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Obviously. Why force them to upgrade when it's more profitable to force people to replace.
I mean, the last computer I bought was my Air in 2010-2011. It took almost 8 years for me to have to "upgrade". The Air still works beautifully and I just replaced its battery for the first time. Obviously it is no match for my new Pro, but it's held up way longer than any of the Dells and Sonys I went through before I switched to Apple.
And again - no one is forcing anyone to spend money at Apple! You do so deliberately and voluntarily.
 
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You a tough guy, bro? Did you feel my comments make you feel insecure?

No, it made me laugh.

Did all my fun smudge the point? The MBP'18 is a better machine than what the old one had, but it is a premium device and you can get much more power in a laptop for less money. The trade offs in the machines we posted here might not make sense for you, but it doesn't change that you can do it better for cheaper. You can also get a window's laptop that's thinner, has better battery life, or is more upgrade-able. Any reason to love the new MBP and there is an older machine that does it better.

And that's kind of our point. The MBP isn't best in any one category. It's a good overall machine, but if you have a specific need for a portable then you can do better. So what exactly are you getting here then when the non-pro older Macbook is just useful as their new flagship?

I mean, the last computer I bought was my Air in 2010-2011. It took almost 8 years for me to have to "upgrade". The Air still works beautifully and I just replaced its battery for the first time.

To be fair, that was the last time they updated it. I kid, but your old Macbook Air being so good is kind of the point. Sure the new pro is faster, but you said it yourself, the air still has life in it.
 
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Absolutely. I am a total convert. Been a Synology fanboy for the last 5 years. Here's what comes built in no matter how much storage you put in it:

  • Plex Media Server (stream all of your content to the Plex App on AppleTV)
  • iTunes Server (you see all of your music in any iTunes or remote app in the house as it broadcasts itself as an iTunes Home sharing server)
  • Office 365 / Google Docs replacement (collaboration and web based document editing
  • CloudStation, works on iOS, Mac, Windows, Android and is a 100% DropBox replacement
  • Photo storage accessible in an app or browser w/ machine learning so it can name people, detect certain objects similar to photos for Mac / iOS
  • Built in antivirus that's free
  • 100% compatibility with Time Machine
  • SMB/AFS drives so you can mount on your mac
  • lots of collaboration features for people who you make users on the NAS
  • Remote access via VPN or an open web-socket (they call it QuickConnect)

...and a lot more!

You can do a ton of side-loaded applications as well like an RSS reader that can read Bittorrent RSS Files then a torrent client so when a new show is posted you love, it auto downloads, moves to your Plex folder and boom it's on your AppleTV.

Lots of NASes out there but Synology is the most turn-key for people who aren't server experts.

Oh and there's no subscription. Every Synology has these features. the only thing worth spending extra money for is one with hardware acceleration to transcode video for Plex. The nicer Synology boxes will transcode video for you which is nice.

Thanks Adam,

I'll def look into this some more. :)
 
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No, it made me laugh.

Did all my fun smudge the point? The MBP'18 is a better machine than what the old one had, but it is a premium device and you can get much more power in a laptop for less money. The trade offs in the machines we posted here might not make sense for you, but it doesn't change that you can do it better for cheaper. You can also get a window's laptop that's thinner, has better battery life, or is more upgrade-able. Any reason to love the new MBP and there is an older machine that does it better.

And that's kind of our point. The MBP isn't best in any one category. It's a good overall machine, but if you have a specific need for a portable then you can do better. So what exactly are you getting here then when the non-pro older Macbook is just useful as their new flagship?

The target market for Apple and slim, professional notebooks is not the same as the one for Alienware, Asus ROG,Razer products. The former cares about a balance of performance, battery life and design and the latter spend their lives on gaming forums. Yes, design matters. This is a big part of Apple’s appeal. Everything they make is extremely pleasing to anyone with good taste. Like I said before this is the type of stuff that appeals to elementary school kids and some teenagers. There is nothing wrong with that but it is not an appropriate machine for adults. Can you imagine someone with one of these in a meeting? No one would take you seriously. For most people these bulky laptops are just not an option.

