Mavericks is the worst, most buggy OS Apple has ever released.

Tbone999

macrumors member
Original poster
Jun 18, 2009
72
2
Why, oh WHY? Did all the people designing the OS in Apple get lobotomized? What in god's name has happened to this once excellent company?

This OS is so buggy that Mail and Safari -- kind of important for a computer, that "getting email" and "using the internet" stuff -- simply do not work. Safari hangs everytime I try to input text in a text input window (e.g., signing into a site). Mail does not retrieve Mail. One suggested solution is to delete your accounts and then re-add them. Great -- but Mail has inexplicably moved its Accounts listing out of the application and into Software Preferences where it hangs every time I try to access it.

There are so many problems with this OS (look at so many of the threads here; e.g., http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1668874).

I mourn the loss of a once great company -- no company with any regard for its products would foist this buggy, useless piece of junk on its customers.

(And don't get me started on Siri. If it's in beta, don't release it to consumers. Make it work. Then release it. Common sense, right?)
 

SandboxGeneral

Moderator emeritus
Sep 8, 2010
24,982
7,927
Detroit
I'm sorry for your experience, but I don't think it is indicative of the experiences of everyone else, or the OS and company as a whole.

My experience with Mavericks has been a good one. I don't have anything to complain about and cannot think of any bugs according to my usage with it.
 

maflynn

Moderator
Staff member
May 3, 2009
63,853
30,369
Boston
I echo what SBG posted, my experience with Mavericks has been very positive. I've had no problems with Mail and Safari. Though other people have, and there were some reports of performance issues, those problems haven't befallen me.

Over all, 10.9 has been very stable and fast in my experience.
 
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Shrink

macrumors G3
Feb 26, 2011
8,914
1,596
New England, USA
I'm sorry for your experience, but I don't think it is indicative of the experiences of everyone else, or the OS and company as a whole.

My experience with Mavericks has been a good one. I don't have anything to complain about and cannot think of any bugs according to my usage with it.
Agree completely^^^^! I haven't experienced any significant problems with Mavericks at all.

While I, too, don't question OP's experience, I do think much of the post is a bit of an over the top response.
 

James Craner

macrumors 68000
Sep 13, 2002
1,707
170
Bristol, UK
While a lot of people have issues with Mail, much of that is with people using Gmail. Mavericks has been pretty robust for me, and I have not seen any of the problems that you have seen, although I know Mavericks has been causing problems for some people. Safari has not been a problem for me.

iOS 7 on the other hand was very buggy for most people including me until the recent 7.1 upgrade.

Might be worth doing a clean install if you are still experiencing problems.
 

chrfr

macrumors G3
Jul 11, 2009
8,195
2,525
Mail has inexplicably moved its Accounts listing out of the application and into Software Preferences where it hangs every time I try to access it.
This is incorrect. Accounts are still listed and can be configured within Mail.
 

talmy

macrumors 601
Oct 26, 2009
4,703
266
Oregon
In my case Leopard was the worst because my networking was dead until the .1 release. Lion came in second for causing problems. Tiger, Snow Leopard, Mountain Lion, and Mavericks installed and ran without a hitch. (Jaguar was my first.)

Mail (with 3 IMAP and 5 POP accounts and tens of thousands of messages) works fine as does Safari.
 

Mac Hammer Fan

macrumors 6502a
Jul 13, 2004
778
109
Belgium
Best system was Snow Leopard imo. Rock solid and with rosetta for older applications. Mavericks introduces on my Mac Pro a new problem: crashes with 10.9 and 10.9.1 and a delay when I choose the command "sleep" in the Finder.
10.9.2 seems more stable, though... But the delay for sleeping remains.
 

Tbone999

macrumors member
Original poster
Jun 18, 2009
72
2
Best system was Snow Leopard imo. Rock solid and with rosetta for older applications. Mavericks introduces on my Mac Pro a new problem: crashes with 10.9 and 10.9.1 and a delay when I choose the command "sleep" in the Finder.
10.9.2 seems more stable, though... But the delay for sleeping remains.
I liked Snow Leopard and Mountain Lion. Honestly, I've never really actively disliked an Apple OS release until this one. I've spent days debugging it, and it still lacks functionality.

