s that way. But there’s too much in this world that I don’t like, yet am pragmatic enough to understand why it is what it is.

 

[CE3]

A big no thank you to Facebook and any of its services.

 

[nburwell]

I'd rather just use iMessage for all my messages but around half of my friends have Android phones so I still need WhatsApp and Messenger.

Same here. In an perfect world, I'd love to use iMessage for messaging all of my friends/family.

While I don't mind using WhatsApp and Messenger, both are owned by Facebook, so I'll just leave it at that.

 

[CE3]

What about a regular SMS? If my friends can’t be bothered to text outside of a service like WhatsApp (or iMessage) then I won’t bother with them either.

 

[Mr. Heckles]

Can you set up an automatic reply on Facebook Messenger? I know you can for a Facebook Page, but not sure for a regular user.

This way I can set up one to tell people to message me on Telegram.

 

[ericgtr12]

Good. FB forces their app as a separate download on its users and invades your phone like a Trojan Horse, tapping into all aspects of your personal data. I quit using FB a long time ago for this very reason.

iMessage is a default messaging app, no more, no less and it's part of Apple's ecosystem.

 

[blacktape242]

honestly, i didn't know there was a comparison...

 

[FairlyKors]

I hate using Facebook Messenger. I don’t even have it installed on my phone. If a friend contacts me with that service, I usually don’t even see it until days later. When I do eventually read it, I tell them that they need to iMessage me in the future.

I used to like WhatsApp for staying in touch with friends and family on Android or overseas but it has really gone downhill since Facebook bought it. I’ve been slowly convincing people to use Telegram instead. It has a much simpler UI and none of the story junk that Facebook tries to force on every app they own. I hope to eventually delete WhatsApp entirely.

That sounds exactly like me, except for the eventual fetching of facebook messages. I deleted the Facebook app when it came out they were doing unethical s— with it on your phone.

Facebook has got to be one of the biggest blunders we’ve made as a global society— rapidly stumbling headlong into the Information Age while not fully aware of our weaknesses.

 

[groadyho]

I hate using Facebook Messenger. I don’t even have it installed on my phone. If a friend contacts me with that service, I usually don’t even see it until days later. When I do eventually read it, I tell them that they need to iMessage me in the future.

I used to like WhatsApp for staying in touch with friends and family on Android or overseas but it has really gone downhill since Facebook bought it. I’ve been slowly convincing people to use Telegram instead. It has a much simpler UI and none of the story junk that Facebook tries to force on every app they own. I hope to eventually delete WhatsApp entirely.

My friends and family have all collectively deleted WhatsApp, we all now use Signal. WhatsApp cant be trusted since FB purchased it.

 

[elpamyelhsa]

Well Tim squeaked by using the true but moth eaten excuse that Apple has to follow the laws of the country it does business in.

I almost wish they would not do business in China. Sometimes I even get angry about it. But looking at it from Apple/Tim Cook’s viewpoint, he’s battled our own government over privacy issues and knows probably better than most of us just how hungry the government is to get its mitts on our data. We already know what was done thanks to the past leaks and it was more like something you’d see the Chinese government do than what a freedom idealizing democracy is supposed to be up to.

He probably doesn’t see a whole lot of difference between what the US has demanded of him vs what the Chinese want. But we have laws he can use to fight our government. He does not in China. I can see why he would not want to leave all that money on the table. He can take it and keep growing Apple and trying to make it more powerful and wield more clout where it can be wielded.

I don’t like that it’s that way. But there’s too much in this world that I don’t like, yet am pragmatic enough to understand why it is what it is.

Just in case you are implying Apple handed over customer data to China to able to sell products in China, Apple made a statement about when they moved Chinese data to China and they confirmed it is encrypted and no keys were stored with it. Even if China asked for the iMessage data keys couldn’t be provided for it.

Also iMessage being end-to-end encryption means not even Apple has keys to read these messages.

 

[AppleHaterLover]

They'll have to pry my WhatsApp from my cold, dead hands.

I will not endorse any messaging platform that only works on one platform. Thank you very much.

 

[5105973]

Just in case you are implying Apple handed over customer data to China to able to sell products in China, Apple made a statement about when they moved Chinese data to China and they confirmed it is encrypted and no keys were stored with it. Even if China asked for the iMessage data keys couldn’t be provided for it.

Also iMessage being end-to-end encryption means not even Apple has keys to read these messages.

No not implying anything. Loads of articles have stated what the case is and I won’t rehash what better writers than I am have already reported.

Just stating that they have to comply with Chinese laws and even some unreasonable requests, whatever those may be, in order to do business there. Sometimes that includes stomping on freedom of speech even in Australia at the behest of China https://www.digitaltrends.com/business/apple-china-ads-censorship/

 

[JGIGS]

If I had a mac at work I might be more inclined to use imessage but I don't and I like using Whatsapp web on a computer vs typing on a phone. iMessage is also useless for group messaging when people are using Android.

I, like most people I know, mainly use Whatsapp because iMessage is pretty useless when you have have to use other platforms or your friends use other platforms.

Unless Apple ever goes multi platform it will continue to be an inferior messaging app and I will continue to avoid using it.

 

[AppleMark]

Well Tim squeaked by using the true but moth eaten excuse that Apple has to follow the laws of the country it does business in.

I almost wish they would not do business in China. Sometimes I even get angry about it. But looking at it from Apple/Tim Cook’s viewpoint, he’s battled our own government over privacy issues and knows probably better than most of us just how hungry the government is to get its mitts on our data. We already know what was done thanks to the past leaks and it was more like something you’d see the Chinese government do than what a freedom idealizing democracy is supposed to be up to.

He probably doesn’t see a whole lot of difference between what the US has demanded of him vs what the Chinese want. But we have laws he can use to fight our government. He does not in China. I can see why he would not want to leave all that money on the table. He can take it and keep growing Apple and trying to make it more powerful and wield more clout where it can be wielded.

I don’t like that it’s that way. But there’s too much in this world that I don’t like, yet am pragmatic enough to understand why it is what it is.

I get what you are saying and agree for the most part on the legal (assuming that China will even follow it's own legal protocol) and business side.

However we all know that you cannot compare the governments of the USA / UK with China, as there is no democratic process, or accountability. So knowingly moving data servers to the control of a state run company is a purposeful and irresponsible move, if you really believe in the privacy of your customers. Even if China (and I am not clear on the Chinese legal system), were to submit a request to Apple using their laws with a US based server, at least there would be checks and balances. The new alternative and reality, is that the Chinese government would have carte blanch over their citizens private data.

So, when you have a company and CEO constantly finger wagging from the pedestal they built themselves, I just think that the position is hypocritical.

Like you, there is much of the world I do not like. However unlike people like Tim Cook, we are not in a position to make a stand of any significance. Even the resolve of Google is crumbling and I do not blame them, when you have others who are more than willing to fill the vacuum and turn a blind eye.

So for all Apple's constant preaching on privacy, we must all come to realise that at some point along the line, privacy has it's price and can be sold away, as he has basically done with China.