That’s not a dig on everything besides Apple, just these gaming notebooks. Nothing wrong with all the great Windows ultrabooks out there.
 
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What does a 4TB SSD upgrade in a PC cost?
Instead of costing $3,200 extra for the 4TB SSD, you can buy several from Newegg for just a little over a thousand dollars (https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147669)

Now while it isn't NVMe and you have to install it yourself, I still don't think it's worth paying 2,000 extra for that, as I'm sure many other people aren't. Nobody needs that much storage at that speed, and if they do, they're lying. It could be nice, but an SSD like this is fine for many.

Also on the topic of performance, don't tell me you think this thing won't throttle at all. It's a 6-core 45w CPU shoved in pretty much the same exact chassis. Older CPUs throttled in this chassis, I don't see why this wouldn't. And for $6,699 you can't get a better gpu than a 560x? A 1050 outperforms that and you can find that in $700 dollar laptops. This is an overpriced machine that doesn't make a lot of sense for most people or most creative professionals.
 
You a tough guy, bro? Did you feel my comments make you feel insecure?
[doublepost=1531511448][/doublepost]

It doesn’t matter if the dGPU is working hard or not in that thing. The battery life will still be under 2 hours. They might’ve hit 2 hours repeating a video a local video or playing audio. Like I told the other guy, if it can’t be used without a socket, it is good for nothing. At home people can use a full desktop.

This is a stupid comment. You clearly do not understand power consumption.
 
Instead of costing $3,200 extra for the 4TB SSD, you can buy several from Newegg for just a little over a thousand dollars (https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147669)

Now while it isn't NVMe and you have to install it yourself, I still don't think it's worth paying 2,000 extra for that, as I'm sure many other people aren't. Nobody needs that much storage at that speed, and if they do, they're lying. It could be nice, but an SSD like this is fine for many.

Also on the topic of performance, don't tell me you think this thing won't throttle at all. It's a 6-core 45w CPU shoved in pretty much the same exact chassis. Older CPUs throttled in this chassis, I don't see why this wouldn't. And for $6,699 you can't get a better gpu than a 560x? A 1050 outperforms that and you can find that in $700 dollar laptops. This is an overpriced machine that doesn't make a lot of sense for most people or most creative professionals.

That's a huge assumption on your end, and doesn't make you look mature or genuine in a dumb argument in the first place.

There are plenty of people out there (big youtubers to name one group) that shoot with red camera's or 4k DSLRS that could easily use up the 4TB for editing videos when they're on trips. Could they usual external solutions? Sure, but this way they don't have to deal with anything other than a dongle to transfer data from the camera to their computer. That's just one example. Music production is another great example. You judging what someone else who's an actual professional (because you sure don't sound like or come off as one) needs or doesn't need for their workflow is seriously laughable, and extremely amateur hour.
 
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That's a huge assumption on your end, and doesn't make you look mature or genuine in a dump argument in the first place.

There are plenty of people out there (big youtubers to name one group) that shoot with red camera's or 4k DSLRS that could easily use up the 4TB for editing videos when they're on trips. Could they usual external solutions? Sure, but this way they don't have to deal with anything other than a dongle to transfer data from the camera to their computer. That's just one example. Music production is another great example. You judging what someone else who's an actual professional (because you sure don't sound like or come off as one) needs or doesn't need for their workflow is seriously laughable, and extremely amateur hour.