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This is incorrect. Accounts are still listed and can be configured within Mail.
Not in my Mail. When I select Accounts in the Mail drop down menu, it attempts to open the Internet Accounts pane of Software Preferences, which uses up 100% of my CPU and hangs.

When I try to select Mail preferences (where I'm guessing you're saying accounts are still configurable in), Mail hangs. I have reset my Pram, rebuilt my mailboxes, reinstalled Mavericks, etc. Mail won't retrieve mail and won't let me reconfigure my accounts in an attempt to fix that. I'm at the end of my rope with this.

I'm glad that others are having positive experiences with the OS, but I've liked every single OS Apple has released until this one. I shouldn't have to spend days debugging it -- it should just work, and work well.
 

chrfr

macrumors G3
Jul 11, 2009
8,195
2,525
When I try to select Mail preferences (where I'm guessing you're saying accounts are still configurable in), Mail hangs. I have reset my Pram, rebuilt my mailboxes, reinstalled Mavericks, etc.
It sounds like your computer is having a problem that isn't necessarily to be attributed to Mavericks. Your experience is certainly not typical of most users' experiences.
When you reinstalled the OS, did you migrate your old account or create a new one without migrating files?
 

Dustman

macrumors 65816
Apr 17, 2007
1,270
33
Mavericks is far from the worst, most buggy OS Apple has put out.

OS 8.5.1, OS 9.04, and OS 10.0-10.2 come to mind, with the latter being the worst.
 

aristobrat

macrumors G5
Oct 14, 2005
12,245
1,312
I'm glad that others are having positive experiences with the OS, but I've liked every single OS Apple has released until this one. I shouldn't have to spend days debugging it -- it should just work, and work well.
Personally, I haven't seen any new OS that didn't cause days of grief for some people. Sorry that it's your turn with Mavericks.

In general, Mavericks (to me) seems to a lot less people complaining about it, especially compared to Lion. Good lord, reading the forums here, some folks would have you believe that the devil himself coded that release.

Back to your mail issue, have you tried manually deleting the Mail plist and folders? To me, it sounds like the issue is somewhere in there.
 

MPclk2006

macrumors regular
Sep 20, 2013
195
27
Kentucky
Maybe is because I do not use either of those apps, but I have not had any issues with Mavericks, I run it on a Macbook mid2009 and it runs just fine. I use my iphone/ipad to check my emails and firefox as my browser.
 

Altemose

macrumors G3
Mar 26, 2013
9,089
444
Elkton, Maryland
I liked Snow Leopard and Mountain Lion. Honestly, I've never really actively disliked an Apple OS release until this one. I've spent days debugging it, and it still lacks functionality.

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Not in my Mail. When I select Accounts in the Mail drop down menu, it attempts to open the Internet Accounts pane of Software Preferences, which uses up 100% of my CPU and hangs.

When I try to select Mail preferences (where I'm guessing you're saying accounts are still configurable in), Mail hangs. I have reset my Pram, rebuilt my mailboxes, reinstalled Mavericks, etc. Mail won't retrieve mail and won't let me reconfigure my accounts in an attempt to fix that. I'm at the end of my rope with this.

I'm glad that others are having positive experiences with the OS, but I've liked every single OS Apple has released until this one. I shouldn't have to spend days debugging it -- it should just work, and work well.
I don't exactly see how you can "spend days debugging it" when it isn't an open source operating system. If you let us know of your eMail provider, we may be able to help with that.

People always fault Apple with bugs in the new software. Every software has bugs, whether people see them or not is a different story.

Let's take a timeline shall we...

OS X 10.0: Unstable Finder and kernel
OS X 10.1: Terrible graphics drivers
OS X 10.2: Excellent graphics, somewhat lacking performance

OS X 10.3: Not anything worth mentioning
OS X 10.4: Very few issues
OS X 10.5: Disabled network for some users until 10.5.1

OS X 10.6: Had issues with QuartzGL for Intel cards
OS X 10.7: Slow performance, removed features
OS X 10.8: Stable, fast, what 10.7 should have been

That isn't too bad, but lets have a look at the Microsoft equivalent.