No, I'm not a professional, I'm actually a teenager studying computer science at a county wide STEM high school, so I guess I am real amateur hour. I'm not saying that content creators don't need large amounts of space for their content, because 4k raw footage takes up a crap ton of space. What I'm saying is that they don't need to spend $3,200 for 4TB of NVMe storage. An NVMe is great for boot drives and really fast access, but all my 4k footage doesn't need to be on a drive that fast. It's unnecessary, incredibly expensive, and I would rather still have relatively fast SATA speeds for a significantly lower price point. And no, no professional needs an NVMe drive for their workflow. Nice to have? Yes. Fast? Definitely. Worth the price? No. Apple is forcing people who want these large amounts of storage to pay for what they don't need. They can most likely get work done at probably pretty comparable rate with a slower but still plenty fast SSD.
 
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I don't get people freaking out about the price.

That's ****ing 4 TB of ****ing 3.2 Gbit/s flash storage. What do you expect?
Also 32 GB of 2400 MHz DDR4 and Intel probably charges quite a bit for that "i9" moniker.

So 4TB flash storage consumer cost is about $1200 to $1500 but Apple gets them at bulk price.
32gb ddr4 is roughly $300 to $400
and i9 CPU is about $600

so the 3 things you mentioned cost $2500 total, but you are paying $7000 for the laptop.. let's not try to justify apple laptop on hardware cost.
 
No, I'm not a professional, I'm actually a teenager studying computer science at a county wide STEM high school, so I guess I am real amateur hour. I'm not saying that content creators don't need large amounts of space for their content, because 4k raw footage takes up a crap ton of space. What I'm saying is that they don't need to spend $3,200 for 4TB of NVMe storage. An NVMe is great for boot drives and really fast access, but all my 4k footage doesn't need to be on a drive that fast. It's unnecessary, incredibly expensive, and I would rather still have relatively fast SATA speeds for a significantly lower price point. And no, no professional needs an NVMe drive for their workflow. Nice to have? Yes. Fast? Definitely. Worth the price? No. Apple is forcing people who want these large amounts of storage to pay for what they don't need. They can most likely get work done at probably pretty comparable rate with a slower but still plenty fast SSD.

Those people can use buy the units with smaller internal drives and use USB SSDs and get those ~500Mb R/W speeds they’d see on SATA. Source: I am “those people” with 200Gb of VMs.
 
Can you imagine someone with one of these in a meeting? No one would take you seriously. For most people these bulky laptops are just not an option.

What a weird way to exclude them. What are you doing in a meeting that requires a MBP? Most meetings can be handled with an iPad or or an entry level MacBook. What are you doing in a meeting that requires any sort of computing power?

You're right, you wouldn't pull it out in a meeting, but you wouldn't pull a MBP out either. Forget the meeting scenario. What are you doing with a MBP that a MacBook can't do. Can the 2018 MBP run a VR headset? Can it manage content on 8 TVs or projectors? Can it even do 4?

Any real world situation where there is value in pulling out a professional grade laptop the people in the room are going to be impressed by the hardware in these "gaming" notebooks. If those 'judgy business-people' you described are also successful than they probably care more about results than appearance anyway.
[doublepost=1531521781][/doublepost]
There are plenty of people out there (big youtubers to name one group) that shoot with red camera's or 4k DSLRS that could easily use up the 4TB for editing videos when they're on trips.

We should ask Linus what he thinks.
 
No, I'm not a professional, I'm actually a teenager studying computer science at a county wide STEM high school, so I guess I am real amateur hour. I'm not saying that content creators don't need large amounts of space for their content, because 4k raw footage takes up a crap ton of space. What I'm saying is that they don't need to spend $3,200 for 4TB of NVMe storage. An NVMe is great for boot drives and really fast access, but all my 4k footage doesn't need to be on a drive that fast. It's unnecessary, incredibly expensive, and I would rather still have relatively fast SATA speeds for a significantly lower price point. And no, no professional needs an NVMe drive for their workflow. Nice to have? Yes. Fast? Definitely. Worth the price? No. Apple is forcing people who want these large amounts of storage to pay for what they don't need. They can most likely get work done at probably pretty comparable rate with a slower but still plenty fast SSD.

Well this lack of awareness makes more sense now that I know you're a CS. Here's a piece of advice. Make sure you take some humanities classes when you get to college early, because they actually are important, contrary to what silicon valley culture makes you think, and will help you maybe be empathetic to others, something you clearly need to work on.

Now as for why it is necessary for film makers (I used youtubers as a perfect example) would want (and need) those faster speeds. If they are storing the footage on their computer, as well as rendering a final movie in FC, that speed will make a difference in terms of time. Time for those professionals = money. The faster they can get it off their camera's and start cutting, and rendering movies, the better. Take my friend, a professional who shoots other people's promo ads. his clients will start to demand promo reels faster. He wouldn't be hired for a lot of jobs if he wasn't using a mac (you should hear some of the stories of how eccentric his clients can be) In that case, him having the biggest and best may let him keep clients, in other words, it would make him more money in the long run. So yes, that's a need. Again, it's not worth the price to you. To other's it is. I also don't need a fully maxed out MacBook Pro. But will I pay $2,000 for a new 13 inch MacBook air with retina screen and a 512 SSD and 16 GIGS of RAM if they come out in the fall? You bet I will. Because it is the only piece of computer kit I can see myself needing in the near future. Now, you could make the argument that I could go get a MATEBOOK X PRO for a lower lower, and get everything I need. Except you don't know me, or my work flow, and the fact remains I have software for my business that I need that only runs on Mac 0S. That's worth the $500 I'm paying for the operating system alone.


I'm not even getting into what some scientists would need, or music producers working with huge names. Speed equals money, there for, need. Or, people who do a lot of software development and run a ton of heavy VM'S. That's a need right there.

Lastly, apple isn't forcing anyone to do anything. If they want to choose the biggest drives, it's an option. You could get a smaller drive in the mac, and using usb C, use a Samsung drive at a lower price. It sounds like that's what you would do. More power to you.

The people who question how much these cost, it's clearly not the computers for you. That's fine. The prosumers can get the lower sized hard drives, and everything will cost more or less what they cost last year. For students and average adults, the MacBook and MacBook air refresh reboot aren't out yet, but by all accounts, will be here this fall. Or hell, for the majority of computer users, phones, chrome books and iPads do what people need.
 
What a weird way to exclude them. What are you doing in a meeting that requires a MBP? Most meetings can be handled with an iPad or or an entry level MacBook. What are you doing in a meeting that requires any sort of computing power?

You're right, you wouldn't pull it out in a meeting, but you wouldn't pull a MBP out either. Forget the meeting scenario. What are you doing with a MBP that a MacBook can't do. Can the 2018 MBP run a VR headset? Can it manage content on 8 TVs or projectors? Can it even do 4?

Any real world situation where there is value in pulling out a professional grade laptop the people in the room are going to be impressed by the hardware in these "gaming" notebooks. If those 'judgy business-people' you described are also successful than they probably care more about results than appearance anyway.
[doublepost=1531521781][/doublepost]

We should ask Linus what he thinks.

Does the 2018 MacBook Bro even lift? (about as relevant to a “Pro” as a VR headset)

How many times are we going to be treated to, “This MacBook Pro can’t do what this 4 inch thick, neon, 2 hour battery life gaming laptop(sic) can do. It’s not Pro!!”. Yes. Yes, we know the MacBook Pro is not a gaming laptop. The clue is in the name.
 
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What a weird way to exclude them. What are you doing in a meeting that requires a MBP? Most meetings can be handled with an iPad or or an entry level MacBook. What are you doing in a meeting that requires any sort of computing power?

You're right, you wouldn't pull it out in a meeting, but you wouldn't pull a MBP out either. Forget the meeting scenario. What are you doing with a MBP that a MacBook can't do. Can the 2018 MBP run a VR headset? Can it manage content on 8 TVs or projectors? Can it even do 4?