Windows Me: Unstable everything, based on DOS
Windows 2000: Stable
Windows XP: Had reliability issues with Fat32 partitions at the beginning
Windows Vista: I think we all know, took hundreds of updates and 2 service packs to get it somewhat decent.

Windows 7: Stable, great performance.
Windows 8: This in and of itself is a bug

OS X isn't perfect but it has a heck of a lot better bugs than Windows. We will happily try and help you fix the issues... Another thing, when you reinstalled Mavericks, did you wipe the drive?
 

Tbone999

macrumors member
Original poster
Jun 18, 2009
72
2
I don't exactly see how you can "spend days debugging it" when it isn't an open source operating system. If you let us know of your eMail provider, we may be able to help with that.
When I spend hours and hours looking up possible solutions to these problems on the internet, and hours and hours trying one thing and another, I consider that debugging. (How absurd and condescending your "open source" comment is. It's obvious what I'm talking about.)

Yes, as part of my troubleshooting, I did a clean install of Mavericks (which took a great deal of time). Didn't help. Rebooted in safe mode, deleted the envelope files from the Mailbox data file, etc., etc.

My email provider is Apple (iCloud). I read a great deal about Mavericks giving Gmail users a lot of trouble, but I don't sync to a gmail account at all, just iCloud.

----------

I think I'm going to accept the general wisdom here and posit that my problem may be hardware related. I will say that there are numerous complaints about Mail on the Apple discussion board, many of them resembling mine, I would think that at least one of the standard fixes would help, especially the clean install.

Do people think I should run diskwarrior or TechToolsPro (I own neither, I'd have to buy them), or just take it in to Apple? I repaired permissions and also verified the disk using Disk Utility, which reported no problem.
 

Altemose

macrumors G3
Mar 26, 2013
9,089
444
Elkton, Maryland
When I spend hours and hours looking up possible solutions to these problems on the internet, and hours and hours trying one thing and another, I consider that debugging. (How absurd and condescending your "open source" comment is. It's obvious what I'm talking about.)

Yes, as part of my troubleshooting, I did a clean install of Mavericks (which took a great deal of time). Didn't help. Rebooted in safe mode, deleted the envelope files from the Mailbox data file, etc., etc.

My email provider is Apple (iCloud). I read a great deal about Mavericks giving Gmail users a lot of trouble, but I don't sync to a gmail account at all, just iCloud.

----------

I think I'm going to accept the general wisdom here and posit that my problem may be hardware related. I will say that there are numerous complaints about Mail on the Apple discussion board, many of them resembling mine, I would think that at least one of the standard fixes would help, especially the clean install.

Do people think I should run diskwarrior or TechToolsPro (I own neither, I'd have to buy them), or just take it in to Apple? I repaired permissions and also verified the disk using Disk Utility, which reported no problem.
I was looking for clarification on your definition of "debugging" since I come from a programming background. This may sound absurd, but have you updated your Apple ID associated with your iCloud address?

Simply update the password, sign in and out of iCloud in System Preferences, and then check mail. It should work.

For some reason, it doesn't reject an expired password but rather raises hell when someone needs Mail in Mavericks. It has happened to me as well. Let us know.
 

tywebb13

macrumors 68020
Apr 21, 2012
2,431
812
I use airplay mirroring a lot and so was interested in mountain lion when the first beta for that came out and have been using airplay mirroring ever since.

Mavericks is definitely an improvement on mountain lion in this regard. So notwithstanding some minor bugs which evidently annoy some people, I think if you use this, it is well worth the upgrade - especially if you use more than 1 monitor, as I do.

The only major problem I had with mavericks was with mavericks developer preview 6 which killed off airplay mirroring altogether! But I downgraded to DP5, sent a bug report and soon thereafter apple fixed it in DP7.
 

the bug

macrumors regular
Feb 21, 2014
103
14
Someone clearly doesn't remember Tiger.
Sorry your having trouble, but Mavericks has been quite stable for me, even on an un-supported system (1,1 Mac Pro).

Most people don't remember the dark days of "Type 11" errors on System 7. :)
- Jay