Any real world situation where there is value in pulling out a professional grade laptop the people in the room are going to be impressed by the hardware in these "gaming" notebooks. If those 'judgy business-people' you described are also successful than they probably care more about results than appearance anyway.
[doublepost=1531521781][/doublepost]

We should ask Linus what he thinks.

Linus is a complete joke when it comes to mac's. I love his take on windows kits, but he chooses to not learn facts about macs and pretends doing things differently is somehow worse. He also does not edit himself, has a team of editors all using sponsored machines tricked out using premier. He also shoots the majority of his videos at the office, and when he travels his videos always appear time delayed in terms of when they show up. Look at ijustine, Mathew Morris, MKBHD, austin evans, or Casey Niestat for youtubers who I'm thinking more of. Smaller teams (or in the case of Casey and Justine, single person crews)
 
Instead of costing $3,200 extra for the 4TB SSD, you can buy several from Newegg for just a little over a thousand dollars (https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820147669)
A $100 steak vs a $20 one. You're still going to leave it in the toilet at the end of the day.
$50 underwear vs $5. You're still just covering your genitals with it and then covering that up.

The price doesn't matter. It's completely up to the person who think whatever the thing is, is worth the $$$.
If they don't they won't buy it.
 
That's probably what, less than $50 on Amazon?

Not to mention that the cost for USB-C to USB-A endcap adapters have gotten ridiculously cheap. You could get them for just slightly more than $1 per adapter if purchased in a multi-pack with one seller on Amazon.

I get it if you're getting tripped up by the lack of an SD card slot or built in Ethernet, but if you're echoing the most common complaint about losing two USB-A ports (which isn't enough for lots of people anyway), you're just lazy.

Buy an adapter for every single USB-A device you own and for good measure buy another handful and store them in places where you might need one suddenly. They've gotten THAT cheap.
 
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This is a stupid comment. You clearly do not understand power consumption.

You don’t understand power consumption. That machine has to power a ******** of components. Look at the power supply wattage! It’s not coming from me. That is Asus. If the thing lasted more than 2 hours in the best of circumstances, they would make sure everyone could see it. The battery life is basically a footnote on their site.
 
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They need to separate the cpu from the keyboard and display. There is no reason we should have to get a 15” heavy laptop to get an i7 that gets hot on the lap. Can’t the laptop be light and thin and the powerful cpu be sitting 10 feet away on my desk, or in my backpack running on battery?
 
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Does the 2018 MacBook Bro even lift? (about as relevant to a “Pro” as a VR headset)

How many times are we going to be treated to, “This MacBook Pro can’t do what this 4 inch thick, neon, 2 hour battery life gaming laptop(sic) can do. It’s not Pro!!”. Yes. Yes, we know the MacBook Pro is not a gaming laptop. The clue is in the name.

VR != gaming.
 
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Right!? And those parts better come soldered, cause buying a laptop and adding a faster drive and RAM doesn't count. You can't buy a GT83VR MSI laptop with SLI 1080's and then replace the 16GB ram, nor can you get an Asus ROG G703 with an 4.8 Ghz i9, 1080 with 1440 gsync display because that has a 8700Mb/s drive. 8700 is not 3200.

Oh, and it better have a GPU that's at slower than the discontinued 2010 GTX 570 and nothing but thunderbolt I/O!

Did I miss where you linked to all this costing less? That’s great these laptops come with a True Tone display. I thought only Apple did that.
 
Did I miss where you linked to all this costing less? That’s great these laptops come with a True Tone display. I thought only Apple did that.

But imagine the promotion and raise you’ll get, not to mention the tail, when you pull out your MSI GT83VR, plug in both adapters (yes, it actually needs two power adapters), open a can of Monster energy drink, strap on your business VR helmet and proceed to give a killer presentation on 8 monitors. Pro as heck. Man, Tim just does not get it.

18001D6B-F69F-4FB8-BDF0-4FF5E14C69E7.png 76195C31-7E79-49C8-BAC6-0185C45F2C37.jpeg
 
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